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On May 26 2009 13:32 EvilTeletubby wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2009 12:56 Aurra wrote:
I guess I'll put that video in perspective.
Normally, when a POS is set up only members of that alliance can enter the forcefield (that bubble you see). If you want people outside your alliance to enter your POS, you need to set a password on the POS and give it to whoever you want to enter, who then enters the password into their ship. If they match they'll be able to enter.
The Goonswarm & Co Titans obtained the password to one of Kenny's POSes (hurf blurf spies) and entered Kenny's POS forcefield. They can't attack the Kenny ships that are inside, so what they do is they get as close to the center of the shield as possible, and then remove the password from their ship. This causes the POS to expel the Titan from shields automatically at a rather high rate of speed. Due to the size of the Titan it inevitably bumps into other ships in the forcefield, pushing them out of the POS and into the waiting arms of 200+ hostile battleships. So basically they're drone-drilling. 
Haha, nice one.
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Yeah, you can see it really well in the first 10 seconds of that video. That Avatar (The big yellow space dong) going left out of the forcefield sideways, taking several battleships with it.
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Oh snap, I forgot about this stuff... I'll have to spend tomorrow catching up on the news. :D
I read the last page or so, though... it's totally a drone drill, haha.. It's like when someone, don't remember who, used an SCV drill to removed the stasis'd units on their ramp..
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Why did Goons want Delve? I know there was bad blood started between BoB and the Goons early on, but what is it about Delve? Just to take it from them?
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Delve has far more resources per <unit of measurement> than any other region in the game. What led up to that is a bit of controversy in itself.
Delve used to be a rather shitty region, BOB moved into it after beating the former owners (Fountain Alliance iirc, I wasn't playing yet during that time so I might be wrong). Suddenly a small "roleplaying event" happened and new NPCs inhabited the space. NPCs with named spawns that dropped the best possible modules in the game. Then when Tier 2 was put in and subsequently moon mining, Delve became the home of something like 30 R64 moons, the highest quality in the game. You're lucky to find 10 in most other regions in the game.
So yeah, it's one part rubbing it in the face of what was once considered the largest, virtually unkillable alliance that made it their goal to prevent us from ever getting on our feet. The other part is it's making us ridiculously rich and the directorate is having trouble spending all the money we're making now.
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On May 26 2009 13:32 EvilTeletubby wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2009 12:56 Aurra wrote:
I guess I'll put that video in perspective.
Normally, when a POS is set up only members of that alliance can enter the forcefield (that bubble you see). If you want people outside your alliance to enter your POS, you need to set a password on the POS and give it to whoever you want to enter, who then enters the password into their ship. If they match they'll be able to enter.
The Goonswarm & Co Titans obtained the password to one of Kenny's POSes (hurf blurf spies) and entered Kenny's POS forcefield. They can't attack the Kenny ships that are inside, so what they do is they get as close to the center of the shield as possible, and then remove the password from their ship. This causes the POS to expel the Titan from shields automatically at a rather high rate of speed. Due to the size of the Titan it inevitably bumps into other ships in the forcefield, pushing them out of the POS and into the waiting arms of 200+ hostile battleships. So basically they're drone-drilling.
haha good analogy.
BTW i havent played EVE ever but im fascinated by the events but im confused about a few things so could you please clarify what is a Cyano Jammer/field, how do stargates and jump gates work (which can use capital ships), what does it mean when they bubble a gate?
Also what do towers do, i keep hearing how many towers each kill but i dont know what they do, thanks.
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On May 26 2009 14:13 Kwidowmaker wrote:
Why did Goons want Delve? I know there was bad blood started between BoB and the Goons early on, but what is it about Delve? Just to take it from them?
Back in 2006 Band of Brothers alliance decided they'd be awesome and go beat up the goons in their backwater home region. They blew up a ton of newbies in t1 frigates with fleets of "highly experienced elite pvpers" and hurf blurfed all over the forums about k/d ratios ("we blew up 31899 frigates and 239410 rookie ships and 1239410 shuttles while losing 2 battleships!"), "there are no goons," "we will dominate your game," etc. Goons and their friends have been dedicated to the destruction of BoB/Kenny ever since. "Fortress Delve" was the symbol of BoB power and is an incredibly rich region, so yeah.
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so in the sov map which are which? the red ones are stargatesor jump bridges or cyno fields.
are cyno fields natural or built?, what is the difference between a cyno field and a jump bridge
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On May 26 2009 14:11 f10esqftw wrote:
Oh snap, I forgot about this stuff... I'll have to spend tomorrow catching up on the news. :D
I read the last page or so, though... it's totally a drone drill, haha.. It's like when someone, don't remember who, used an SCV drill to removed the stasis'd units on their ramp..
Ello Mr.Trap, your thinking of Mind v Stats.
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On May 26 2009 18:26 baal wrote:
so in the sov map which are which? the red ones are stargates or jump bridges or cyno fields.
are cyno fields natural or built?, what is the difference between a cyno field and a jump bridge
Dear god, did you even read the previous page? All your questions are answered there.
Jump bridges and cyno fields aren't shown on the sov map. Only stargates.
Cyno fields are deployed by players, usually in ships dedicated to the task. They allow capital ships to jump between systems (just one jump at a time I think, I'm not certain about this).
Jump bridges allow capital and sub-capital ships to jump between systems that would require multiple jumps by ordinary means (stargate and cyno) but these bridges can only be built in Sov 3-4 systems.
Anyway, awesome updates everybody. It's nice that we have a couple of TL guys in GS.
Traitors though they may be, they provide us with juicy info.
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On May 26 2009 19:32 Psyker wrote:
Anyway, awesome updates everybody. It's nice that we have a couple of TL guys in GS.
HEROES though they may be, they provide us with juicy info.
FYP, obviously
:D!
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So uh... I don't see how goons keep winning battles, but keep losing sov. in more and more systems. Just today, Blade. (a BOB pet) gained sov. in Querious and Goons lost sov. in Period Basis. Over the past few days, Goons also lost 2 systems to Kenny. Could someone please clarify for me.
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On May 27 2009 06:09 Try wrote:
So uh... I don't see how goons keep winning battles, but keep losing sov. in more and more systems. Just today, Blade. (a BOB pet) gained sov. in Querious and Goons lost sov. in Period Basis. Over the past few days, Goons also lost 2 systems to Kenny. Could someone please clarify for me.
You can shoot and take down Player owned Stations without directly engaging the opponents army.
Also, keep in mind that news in Eve is rather realistic... meaning you will often get propaganda and various means of deception in order to look better. I very much doubt that goons win as often as they claim they do, but keeping appearances is key to keeping morale.
I have no doubt that they have won the majority of their battles given how everything turned out but I don't think they came out of these fights nearly as well off as they think they did. Now they are also dealing with the logistics of having so much damn space at the same time while being attacked by multiple entities.
A whole new ball game.
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The Goons amaze me. Unlike Starcraft, the whole game is not held in your RAM (how can it be?). Instead, the relevant information is kept on your computer, and sent by the server. I'm not sure exactly what this relevant information entails, but I believe it is a model of your solar system, and your grid. What is your grid? Allow the Goon Beldoman from the City of Heroes topic to explain:
In a nutshell, grids are how EVE Online tracks local objects in space in relationship to each other. Static objects, like planets and moons, have permanent grids assigned to them, but for the most part they are created and resized dynamically when a player's ship arrives in a system and starts moving around. On a basic level, this has been known to EVE players for a long time (I think).
Now, to part 1 of why Goons amaze me:
They've figure out how to use the girds as a weapon. Again, Beldoman will explain:
Going back to the first Delve war, some goons stumbled upon the underlying mechanics of how grid creation works, and quickly found ways to use this to their advantage, such as by allowing rapid in-system fleet movements that enemy ships couldn't easily counter.
From what I can surmise, this can be used to sidestep a big problem with large fleet warfare. When you warp to an enemy fleet off grid, the server needs to send you the grid so you can update. The time between your ship being loaded onto the grid and your ship loading the grid leave you completely unable to do anything, and you can be ganked EZ. Imagine 100+ ships trying to load the grid, and you can see how even the worst lag on Bnet would be desirable.
How to use the grids to counter this is simple. Extend the grid so that your fleet can warp into the grid and load at a safe distance from the enemy. Then, warp into the enemy fleet and be able to engage right after warp.
Now, how does a guy who's only played on a trial account and who's only forays into 0.0 have been unsuccessful scavenging runs? Onto the second part of why Goons amaze me:
They made the secret of Grid-Fu public. Beldoman will give us the background.
At some point, a defector to -A- brought the secret with him, and since then -A- has become quite adept at grid-fu.
Apparently the goons are happily releasing the info now, in part because the cat is out of the bag, and in part because some of the ways that -A- are utilizing grids to reshape *other* grids are technically exploitive and putting this info out there might cause CCP to get off their butts and adjust how grids interact.
For a Goonier perspective, Seoul_Power jumps in:
The guy who brought the secrets of grid-fu to AAA didn't defect so much as he got kicked out by Darius for being annoying. We just forgot that he had access to some sensitive information, such as a log of R64 moon locations and our knowledge of grid-fu, which honestly wasn't a big deal, since AAA was a friendly alliance at the time.
Here is the Grid-Fu Manual (pdf with some explicit language)
Here is the COAD topic where the manual was unveiled
Here is the most recent CoH page detailing the Delve War (this is where I stubled upon the manual, and where Beldoman and Seoul_Power give those quote)
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On May 27 2009 06:28 Jayme wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2009 06:09 Try wrote:
So uh... I don't see how goons keep winning battles, but keep losing sov. in more and more systems. Just today, Blade. (a BOB pet) gained sov. in Querious and Goons lost sov. in Period Basis. Over the past few days, Goons also lost 2 systems to Kenny. Could someone please clarify for me. You can shoot and take down Player owned Stations without directly engaging the opponents army. Also, keep in mind that news in Eve is rather realistic... meaning you will often get propaganda and various means of deception in order to look better. I very much doubt that goons win as often as they claim they do, but keeping appearances is key to keeping morale. I have no doubt that they have won the majority of their battles given how everything turned out but I don't think they came out of these fights nearly as well off as they think they did. Now they are also dealing with the logistics of having so much damn space at the same time while being attacked by multiple entities. A whole new ball game.
Keep in mind what I wrote about earlier regarding key logistics systems. An alliance is better off keeping just the key systems and losing the fat surrounding them than the other way around. I1Y right now is our entrance to empire space for logistics purposes and losing it would of been a huge headache. With Kenny's morale crippled right now we are cleaning up the POSes in the surrounding systems at a rate that rivals ye old PR- camp.
So yeah, we "lost" those systems, but Kenny is unable to defend them right now so it is rather meaningless. They'll be Goonfleet sov again before the week is over.
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Aurra, thanks for your last answer. I have another question.
On COAD I saw a Goon thread about a ~1000 member drop in Goonswarm. The OP cited the new squad system as a cause.
So my question(s) is: What is the new squad system? Why did the Goon numbers drop so much? If it wasn't the squad system, what was it?
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Kicking out inactive players, it happens once or twice a year. Generally the GS directorate does it right before starting a newbie drive.
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This grid stuff is genius. My jaw dropped at some of the applications these guys have come up with (specifically the drive-by tactic on an enemy POS).
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5/26 Mittani Update.
+ Show Spoiler +The last update was late last night (9pm EST), so this will cover from late US tz onward. Between 3:00 and 7:00 EVE, both hostile towers in ED- were destroyed and replaced. This means that ED is once more 11/11 GS. The enemy has no foothold here any longer. From a strategic perspective, this is ~huge~.
Hostiles had timed a bunch of their shitty pet spam towers for between 9:00 and 12:00. We got a fleet up and obliterated them after downtime.
This downtime formup with DBRB and Mister Vee has worked out very well, and I'm damn happy to see both cap and subcap pilots getting action in this neglected timezone. As long as we can provide a FC at this hour, there'll probably be action at this timeslot in the upcoming weeks. I realize that the players are there, it's just been leadership/fcs lacking.
The carnage began in 4-2. 4-2 in Querious is part of the probable RKZ bridge route which TheAdj mapped based on their Sov3. We killed two towers, nuked a carrier trying to triage rep, reinforced one into a US TZ timer (oops, forgot to time!) hit another than bounced to ZXJ. In ZXJ we blew up five Frontal Impact towers. In LS-V, we destroyed an -A- medium staging tower which was next door to I1Y. Then we rounded out the action by blowing up the Skunk-Works tower in W6V.
Tonight we need to make our pos jpg grow. Our focus will remain on cleaning up shitty pet spam and RKZ outlying sov systems. Take a break if you need to; we'd like to generate sustained, reliable turnout rather than burning everyone out. There's a ton of siegework yet to be done, but for now resistance appears to be minimal.
So far there's been essentially zero resistance during our purge of Querious, towers are not being timed by Kenny & Co and the towers are dying minutes after coming out of reinforced. AFK POS shooting all day hooray.
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EPT
