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Rio de Janeiro on the edge of Civil War - Page 10

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TrevorJK
Profile Joined May 2009
United States77 Posts
November 26 2010 04:49 GMT
#181
Heres a post from SA, to give another person's local perspective. It's pretty informative/good read:

+ Show Spoiler +
I live in Rio, so let me give you a local middle/high class input on the issue.

1 - The slums (favelas) are densely populated areas where poor people live. Since the 80's, they are dominated by criminal factions who make a lot of cash selling drugs (mainly cocaine and pot). With time, the local factions got richer and stronger, with heavy armament like AR-15, FAL 7.62 and M-16 rifles.

The police never really bothered them because they were corrupt (some slums are even controlled by militias formed by local cops, who also sell drugs, pirate cable, sell gas in the slum, charge protection, etc.) , the political leadership was corrupt and fuck it only poor people live there so who cares. As long as the rich, tourist areas were safe, all was fine. There were good intentions, but few practical results.

And the drug dealers went along. They controlled the slums, but didn't use their fearsome firepower to commit petty crimes. They fought between themselves for control of the slums, but avoiding confrontation with the police.

2 - 2 years ago it started to change. The state government started to implement a new idea to fight crime. They would invade the slums, dislodge the drug dealers, and implant a "Pacifying Police Station" in the slum, to assure that the criminals would never return.

During the 1st phase, from dec/2008 to nowish, the police occupied ("pacified") 12 slums. All of those were relatively isolated slums in the middle of the rich areas. Slums were it was easy to surround and establish control. The big slums in the suburbs were left untouched.

Also, the plans for occupation of a slum were widely announced in the media before the fact, so the criminals would have time to flee the slum and the occupation would occur without a shootout.

This phase was a huge success, and today, most of the slums in the rich areas are free from rifle-wielding drug dealers. Those fled to the slums in the suburbs, with all the firepower they had. Very few apprehensions (of guns, drugs or criminals) were made during those police operations.

They also sent the faction leaders, the famous drug lords, to federal max security prisons in other states, disrupting the command chain of the factions (state prisons are also a cesspool of corruption. For instance: Inmates use cellphones to simulate kidnappings and extort money from helpless/naive people).

3 - Despite losing very few men, very few guns, almost no drug and practically no money in those occupations, the factions started to lose revenue, for those occupied slums were very lucrative, and the rich people who buys cocaine wouldn't go to the suburbs to buy their drugs. Middle class drug dealers, who operated in apartments and didn't bear any guns at all, occupied the drug market. Also, the justice started to freeze the assets of the faction leaders and their family.

Finally, the governor of the state of Rio just got reelected, partially because of his security policy.

4 - So we came to this week. Apparently, faction leaders in a federal max security prison in another state managed to send a message to their underlings to start a terror campaign. Since Sunday, 77 vehicles were torched in the streets. You can see some photos here.

To counter that, the police decided to invade one of the most important slum controlled by that faction. Vila Cruzeiro, the slum occupied today, was a bastion of the criminal factions. An investigative journalist was murdered there in 2002, causing an uproar; a police helicopter was shot down there in 2009. And the police intelligence reckoned that a great number of criminals with lots of guns fled from the pacified slums to there. So they decided to invade.

5 - The invasion had logistic support of the Navy, which was surprising since the federal armed forces usually stay the hell away from crime fighting in Rio (states constitutional rights, refusal to be placed in control of state forces, lack of training as a police force in urban area.) Those APCs were even manned by Navy Marines under the command of the police. After 4 hours of gunfighting, over 200 criminals fled through the hills on the rear end of the slum to another even larger slum also controlled by that faction. Watch that video, it's really impressive. The Vila Cruzeiro slum is now completely occupied by the police forces.

The larger slum is called "Complexo do Alemão" (German's Complex), which is actually 13 slums that are really close to each other. Apparently, the police has surrounded it too, but the sheer size of that place makes establishing a perimeter very hard. To accomplish that, the Brazilian Army is sending 800 men and 10 APC, specifically to help establishing the perimeter. No announcements were made, but everyone expects that the police will start invading that slum tomorrow.

6 - Meanwhile, the terror attacks continue. Buses are still being torched, mainly in the suburbs, and I believe there will be even more attacks during the night. The police has every man available patrolling the streets, including the police band, the policemen in administrative duty and even recalling the officers in vacation. The Federal Police will help in special tasks tomorrow, and the National Security Force is ready to support the street patrolling if asked.

The torching and the terror acts probably will keep happening, since the MD of the crooks is boarding buses in pairs with a handguns and backpacks containing gas, ordering everyone out and setting fire on the vehicle from the inside. It happens in a matter of seconds, and the flames can't be put down. They are also torching parked cars in the middle of the night. The police has arrested about a dozen of these guys, and usually manage to capture the ones acting in the rich areas, away from the slums, sadly only after the facts.

7 - The reaction of the citizens is mixed. I think there's overwhelming support for the police forces, but the terror is affecting the daily routine, specially the poor people who commute using buses. Upper/Middle class people in the rich areas haven't been affected, but the images on the media are frightening, and some might feel threatened despite the lack of unusual serious criminal activities in the rich areas. (i think only 2 cars were torched in the south zone, during the night, and they were parked (so no armed robbery) and the culprits were captured.

I think that many people want to see a complete massacre of the criminals. A catharsis of sort. They don't really see the criminals as human beings no more, specially the upper/middle classes. I reckon that if the police invade the Alemão Complex tomorrow, and lots of innocent people get killed as collateral damage, there wouldn't be a huge uproar. At maximum it would be seen as a necessary tragedy. Personally, I think that scenario would suck, and I hope it doesn't happen, but I confess that part of me will be very happy about the dead criminals.

About the reaction of the poor people who live on the area, I saw an image on the TV where the locals were offering water and snacks to the police forces. That usually never happens because in the slums, people who collaborate with the police is usually killed by he criminals. So, for them to be so openly helping the police forces, it seems that they truly believe that the occupation is for good and that the criminals will not return. But I guess that they still don't like the stray bullets.

That's it, for now. Stay tuned for tomorrow's chapter. Looks like its going to be a blast.
D10
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Brazil3409 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 05:11:27
November 26 2010 04:50 GMT
#182
Yes tropa de elite is amazing, excelent movie, I hope they make 3 out of this and its a blockbuster action movie
" We are not humans having spiritual experiences. - We are spirits having human experiences." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
Jswizzy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States791 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 23:50:57
November 26 2010 05:48 GMT
#183
On November 26 2010 06:56 night terrors wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2010 06:51 Jswizzy wrote:
I was in the Navy and Rio was one of the ports we hit. I most say that Rio is the scariest play I have ever been.


Cmon man dont leave us hanging with that. Why is is the scariest place you've been to?

I don't want to bad mouth someones country since I was only there for 3 days and I am sure there is great stuff to see in BR(I lived in Panama for years and it looks bad at first glance there but once you see the rain forest and mountains it is a really cool and beautiful country just not the city area) but to sum it up Disease(aids,yellow fever), Dangerous wild life(mosquitoes, scorpions,snakes), Poverty(slums, gangs, graffiti) and I am still mad that I had to get a small poxes shot that has left a permit scar on my shoulder just to go ashore.
I always try to give a sensitive, reasoned answer. This is usually awkward, time consuming and pointless.
D10
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Brazil3409 Posts
November 26 2010 05:53 GMT
#184
On November 26 2010 14:48 Jswizzy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2010 06:56 night terrors wrote:
On November 26 2010 06:51 Jswizzy wrote:
I was in the Navy and Rio was one of the ports we hit. I most say that Rio is the scariest play I have ever been.


Cmon man dont leave us hanging with that. Why is is the scariest place you've been to?

I don't want to bad mouth someones country since I was only there for 3 days and I am sure there is great stuff to see in BR(I lived in Panama for years and it looks bad at first glance there but once you see the rain forest and mountains it is a really cool and beautiful country just not the city area) but to sum it up Disease(aids,yellow fever), Dangerous wild life(mosquitoes, scorpions,snakes), Poverty(slums, gangs, graffiti) and I am still mad that I had to get a small poxes shot that has left a permit scare on my shoulder just to go ashore.


Oh yea that sucks horribly, all Brazilians have those annoying scars
" We are not humans having spiritual experiences. - We are spirits having human experiences." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
Jemmani
Profile Joined November 2010
United States76 Posts
November 26 2010 11:04 GMT
#185
So the government is corrupt by taking money from drug lords? then it tries to clean up the place?
sucks it had to come to this but im not surprised.

really hope this ends as fast as possible and with the least amount of casualties.

be safe
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42417 Posts
November 26 2010 11:08 GMT
#186
Hope you and your friends & family will be alright.

Stay safe!
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
SeF
Profile Joined December 2008
Brazil34 Posts
November 26 2010 11:15 GMT
#187
Yeah...everyday gets more complicated there :/ It's all over the news
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42417 Posts
November 26 2010 11:21 GMT
#188
On November 26 2010 20:15 SeF wrote:
Yeah...everyday gets more complicated there :/ It's all over the news


I just wanna add, even though its so fast 2nd message to this thread,

In Finland we don't seem to have ANY news about this. Usually We aren't that behind with news like these. Weirds..
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17850 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 11:31:50
November 26 2010 11:29 GMT
#189
Yeah, definitely time to rewatch the City of God and Tropa de Elite...

Edit: And to people that actually live there:
Do you believe that "cleansing" the favelas is actually something that can happen? As it is, they definitely reduce the attractivenes of RDJ when it comes to upcoming football championships and olympics. Not to mention the drug trading and other criminal activities that are probably abundant there...
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
ZeromuS
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada13426 Posts
November 26 2010 11:59 GMT
#190
Brazil is crazy I watch Globo here in Canada sometimes and man its messed.

on a lighter note all the gangster girlfriends need to tell their men to stay in and watch novellas so the kids can go out and play j/k

Seriously good luck to you brazilians boa sorte Rio de Janeiro you may need it at the moment :S

(note: some channels in brazil offset world cup showings to preserve the Novellas original air times - no joke hence my joke comment)
StrategyRTS forever | @ZeromuS_plays | www.twitch.tv/Zeromus_
Kelberot
Profile Joined July 2010
Brazil364 Posts
November 26 2010 12:03 GMT
#191
On November 26 2010 20:29 Manit0u wrote:
Yeah, definitely time to rewatch the City of God and Tropa de Elite...

Edit: And to people that actually live there:
Do you believe that "cleansing" the favelas is actually something that can happen? As it is, they definitely reduce the attractivenes of RDJ when it comes to upcoming football championships and olympics. Not to mention the drug trading and other criminal activities that are probably abundant there...

They can enforce peace for a while. At least until 2016, maybe.

I don't think you can "cure" the problem, or that peace will last forever, but I'm happy that this is happening, it's definitely for the best.
Scruff
Profile Joined May 2010
Singapore509 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 12:35:04
November 26 2010 12:26 GMT
#192
This is really terrible. I hope not too many innocent people gets killed
I astonish myself everyday
Loanshark
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
China3094 Posts
November 26 2010 12:41 GMT
#193
When reading through the thread I was reminded of that level in Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2.

Hope everything goes well for you guys over there and that you don't get hurt. Hope the police can take out the criminals.
No dough, no go. And no mercy.
Gleen
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brazil707 Posts
November 26 2010 14:39 GMT
#194
Another day of conflicts envolving police and criminals, now at the eges of complexo do alemao... criminals even shot at a police helicopter...

Some statistics:

I don't even know the right number of vehicles burned during attacks, but of a recent news says that 60 motorbikes were found burned.

192 people were arrested since the beginings of attacks.

Near 800 soldiers from national army will be deployed to help BOPE.
I'm nowhere near good, but I still have fun playing with my probes
Tschis
Profile Joined November 2010
Brazil1511 Posts
November 26 2010 15:18 GMT
#195
On November 25 2010 19:05 Sfydjklm wrote:
i was reading about BOPE on wiki, and i was wondering what exactly does knife in the skull mean as a motto?


They kinda of have "license to kill".

I mean, it's not like they can do at free will, but most of the times when they are called, the situation is really bad, so that's what happens, bad people die.

//tx
"A coward is not someone that runs from a battle knowing he will lose. A coward is someone who challenges a weak knowing he will win."
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
November 26 2010 15:20 GMT
#196
On November 26 2010 20:21 Grettin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2010 20:15 SeF wrote:
Yeah...everyday gets more complicated there :/ It's all over the news


I just wanna add, even though its so fast 2nd message to this thread,

In Finland we don't seem to have ANY news about this. Usually We aren't that behind with news like these. Weirds..


It is not weird at all, here in the Netherlands noone is writing about it at all either, we get drowned in news about the EU financial status and stuff regarding the PIIGS countries and Iceland, and a bit of Korea on the side

Brazil?nowhere to be seen

Still,stay safe and hopefully the police will take care of it
WriterXiao8~~
theinvisiblePLER
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States110 Posts
November 26 2010 15:39 GMT
#197
On November 27 2010 00:20 Kipsate wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2010 20:21 Grettin wrote:
On November 26 2010 20:15 SeF wrote:
Yeah...everyday gets more complicated there :/ It's all over the news


I just wanna add, even though its so fast 2nd message to this thread,

In Finland we don't seem to have ANY news about this. Usually We aren't that behind with news like these. Weirds..


It is not weird at all, here in the Netherlands noone is writing about it at all either, we get drowned in news about the EU financial status and stuff regarding the PIIGS countries and Iceland, and a bit of Korea on the side

Brazil?nowhere to be seen

Still,stay safe and hopefully the police will take care of it

And you Europeans say the U.S. has no knowledge about the rest of the world... HAH
D10
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Brazil3409 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 15:46:24
November 26 2010 15:45 GMT
#198
Loot from the Invasion on Vila Cruzeiro.
[image loading]
and lol what a beard
[image loading]

" We are not humans having spiritual experiences. - We are spirits having human experiences." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
Armathai
Profile Joined October 2007
1023 Posts
November 26 2010 15:54 GMT
#199
Holy hell that's a lot of drugs. Stay safe guys over in Rio!

I wonder if the Police/Army are going to try and take the favela in small bits until they have it all or try and storm in and out at strong points.
Looking for ArcticCerebrate formerly from @USEast
fabiano
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Brazil4644 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-26 15:59:38
November 26 2010 15:59 GMT
#200
On November 27 2010 00:45 D10 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]



hahah wtf

"When the geyser died, a probe came out" - SirJolt
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