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Keep it civil guys.
Alright I am sick of warning people: Trolling, flame baiting, and derailing will result in insta bans.
The same goes for conspiracy theorists and stupidity generally.
Confirmation was as follows
- On-site DNA test which came back as 99% positive.
- photos of face sent to CIA and confirmed with photo analysis
- confirmed by 20 year old wife who live in pakistan.
This thread is specifically dedicated to the details surrounding the raid/his death. |
You sir have no idea how terrorists think.~
no u
reasons why being a "martyr" isnt enough to make up for how big this hurts al-qaeda
1. killing the enemy's leader is the biggest coup in war. we killed their leader. they couldn't stop it.
2. this shows beyond a shadow of a doubt how well we've infiltrated al qaeda, both their communications and with CIA men and informants on the ground. every terrorist leader has to look over their shoulders three times now instead of twice, worry about their security.
3. it also put an exclamation point on the fact that president obama is no different from president bush when it comes to killing terrorists: he's all for it. he's going to say yes, bomb them, or send a team in, when decider time comes. he's already shown this with his drone campaign but some people still dont believe it.
4. who knows how many things osama kept to himself, connections and sources of funds only he knew, that are now lost to al-qaeda.
all these things are worse for terrorist morale than being "happy" at osama's "martyrdom."
terrorist leaders aren't mindless idiots, they are very ruthless very practical men, and i'm sure they're bummed as shit osama took one in the forehead.
They're all bad in their own unique way.
the fox broadcasting system existed way way way before rupert murdoch and roger ailes started fox news. the two systems are totally independent from each other except that murdoch owns both and fox news gets local feeds from fox affiliate stations.
when CNN has a live feed from some local channel about a tornado somewhere, that doesnt mean CNN and the local station are the same thing. you're just being snarky.
User was warned for this post
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Well, he's dead now allright, got what he deserved, but that doesn't mean terrorism is going to to disappear. Someone will just take his place and we'll continue a war on terrorism, a war that can't really be won  .
Anyway the implications of this could be huge. We could see a split in the al quaeda organization, or a fight for power within it that could lower its power. Or some kind of strange reaction from terrorist organizations and supporters making an icon out of Osama which would be even worse that if he would still be alive.
@DeepElemBlues you're wrong. It took the world more than 10 years to do it, it's not such a great show of power.
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On May 02 2011 15:59 diehilde wrote:
apparently people gathered in front of the white house and on ground zero to celebrate bin ladens death. disgusting imo.
I swear, I'm honestly not being racist, you are the around the fourth or fifth person I've seen with a comment like this, and so far the authors have all been German. Why?
Regardless, I understand some people might think that celebrating ANY kind of death is disgusting. However, you're obviously not in their shoes. A mass murderer killing thousands of people around the world and directing one of the most deadly terrorist groups in the world was finally brought to justice (I sincerely hope you agree on that much). And by stopping Bin Laden, terrorism is dealt a huge blow symbolically and physically (but clearly more in the former). I think that's reason enough to celebrate. People aren't necessarily celebrating that a man was killed; rather, they're celebrating justice being served, and the big blow dealt to terrorist groups.
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On May 02 2011 16:08 ryanAnger wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 16:05 Drewx wrote:
Wow crazy times we live in. These scenes from the States look crazy would never expect to see anything like that where I live. If Australia were put into the exact circumstances that the US is currently, the reaction would be exactly the same. We aren't monsters for celebrating the death of a monster.
ppl are monsters for celebrating any man's death, if that's what they are actually celebrating
he was born a child, he had a mother and father and hopes and dreams. he had challenges and successes and love and fear and hate. that's reality. he was just a man like you or me and now he is dead.
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On May 02 2011 16:05 Probulous wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 15:59 diehilde wrote:
apparently people gathered in front of the white house and on ground zero to celebrate bin ladens death. disgusting imo. This is insensitive. The man was responsible for over 3000 US deaths in an unprovoked attack. He was no angel. Yes, there may have been a better way to punish him but by all accounts he died in a shoot-out. In addition, even if he was caught, he would have been found guilty and executed. To rain on people's parade because you object to the method of achieving the same outcome is insensitive. Particularly for those at ground zero. There may be a reason they are celebrating. To all americans, enjoy today.
I dont care what he did, celebrating the death of a human being is tasteless. you can be relieved because of the consequences, you can celebrate when a war is over or al qaeda disbands or smth. but celebrating the death of someone is just absurd. especially because it doesnt mean the end of terror, if anything it means more terror attacks.
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On May 02 2011 15:02 themell wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 14:55 polysciguy wrote:On May 02 2011 14:52 tryummm wrote:
I don't see what the big news is...unless the troops are all coming home. That isn't the case, however.
There were other Al Qaeda leaders, like Anwar Al-Awlaki. its the message behind it. think about it, what would happen if someone assassinated obama tonight? well, tomorrow we'd see the innaugaration of biden, would anything drastically change? probably not. so why assassinate a leader at all? morale loss and confusion among the enemy ranks. There's no "clear" leader when the original leader dies. For the presidency, It's different because there is a clear line of succession if Obama dies. For Bin Laden, it's different because there is no clear line of succession. When Bin Laden dies, no one knows who the new leader is. Instead, you'll have multiple "leaders" pop up. This causes several small groups to form, but these groups can be hostile or non-communicative to other groups. What happens is a total decrease in power as no one knows who to follow. Think of it like this. You play starcraft and you give shared control to someone. However, it's difficult for you to communicate with the other leader, so each of you start giving orders to your army. You order your army to one spot, but then he orders them to another without you knowing. That means total mayhem.
I'm afraid that analogy doesn't work. I live in Pakistan so we always follow these developments; we've more or less been the epicentre (and principal victims) of terrorism for a while. How you described the Presidency working is true, there is always a clear line of succession. But the terroist-cell-ideology model of this war is completely different. Bin Laden wasn't the first leader taken out, and in this case probably didn't even make any real plans for years. Leaders die, and more pop up, but they don't usually struggle for control. Rather, they divvy up their operation by region. You have to address the underlying causes, get better intel AND fight them militarily to stop the hydra heads growing back.
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@DeepElemBlues you're wrong. It took the world more than 10 years to do it, it's not such a great show of power.
i think you're wrong, it's incredibly hard to find one person hiding out of almost 7 billion when they have a lot of money and a whole network of people supporting them.
the real world isn't where in the world is carmen sandiego
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why did they dispose of his body so quickly?! sigh, should've shipped his ass over here and stuff him for a museum
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On May 02 2011 16:22 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 16:08 ryanAnger wrote:On May 02 2011 16:05 Drewx wrote:
Wow crazy times we live in. These scenes from the States look crazy would never expect to see anything like that where I live. If Australia were put into the exact circumstances that the US is currently, the reaction would be exactly the same. We aren't monsters for celebrating the death of a monster. ppl are monsters for celebrating any man's death, if that's what they are actually celebrating he was born a child, he had a mother and father and hopes and dreams. he had challenges and successes and love and fear and hate. that's reality. he was just a man like you or me and now he is dead.
You're a fool if you actually feel this way. Sure, he was a man, just like you and me, but that is where the similarities end. He was human, but there was no humanity about him. I celebrate his death because he deserved to die, and that is undeniable.
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I love the naivety that is people posting not to celebrate a person's death. People are celebrating the death of not only the person, but also what the person represents. Furthermore it is truly difficult not to be overjoyed when an individual who has caused mass murder, and is likely to persist in orchestrating such instances, is killed, especially in a firefight in which he participated. Don't be idiots, really, that is like being told off for celebrating the death of Hitler.
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On May 02 2011 16:22 travis wrote:
ppl are monsters for celebrating any man's death, if that's what they are actually celebrating
he was born a child, he had a mother and father and hopes and dreams. he had challenges and successes and love and fear and hate. that's reality. he was just a man like you or me and now he is dead.
Sympathy for the devil. Niiiice.
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The whole "celebrating" thing is overblown. Many, if not most, of those people outside the white house are college kids who live a few minutes away. Give college kids ANYTHING to celebrate or drink about and they will do it in a heartbeat... especially when they probably have finals tomorrow...
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Well, Osama never managed anything NEAR the scale of Hitler but here's the important bit: if he could have, he WOULD have.
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On May 02 2011 16:16 DeepElemBlues wrote:
1. killing the enemy's leader is the biggest coup in war. we killed their leader. they couldn't stop it.
Osama wasn't "leading" Al-Qaida for many years now. He was a symbolic figure, nothing more.
2. this shows beyond a shadow of a doubt how well we've infiltrated al qaeda, both their communications and with CIA men and informants on the ground. every terrorist leader has to look over their shoulders three times now instead of twice, worry about their security.
The fact that he was killed after 10 years, even though ha was the most wanted terrorist, will not scare other terrorist leaders too much I believe.
3. it also put an exclamation point on the fact that president obama is no different from president bush when it comes to killing terrorists: he's all for it. he's going to say yes, bomb them, or send a team in, when decider time comes. he's already shown this with his drone campaign but some people still dont believe it.
You honestly think that the terrorists didn't know that the American President would try to kill them before?
4. who knows how many things osama kept to himself, connections and sources of funds only he knew, that are now lost to al-qaeda.
Now this is just speculation and I don't think Al-Qaida is too worried about that...
terrorist leaders aren't mindless idiots, they are very ruthless very practical men, and i'm sure they're bummed as shit osama took one in the forehead.
Terrorist leaders aren't mindless idiots, but they are willing to die to achieve their goals. They will also realize that Osama's dead won't change their situation and will only help them recruit new people. As you said, those guys are practical...
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On May 02 2011 16:22 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 16:08 ryanAnger wrote:On May 02 2011 16:05 Drewx wrote:
Wow crazy times we live in. These scenes from the States look crazy would never expect to see anything like that where I live. If Australia were put into the exact circumstances that the US is currently, the reaction would be exactly the same. We aren't monsters for celebrating the death of a monster. ppl are monsters for celebrating any man's death, if that's what they are actually celebrating he was born a child, he had a mother and father and hopes and dreams. he had challenges and successes and love and fear and hate. that's reality. he was just a man like you or me and now he is dead.
Best troll in this thread.
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On May 02 2011 16:26 ryanAnger wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2011 16:22 travis wrote:On May 02 2011 16:08 ryanAnger wrote:On May 02 2011 16:05 Drewx wrote:
Wow crazy times we live in. These scenes from the States look crazy would never expect to see anything like that where I live. If Australia were put into the exact circumstances that the US is currently, the reaction would be exactly the same. We aren't monsters for celebrating the death of a monster. ppl are monsters for celebrating any man's death, if that's what they are actually celebrating he was born a child, he had a mother and father and hopes and dreams. he had challenges and successes and love and fear and hate. that's reality. he was just a man like you or me and now he is dead. You're a fool if you actually feel this way. Sure, he was a man, just like you and me, but that is where the similarities end. He was human, but there was no humanity about him. I celebrate his death because he deserved to die, and that is undeniable.
with the same reasoning people in the middle east celebrated the death of the 9/11 victims. I guess the difference is they are wrong and you are right, isnt it?
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On May 02 2011 16:27 FireSA wrote:
I love the naivety that is people posting not to celebrate a person's death. People are celebrating the death of not only the person, but also what the person represents. Furthermore it is truly difficult not to be overjoyed when an individual who has caused mass murder, and is likely to persist in orchestrating such instances, is killed, especially in a firefight in which he participated. Don't be idiots, really, that is like being told off for celebrating the death of Hitler.
There are people out there who find every human life to be sacred. And while they might be for one dying so that others may live, they wouldn't be "overjoyed" about it.
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It is pretty much gonna get worse. The 'new' leader will obviously have something to prove imo. And I bet he will be more 'proactive'. I guess I will be in some serious shit now lol. As it is Pakistan isn't safe atm .
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On May 02 2011 14:34 Cognizance wrote:
COUNTER-TERRORISTS WIN
This. Just posting because I am happy.
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EPT
