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On May 21 2015 22:58 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. Ugh, the fallacy that natural = good/ ideal and artificial/ synthetic = bad/ worse. Surely you can come up with a list of counterexamples to this idea? Start with diseases/ disorders/ natural disasters vs. vaccines/ surgery/ any sort of technology everrrr.
Yeah.. the average lifespan of mankind went up thanks to all the medicine.
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What the hell just happened guys...
Yesterday my credit card balance was like $1386, today I go check and it's down $977. I don't know where all of it went, but I had a transaction for $250 on May 15th that just disappeared. There are other transactions on May 14th and 17th that are still on the card. Am I getting heaps of free money y'all?!
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On May 21 2015 23:00 Djzapz wrote:
What the hell just happened guys...
Yesterday my credit card balance was like $1386, today I go check and it's down $977. I don't know where all of it went, but I had a transaction for $250 on May 15th that just disappeared. There are other transactions on May 14th and 17th that are still on the card. Am I getting heaps of free money y'all?!
I'd call the credit card company and ask if there's been any suspicious behavior/ transactions on the card that you're not aware of... because while that sounds cool and all, it could just as easily go in the other direction...
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France17333 Posts
On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. If you would tell me that you understand all the molecular mechanisms that contribute to the common cold and you have designed a drug that targets those mechanisms without compromising others and you would have tailored that drug to my genetic composition, I would take that drug. But as a matter of fact, we know ridiculously little about the molecular interactions and how drugs affect the body on a systemic level. Molecular biology is still in the Middle Ages. This won't change until we have tissue- or organism-wide real-time simulations of molecular interactions that allow us to draw complete pictures. There is a reason why basically every drug out there has some side effect. Because we don't know shit about the human body.
Pushing your logic to the extreme : why do we wear clothes to protect ourselves from the weather while our skin is the result of "millions of years of evolution"? Why do we want to neutralize fecondation through contraception while, after all, since the fecondation process is natural and the result of "millions of years of evolution", it should only be good, right? Why do we use soap to shower and wash our hands while, naturally, we cannot use soap, thus the "millions of years of evolution" probably prepared us to clean ourselves without it?
The very reason you are browsing on this thing called the Internet right now, the very reason you'll probably live ~70/80 years instead of ~30, the very reason you can travel from America to Europe or Asia safely, efficiently and at a relatively low cost, is this : the fight the human being has led against the limitations nature put on him, aka the fight for comfort. We don't need to know everything about something to develop objects, behaviors, substances, etc, or else we would never had quit the primal state of mankind. You're talking about potential "organism-wide real-time simulations of molecular interactions that allow us to draw complete pictures". But how can you even be sure that achieving this, which is achieving complete knowledge, is even possible? You can't. You cannot prove that we, as human beings, can achieve complete knowledge, just like you cannot prove that we can't achieve it. Thus we are forced to act with incomplete information. Does it sometimes lead to bad things? Of course. Is the reward way greater than the risk? Of course.
And what freestalker said is correct as well. We do know a lot about molecular interactions. We are far, far, very far from complete knowledge, but we can act with the knowledge we have. Drugs also pass very demanding tests concerning their toxicity, efficiency, safety of use, etc. Hell, between the point when someone in a laboratory says "guys, let's do a drug for disease X !" and the point when it is allowed to be sold on the market (assuming it is allowed in the first place), 10 to 13 years are spent on research and testing. Do you realize? 10 to 13 years? That's not "ridiculously little".
On May 21 2015 22:37 helpman175 wrote:
@freestalker you say it, the long time it takes to create the drugs is an expression of how little we know about the interactions on a molecular level.
And no I'm not against vaccines. I'm aware that medicine is often required even if it is imperfect.
I'm against taking drugs on every occasion, just because we can (antibiotics, analgesics, antiinflammatories, decongestants, etc.)
We agree on the last part, but claiming that anti-inflammatories are straight up useless/bad is ridiculous.
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@freestalker I wouldn't be so pessimistic about this. Molecular simulations of small organisms should be possible within the next 500 years. It will need some major advances in molecule detection for that though. Maybe it takes 1000s of years until we will be able to have a computer simulation of a complete human, but I am pretty sure that we will get there at some point.
Once you have that simulation, it will be pretty straightforward to test different molecule structures and how they affect the human body in real time.
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On May 21 2015 23:02 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 23:00 Djzapz wrote:
What the hell just happened guys...
Yesterday my credit card balance was like $1386, today I go check and it's down $977. I don't know where all of it went, but I had a transaction for $250 on May 15th that just disappeared. There are other transactions on May 14th and 17th that are still on the card. Am I getting heaps of free money y'all?! I'd call the credit card company and ask if there's been any suspicious behavior/ transactions on the card that you're not aware of... because while that sounds cool and all, it could just as easily go in the other direction...
Wouldn't they automatically call me had that been the case? And the $250 transaction is not something that'd be suspicious, so I find it odd.
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@helpman175
In 1000 years we'll most probably be extinct  We're on a good way.
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On May 21 2015 23:05 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 23:02 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 21 2015 23:00 Djzapz wrote:
What the hell just happened guys...
Yesterday my credit card balance was like $1386, today I go check and it's down $977. I don't know where all of it went, but I had a transaction for $250 on May 15th that just disappeared. There are other transactions on May 14th and 17th that are still on the card. Am I getting heaps of free money y'all?! I'd call the credit card company and ask if there's been any suspicious behavior/ transactions on the card that you're not aware of... because while that sounds cool and all, it could just as easily go in the other direction... Wouldn't they automatically call me had that been the case? And the $250 transaction is not something that'd be suspicious, so I find it odd.
They definitely should notify you if they think there's anything odd with the transactions, but perhaps you should find a list of all the transactions/ changes made to your credit card recently, which you could probably find online/ via a call to them.
Basically, any time anything unexpected happens with your credit card you should immediately figure out why it happened. Better safe than sorry.
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On May 21 2015 23:07 freestalker wrote:@helpman175 In 1000 years we'll most probably be extinct We're on a good way.
nah, humans are like rats, it's very hard to eradicate them completely.
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On May 21 2015 22:59 freestalker wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:58 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. Ugh, the fallacy that natural = good/ ideal and artificial/ synthetic = bad/ worse. Surely you can come up with a list of counterexamples to this idea? Start with diseases/ disorders/ natural disasters vs. vaccines/ surgery/ any sort of technology everrrr. Yeah.. the average lifespan of mankind went up thanks to all the medicine.
And cars, planes, light bulbs, air conditioning, clothes, phones, computers, contraception, and bridges are pretty useful too.
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On May 21 2015 23:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 23:05 Djzapz wrote:On May 21 2015 23:02 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 21 2015 23:00 Djzapz wrote:
What the hell just happened guys...
Yesterday my credit card balance was like $1386, today I go check and it's down $977. I don't know where all of it went, but I had a transaction for $250 on May 15th that just disappeared. There are other transactions on May 14th and 17th that are still on the card. Am I getting heaps of free money y'all?! I'd call the credit card company and ask if there's been any suspicious behavior/ transactions on the card that you're not aware of... because while that sounds cool and all, it could just as easily go in the other direction... Wouldn't they automatically call me had that been the case? And the $250 transaction is not something that'd be suspicious, so I find it odd. They definitely should notify you if they think there's anything odd with the transactions, but perhaps you should find a list of all the transactions/ changes made to your credit card recently, which you could probably find online/ via a call to them. Basically, any time anything unexpected happens with your credit card you should immediately figure out why it happened. Better safe than sorry.
I'm checking online and some of them just disappeared. But yeah, I'll be calling I guess.
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On May 21 2015 22:58 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. Ugh, the fallacy that natural = good/ ideal and artificial/ synthetic = bad/ worse. Surely you can come up with a list of counterexamples to this idea? Start with diseases/ disorders/ natural disasters vs. vaccines/ surgery/ any sort of technology everrrr.
Saying you don't need medicine for minor ailments is like saying you don't need footwear for short runs around the block.
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On May 21 2015 23:51 Thieving Magpie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:58 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. Ugh, the fallacy that natural = good/ ideal and artificial/ synthetic = bad/ worse. Surely you can come up with a list of counterexamples to this idea? Start with diseases/ disorders/ natural disasters vs. vaccines/ surgery/ any sort of technology everrrr. Saying you don't need medicine for minor ailments is like saying you don't need footwear for short runs around the block.
There are movements that defend barefeet running, it greatly improves technique.
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On May 21 2015 23:51 Thieving Magpie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 22:58 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 21 2015 22:11 helpman175 wrote:On May 21 2015 22:00 OtherWorld wrote:On May 21 2015 21:34 helpman175 wrote:
Anti-inflammatory drugs against the common cold are the worst.
Inflammation is a natural protective response by the body.
Why would any sane person get rid of that?
The same goes for decongestant drugs. The mucus forms a natural protective layer so that the infection cannot spread to other parts of the body such as the lungs.
So because it's natural and coming from the body, it's good? It is the result of millions of years of evolution and far better tested than any drug out there. Ugh, the fallacy that natural = good/ ideal and artificial/ synthetic = bad/ worse. Surely you can come up with a list of counterexamples to this idea? Start with diseases/ disorders/ natural disasters vs. vaccines/ surgery/ any sort of technology everrrr. Saying you don't need medicine for minor ailments is like saying you don't need footwear for short runs around the block.
You should be very careful, thought, to not let the "taking of medicine" become a habit. Taking appropriate medicine when you are sick is a good idea. Deciding for yourself that you are sick and what kind of medicine you should take is not a good idea unless you are a doctor. Or into homeopathy, in that case take however much of that stuff as you want, it is not doing anything anyways.
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This is funny, so let's have a poll
Poll: When having a cold, Ido not take medication (12) 86% take medication (2) 14% 14 total votes Your vote: When having a cold, I (Vote): take medication
(Vote): do not take medication
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It depends on how bad i feel?
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On May 22 2015 00:24 helpman175 wrote:This is funny, so let's have a poll Poll: When having a cold, Ido not take medication (12) 86% take medication (2) 14% 14 total votes Your vote: When having a cold, I (Vote): take medication
(Vote): do not take medication
As if a cold means exactly the same thing and same degree, all the time?
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France17333 Posts
On May 22 2015 00:24 helpman175 wrote:This is funny, so let's have a poll Poll: When having a cold, Ido not take medication (12) 86% take medication (2) 14% 14 total votes Your vote: When having a cold, I (Vote): take medication
(Vote): do not take medication
"having a cold" means nothing, you know. Besides, the fact that YOU think that you should not take medications doesn't mean that this can be applied to everyone.
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On May 22 2015 00:32 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2015 00:24 helpman175 wrote:This is funny, so let's have a poll Poll: When having a cold, Ido not take medication (12) 86% take medication (2) 14% 14 total votes Your vote: When having a cold, I (Vote): take medication
(Vote): do not take medication
"having a cold" means nothing, you know. Besides, the fact that YOU think that you should not take medications doesn't mean that this can be applied to everyone.
Agreed, and vice-versa: Just because one person's symptoms aren't awful/ he isn't extremely uncomfortable with the cold doesn't mean he can generalize to other people who are sick and how they deal with their illness.
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On May 21 2015 23:14 helpman175 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2015 23:07 freestalker wrote:@helpman175 In 1000 years we'll most probably be extinct We're on a good way. nah, humans are like rats, it's very hard to eradicate them completely.
Almost impossible to eradicate humanity because it is too widespread to wipe them in one go and any remaining community will be able to rebuild and spread in a few hundred years.
(still easier than rats because a naked human group needs some kind of shelter/tools/agriculture or help from the environment to survive)
Population back down to a few hundred million (world before industrial revolution) within the next 1000 years sounds probable.
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EPT
