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On November 12 2010 10:33 .risingdragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:30 NIJ wrote:On November 12 2010 10:24 .risingdragoon wrote:
You think the point of the back of the bus was cus of the actual sitting in the back?
How bout you think a little? WTF equating racism to this? If racism was this little wind instead of the fucking tornado that it is, that chapter wouldn't have taken so many lives to bring to this point in time. Were you dropped as a child? if you gonna discuss this then discuss, what do you know about me huh? lol you're still too fucking little to know the world. this is barely anything compare to some of the unmovable rocks out there today. this is only gonna get better with time, whereas there's shit out there people oughta tackle head on or it'll never change.
I know that you're retarded. Which is why I asked you if you ever got dropped. Cause if you did its not your fault.
What do you know about me and my age? Yeah I thought so. Are you really that retarded?
User was temp banned for this post.
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On November 12 2010 10:30 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:24 .risingdragoon wrote:
You think the point of the back of the bus was cus of the actual sitting in the back?
How bout you think a little? WTF equating racism to this? If racism was this little wind instead of the fucking tornado that it is, that chapter wouldn't have taken so many lives to bring to this point in time. Were you dropped as a child?
If he was dropped he's not likely to remember it and shouldn't even know it unless a parent informed him.
A better question is did he have a glue-sniffing habit as a child, which would definitely explain how he's managed to equate "bunch of guys talking about random private school on a website dedicated to starcraft" to "shoving tolerance down touchy people's throats".
User was temp banned for this post.
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On November 12 2010 10:52 Krigwin wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:30 NIJ wrote:On November 12 2010 10:24 .risingdragoon wrote:
You think the point of the back of the bus was cus of the actual sitting in the back?
How bout you think a little? WTF equating racism to this? If racism was this little wind instead of the fucking tornado that it is, that chapter wouldn't have taken so many lives to bring to this point in time. Were you dropped as a child? If he was dropped he's not likely to remember it and shouldn't even know it unless a parent informed him. A better question is did he have a glue-sniffing habit as a child, which would definitely explain how he's managed to equate "bunch of guys talking about random private school on a website dedicated to starcraft" to "shoving tolerance down touchy people's throats".
WTF you talking about?
lol making shit up about me only works if I care what you say about me.
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On November 12 2010 10:47 .risingdragoon wrote:
The way bigotry does damage is if it's condoned and carried by the socio-political climate of the day. That's what was being fought against, not the physical sitting in the back of the bus which is only a symbol. The gay movement has already crossed over that line, all that is left now is a buncha technicalities and conservative sentiment which time will fix, and it's better to ease into it over time than cram it down touchy people's throats.
Then by that logic if a bus driver asked a black man to sit in the back to make room for whites in the front it'd be totally cool and people wouldn't need to overreact to it because society doesn't condone that kind of behavior anymore!
Obviously gays haven't gotten where other minorities have because we have shit like this happening every year.
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On November 12 2010 10:56 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:47 .risingdragoon wrote:
The way bigotry does damage is if it's condoned and carried by the socio-political climate of the day. That's what was being fought against, not the physical sitting in the back of the bus which is only a symbol. The gay movement has already crossed over that line, all that is left now is a buncha technicalities and conservative sentiment which time will fix, and it's better to ease into it over time than cram it down touchy people's throats. Then by that logic if a bus driver asked a black man to sit in the back to make room for whites in the front it'd be totally cool and people wouldn't need to overreact to it because society doesn't condone that kind of behavior anymore! Obviously gays haven't gotten where other minorities have because we have shit like this happening every year.
No. Gender is a different issue from race. Whoever started clumping minorities together should have realized that inane people will begin to assume parallels between them that don't necessarily exist.
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On November 12 2010 10:56 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:47 .risingdragoon wrote:
The way bigotry does damage is if it's condoned and carried by the socio-political climate of the day. That's what was being fought against, not the physical sitting in the back of the bus which is only a symbol. The gay movement has already crossed over that line, all that is left now is a buncha technicalities and conservative sentiment which time will fix, and it's better to ease into it over time than cram it down touchy people's throats. Then by that logic if a bus driver asked a black man to sit in the back to make room for whites in the front it'd be totally cool and people wouldn't need to overreact to it because society doesn't condone that kind of behavior anymore! Obviously gays haven't gotten where other minorities have because we have shit like this happening every year.
what kind of logic is that? if society doesn't condone it, why would the bus driver ask?
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5673 Posts
Guys, keep it decent, please. Personal attacks will not be tolerated.
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On November 12 2010 10:59 LunarC wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:56 overt wrote:On November 12 2010 10:47 .risingdragoon wrote:
The way bigotry does damage is if it's condoned and carried by the socio-political climate of the day. That's what was being fought against, not the physical sitting in the back of the bus which is only a symbol. The gay movement has already crossed over that line, all that is left now is a buncha technicalities and conservative sentiment which time will fix, and it's better to ease into it over time than cram it down touchy people's throats. Then by that logic if a bus driver asked a black man to sit in the back to make room for whites in the front it'd be totally cool and people wouldn't need to overreact to it because society doesn't condone that kind of behavior anymore! Obviously gays haven't gotten where other minorities have because we have shit like this happening every year. No. Gender is a different issue from race. Whoever started clumping minorities together should have realized that inane people will begin to assume parallels between them that don't necessarily exist.
I'm talking about sexual orientation not gender. Discrimination by sexual orientation is not different than discrimination by race. You cannot change your sexual orientation any easier than you can change your race.
You can argue that this case here was more about gender and not sexual orientation (though I'd disagree) but other cases where gays have been barred from formals or proms were most definitely about sexual orientation.
On November 12 2010 11:00 .risingdragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 10:56 overt wrote:On November 12 2010 10:47 .risingdragoon wrote:
The way bigotry does damage is if it's condoned and carried by the socio-political climate of the day. That's what was being fought against, not the physical sitting in the back of the bus which is only a symbol. The gay movement has already crossed over that line, all that is left now is a buncha technicalities and conservative sentiment which time will fix, and it's better to ease into it over time than cram it down touchy people's throats. Then by that logic if a bus driver asked a black man to sit in the back to make room for whites in the front it'd be totally cool and people wouldn't need to overreact to it because society doesn't condone that kind of behavior anymore! Obviously gays haven't gotten where other minorities have because we have shit like this happening every year. what kind of logic is that? if society doesn't condone it, why would the bus driver ask?
What? Just because society doesn't condone blatant racism or homophobia doesn't mean it isn't still happening.
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.risingdragoon...
The clout surrounding homosexuals and their treatment is the new civil rights movement of our time. To say that you cannot equate it to racism is absurd. At least if you were black living in the 1960s, you had support and acceptance within your family and race. Homosexuals aren't that fortunate and are sometimes even killed by their own families. They may have a better life in Western society, but look at less civilized places and you'll find that they are stoned for even acknowledging they're attracted to the same sex (which has an underlying biological cause, so it's not something they can change, just like ethnicity).
The reason why racism is a much more frequent situation is because there happens to be more black people or whatever given race than there are homosexuals.
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I'm talking about sexual orientation not gender. Discrimination by sexual orientation is not different than discrimination by race. You cannot change your sexual orientation any easier than you can change your race.
You can argue that this case here was more about gender and not sexual orientation (though I'd disagree) but other cases where gays have been barred from formals or proms were most definitely about sexual orientation.
To be fair, the school is claiming it was discrimination by gender, not by sexual orientation (its an all girls school blah blah blah). She was not allowed to bring her because she was a girl, not because she was a lesbian.
It's still sounds like bullshit to me, though.
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On November 12 2010 11:12 overt wrote:
What? Just because society doesn't condone blatant racism or homophobia doesn't mean it isn't still happening.
That's my whole fucking point.
This is a similar (imo a lesser) case to that, only instead of coming from a place of hate, this comes from a quandary of having to officiate a school function and unfortunately it's being dragged into an issue much larger and more complicated than itself.
This sucks for everybody, the girls, the school officials. Unlike most cases of racism, there is no "winner" here.
On November 12 2010 11:16 Masamune wrote:
.risingdragoon...
The clout surrounding homosexuals and their treatment is the new civil rights movement of our time. To say that you cannot equate it to racism is absurd. At least if you were black living in the 1960s, you had support and acceptance within your family and race. Homosexuals aren't that fortunate and are sometimes even killed by their own families. They may have a better life in Western society, but look at less civilized places and you'll find that they are stoned for even acknowledging they're attracted to the same sex (which has an underlying biological cause, so it's not something they can change, just like ethnicity).
The reason why racism is a much more frequent situation is because there happens to be more black people or whatever given race than there are homosexuals.
fair enough
but you're talking about it as a whole, and elsewhere in the world where where the climate hasn't shifted yet.
I'm just talking about this one incident.
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What I don't get is, how can this happen with all the equal rights legislation and stuff (ok not marriage yet but in regards to discrimination etc).
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Single-gender schools are stupid. Students at single-gender schools need to be exposed to the opposite gender so they don't become socially retarded. A school event to forcibly expose students of single-gender schools to opposite-gender peers makes perfect sense.
The problem is that this event was a formal dance, which in this society is inherently about sex/romance, and thus partner selection is expected to match sexual interest.
If the school held a more general party (games, food, music, dancing, whatever) with the theme of inviting similar-age guys for mixed-gender interaction, there wouldn't be a problem.
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I agree with the people who say this is a similar issue to when blacks and whites could not date or other such things.
I find it somewhat ironic that many straight people claim that homosexuals are immoral or sinful when they themselves act with such hatred towards others. The people who made this decision should be replaced, as far as Im concerned.
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On November 12 2010 11:19 .risingdragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 11:16 Masamune wrote:
.risingdragoon...
The clout surrounding homosexuals and their treatment is the new civil rights movement of our time. To say that you cannot equate it to racism is absurd. At least if you were black living in the 1960s, you had support and acceptance within your family and race. Homosexuals aren't that fortunate and are sometimes even killed by their own families. They may have a better life in Western society, but look at less civilized places and you'll find that they are stoned for even acknowledging they're attracted to the same sex (which has an underlying biological cause, so it's not something they can change, just like ethnicity).
The reason why racism is a much more frequent situation is because there happens to be more black people or whatever given race than there are homosexuals. fair enough but you're talking about it as a whole, and elsewhere in the world where where the climate hasn't shifted yet. I'm just talking about this one incident.
You've taken this one incident and trivialized it compared to racism as a whole. Read your posts over.
But this once incident just goes to show that there is much more tolerance of race than there is of homosexuals, so I don't see how this just being a little dance has anything to do with its significance.
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On November 12 2010 11:41 Masamune wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 11:19 .risingdragoon wrote:On November 12 2010 11:16 Masamune wrote:
.risingdragoon...
The clout surrounding homosexuals and their treatment is the new civil rights movement of our time. To say that you cannot equate it to racism is absurd. At least if you were black living in the 1960s, you had support and acceptance within your family and race. Homosexuals aren't that fortunate and are sometimes even killed by their own families. They may have a better life in Western society, but look at less civilized places and you'll find that they are stoned for even acknowledging they're attracted to the same sex (which has an underlying biological cause, so it's not something they can change, just like ethnicity).
The reason why racism is a much more frequent situation is because there happens to be more black people or whatever given race than there are homosexuals. fair enough but you're talking about it as a whole, and elsewhere in the world where where the climate hasn't shifted yet. I'm just talking about this one incident. You've taken this one incident and trivialized it compared to racism as a whole. Read your posts over. But this once incident just goes to show that there is much more tolerance of race than there is of homosexuals, so I don't see how this just being a little dance has anything to do with its significance.
you kidding me? more tolerance of race? what if I say there's also much more intolerance of race on a daily basis cus, unlike race, you can't see gayness if the person doesn't act all stereotypical? the fact that gay movement got fast-tracked in 1-2 decade to me is proof that people are a lot more tolerant of gays.
also it just occured to me that these 2 girls see each other on a daily basis. you can't say the same for the hetero girls.
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Aww no one had any responses to my 2 cents? I thought they were good and had no flame baiting....
Anyways on topic.... These kind of tolerances take time. Im filipino (though raised in the USA), back there homosexuality is in the media and everywhere and they are very much accepted.
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It's a shame, but scratch many Australians and you'll find a White Australian. Unfortunately this bigotry doesn't just extend to race. While some countries I can think of are probably worse off, we have a long way to go until we're as liberal as we preferably should be.
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On November 12 2010 11:54 .risingdragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2010 11:41 Masamune wrote:On November 12 2010 11:19 .risingdragoon wrote:On November 12 2010 11:16 Masamune wrote:
.risingdragoon...
The clout surrounding homosexuals and their treatment is the new civil rights movement of our time. To say that you cannot equate it to racism is absurd. At least if you were black living in the 1960s, you had support and acceptance within your family and race. Homosexuals aren't that fortunate and are sometimes even killed by their own families. They may have a better life in Western society, but look at less civilized places and you'll find that they are stoned for even acknowledging they're attracted to the same sex (which has an underlying biological cause, so it's not something they can change, just like ethnicity).
The reason why racism is a much more frequent situation is because there happens to be more black people or whatever given race than there are homosexuals. fair enough but you're talking about it as a whole, and elsewhere in the world where where the climate hasn't shifted yet. I'm just talking about this one incident. You've taken this one incident and trivialized it compared to racism as a whole. Read your posts over. But this once incident just goes to show that there is much more tolerance of race than there is of homosexuals, so I don't see how this just being a little dance has anything to do with its significance. you kidding me? more tolerance of race? what if I say there's also much more intolerance of race on a daily basis cus, unlike race, you can't see gayness if the person doesn't act all stereotypical? the fact that gay movement got fast-tracked in 1-2 decade to me is proof that people are a lot more tolerant of gays. also it just occured to me that these 2 girls see each other on a daily basis. you can't say the same for the hetero girls.
Yes, there is more tolerance of race in the West, and I'd argue elsewhere in world, in comparison to homosexuals. If this girl had brought a black male to the formal, nothing would have happened.
Saying that there is more intolerance of race because you can't see a person's sexual orientation is one of the fucking dumbest things I've seen all week. You don't go by quantity, you go by quality. There are more cases of racism because there happens to be more people of different fucking races. But when you compare the severity of treatment towards both groups, it's probably a little worse in favour of gay people. The fact that there are propositions involving their rights and their eligibility to get married in the States, whereas interracial couples don't experience any of this should give you a damn clue.
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Personally, i believe the school had the wrong of it, because there are laws (I think, don't quote me on this) that prevent this. On a side note, a lesbian couple at our school was allowed to attend our dances.
EDIT: I think the reason why there is so little tolerance with homosexuality in the west has to do with the idea that a person CHOSE to be sexually oriented this way, but this is not true. I have a gay friend, and I honestly think he didn't make the choice, he is very conscious about what people think of him, and changes himself based on it, but remains adamantly gay.
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