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Pope compares secularism to Nazism - Page 22

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Redunzl
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
862 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 15:10:58
September 20 2010 15:10 GMT
#421
what is the big fuss. this is what speeches are all about... riling up civilians to talk about nothing whilst they usurp your power. this sort of comment from the pope is certainly not without precedent.
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32051 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 15:24:06
September 20 2010 15:22 GMT
#422
On September 20 2010 23:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 20 2010 23:06 Hawk wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:32 hypercube wrote:
It's funny how public personas can get away with statements that would get you banned on any respectable message board. Not for inflamatory language, just plain old trolling;


heh, the best post was all the way back on page one.

I think my other fav (from another board) was that 'well, you're allowed to start comparing people to nazis when you've actually been a nazi'
˙
Some other stupid shit that was said during this same tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11325699
"England today is a secularised, pluralistic country. When you land at Heathrow Airport, you sometimes think you'd landed in a Third World country."
Asked whether Christians were discriminated against in the UK, he said: "Particularly in England, an aggressive neo-atheism is widespread. For example, if you wear a cross with British Airways, you're discriminated against."


Now an immature, yet funny, picture to complete my wonderful post:

[image loading]


Why do you Americans not distinguish between Catholics and Protestants/Christians, it's not the same thing. I really really do not understand, is it all just the same thing to you people?
It makes having a discussion so much more difficult when you don't distinguish between different religious schools when having a discussion about religion.

Catholicism doesn't = Christianity and it's been posted at least 10 times in this thread.

In England which the article you quoted is about, there is a huge difference between Catholics and Christians both historically and culturally. Therefore they should not be referred to as the same thing, it makes no sense.

Edit: I just searched this on Wikipedia and realize now, that I have bugger all chance of winning this definition argument. It's still awful though, in my opinion, that so many people use the same term for things that are so incredibly different both in the way that it's practiced but also historically and culturally. *sigh*


You realize that I never once made this distinction, I just quoted the source, right??

And I'm hardly some religious scholar, but I'm pretty sure what he stated was accurate. Catholics and protestants all practice some derivative of christianity, so at the very heart of the argument, they are christians in that sense.

The quote you're referencing, the guy is responding to a question where he's asked if anyone who follows the teachings of jesus is discriminated against... not once particularly sect.
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
Evil_Monkey_
Profile Joined May 2003
Denmark296 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 15:50:53
September 20 2010 15:38 GMT
#423
On September 21 2010 00:22 Hawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 20 2010 23:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 20 2010 23:06 Hawk wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:32 hypercube wrote:
It's funny how public personas can get away with statements that would get you banned on any respectable message board. Not for inflamatory language, just plain old trolling;


heh, the best post was all the way back on page one.

I think my other fav (from another board) was that 'well, you're allowed to start comparing people to nazis when you've actually been a nazi'
˙
Some other stupid shit that was said during this same tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11325699
"England today is a secularised, pluralistic country. When you land at Heathrow Airport, you sometimes think you'd landed in a Third World country."
Asked whether Christians were discriminated against in the UK, he said: "Particularly in England, an aggressive neo-atheism is widespread. For example, if you wear a cross with British Airways, you're discriminated against."


Now an immature, yet funny, picture to complete my wonderful post:

[image loading]


Why do you Americans not distinguish between Catholics and Protestants/Christians, it's not the same thing. I really really do not understand, is it all just the same thing to you people?
It makes having a discussion so much more difficult when you don't distinguish between different religious schools when having a discussion about religion.

Catholicism doesn't = Christianity and it's been posted at least 10 times in this thread.

In England which the article you quoted is about, there is a huge difference between Catholics and Christians both historically and culturally. Therefore they should not be referred to as the same thing, it makes no sense.

Edit: I just searched this on Wikipedia and realize now, that I have bugger all chance of winning this definition argument. It's still awful though, in my opinion, that so many people use the same term for things that are so incredibly different both in the way that it's practiced but also historically and culturally. *sigh*


You realize that I never once made this distinction, I just quoted the source, right??

And I'm hardly some religious scholar, but I'm pretty sure what he stated was accurate. Catholics and protestants all practice some derivative of christianity, so at the very heart of the argument, they are christians in that sense.

The quote you're referencing, the guy is responding to a question where he's asked if anyone who follows the teachings of jesus is discriminated against... not once particularly sect.

I made a mistake, but defining Protestants and Catholics as the same thing is just really destructive and confusing to a debate like this. For example, when I read the 'quote' that you posted. I'm assuming, that he's talking about the Church of England and protestants etc., because the word Christianity is used, when in fact he's probably only talking about The Roman Catholic Church and its members, if the same term is used about the whole lot, how are people going to be able to tell what's what and which group of people is being refered to? Using the term 'Christian' is far less accurate than using the term 'Roman Catholics' because it's a much wider term and this whole debate is about the Pope and the Roman Catholic Church.

Edit: I searched for the news on this quote on Sky News and found this:

'http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Pope-Cardinal-Walter-Kasper-A-Key-Member-Of-The-Popes-Entourage-Calls-Britain-Third-World/Article/201009315729437?lid=ARTICLE_15729437_Pope:CardinalWalterKasper,AKeyMemberOfThePopesEntourageCallsBritainThirdWorld&lpos=searchresults'
The interview isn't there and without having the interview I honestly don't know if he means Roman Catholics are being discrimanted against or all followers of Christianity. It's really annoying to be honest.
........
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32051 Posts
September 20 2010 15:44 GMT
#424
On September 21 2010 00:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2010 00:22 Hawk wrote:
On September 20 2010 23:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 20 2010 23:06 Hawk wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:32 hypercube wrote:
It's funny how public personas can get away with statements that would get you banned on any respectable message board. Not for inflamatory language, just plain old trolling;


heh, the best post was all the way back on page one.

I think my other fav (from another board) was that 'well, you're allowed to start comparing people to nazis when you've actually been a nazi'
˙
Some other stupid shit that was said during this same tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11325699
"England today is a secularised, pluralistic country. When you land at Heathrow Airport, you sometimes think you'd landed in a Third World country."
Asked whether Christians were discriminated against in the UK, he said: "Particularly in England, an aggressive neo-atheism is widespread. For example, if you wear a cross with British Airways, you're discriminated against."


Now an immature, yet funny, picture to complete my wonderful post:

[image loading]


Why do you Americans not distinguish between Catholics and Protestants/Christians, it's not the same thing. I really really do not understand, is it all just the same thing to you people?
It makes having a discussion so much more difficult when you don't distinguish between different religious schools when having a discussion about religion.

Catholicism doesn't = Christianity and it's been posted at least 10 times in this thread.

In England which the article you quoted is about, there is a huge difference between Catholics and Christians both historically and culturally. Therefore they should not be referred to as the same thing, it makes no sense.

Edit: I just searched this on Wikipedia and realize now, that I have bugger all chance of winning this definition argument. It's still awful though, in my opinion, that so many people use the same term for things that are so incredibly different both in the way that it's practiced but also historically and culturally. *sigh*


You realize that I never once made this distinction, I just quoted the source, right??

And I'm hardly some religious scholar, but I'm pretty sure what he stated was accurate. Catholics and protestants all practice some derivative of christianity, so at the very heart of the argument, they are christians in that sense.

The quote you're referencing, the guy is responding to a question where he's asked if anyone who follows the teachings of jesus is discriminated against... not once particularly sect.

I made a mistake, but defining Protestants and Catholics as the same thing is just really destructive and confusing to a debate like this. For example, when I read the 'quote' that you posted. I'm assuming, that he's talking about the Church of England and protestants etc., because the word Christianity is used, when in fact he's probably only talking about The Roman Catholic Church and its members, if the same term is used about the whole lot, how are people going to be able to tell what's what and which group of people is being refered to? Using the term 'Christian' is far less accurate than using the term 'Roman Catholics' because it's a much wider term and this whole debate is about the Pope and the Roman Catholic Church.


I'm almost positive that he's talking about all of the christian based groups there, rc's, protestants and eastern orthodox. He mentions discriminating against anyone wearing a cross. Could be wrong, but whatever. I'm just making note that it wasn't me who said it
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
Chairman Ray
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States11903 Posts
September 20 2010 15:52 GMT
#425
The pope is a religious leader. I don't expect him to be educated, or even smart.
Evil_Monkey_
Profile Joined May 2003
Denmark296 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 16:01:09
September 20 2010 15:54 GMT
#426
On September 21 2010 00:44 Hawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2010 00:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 21 2010 00:22 Hawk wrote:
On September 20 2010 23:38 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 20 2010 23:06 Hawk wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:32 hypercube wrote:
It's funny how public personas can get away with statements that would get you banned on any respectable message board. Not for inflamatory language, just plain old trolling;


heh, the best post was all the way back on page one.

I think my other fav (from another board) was that 'well, you're allowed to start comparing people to nazis when you've actually been a nazi'
˙
Some other stupid shit that was said during this same tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11325699
"England today is a secularised, pluralistic country. When you land at Heathrow Airport, you sometimes think you'd landed in a Third World country."
Asked whether Christians were discriminated against in the UK, he said: "Particularly in England, an aggressive neo-atheism is widespread. For example, if you wear a cross with British Airways, you're discriminated against."


Now an immature, yet funny, picture to complete my wonderful post:

[image loading]


Why do you Americans not distinguish between Catholics and Protestants/Christians, it's not the same thing. I really really do not understand, is it all just the same thing to you people?
It makes having a discussion so much more difficult when you don't distinguish between different religious schools when having a discussion about religion.

Catholicism doesn't = Christianity and it's been posted at least 10 times in this thread.

In England which the article you quoted is about, there is a huge difference between Catholics and Christians both historically and culturally. Therefore they should not be referred to as the same thing, it makes no sense.

Edit: I just searched this on Wikipedia and realize now, that I have bugger all chance of winning this definition argument. It's still awful though, in my opinion, that so many people use the same term for things that are so incredibly different both in the way that it's practiced but also historically and culturally. *sigh*


You realize that I never once made this distinction, I just quoted the source, right??

And I'm hardly some religious scholar, but I'm pretty sure what he stated was accurate. Catholics and protestants all practice some derivative of christianity, so at the very heart of the argument, they are christians in that sense.

The quote you're referencing, the guy is responding to a question where he's asked if anyone who follows the teachings of jesus is discriminated against... not once particularly sect.

I made a mistake, but defining Protestants and Catholics as the same thing is just really destructive and confusing to a debate like this. For example, when I read the 'quote' that you posted. I'm assuming, that he's talking about the Church of England and protestants etc., because the word Christianity is used, when in fact he's probably only talking about The Roman Catholic Church and its members, if the same term is used about the whole lot, how are people going to be able to tell what's what and which group of people is being refered to? Using the term 'Christian' is far less accurate than using the term 'Roman Catholics' because it's a much wider term and this whole debate is about the Pope and the Roman Catholic Church.


I'm almost positive that he's talking about all of the christian based groups there, rc's, protestants and eastern orthodox. He mentions discriminating against anyone wearing a cross. Could be wrong, but whatever. I'm just making note that it wasn't me who said it


I would have thought it was generally about Christians, but when the cross comment comes out, you can be almost sure he's talking about The Roman Catholic Church, due to protestants here not frequently carrying crosses etc. for all to see.
In addition, with the religious climate as it is in England, many Catholics feel like they're being discriminated against, recently, in the media with all the negative stories in the press. I also doubt he would make statements on behalf of other religious groups.
........
WilbertK
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands210 Posts
September 20 2010 16:01 GMT
#427
On September 20 2010 17:05 Wombatsavior wrote:
I remember when i first fell out of "religion." Thinking that I was just born christian, all though I was never made to go to church. I went straight to atheism because frankly, organized religion for me is a more nonsensical trip I don't need to go down. I do think though, that before you decide you are atheist to consider Agnostic, in that you believe your own ideas of what life is. Atheism after all means there is absolutely nothing more, and when you look at the magnitude of the universe, it's a little hard to say "Yeah man, all on accident."

I'm going to shamelessly link to my first contribution to this thread, because I think it'll shed some light on the link between agnosticism and atheism.

Also, I'm going to add something. Atheism doesn't mean there's nothing more. Atheism just means not believing in gods. Most buddhists are atheists. What I think you intend to describe is scientific naturalism.

A lot of atheists are naturalists. However, that doesn't mean that naturalism is a part of atheism, or even that it has anything to do with it.

These are some common misconceptions. What made me write this reply, however, is the last sentence in your post. The idea that atheists believe it all 'just accidentally happened' is popular amongst evangelical christians such as Ray Comfort (look him up, he's funny). But that is not the view of the scientific community to which they attribute this idea. This phrase most often comes up in discussions about evolution. And while chance plays a role in the mechanism of evolution. The process isn't an accident. It is bound to happen. I'm not going for a thread hijack, so I'm not going into depth on this. I might open up a science thread in the near future though, if I think people will appreciate that.
DoubleZee
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada556 Posts
September 20 2010 16:43 GMT
#428
Catholics are crazy, of course their leader is going to say crazy stuff.
Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!
zqfmgb
Profile Joined July 2010
United States34 Posts
September 20 2010 16:54 GMT
#429
On September 20 2010 22:22 goldenkrnboi wrote:
stop trolling.


A) You don't know what trolling means.
B) You don't read your Bible.
C) All of the above.

I recommend reading Leviticus and Deuteronomy.


On September 20 2010 15:50 Electric.Jesus wrote:
That, combined with the fact that neither the theist nor the atheist position can be empirically proven.

Too bad, people forgot about the existentialist view: whether god exists or not should not f***ing matter!


Existentialism has very little to do with religion. However, the most influential people of existential thought were very irreligious, such as Jean-Paul Sartre and Nietzche.

The theist position can be disproven through basic logic. All theisms have the same amount of empirical evidence like any other supposed supernatural occurrences. Therefore, if you can believe in a god, you can probably believe in unicorns, leprechauns, Superman, Zeus, and the like.
Deny the existence of unicorns? Well you can't necessarily prove or disprove that, because they probably don't exist!

Also, science has explained the natural world empirically enough that if some sort of god did exist, she/he/it would have done absolutely nothing in the creation or influence of this universe.
7mk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Germany10157 Posts
September 20 2010 17:10 GMT
#430
On September 20 2010 12:12 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 20 2010 01:47 7mk wrote:
On September 19 2010 21:23 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 19 2010 20:32 7mk wrote:
On September 19 2010 17:52 KwarK wrote:
I find this hilarious, both because of the Nazi Youth connection and the fact that it was the support of the German Catholic party that brought Hitler to power. They made a pact with the Pope that gave Hitler the support of the Catholic Church in exchange for protection for German Catholics. While you can make an argument that all Germans consented to the atrocities that followed out of self interest most didn't put it in writing. The Catholic Church were the first to assure Hitler he could do whatever he liked to anyone else as long as they were protected.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichskonkordat


Yeah that's the first thing I thought about when I read the OP.

If anyone thinks Nazi Germany was really christian they are a bit naive (hell, some churches had the bible replaced by Mein Kampf) but other than that I disagree with about everything blitzkrieger and that other dude ( who was even wrose) wrote.

On September 19 2010 17:30 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:48 blitzkrieger wrote:
On September 19 2010 16:41 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:
If atheists abused 1000's of innocent children like they have, I would listen to what this old troll has to say. Fact is though, that it's him and his followers that have done so.


There are actually much less pedophiles in the Church than the general population by quite some amount (20x less?). Again I wish I had a source but I don't. And I don't excuse them for trying to have "damage control" for it either. I'm not even Catholic.

You are so blind, I'm not gonna waste any more time on you (after this). The Pope and The Catholic church has accepted a figure saying '0,05% or 1/20' of the priests have abused children. You can have your kiddy fiddler religion all for yourself mate. You're making up statistics as you go a long, not 1/20 of the general population are peadophiles and have commited crimes like this. This was broadcast on Sky News yesterday, now you go find a source for your imaginary statistics and catholic priests will hopefully be able to abuse children for many more years to come.

edit: I just realized that by your statistics I.E. the general population having 20times as high a rate of peadophelia as The Catholic Church would mean that every single person who's not a priest would be a peadophile. Do you still think your inventend statistics are correct? or do you admit that you are just slinging random stuff out and trolling in general?


wow massive math fail, 0.05% is not 1/20. That would be 5%.

It's a typo, I guess you've never made one. 0,05 = 5% = 1/20 I've corrected it.


Well if you really meant 5% then I'd like to know what source Sky News has because my father is a forensic psychiatrist and he has very different numbers.

Just go on their webpage skynews.com, how on earth would your father being a forensic psychiatrist have anything to do with him knowing the numbers for abuse by priests from the Catholic Church.

Check the Adam Boulton panel where they discuss Child abuse by the Catholic Church, but I'm sure your daddy knows much better than them.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Politics/Popes-Visit-Skys-Adam-Boulton-Chairs-Debate-On-Whether-The-Papal-Visit-Is-A-Force-For-Good/Article/201009315729586?lid=ARTICLE_15729586_PopesVisit:SkysAdamBoultonChairsDebateOnWhetherThePapalVisitIsAForceForGood&lpos=searchresults

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/video/Pope-Debate-Child-Abuse-In-The-Catholic-Church-Is-Discussed-By-A-Panel-On-Sky-News/Video/201009315729669?lpos=video_Article_Related_Content_Region_1&lid=VIDEO_15729669_Pope_Debate:_Child_Abuse_In_The_Catholic_Church_Is_Discussed_By_A_Panel_On_Sky_News

I saw it on Sky News, I'm not sure these sources are 100% the same as what I watched on the news, but can't really verify it seeing as I'm in China and Chinese internet is ever worse than the Pope.

The stats metioned '5%' is introduced by Adam Boulton is for America and it's a stat found by an independent inquiry funded by The Catholic Church.



l"how on earth would your father being a forensic psychiatrist have anything to do with him knowing the numbers for abuse by priests from the Catholic Church."

??
Because his job makes him a specialist on the subject of paedophilia and he knows more about it than pretty much any other person in this country ?(besides that he has direct connections to most important figures in our judiciary system). Either way I dont get how you can even ask that question if you know what a forensic psychiatrist does. It's like asking why a archaeologist would know anything about dinosaurs.


That being said if I recall correctly my father was talking about statistics in germany, and those statistics said that overall child abuse among priests was overall just very slightly lower than
average. And in the news report you posted that british guy says the stats for UK are 0.04%.
So when one single project brings up hugely different numbers than any other researches I would dare argue that it's likely that that single project is wrong.
Or maybe it's just US priests that are fucked up, who knows.


beep boop
MidKnight
Profile Joined December 2008
Lithuania884 Posts
September 20 2010 17:20 GMT
#431
So people STILL can't admit that we are just another species of animals on this planet and when we die we most likely just vanish forever?
It's better to delude yourself with fairytales that we are special, have souls and will go to a happy place up in the sky, right..

I mean, Catholic church in particular is the biggest joke ever, it's pretty scary that it has so much power even at this day.They have already shown what their agenda is, just because they don't go around killing people who don't agree with them anymore doesn't mean they suddendly became 'good'.

Also I just love when people use religion as a source for "moral values".
Moral values exist because society cannot exist without them.
Piranhas don't go around and kill each other either, they work as a group to achieve their goal, that doesn't exactly mean they have read the holy book though.

I honestly think that every intelligent civilization out there (yea, I do think there are a lot of other intelligent life forms in the universe, unless earth is some sort of mega-anomaly) has to go through the same phase of questioning their origins, explaining everything via some sort of divine power and then bit by bit figuring everything out.
Religion is definitely a halt in achieving something more as a race.
r3z3nd3
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Brazil522 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 17:21:03
September 20 2010 17:20 GMT
#432
who's this pope guy? and why he deserve all this attention?
Born to fast expand
Offhand
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1869 Posts
September 20 2010 17:47 GMT
#433
On September 21 2010 02:20 r3z3nd3 wrote:
who's this pope guy? and why he deserve all this attention?


Because over a billion people believe he's infallible.
eH
Profile Joined May 2010
88 Posts
September 20 2010 17:59 GMT
#434
On September 20 2010 15:50 Electric.Jesus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 20 2010 15:24 Nadir wrote:
On September 20 2010 08:55 wadadde wrote:The reason why religious people often take issue with people pointing out that they don't really have a leg to stand on, is IMO that they see their beliefs are such an integral part of their identity.

Actually you're exactly right. I came to this exact same conclusion sitting in my psychology lecture after writing that post. Attack the core of someones identity and you get rage, a state of mind not conducive to logic or reasoning.


That, combined with the fact that neither the theist nor the atheist position can be empirically proven.

Too bad, people forgot about the existentialist view: whether god exists or not should not f***ing matter!



What the hell does the atheist position have to prove? I'm not positing anything, and not putting forth any idea which requires empirical evidence to back up. I'm simply saying, "theres no evidence for the existence of any god. Until such evidence exists, it would be completely illogical and totally contradictory to live my life based on the idea that there is one."


The guy who stands there telling me that an all powerful man in the sky exists and that I should live my life by bigoted, arrogant rules in order to stay in his good graces better be showing me something to back up that claim, otherwise I'll listen to him about as much as I'll listen to that guy in the mental health facility who thinks he's napoleon.
leve15
Profile Joined August 2010
United States301 Posts
September 20 2010 18:01 GMT
#435
He's not a world leader.

I'm Napoleon when I play starcraft.
psychopat
Profile Joined October 2009
Canada417 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 18:06:39
September 20 2010 18:02 GMT
#436
Saw the speech, snickered, went back to business as usual. As with almost anything, you have to consider the source and its motivations.

What the hell does the atheist position have to prove? I'm not positing anything, and not putting forth any idea which requires empirical evidence to back up. I'm simply saying, "theres no evidence for the existence of any god. Until such evidence exists, it would be completely illogical and totally contradictory to live my life based on the idea that there is one."


That sounds more like an agnostic than an atheist. The atheist posits that there is no deity. The agnostic acknowledges that he doesn't know whether there is a deity, nor does he really care.
DrN0
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom184 Posts
September 20 2010 18:11 GMT
#437
You think you guys are pissed, I am from the UK and recovering from a recession what do we do, we spend £10 million pounds on some fake, who decides whenever there is a gap in science it is due to gods creation. Science has been held back by religion so many times it is ridiculous, now they just say that god created it all rather then what they used to say. My god this man annoys me, when any pope visits africa the AIDs count sky rockets thanks to his views on condoms.

Not to mention his ridiculous speech that guy deserves a **** slap.
WilbertK
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands210 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 18:35:21
September 20 2010 18:32 GMT
#438
On September 21 2010 03:02 psychopat wrote:
Saw the speech, snickered, went back to business as usual. As with almost anything, you have to consider the source and its motivations.

Show nested quote +
What the hell does the atheist position have to prove? I'm not positing anything, and not putting forth any idea which requires empirical evidence to back up. I'm simply saying, "theres no evidence for the existence of any god. Until such evidence exists, it would be completely illogical and totally contradictory to live my life based on the idea that there is one."


That sounds more like an agnostic than an atheist. The atheist posits that there is no deity. The agnostic acknowledges that he doesn't know whether there is a deity, nor does he really care.

That isn't true. The atheist isn't convinced that there is a god, and doesn't believe. That's all there is to it. You don't have to be sure there is no god to be an atheist. Being sure there is no god makes you a strong atheist, or a gnostic atheist.

An agnost is someone who believes that you cannot ultimately know whether or not there is a god.

You can be an agnostic theist, and believe there is a god, while saying you're not 100% sure.

I explained this more thoroughly in this post.
WilbertK
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands210 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 18:34:33
September 20 2010 18:33 GMT
#439
Offhand
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1869 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-20 18:34:32
September 20 2010 18:33 GMT
#440
On September 21 2010 00:10 chrisSquire wrote:
what is the big fuss. this is what speeches are all about... riling up civilians to talk about nothing whilst they usurp your power. this sort of comment from the pope is certainly not without precedent.


When people start leaving your group in droves, possible because of that pedophilia thing you've been hiding for at least a century you need to do something to drum up support from the base!

What easier way then demonizing easy groups like atheists and gays?
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