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Ever. I tried designing fits to fight condors, but at T1 frig size, it's pretty close to impossible (for fighting them in novice). There's absolutely no way you would be able to fight them at range, standard weapons are beaten by TDs, light missiles are too slow and drones spend so much time microwarpdriving that they can kill them before it kills them, even if you have 10. I can design fits able to kill one if he's without links and implant with a close range mwd frig, but I always hit the "and if he does have links/implants?". I don't really want to fly a dramiel especially for countering them and still dying if they are linked. Being efficient against them also make your fit completely crap against anything brawling because you have to cut so many things to reach their speed. :<
tl,dr: I hate condors.
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Atrons man Atrons they can kill condors. (but its hard)
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On July 17 2013 13:59 DefMatrixUltra wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 12:54 Veldril wrote:On July 17 2013 08:32 DefMatrixUltra wrote:On July 17 2013 05:20 Warri wrote:On July 17 2013 03:42 DefMatrixUltra wrote:Apparently ISK is what wins null sov. And not thousands of man-hours of bitchwork. If ISK means being able to afford a better reimbursement policy and thus have more people fly proper ships instead of kitchensink stuff, as is apparently tests problem right now, then ISK can at least help winning the war. You're right, of course. What I was referring to is his implication that TEST will somehow trounce Goons, whose wallets will all shrivel up and die, simply because they're not afraid of overtly "double"-taxing their constituents. It's a complicate(d) situation. It really isn't. All those things you say about SRF are correct, and they apply to both TEST and GSF as well as most other null alliances. TEST is at a disadvantage in this particular arena because of their financial issues. GSF is running along as they normally do (hard to have financial problems when you divvy out who gets the oil fields). Greedy Goblin is trying to imply that, because TEST (who is having financial trouble) has come up with "innovative" solutions (maybe) to their financial problems (due solely to his genius), TEST is no longer the presumptive underdog or maybe even is the presumptive favored party. This is just plain wrong. It is yet another example of Greedy Goblin finding some harmless sector of "knowledge" and making extravagant claims and predictions that, if true, would build up the image of his genius and successes. Wait for the followup post after the Amazing Exciting War (TM) is over where he talks about how TEST is stupid and he is smart, and if he was in charge they would have "won". This guy is the Fox News of EVE.
Well yeah, you are right. Anyone who believes TEST by itself (or even with N3) is not an underdog is either crazy or know nothing about war.
This morning gonna be interesting. Massive fleet coming up from both sides to fight.
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United States41989 Posts
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Well yeah, you are right. Anyone who believes TEST by itself (or even with N3) is not an underdog is either crazy or know nothing about war.
This morning gonna be interesting. Massive fleet coming up from both sides to fight.
Test with N3 and PL aren't underdogs... If they start acting like a coalition if they want to survive. Test as an alliance + N3 as a coalition (with no coalition spirit to speak of) and PL as a wild card are underdogs though.
The problem isn't about ISK alone. The problem is about being united. Test flies with their own fleets, same with N3, same with PL (you can join others' fleets but they may be with other doctrines, not reimbursed, etc). This CAN'T work. If PL was leading the whole capfleet, Z9PP would have been a clean extraction (they did extract their own carriers smoothly). If N3 & PL were really implicated at a coalition level, they would be able to field two to three time as many ships, and use supers/titans in direct engagements. If N3+Test was a coalition, N3 alliances would lend money to Test like GSF does with poorer CFC alliances in time of need. Etc.
It's a coalition against a pile of alliances, and as such, it's just a question of time. For the defenders of fountain, it's "reform or die" time.
Atrons man Atrons they can kill condors. (but its hard)
Tried slashers, works okay I guess (as long as they're not linked, of course, or as long as you are). The problem is you can only engage condors (and the few other long range setups) with that While condors can engage everything but atrons and slashers. For me the problem lies with light missiles. They're so vastly superior to other long range weapons at frig size (huge range, decent damage, not countered by tracking disruptor). Other long range setups can be handled with one or two tracking disruptors and completely neutralized (except drones, but drones can be killed). The only thing preventing condors from applying damage at range are sensor damps (with lock range scripts), but sadly, those are completely useless against the majority of the non-condor setups, contrary to tracking disruptors which can swap script and remain hugely relevant.
One thing I could try would be a range + damp fit though. If they can't lock you because of damps, they can't tracking disrupt you. Still, same problem, useless against most other ships. :<
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United States41989 Posts
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High sec statics are going to be busy busy. You're always going to be less safe running sites in there no matter what you do. If you are going to use it passively I suppose they are ok.
For your purposes though, honestly I'd just look for a C3 with a null static. They are all empty...not hard to find at all and you have the capital to wait for high sec / favorable low sec exits to come around. Logistics are not too hard beyond getting in and getting set up. You won't be on every day to run the sites so there will always be those and the null static will make it much more like 'single player eve'.
Edit:
You're also taking a risk purchasing a wormhole. If you are looking for a C3 they are trivially easy to find. And very few are occupied. Its worth the hour or two of probing just so you don't make yourself vulnerable to shenanigans.
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On July 16 2013 22:59 KwarK wrote:You sir, have earned an honourable SD in game channel invitation.
i will redeem it when next online, whatever it may be
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United States41989 Posts
Was looking for ones with caps in them rather than probing my own and building. Seemed easier.
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On July 17 2013 18:40 Nyvis wrote:Show nested quote +
Well yeah, you are right. Anyone who believes TEST by itself (or even with N3) is not an underdog is either crazy or know nothing about war.
This morning gonna be interesting. Massive fleet coming up from both sides to fight.
Test with N3 and PL aren't underdogs... If they start acting like a coalition if they want to survive. Test as an alliance + N3 as a coalition (with no coalition spirit to speak of) and PL as a wild card are underdogs though. The problem isn't about ISK alone. The problem is about being united. Test flies with their own fleets, same with N3, same with PL (you can join others' fleets but they may be with other doctrines, not reimbursed, etc). This CAN'T work. If PL was leading the whole capfleet, Z9PP would have been a clean extraction (they did extract their own carriers smoothly). If N3 & PL were really implicated at a coalition level, they would be able to field two to three time as many ships, and use supers/titans in direct engagements. If N3+Test was a coalition, N3 alliances would lend money to Test like GSF does with poorer CFC alliances in time of need. Etc. It's a coalition against a pile of alliances, and as such, it's just a question of time. For the defenders of fountain, it's "reform or die" time.
Everything you say is true and essential for the survival of a nullsec entity. I think you're over-romanticizing the concept of organization, though.
GSF is effective in nullsec because they are highly organized. They don't have some outstanding military tradition. They don't have skillful pilots. They don't necessarily vastly outnumber their opponents. What they do have is a visible structure that even a simpleton can follow in addition to "invisible" structures that make everything in the background run properly. They impose this structure on everyone they interact with as well. That way when they call for help, it's more like picking bodies out of a reserve force than having RandomThirdParty show up and do Odin knows what.
These are the essential problems that "coalitions" (more like city-states amirite) face. If they do not share an organizational system, they can't interact with each other militarily and economically without friction. GSF's system of Military Dictatorship For Dummies works really well because it's a unidirectional lowest common denominator basis for interaction. This guarantees that they're able to use their own population to its fullest and also able to poach from the population of other entities without significant learning curve and without political hangups.
Imagine a TEST-led fleet that gets 50 bodies from PL. Ok so this TEST fleet has 50 extra bodies, almost certainly underutilized. Now imagine that a PL-led fleet gets 100 bodies from TEST. It might cause more problems than it would solve. From what I've seen of PL fleets, there is a style of command specific to them with a learning curve beyond the capabilities of an average TEST member to pick up on at a moment's notice. This is an organizational problem reflecting a possible under-utilization of manpower.
Coalitions don't need a shared political basis to fix problems like this. They just need an organized system of interaction.
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Today I fced a brave newbies gang vs Turn left vs CVA
If you have played with me in Rahadalon you know that I am perma banned from their mumble for using a spy to squadwarp their fleets to death so this was a bit problematic.
First I had some random russian proxy that stopped working half way through and took chrome and most other non eve internet things with it. Then I had to relay orders to gray arachnids on ts. Then he crashed and our entire gang died.
http://yoloswag.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=18794871
yeah
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Russian Federation3631 Posts
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neither side in TEST vs. CFC will run out of isk before they run out of semi-sentient bodies to fight with, it is almost an entire irrelevance. who ever on TEST's side decided to time for AUtz is a moron though. guaranteeing their loss, its so stupid.
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United States7481 Posts
AUtz is probably the test friends' relative best time zone, CFC never really gained the advantage in that TZ in tribute (opposing coalition collapsed before then). Last night was a bit early for actual AUTZ though. Right around downtime is when N3 has their best chance, I think.
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On July 17 2013 15:31 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +PS: The donation board will also make the "you just made up your 0.5T" posts pointless. After all, it's irrelevant how much I have. What matters is how do I use it. I think most of it will slowly but surely go to the TEST coffers. This guy wants so badly for people to hang out with him that he's planning to give all his isk to TEST. I'm kinda waiting for him to eventually give them everything he's ever earned and them to kick him again. And the best part is if he then earns more he'll almost certainly rejoin.
[H] Isk
[W] Friends 
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On July 18 2013 08:06 Antoine wrote:
AUtz is probably the test friends' relative best time zone, CFC never really gained the advantage in that TZ in tribute (opposing coalition collapsed before then). Last night was a bit early for actual AUTZ though. Right around downtime is when N3 has their best chance, I think.
i'm not talking about winning fights, i am talking about winning a war. and although the two are connected they are very very different. if TEST are timing to AUtz for nulli, they are getting fucked by nulli far worse than by the CFC.
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When I saw 178 million SP, I thought there was no way it could be missing a huge amount of shit, it's got so much SP that it simply can't be that bad.
But then I took a look at it. What the fuck was this guy thinking when he was training shit? So much useful shit missing, and so much useless shit V'd.
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Russian Federation3631 Posts
Acceleration Control / Rank 4 / Level: 4 / SP: 339,414 of 1,024,000 - training to level 5
High Speed Maneuvering / Rank 5 / Level: 4 / SP: 226,275 of 1,280,000
Shield Rigging / Rank 3 / Level: 3 / SP: 24,000 of 135,765
also the electronics holy fuck
*sob*
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why are caracals so good now? sorry been out of eve for so long :|. Is it just asb fit and a baby drake essentially?
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Russian Federation3631 Posts
so when evaluating a nano ship, you look for the following:
raw damage at range - because damage at scram range doesn't mean shit. and you want damage to kill larger ship classes than you because that is how you get elite pvp street cred.
applied damage vs tacklers - in most cases, barring recons, fast tackle is the biggest threat to a nano ship
speed - so you can keep at range and not ram thoraxes / brutixes like certain bads do
threat - because people will react disproportionately to certain ships (curse, vagabond). ideally you want lowest threats possible so that people will fight you
compared vs the drake, the caracal has worse damage at range, much better / consistent applied damage on tacklers, much better speed (something like 3600 overheat vs 2200 overheat), and much lower threat. People don't respect cruisers as a ship class as much as they should ~
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EPT
