|
On June 06 2011 08:34 Asjo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:24 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:04 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 06:36 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:24 ChinaRestaurant wrote:On June 06 2011 06:06 Asjo wrote:
I see this as a harsh prank by the girls, not a legal matter. Also, I think we have to consider that maybe the kid secretly liked this. The video aside, it's mostly playing around involving close physical contact with girls ...
The reason that people would react differently if it was a bunch of boys would only be due to rationalizations in regards to the sexual aspect of it. People interpret behaviour, consider what it might lead to, and act preventatively. Perhaps this might sometimes lead to an overreaction, but that doesn't mean that you should also overreact to a single instance of bullying by girls in the name of equality. As it is, it was a bunch of young kids acting immaturely and getting physical about it. Obviously, the school/parents will react to avoid things escalating, but as such there is nothing outrageous about the interaction.
I don't know if the comments in this thread about child porn are serious. However, just because someone underage is filmed nude, does not in any way make it child porn. Nudity is the most natural thing in the world. Child porn is about exploitation of children and the often sexualized depiction of such. I dont think youve ever undressed or have been undressed unwillingly in front of relative strangers have you? Try putting yourself in the shoes of the boy, 3 years younger and alone, in public, getting undressed while being kept down by the girls. Sure is quite a lot of humiliation in that. Something similar happened to me once, just that the people doing it were 3 boys from my class and they undressed me for practically everyone in my class to see. Believe me there is nothing to secretly enjoy about this at that age. Later on in your life when you might or might not develop kinks and fetishes is another thing, but dont tell me an 11 year old might be into humiliation, even if it involved being in close contact with some girls. I beg to differ about your last point. You can develop certain ways of relating to girls in terms physical contact, conversation, etc. At this age your hormones might be kicking in, and you're desperate to somehow get in touch with the girls. So, based on whatever experience you have, you assume a behaviour that allows you to do so. This might mean willingly engaging is humiliating situations of some kind and repeating this due to past "success". For all we know, the boy might have somehow tries to encourage the reaction of the girls, even if not this specific act. We don't know. But I certainly wouldn't count out the fact that the boy might have enjoyed it. The other you example you give is more clear cut. At this age, boys start getting more insecure about group dynamics and will battle for dominance. Your lack of power in relation to the boys that you compete with being so clearly displayed will certainly mark you. Mind you, it likely won't have any long-term effects, but you certainly won't like it. Even more so, the situation being designed to humiliate you (carried out for the audience), not just and act of fun/soperiority/venting, enhances this effect. Add to that the fact that most of us get humiliated terribly during our younger years, often against our will. More often than not, it does not weaken us. We learn from it and grow. It's an integral part of interaction at this stage, and if we never get to be foolish kids and act out all our ugly feelings and go through all the motions, there is little chance of use growing up as wise and well-balanced adults. This doesn't mean that kids should behave and treat each other well, but often this comes as part of a process. There will be bullying, people will act to stop the bullying, and hopefully everyone will learn from it. First of all let's say he did enjoy it..why was he screaming and bawling his eyes out?,if I am correct in believing that being publicly humiliated to some people is enjoyable...they wouldn't be screaming or protesting against it would they? Call me crazy, but when people do stuff that they enjoy (Even S&M activities) they don't react in the same way that kid did...do they? NO! Good, now we're learning! Also the whole "Close physical contact with girls" thing, at the onset of puberty (can start in either sex between ages of 10-13, potentially earlier, potentially later). You begin to develop an interest in girls...that is not to say you want to see them NAKED OR that you want THEM TO SEE YOU NAKED, you merely begin to get interested at them. You're not by any means "Desperate" to get into contact with girls, in my experience most guys are scared to hell to even TALK to a girl at around that age BECAUSE of their new found interest in them. It's not like puberty hits and boys are just like "Wow...I never thought about this before but...girls..are awesome, I wanna hang out with them...and ...i get this weird feeling whenever I'm near them..i wonder if they touch me?....". I really am astonished at how you, and people like you can think this way..it's Mind boggling, absolutely Mind Boggling. as for it not being child porn, Clearly you do not know what child porn is, they do not have to be sexually explicit and child nudity IS considered Child Porn. Maybe at ages 1-4 i can see it not being child porn, cause it's just a baby...but even then there are some Sick Fucks out there. I'm honestly hoping you're just trolling, because this is a pretty fucked up way to look at this....saying that kid, who was clearly NOT enjoying being publicly humiliated and assaulted, could've liked it is just...Wow I would say you have a very narrow-minded interpreation of what I am saying. My point is completely valid; he could definitely have enjoyed it. I'm using my own experience and knowledge to make that call. I haven't watched the video with sound (sitting on an old computer with no sound right now), so I don't know whather than would change my perception. However, I do know that even if he got enjoyment from it, he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it. I never said that child porn had to be sexually explicit. I'm saying it involved the exploitation of children. This is not exploitation of the boy for the sake of child pornography (at least not that we know of  ). He just happens to be naked, the context not at all related. Now, if you're a family father who takes pictures of your daughter while she is naked and bathing there is nothing wrong with that, even if you have her pose. There is nothing wrong with putting these pictures in your family album and showing said album to visitors. However, if you circulate all the nude pictures among other adult males the circumstances do start to point towards to use of these pictures as child pornography. You must be conscious about the heavy stigma that had developed around child pornograpy due to media coverage of incidents. This has gotten to the point where some fathers are afraid to touch their own daughters. It is important to insist that the fear of child explotation does invade and dictate other areas of life, where children can be naked in completely normal circumstances, where they are not being exploited. I'm narrow-minded? Ok I'll bite, from what personal experiences have you concluded that this kid could potentially enjoy this, not related to you by friends, the internet, or anywhere else. What PERSONAL experience with being publicly stripped down by 3 other people and enjoying it do you have? You say that you're using your experience and knowledge, so knowledge of what? do you have a degree in child psychology? most likely not, were you as a child stripped down naked and had a video of it posted on the internet for thousands to see? Also the whole " he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it." thing....11 year olds are not Smart enough to have thought that out While being Assaulted, this isn't speculation, this is fact, Kids are not that smart, that's why Adults make the majority of their decisions for them. but no, this kid is obviously faking it cause he wants the sexy time with the ladies right? ofc couldn't possible be he is actually being traumatized, potentially for life or anything? not at all. Of course they can be that smart. As I have speculated earlier, he might have engaged in a similar pattern of behaviour that eventually lead to this, so he understands what will make the girls do what he wants. I think the part of this that is most likely cause actual resistance is the fact that he is being filmed and could risk a degree of exposure that he would find too much. It's silly of your to assert that to understand anything you have to have experiences precisely that or have to have a degree. Me not being a child psychologist does not mean that I would not be able to understand a child better than one such would. And experiences with something similar would give me and understand of what could be going on in this situation. And you poking fun at my statements or exaggerating them does not make them any less valid. My point stands.
no,no,no you don't just get to side-step. i asked you from what personal Experiences did you draw your conclusions from. your Speculation is just that...speculation,unless you can provide some sort of evidence, from personal experience or a professional source, that proves that your speculation has the potential to be accurate, what you're saying is nothing more then inane prattle from a sexist. Furthermore, if you're suggesting he engaged in similar behaviour then there is also a likely chance that there is documentation, and possible news coverage of that incident....Furthermore implying that an elven year old has that sophisticated a concept of manipulation, which is exactly what it would be is a little bit preposterous. you said from your own experiences, from your own intuition you drew this conclusion specifically. What experience? what made you draw this conclusion? At the age of eleven I can say with confidence that nearly every eleven year old would find being publicly stripped too much exposure.
|
The right punishment: Let the exact same thing happen with 17 year old boys to each of those bitches.
|
This is one of the most disgusting and degrading things a child can do to another, the panic and fear the kid must have been growing through.
The immature, horrible people, attempting to either justify this or attempting to show off by wishing it happened to them should take a long hard look in the mirror and think about how real humans interact. Disgusting.
|
Last post in this thread, i cant take this sexist bullshit in here.
Just get the girls some community service, they need to be punished in order to advance in gender equality. Not necessarily a note in their criminal record, but something like community service for a not so short time would be the least i expect from this incident. The crime is not supposed to be determined on the intentions of the offender, much more the damage that was caused by the act itself. I dont think the kid enjoyed it in the least bit. Having been in a quite similar position myself i think i have probably the best idea what is going on in him. Not to say i KNOW whats going on inside of him but i think i have a pretty good idea.
TL;DR: i think the boy might have been mentally damaged, girls should at least get community service.
|
On June 06 2011 08:49 gold_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:38 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:28 gold_ wrote:On June 06 2011 08:13 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:56 gold_ wrote:On June 06 2011 07:44 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:33 Mordiford wrote:On June 06 2011 07:11 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:56 NinjaDrone wrote:
And if this had happened to a girl I doubt anyone would be like "herp derp derp she probably enjoyed it." When is the double standard for men and women on these matters going to stop. Molestation and rape are serious crimes where gender of offender and victim do not matter. Of course they wouldn't. They would interpret it differently, based on their experience and knowledge. They would know that girls at that age are extremely sensitive (developing identity, emotionally fragile, etc.) and are conscious about physical things. As they generally place more weight on appearances, they would not only see the display as a humiliating one, but one that changes their self-image. There is more of a chance that this would affect a girl's relation to the other gender (with boys often being more motivated to get to know the other gender while girls are more held back) and that being overpowered physically would make her very uneasy in the future (unlike for boys, who likely will have experienced this frequently). Needless to say, we don't actually know. We base our interpretation on what we can see and what we have experienced. In our case, we don't know much, since we didn't see the incident, don't fully understand the context and don't know the people involved. It has nothing to do with double standards, and I'm sure people would react strongly if the girls actually did rape the boy or something to that effect (if not, at least, then you can talk about double standards). As of now, nothing happened that requires legal involvement. Can you cite a fucking source? I don't understand where people are getting all this shit from... So if a guy does it the girl has more of a chance to be traumatized and scarred than if a girl does it to a guy? I don't believe this assumption is true, particularly at that age. Also, I don't know about this "Boys are more motivated to get to know the other gender", there is timidness and openness on both sides. I also really disagree with the person who said that one is more likely to end in murder or what not, once again, I don't know about that... Also, the doubt standard still exist because we're talking about a situation where boys strip a girl in a similar fashion to this, not in a situation where they rape a girl. And this is still a legal matter, if you watch the video it involves assault. People don't cite sources to make judgement calls in everyday situations. I already mentioned where I'm getting this from; intuition. Regardless of what any scientific explanation will say, we understand our sorroudings from how we interpret our experiences. As such, this understanding motivates a large majority of any actions we will make. It sounds like you have a different interpretations of the events and possible consequences of what occurred. Just like me, you will have a bias that we cause you to interpret it one way or another. As it happens, people will commonly interpret the situation the way I do (the girls being more likely to be traumatized) and as a result will act from these assumptions (whether this manifests in the legal system, parents' reactions or the school's response). Just like the example I made about terrorists, where they are assumed to be more dangerous and are therefore treated differently in a specific situation. The main point is that this action is not motivated for a bias towards favouring girls, but simply an interpretation of events. I'm sure there will be other sitiuations where people react more harshly because it was a girl who did it rather than a boy - all depends on the context. Your thinking is the type of thinking that needs to change if equality is to prevail. Young boys are just as emotional as young girls, unfortunately young boys are taught to not show there feelings. If your in high school as a young boy, and you start crying like a "pussy" you will be picked on as being a "pussy" right? A young girl crying is normally seen as OK, right? Everyone treated the same please! We are all humans, don't forget that. Male or female we all have emotions, if you think otherwise you need to go see a doctor. When this boy gets ridiculed for this and becomes a drug addict and / or kills himself, then what? He was a pussy right? Should have beaten those 3 girls up, right? Saying that we all have feelings really is a moot point. As such, the ways society works creates many sensitivities. If people were socialized differently, they would feel differently about things. Our way of understanding things and reacting to them have their base in social constructs. What I say has nothing to do with equality, but simply how different situations would affect different people based on their bagground. No doubt that some boys could be affected gravely by this situation, it's just less likely. Just like it's less likely that the situation would turn into rape because the aggressors were girls. That doesn't mean that men or women should have different opportunities in the work market - it's simple something we judge on a situational bases based on our past experiences. It seems like what you are addressing is not legislative part of equality, but the stigma that you can feel due to the socializaiton. That you're excluded from a group or treated differently because you don't exhibit the desired or expected behaviour in some way. I have no doubt that this can feel very unjust, and it's important that people are aware of the effects of something like gender roles. However, it's not something you can legislate. It just something you have to deal with by breaking the norms or otherwise compensating for what reactions you might receive in a specific situation. I beg to differ. Who would be ridiculed more for this happening to them? A "helpless" young girl who can't defend herself ( Your rational thinking, all girls are wusses. Right? ), or a "strong" young boy who should be able to defend himself? This is going by your own thinking, the boy would be the one that would get ridiculed, the girl would get comfort and people to talk to. I think you must have confused my post with another, given your reference to characteristics "helpless", "wusses" or "strong". However, regardless of whether this is our intepretation, these characteristics need not be the most important ones in determining how we react to such incident. I pointed out some other factors in a previous post of mine. OK I may have read your posts and interpreted your posts as basically stating that, sorry. But answer this question "Who would be ridiculed more for this happening to them?"
As I see it, it's not important who would be ridiculed the most. The question is rather that which I have already addressed: Who would be affected most and how?
Either way, I'll indulge your hypothetical point and say that based on this isolated incident, a boy would likely receive the most ridicule as a result of this incident. This depends on many factors, of course. It could be that girls were normally not ridiculed by boys at this hypothetical school, and the event served to legitimize that this happened because one of the "alpha males" did it as an act of bullying. The girl, being ugly, fat or having some other characteristic that would make her the likely target of bullying, suddenly started to become bullied a lot more. In this scenario, but boy wouldn't be bullied quite as much, as he would more likely be considered one of several "targets". So, really, that is very hard to generalize, since specific circumstances are more important that the general psychology of it.
|
If the genders in this were reversed this would be one hell of a shitstorm.
|
On June 06 2011 08:49 Nanoko wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:34 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:24 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:04 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 06:36 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:24 ChinaRestaurant wrote:On June 06 2011 06:06 Asjo wrote:
I see this as a harsh prank by the girls, not a legal matter. Also, I think we have to consider that maybe the kid secretly liked this. The video aside, it's mostly playing around involving close physical contact with girls ...
The reason that people would react differently if it was a bunch of boys would only be due to rationalizations in regards to the sexual aspect of it. People interpret behaviour, consider what it might lead to, and act preventatively. Perhaps this might sometimes lead to an overreaction, but that doesn't mean that you should also overreact to a single instance of bullying by girls in the name of equality. As it is, it was a bunch of young kids acting immaturely and getting physical about it. Obviously, the school/parents will react to avoid things escalating, but as such there is nothing outrageous about the interaction.
I don't know if the comments in this thread about child porn are serious. However, just because someone underage is filmed nude, does not in any way make it child porn. Nudity is the most natural thing in the world. Child porn is about exploitation of children and the often sexualized depiction of such. I dont think youve ever undressed or have been undressed unwillingly in front of relative strangers have you? Try putting yourself in the shoes of the boy, 3 years younger and alone, in public, getting undressed while being kept down by the girls. Sure is quite a lot of humiliation in that. Something similar happened to me once, just that the people doing it were 3 boys from my class and they undressed me for practically everyone in my class to see. Believe me there is nothing to secretly enjoy about this at that age. Later on in your life when you might or might not develop kinks and fetishes is another thing, but dont tell me an 11 year old might be into humiliation, even if it involved being in close contact with some girls. I beg to differ about your last point. You can develop certain ways of relating to girls in terms physical contact, conversation, etc. At this age your hormones might be kicking in, and you're desperate to somehow get in touch with the girls. So, based on whatever experience you have, you assume a behaviour that allows you to do so. This might mean willingly engaging is humiliating situations of some kind and repeating this due to past "success". For all we know, the boy might have somehow tries to encourage the reaction of the girls, even if not this specific act. We don't know. But I certainly wouldn't count out the fact that the boy might have enjoyed it. The other you example you give is more clear cut. At this age, boys start getting more insecure about group dynamics and will battle for dominance. Your lack of power in relation to the boys that you compete with being so clearly displayed will certainly mark you. Mind you, it likely won't have any long-term effects, but you certainly won't like it. Even more so, the situation being designed to humiliate you (carried out for the audience), not just and act of fun/soperiority/venting, enhances this effect. Add to that the fact that most of us get humiliated terribly during our younger years, often against our will. More often than not, it does not weaken us. We learn from it and grow. It's an integral part of interaction at this stage, and if we never get to be foolish kids and act out all our ugly feelings and go through all the motions, there is little chance of use growing up as wise and well-balanced adults. This doesn't mean that kids should behave and treat each other well, but often this comes as part of a process. There will be bullying, people will act to stop the bullying, and hopefully everyone will learn from it. First of all let's say he did enjoy it..why was he screaming and bawling his eyes out?,if I am correct in believing that being publicly humiliated to some people is enjoyable...they wouldn't be screaming or protesting against it would they? Call me crazy, but when people do stuff that they enjoy (Even S&M activities) they don't react in the same way that kid did...do they? NO! Good, now we're learning! Also the whole "Close physical contact with girls" thing, at the onset of puberty (can start in either sex between ages of 10-13, potentially earlier, potentially later). You begin to develop an interest in girls...that is not to say you want to see them NAKED OR that you want THEM TO SEE YOU NAKED, you merely begin to get interested at them. You're not by any means "Desperate" to get into contact with girls, in my experience most guys are scared to hell to even TALK to a girl at around that age BECAUSE of their new found interest in them. It's not like puberty hits and boys are just like "Wow...I never thought about this before but...girls..are awesome, I wanna hang out with them...and ...i get this weird feeling whenever I'm near them..i wonder if they touch me?....". I really am astonished at how you, and people like you can think this way..it's Mind boggling, absolutely Mind Boggling. as for it not being child porn, Clearly you do not know what child porn is, they do not have to be sexually explicit and child nudity IS considered Child Porn. Maybe at ages 1-4 i can see it not being child porn, cause it's just a baby...but even then there are some Sick Fucks out there. I'm honestly hoping you're just trolling, because this is a pretty fucked up way to look at this....saying that kid, who was clearly NOT enjoying being publicly humiliated and assaulted, could've liked it is just...Wow I would say you have a very narrow-minded interpreation of what I am saying. My point is completely valid; he could definitely have enjoyed it. I'm using my own experience and knowledge to make that call. I haven't watched the video with sound (sitting on an old computer with no sound right now), so I don't know whather than would change my perception. However, I do know that even if he got enjoyment from it, he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it. I never said that child porn had to be sexually explicit. I'm saying it involved the exploitation of children. This is not exploitation of the boy for the sake of child pornography (at least not that we know of ). He just happens to be naked, the context not at all related. Now, if you're a family father who takes pictures of your daughter while she is naked and bathing there is nothing wrong with that, even if you have her pose. There is nothing wrong with putting these pictures in your family album and showing said album to visitors. However, if you circulate all the nude pictures among other adult males the circumstances do start to point towards to use of these pictures as child pornography. You must be conscious about the heavy stigma that had developed around child pornograpy due to media coverage of incidents. This has gotten to the point where some fathers are afraid to touch their own daughters. It is important to insist that the fear of child explotation does invade and dictate other areas of life, where children can be naked in completely normal circumstances, where they are not being exploited. I'm narrow-minded? Ok I'll bite, from what personal experiences have you concluded that this kid could potentially enjoy this, not related to you by friends, the internet, or anywhere else. What PERSONAL experience with being publicly stripped down by 3 other people and enjoying it do you have? You say that you're using your experience and knowledge, so knowledge of what? do you have a degree in child psychology? most likely not, were you as a child stripped down naked and had a video of it posted on the internet for thousands to see? Also the whole " he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it." thing....11 year olds are not Smart enough to have thought that out While being Assaulted, this isn't speculation, this is fact, Kids are not that smart, that's why Adults make the majority of their decisions for them. but no, this kid is obviously faking it cause he wants the sexy time with the ladies right? ofc couldn't possible be he is actually being traumatized, potentially for life or anything? not at all. Of course they can be that smart. As I have speculated earlier, he might have engaged in a similar pattern of behaviour that eventually lead to this, so he understands what will make the girls do what he wants. I think the part of this that is most likely cause actual resistance is the fact that he is being filmed and could risk a degree of exposure that he would find too much. It's silly of your to assert that to understand anything you have to have experiences precisely that or have to have a degree. Me not being a child psychologist does not mean that I would not be able to understand a child better than one such would. And experiences with something similar would give me and understand of what could be going on in this situation. And you poking fun at my statements or exaggerating them does not make them any less valid. My point stands. no,no,no you don't just get to side-step. i asked you from what personal Experiences did you draw your conclusions from. your Speculation is just that...speculation,unless you can provide some sort of evidence, from personal experience or a professional source, that proves that your speculation has the potential to be accurate, what you're saying is nothing more then inane prattle from a sexist. Furthermore, if you're suggesting he engaged in similar behaviour then there is also a likely chance that there is documentation, and possible news coverage of that incident....Furthermore implying that an elven year old has that sophisticated a concept of manipulation, which is exactly what it would be is a little bit preposterous. you said from your own experiences, from your own intuition you drew this conclusion specifically. What experience? what made you draw this conclusion? At the age of eleven I can say with confidence that nearly every eleven year old would find being publicly stripped too much exposure.
Your insistence on evidence simply forces me to repeat my previous point; it's intuition, the sum of all our experiences. I am not going to write several pages of life experiences which might give me an insight into the different aspects of human behaviour that are represented in the situation. Suffice to say, most 27-year olds would have sufficient experience to make an informed interpretation of this situation.
I doubt anyone will "document" other incidents, unless this went to court. I don't see what revelance it has to bring this up.
|
On June 06 2011 09:01 Asjo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:34 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:24 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:04 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 06:36 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:24 ChinaRestaurant wrote:On June 06 2011 06:06 Asjo wrote:
I see this as a harsh prank by the girls, not a legal matter. Also, I think we have to consider that maybe the kid secretly liked this. The video aside, it's mostly playing around involving close physical contact with girls ...
The reason that people would react differently if it was a bunch of boys would only be due to rationalizations in regards to the sexual aspect of it. People interpret behaviour, consider what it might lead to, and act preventatively. Perhaps this might sometimes lead to an overreaction, but that doesn't mean that you should also overreact to a single instance of bullying by girls in the name of equality. As it is, it was a bunch of young kids acting immaturely and getting physical about it. Obviously, the school/parents will react to avoid things escalating, but as such there is nothing outrageous about the interaction.
I don't know if the comments in this thread about child porn are serious. However, just because someone underage is filmed nude, does not in any way make it child porn. Nudity is the most natural thing in the world. Child porn is about exploitation of children and the often sexualized depiction of such. I dont think youve ever undressed or have been undressed unwillingly in front of relative strangers have you? Try putting yourself in the shoes of the boy, 3 years younger and alone, in public, getting undressed while being kept down by the girls. Sure is quite a lot of humiliation in that. Something similar happened to me once, just that the people doing it were 3 boys from my class and they undressed me for practically everyone in my class to see. Believe me there is nothing to secretly enjoy about this at that age. Later on in your life when you might or might not develop kinks and fetishes is another thing, but dont tell me an 11 year old might be into humiliation, even if it involved being in close contact with some girls. I beg to differ about your last point. You can develop certain ways of relating to girls in terms physical contact, conversation, etc. At this age your hormones might be kicking in, and you're desperate to somehow get in touch with the girls. So, based on whatever experience you have, you assume a behaviour that allows you to do so. This might mean willingly engaging is humiliating situations of some kind and repeating this due to past "success". For all we know, the boy might have somehow tries to encourage the reaction of the girls, even if not this specific act. We don't know. But I certainly wouldn't count out the fact that the boy might have enjoyed it. The other you example you give is more clear cut. At this age, boys start getting more insecure about group dynamics and will battle for dominance. Your lack of power in relation to the boys that you compete with being so clearly displayed will certainly mark you. Mind you, it likely won't have any long-term effects, but you certainly won't like it. Even more so, the situation being designed to humiliate you (carried out for the audience), not just and act of fun/soperiority/venting, enhances this effect. Add to that the fact that most of us get humiliated terribly during our younger years, often against our will. More often than not, it does not weaken us. We learn from it and grow. It's an integral part of interaction at this stage, and if we never get to be foolish kids and act out all our ugly feelings and go through all the motions, there is little chance of use growing up as wise and well-balanced adults. This doesn't mean that kids should behave and treat each other well, but often this comes as part of a process. There will be bullying, people will act to stop the bullying, and hopefully everyone will learn from it. First of all let's say he did enjoy it..why was he screaming and bawling his eyes out?,if I am correct in believing that being publicly humiliated to some people is enjoyable...they wouldn't be screaming or protesting against it would they? Call me crazy, but when people do stuff that they enjoy (Even S&M activities) they don't react in the same way that kid did...do they? NO! Good, now we're learning! Also the whole "Close physical contact with girls" thing, at the onset of puberty (can start in either sex between ages of 10-13, potentially earlier, potentially later). You begin to develop an interest in girls...that is not to say you want to see them NAKED OR that you want THEM TO SEE YOU NAKED, you merely begin to get interested at them. You're not by any means "Desperate" to get into contact with girls, in my experience most guys are scared to hell to even TALK to a girl at around that age BECAUSE of their new found interest in them. It's not like puberty hits and boys are just like "Wow...I never thought about this before but...girls..are awesome, I wanna hang out with them...and ...i get this weird feeling whenever I'm near them..i wonder if they touch me?....". I really am astonished at how you, and people like you can think this way..it's Mind boggling, absolutely Mind Boggling. as for it not being child porn, Clearly you do not know what child porn is, they do not have to be sexually explicit and child nudity IS considered Child Porn. Maybe at ages 1-4 i can see it not being child porn, cause it's just a baby...but even then there are some Sick Fucks out there. I'm honestly hoping you're just trolling, because this is a pretty fucked up way to look at this....saying that kid, who was clearly NOT enjoying being publicly humiliated and assaulted, could've liked it is just...Wow I would say you have a very narrow-minded interpreation of what I am saying. My point is completely valid; he could definitely have enjoyed it. I'm using my own experience and knowledge to make that call. I haven't watched the video with sound (sitting on an old computer with no sound right now), so I don't know whather than would change my perception. However, I do know that even if he got enjoyment from it, he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it. I never said that child porn had to be sexually explicit. I'm saying it involved the exploitation of children. This is not exploitation of the boy for the sake of child pornography (at least not that we know of ). He just happens to be naked, the context not at all related. Now, if you're a family father who takes pictures of your daughter while she is naked and bathing there is nothing wrong with that, even if you have her pose. There is nothing wrong with putting these pictures in your family album and showing said album to visitors. However, if you circulate all the nude pictures among other adult males the circumstances do start to point towards to use of these pictures as child pornography. You must be conscious about the heavy stigma that had developed around child pornograpy due to media coverage of incidents. This has gotten to the point where some fathers are afraid to touch their own daughters. It is important to insist that the fear of child explotation does invade and dictate other areas of life, where children can be naked in completely normal circumstances, where they are not being exploited. I'm narrow-minded? Ok I'll bite, from what personal experiences have you concluded that this kid could potentially enjoy this, not related to you by friends, the internet, or anywhere else. What PERSONAL experience with being publicly stripped down by 3 other people and enjoying it do you have? You say that you're using your experience and knowledge, so knowledge of what? do you have a degree in child psychology? most likely not, were you as a child stripped down naked and had a video of it posted on the internet for thousands to see? Also the whole " he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it." thing....11 year olds are not Smart enough to have thought that out While being Assaulted, this isn't speculation, this is fact, Kids are not that smart, that's why Adults make the majority of their decisions for them. but no, this kid is obviously faking it cause he wants the sexy time with the ladies right? ofc couldn't possible be he is actually being traumatized, potentially for life or anything? not at all. Of course they can be that smart. As I have speculated earlier, he might have engaged in a similar pattern of behaviour that eventually lead to this, so he understands what will make the girls do what he wants. I think the part of this that is most likely cause actual resistance is the fact that he is being filmed and could risk a degree of exposure that he would find too much. It's silly of your to assert that to understand anything you have to have experiences precisely that or have to have a degree. Me not being a child psychologist does not mean that I would not be able to understand a child better than one such would. And experiences with something similar would give me and understand of what could be going on in this situation. And you poking fun at my statements or exaggerating them does not make them any less valid. My point stands. no,no,no you don't just get to side-step. i asked you from what personal Experiences did you draw your conclusions from. your Speculation is just that...speculation,unless you can provide some sort of evidence, from personal experience or a professional source, that proves that your speculation has the potential to be accurate, what you're saying is nothing more then inane prattle from a sexist. Furthermore, if you're suggesting he engaged in similar behaviour then there is also a likely chance that there is documentation, and possible news coverage of that incident....Furthermore implying that an elven year old has that sophisticated a concept of manipulation, which is exactly what it would be is a little bit preposterous. you said from your own experiences, from your own intuition you drew this conclusion specifically. What experience? what made you draw this conclusion? At the age of eleven I can say with confidence that nearly every eleven year old would find being publicly stripped too much exposure. Your insistence on evidence simply forces me to repeat my previous point; it's intuition, the sum of all our experiences. I am not going to write several pages of life experiences which might give me an insight into the different aspects of human behaviour that are represented in the situation. Suffice to say, most 27-year olds would have sufficient experience to make an informed interpretation of this situation. I doubt anyone will "document" other incidents, unless this went to court. I don't see what revelance it has to bring this up.
See, this is a double standard and this is what makes you sexist...
|
Yeeahhh... Boys do that to girls they are dangerous perverts...
fucking lame...
|
On June 06 2011 09:02 Mordiford wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 09:01 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:34 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:24 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:04 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 06:36 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:24 ChinaRestaurant wrote:On June 06 2011 06:06 Asjo wrote:
I see this as a harsh prank by the girls, not a legal matter. Also, I think we have to consider that maybe the kid secretly liked this. The video aside, it's mostly playing around involving close physical contact with girls ...
The reason that people would react differently if it was a bunch of boys would only be due to rationalizations in regards to the sexual aspect of it. People interpret behaviour, consider what it might lead to, and act preventatively. Perhaps this might sometimes lead to an overreaction, but that doesn't mean that you should also overreact to a single instance of bullying by girls in the name of equality. As it is, it was a bunch of young kids acting immaturely and getting physical about it. Obviously, the school/parents will react to avoid things escalating, but as such there is nothing outrageous about the interaction.
I don't know if the comments in this thread about child porn are serious. However, just because someone underage is filmed nude, does not in any way make it child porn. Nudity is the most natural thing in the world. Child porn is about exploitation of children and the often sexualized depiction of such. I dont think youve ever undressed or have been undressed unwillingly in front of relative strangers have you? Try putting yourself in the shoes of the boy, 3 years younger and alone, in public, getting undressed while being kept down by the girls. Sure is quite a lot of humiliation in that. Something similar happened to me once, just that the people doing it were 3 boys from my class and they undressed me for practically everyone in my class to see. Believe me there is nothing to secretly enjoy about this at that age. Later on in your life when you might or might not develop kinks and fetishes is another thing, but dont tell me an 11 year old might be into humiliation, even if it involved being in close contact with some girls. I beg to differ about your last point. You can develop certain ways of relating to girls in terms physical contact, conversation, etc. At this age your hormones might be kicking in, and you're desperate to somehow get in touch with the girls. So, based on whatever experience you have, you assume a behaviour that allows you to do so. This might mean willingly engaging is humiliating situations of some kind and repeating this due to past "success". For all we know, the boy might have somehow tries to encourage the reaction of the girls, even if not this specific act. We don't know. But I certainly wouldn't count out the fact that the boy might have enjoyed it. The other you example you give is more clear cut. At this age, boys start getting more insecure about group dynamics and will battle for dominance. Your lack of power in relation to the boys that you compete with being so clearly displayed will certainly mark you. Mind you, it likely won't have any long-term effects, but you certainly won't like it. Even more so, the situation being designed to humiliate you (carried out for the audience), not just and act of fun/soperiority/venting, enhances this effect. Add to that the fact that most of us get humiliated terribly during our younger years, often against our will. More often than not, it does not weaken us. We learn from it and grow. It's an integral part of interaction at this stage, and if we never get to be foolish kids and act out all our ugly feelings and go through all the motions, there is little chance of use growing up as wise and well-balanced adults. This doesn't mean that kids should behave and treat each other well, but often this comes as part of a process. There will be bullying, people will act to stop the bullying, and hopefully everyone will learn from it. First of all let's say he did enjoy it..why was he screaming and bawling his eyes out?,if I am correct in believing that being publicly humiliated to some people is enjoyable...they wouldn't be screaming or protesting against it would they? Call me crazy, but when people do stuff that they enjoy (Even S&M activities) they don't react in the same way that kid did...do they? NO! Good, now we're learning! Also the whole "Close physical contact with girls" thing, at the onset of puberty (can start in either sex between ages of 10-13, potentially earlier, potentially later). You begin to develop an interest in girls...that is not to say you want to see them NAKED OR that you want THEM TO SEE YOU NAKED, you merely begin to get interested at them. You're not by any means "Desperate" to get into contact with girls, in my experience most guys are scared to hell to even TALK to a girl at around that age BECAUSE of their new found interest in them. It's not like puberty hits and boys are just like "Wow...I never thought about this before but...girls..are awesome, I wanna hang out with them...and ...i get this weird feeling whenever I'm near them..i wonder if they touch me?....". I really am astonished at how you, and people like you can think this way..it's Mind boggling, absolutely Mind Boggling. as for it not being child porn, Clearly you do not know what child porn is, they do not have to be sexually explicit and child nudity IS considered Child Porn. Maybe at ages 1-4 i can see it not being child porn, cause it's just a baby...but even then there are some Sick Fucks out there. I'm honestly hoping you're just trolling, because this is a pretty fucked up way to look at this....saying that kid, who was clearly NOT enjoying being publicly humiliated and assaulted, could've liked it is just...Wow I would say you have a very narrow-minded interpreation of what I am saying. My point is completely valid; he could definitely have enjoyed it. I'm using my own experience and knowledge to make that call. I haven't watched the video with sound (sitting on an old computer with no sound right now), so I don't know whather than would change my perception. However, I do know that even if he got enjoyment from it, he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it. I never said that child porn had to be sexually explicit. I'm saying it involved the exploitation of children. This is not exploitation of the boy for the sake of child pornography (at least not that we know of ). He just happens to be naked, the context not at all related. Now, if you're a family father who takes pictures of your daughter while she is naked and bathing there is nothing wrong with that, even if you have her pose. There is nothing wrong with putting these pictures in your family album and showing said album to visitors. However, if you circulate all the nude pictures among other adult males the circumstances do start to point towards to use of these pictures as child pornography. You must be conscious about the heavy stigma that had developed around child pornograpy due to media coverage of incidents. This has gotten to the point where some fathers are afraid to touch their own daughters. It is important to insist that the fear of child explotation does invade and dictate other areas of life, where children can be naked in completely normal circumstances, where they are not being exploited. I'm narrow-minded? Ok I'll bite, from what personal experiences have you concluded that this kid could potentially enjoy this, not related to you by friends, the internet, or anywhere else. What PERSONAL experience with being publicly stripped down by 3 other people and enjoying it do you have? You say that you're using your experience and knowledge, so knowledge of what? do you have a degree in child psychology? most likely not, were you as a child stripped down naked and had a video of it posted on the internet for thousands to see? Also the whole " he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it." thing....11 year olds are not Smart enough to have thought that out While being Assaulted, this isn't speculation, this is fact, Kids are not that smart, that's why Adults make the majority of their decisions for them. but no, this kid is obviously faking it cause he wants the sexy time with the ladies right? ofc couldn't possible be he is actually being traumatized, potentially for life or anything? not at all. Of course they can be that smart. As I have speculated earlier, he might have engaged in a similar pattern of behaviour that eventually lead to this, so he understands what will make the girls do what he wants. I think the part of this that is most likely cause actual resistance is the fact that he is being filmed and could risk a degree of exposure that he would find too much. It's silly of your to assert that to understand anything you have to have experiences precisely that or have to have a degree. Me not being a child psychologist does not mean that I would not be able to understand a child better than one such would. And experiences with something similar would give me and understand of what could be going on in this situation. And you poking fun at my statements or exaggerating them does not make them any less valid. My point stands. no,no,no you don't just get to side-step. i asked you from what personal Experiences did you draw your conclusions from. your Speculation is just that...speculation,unless you can provide some sort of evidence, from personal experience or a professional source, that proves that your speculation has the potential to be accurate, what you're saying is nothing more then inane prattle from a sexist. Furthermore, if you're suggesting he engaged in similar behaviour then there is also a likely chance that there is documentation, and possible news coverage of that incident....Furthermore implying that an elven year old has that sophisticated a concept of manipulation, which is exactly what it would be is a little bit preposterous. you said from your own experiences, from your own intuition you drew this conclusion specifically. What experience? what made you draw this conclusion? At the age of eleven I can say with confidence that nearly every eleven year old would find being publicly stripped too much exposure. Your insistence on evidence simply forces me to repeat my previous point; it's intuition, the sum of all our experiences. I am not going to write several pages of life experiences which might give me an insight into the different aspects of human behaviour that are represented in the situation. Suffice to say, most 27-year olds would have sufficient experience to make an informed interpretation of this situation. I doubt anyone will "document" other incidents, unless this went to court. I don't see what revelance it has to bring this up. See, this is a double standard and this is what makes you sexist...
You'll have to elaborate on that, I'm afraid 
The "double standard" completely missed me, but I assume the "sexist" remark comes from me making generalized statements.
I'll help you out, however. The definition of sexism on Dictionary.com:
1) attitudes or behavior based on traditional stereotypes of sexual roles.
What generalized statements I have made don't dictatice a general attidude or behaviour towards females or males that I apply to my own life. It simply making a judgement call in a specific situation based on past experience.
2) discrimination or devaluation based on a person's sex, as in restricted job opportunities; especially, such discrimination directed against women.
None of what I have said has had anything to do with discrimating or devaluating against someone due to their gender. I have simply claimed that we act based on our understanding of the specific circumstances and the likely consequences. And I have presented my interpretation as far as this goes, suggesting that it will likely be the general intepretation, which explains the reaction that people in this thread are complaining about.
|
First of all, the double standard here is disgusting. Second of all, I cant believe how many idiots there are saying that the boy probably wasnt hurt by this, and that he may have enjoyed it. It's clear that the INTENT of the girls was to completely humiliate him, why else would they go as far as to videotape it? The intent is enough for them to be held completely responsible, so whether or not the boy liked it (which he CLEARLY did not, he was screaming for his mother...) is irrelevant. That's like saying if you plan on killing someone, kill them, and then find out that the person was suicidal, then it wouldnt be murder. That doesnt make sense.
|
ok upon actually watching this video (I was just kinda high reading random shit on the site), that is really fucked up, those girls probably should have gone to court and at least gotten like community service etc..
|
This may have been asked, but I am didn't find it in the thread, so I apologize if it has been.
A lot of people are mentioning: "They are girls, that's why they won't have charges pressed against them; if they were guys, they'd get charged." So my question is - ok, say this is the situation described, but with genders reversed. And the girl's mother says: "This was a prank gone too far, I DO NOT WANT TO PRESS CHARGES, but I want the boys' parents to punish the boys." What would happen? Would the police be forced to say: "OK, we are out." or are they allowed, in this case, to say: "No, the crime is too serious, we will press charges anyway?"
|
On June 06 2011 09:13 Doorhandle wrote:
First of all, the double standard here is disgusting. Second of all, I cant believe how many idiots there are saying that the boy probably wasnt hurt by this, and that he may have enjoyed it. It's clear that the INTENT of the girls was to completely humiliate him, why else would they go as far as to videotape it? The intent is enough for them to be held completely responsible, so whether or not the boy liked it (which he CLEARLY did not, he was screaming for his mother...) is irrelevant. That's like saying if you plan on killing someone, kill them, and then find out that the person was suicidal, then it wouldnt be murder. That doesnt make sense.
Your comparison to murder holds little relevance. The reason I brought this up at all, other than provoking people into a different line of thought, is to point out the implications of the incident. I'm not saying that the boy did enjoy it, but that it's potentially ambiguous and not something that people should automatically make big deal out of (which is not necessarily in the interests of the boy). Whereas killing someone is pretty clear-cut and is certainly a big deal.
Edit: By the way, I'm off to bed (2:24 AM in Denmark), in case anyone will be waiting around for responses to their responses
|
On June 06 2011 09:13 Doorhandle wrote:
First of all, the double standard here is disgusting. Second of all, I cant believe how many idiots there are saying that the boy probably wasnt hurt by this, and that he may have enjoyed it. It's clear that the INTENT of the girls was to completely humiliate him, why else would they go as far as to videotape it? The intent is enough for them to be held completely responsible, so whether or not the boy liked it (which he CLEARLY did not, he was screaming for his mother...) is irrelevant. That's like saying if you plan on killing someone, kill them, and then find out that the person was suicidal, then it wouldnt be murder. That doesnt make sense.
I wonder how many people were watching that video. after seeing the way he was crying and fighting the girls he clearly was severely affected by what happened. The mom was wrong to not press charges, I just hope the parents of the girls are smart and strict enough to give the girls the punishment they deserve.
|
On June 06 2011 08:51 zJayy962 wrote:
The right punishment: Let the exact same thing happen with 17 year old boys to each of those bitches.
LOL that'd be brutal.
|
On June 06 2011 09:19 ePBuckets wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:51 zJayy962 wrote:
The right punishment: Let the exact same thing happen with 17 year old boys to each of those bitches. LOL that'd be brutal.
After watching the video of what they did they kinda deserve this...
|
make me feel really bad for the boy to have such a bad mother...
|
On June 06 2011 09:01 Asjo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 08:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:34 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 08:24 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 08:04 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 07:49 Nanoko wrote:On June 06 2011 06:36 Asjo wrote:On June 06 2011 06:24 ChinaRestaurant wrote:On June 06 2011 06:06 Asjo wrote:
I see this as a harsh prank by the girls, not a legal matter. Also, I think we have to consider that maybe the kid secretly liked this. The video aside, it's mostly playing around involving close physical contact with girls ...
The reason that people would react differently if it was a bunch of boys would only be due to rationalizations in regards to the sexual aspect of it. People interpret behaviour, consider what it might lead to, and act preventatively. Perhaps this might sometimes lead to an overreaction, but that doesn't mean that you should also overreact to a single instance of bullying by girls in the name of equality. As it is, it was a bunch of young kids acting immaturely and getting physical about it. Obviously, the school/parents will react to avoid things escalating, but as such there is nothing outrageous about the interaction.
I don't know if the comments in this thread about child porn are serious. However, just because someone underage is filmed nude, does not in any way make it child porn. Nudity is the most natural thing in the world. Child porn is about exploitation of children and the often sexualized depiction of such. I dont think youve ever undressed or have been undressed unwillingly in front of relative strangers have you? Try putting yourself in the shoes of the boy, 3 years younger and alone, in public, getting undressed while being kept down by the girls. Sure is quite a lot of humiliation in that. Something similar happened to me once, just that the people doing it were 3 boys from my class and they undressed me for practically everyone in my class to see. Believe me there is nothing to secretly enjoy about this at that age. Later on in your life when you might or might not develop kinks and fetishes is another thing, but dont tell me an 11 year old might be into humiliation, even if it involved being in close contact with some girls. I beg to differ about your last point. You can develop certain ways of relating to girls in terms physical contact, conversation, etc. At this age your hormones might be kicking in, and you're desperate to somehow get in touch with the girls. So, based on whatever experience you have, you assume a behaviour that allows you to do so. This might mean willingly engaging is humiliating situations of some kind and repeating this due to past "success". For all we know, the boy might have somehow tries to encourage the reaction of the girls, even if not this specific act. We don't know. But I certainly wouldn't count out the fact that the boy might have enjoyed it. The other you example you give is more clear cut. At this age, boys start getting more insecure about group dynamics and will battle for dominance. Your lack of power in relation to the boys that you compete with being so clearly displayed will certainly mark you. Mind you, it likely won't have any long-term effects, but you certainly won't like it. Even more so, the situation being designed to humiliate you (carried out for the audience), not just and act of fun/soperiority/venting, enhances this effect. Add to that the fact that most of us get humiliated terribly during our younger years, often against our will. More often than not, it does not weaken us. We learn from it and grow. It's an integral part of interaction at this stage, and if we never get to be foolish kids and act out all our ugly feelings and go through all the motions, there is little chance of use growing up as wise and well-balanced adults. This doesn't mean that kids should behave and treat each other well, but often this comes as part of a process. There will be bullying, people will act to stop the bullying, and hopefully everyone will learn from it. First of all let's say he did enjoy it..why was he screaming and bawling his eyes out?,if I am correct in believing that being publicly humiliated to some people is enjoyable...they wouldn't be screaming or protesting against it would they? Call me crazy, but when people do stuff that they enjoy (Even S&M activities) they don't react in the same way that kid did...do they? NO! Good, now we're learning! Also the whole "Close physical contact with girls" thing, at the onset of puberty (can start in either sex between ages of 10-13, potentially earlier, potentially later). You begin to develop an interest in girls...that is not to say you want to see them NAKED OR that you want THEM TO SEE YOU NAKED, you merely begin to get interested at them. You're not by any means "Desperate" to get into contact with girls, in my experience most guys are scared to hell to even TALK to a girl at around that age BECAUSE of their new found interest in them. It's not like puberty hits and boys are just like "Wow...I never thought about this before but...girls..are awesome, I wanna hang out with them...and ...i get this weird feeling whenever I'm near them..i wonder if they touch me?....". I really am astonished at how you, and people like you can think this way..it's Mind boggling, absolutely Mind Boggling. as for it not being child porn, Clearly you do not know what child porn is, they do not have to be sexually explicit and child nudity IS considered Child Porn. Maybe at ages 1-4 i can see it not being child porn, cause it's just a baby...but even then there are some Sick Fucks out there. I'm honestly hoping you're just trolling, because this is a pretty fucked up way to look at this....saying that kid, who was clearly NOT enjoying being publicly humiliated and assaulted, could've liked it is just...Wow I would say you have a very narrow-minded interpreation of what I am saying. My point is completely valid; he could definitely have enjoyed it. I'm using my own experience and knowledge to make that call. I haven't watched the video with sound (sitting on an old computer with no sound right now), so I don't know whather than would change my perception. However, I do know that even if he got enjoyment from it, he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it. I never said that child porn had to be sexually explicit. I'm saying it involved the exploitation of children. This is not exploitation of the boy for the sake of child pornography (at least not that we know of ). He just happens to be naked, the context not at all related. Now, if you're a family father who takes pictures of your daughter while she is naked and bathing there is nothing wrong with that, even if you have her pose. There is nothing wrong with putting these pictures in your family album and showing said album to visitors. However, if you circulate all the nude pictures among other adult males the circumstances do start to point towards to use of these pictures as child pornography. You must be conscious about the heavy stigma that had developed around child pornograpy due to media coverage of incidents. This has gotten to the point where some fathers are afraid to touch their own daughters. It is important to insist that the fear of child explotation does invade and dictate other areas of life, where children can be naked in completely normal circumstances, where they are not being exploited. I'm narrow-minded? Ok I'll bite, from what personal experiences have you concluded that this kid could potentially enjoy this, not related to you by friends, the internet, or anywhere else. What PERSONAL experience with being publicly stripped down by 3 other people and enjoying it do you have? You say that you're using your experience and knowledge, so knowledge of what? do you have a degree in child psychology? most likely not, were you as a child stripped down naked and had a video of it posted on the internet for thousands to see? Also the whole " he would certainly react vividly and show his dismay. This, as such, is what would serve to encourage to girls and also keep up appearances. He doesn't want it to be known that he enjoys it." thing....11 year olds are not Smart enough to have thought that out While being Assaulted, this isn't speculation, this is fact, Kids are not that smart, that's why Adults make the majority of their decisions for them. but no, this kid is obviously faking it cause he wants the sexy time with the ladies right? ofc couldn't possible be he is actually being traumatized, potentially for life or anything? not at all. Of course they can be that smart. As I have speculated earlier, he might have engaged in a similar pattern of behaviour that eventually lead to this, so he understands what will make the girls do what he wants. I think the part of this that is most likely cause actual resistance is the fact that he is being filmed and could risk a degree of exposure that he would find too much. It's silly of your to assert that to understand anything you have to have experiences precisely that or have to have a degree. Me not being a child psychologist does not mean that I would not be able to understand a child better than one such would. And experiences with something similar would give me and understand of what could be going on in this situation. And you poking fun at my statements or exaggerating them does not make them any less valid. My point stands. no,no,no you don't just get to side-step. i asked you from what personal Experiences did you draw your conclusions from. your Speculation is just that...speculation,unless you can provide some sort of evidence, from personal experience or a professional source, that proves that your speculation has the potential to be accurate, what you're saying is nothing more then inane prattle from a sexist. Furthermore, if you're suggesting he engaged in similar behaviour then there is also a likely chance that there is documentation, and possible news coverage of that incident....Furthermore implying that an elven year old has that sophisticated a concept of manipulation, which is exactly what it would be is a little bit preposterous. you said from your own experiences, from your own intuition you drew this conclusion specifically. What experience? what made you draw this conclusion? At the age of eleven I can say with confidence that nearly every eleven year old would find being publicly stripped too much exposure. Your insistence on evidence simply forces me to repeat my previous point; it's intuition, the sum of all our experiences. I am not going to write several pages of life experiences which might give me an insight into the different aspects of human behaviour that are represented in the situation. Suffice to say, most 27-year olds would have sufficient experience to make an informed interpretation of this situation. I doubt anyone will "document" other incidents, unless this went to court. I don't see what revelance it has to bring this up.
You fail to answer with evidence, yet again, relying on your "intuition" reasoning as "evidence" for your beliefs. This is not evidence, you are not making a valid argument merely by saying "well based on past experiences and my knowledge i have drawn conclusion X" . it's like me saying "Well, based on my past experience and knowledge with religious people they are all overbearing Zealots who want o Burn gays at the stake without exception" and backing up my reasoning by saying "it's intuitive thinking for me, I don't need to provide evidence"....As for 27 year olds having experiences that would make them come to the same conclusions as you, well....as you said intuition is the some of our experiences correct? then to draw this conclusion it is not without reason to say that a person would have had to spend a significant amount of time either around children who are bullied in similar manners OR went through similar experiences as a child in order to INTUITIVELY determine conclusion X,Y, or Z
Oh yes And By the way Sexism:" the belief or attitude that one sex is inherently superior to, more competent than, or more valuable than the other. It can also include this type of discrimination in regards to gender. Sexism primarily involves hatred of, or prejudice towards, either sex as a whole (see misogyny and misandry), or the application of stereotypes of masculinity in relation to men, or of femininity in relation to women.[2] It is also called male and female chauvinism."
|
Is it just me, or are girls getting more aggressive nowadays?
Certainly, this was a horrific experience for the boy (Hope he was wearing clean underwear). Should the mother have pressed charges against the girls. IMO, yes. However, playing the devil's advocate, it could very well be that she wants the incident over and done so that the boy can recover quicker.
As so many others have said, if the situation was in reverse, the boys who committed the "crime" would have to stand trial.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
