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On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell?
Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Every single one. That is why I think its retarded to complain. Every MMO I have heard of has had launch issues, bugs. Why would this MMO be any different then the thousands out there? Oh but you purchased so it should be 100% perfect, if that were true in any MMO no MMO would have been released until 10 years in the making probably.
Am I the only one who finds it hilarious that you seem to think this MMO should be different then every other and be 100% perfect? Seriously your posting in this topic makes my brain hurt especially with your logic rofl.
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I think Fruscainte that the point your trying to make isn't the reason people are complaining to you, its where you make it. This is a thread on a site that mainly deals with Starcraft. I, and I presume by the responses in this thread, come here to talk about strategies and if X,Y, or Z is better for this certain class, etc. I know that I could really care less about some bug that I have no intentions of exploiting.
For the most part I agree with your point about the MMOs needing to be held to a higher standard but this really is not the place to say that, IMO. Send them a e-mail or if your brave create a thread on the official forums.
Again not the information but the presentation, IMO.
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On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:On January 06 2012 01:51 Capped wrote:
Theres going to be a major update by the end of January. I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2.  Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious.
It doesn't matter. He's pointing out the same thing I am. No MMO"s have a perfect launch or anything. Why should this be different? Why do I reply to you when you make no since and because its swtor you rip the shit out of this game. Its all you've done.
I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again.
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On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch.
Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing.
Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite.
On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:On January 06 2012 01:51 Capped wrote:
Theres going to be a major update by the end of January. I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again.
This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great.
Besides, don't you have the maturity to be able to withhold your anger? If you think I'm an ignorant fuck for my opinion...why don't you just ignore me? You don't need an ignore button to do it, you just need to do it. I ignore plenty of people I don't like on this forum. It's really not hard.
Nonetheless, I find it amusing that you just admitted you never read my posts essentially. Not to mention incredibly immature because it contributes nothing other than your childish and illogical hatred of my personal being because of my differentiating opinion on a video game
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On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:On January 06 2012 01:51 Capped wrote:
Theres going to be a major update by the end of January. I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great.
I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? Before you say "where the fuck did GW2 come from" I know you are looking forward to it as the next god of MMO's and think it looks way better then swtor that is why I picked that game out of the billion games coming out.
I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO.
I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general?
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On January 06 2012 13:56 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:On January 06 2012 01:51 Capped wrote:
Theres going to be a major update by the end of January. I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great. I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general?
The fuck?
Where did GW2 come from?
Do you want to talk about my poodle next?
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On January 06 2012 13:57 Fruscainte wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:56 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:On January 06 2012 01:51 Capped wrote:
Theres going to be a major update by the end of January. I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great. I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? The fuck? Where did GW2 come from? Do you want to talk about my poodle next?
Read my post so you understand where GW2 came from. I knew you were going to ask that lmao.
""where the fuck did GW2 come from" I know you are looking forward to it as the next god of MMO's and think it looks way better then swtor that is why I picked that game out of the billion games coming out."
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On January 06 2012 13:57 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:57 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:56 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:On January 06 2012 04:23 DrSeRRoD wrote:
[quote]
I think it would be funny (or not really) if they release a patch to 'address' issues on January 21st so everyone that unsubscribes after month 1 has to purchase another subscription to see if it really fixes anything for them. TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great. I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? The fuck? Where did GW2 come from? Do you want to talk about my poodle next? Read my post so you understand where GW2 came from. I knew you were going to ask that lmao. ""where the fuck did GW2 come from" I know you are looking forward to it as the next god of MMO's and think it looks way better then swtor that is why I picked that game out of the billion games coming out."
...What?
I'm not going to talk about GW2 with you because this isn't the thread for GW2. If you want to discuss my opinions about Guild Wars 2, go to the Guild Wars 2 thread. I am here to talk about SWTOR. Stop trying to derail the thread with arbitrary bullshit. You are literally the only one bringing up GW2 in this thread. So, please, let's try to stay on topic -- SWTOR.
I asked you a question.
Why is it okay, in the MMO community and the MMO community alone, to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy products for the simple matter of them being "new"? How is that in any way acceptable? Why is people wanting to get a finished product with their money make them stupid, immature, childish, or WoW fanboys? I don't want to hear about how exceedingly complex making an MMO is -- I want to hear your reasoning of that question.
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On January 06 2012 14:01 Fruscainte wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:57 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:57 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:56 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:On January 06 2012 04:39 Capped wrote:[quote] TBH, if they unsubscribe from an MMO because of issues within the first month, they arent people who anyone wants to play with anyway.
They are whiny little children who want everything as perfect as the milk from their mothers teet. (None of the powder shite!) Much like some of the people in this thread. Point is, its launch month, they are implementing a decent amount of fixes etc and announcing upcoming fixes for major issues, thats GOOD (no matter how much i whine about maintenance when i dont have work, bastards.) Comparing it to WoW, Rift, Aion, <Shitty MMO> is pointless, different game, different companies, different issues, different release dates. Some good, some bad, some ugly. They had a brilliant launch if you ask me, yes some bugs but its their first MMO and all i see is them working their tits off to fix them. My hats are off to them. To end, refer to paragraph 2. Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great. I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? The fuck? Where did GW2 come from? Do you want to talk about my poodle next? Read my post so you understand where GW2 came from. I knew you were going to ask that lmao. ""where the fuck did GW2 come from" I know you are looking forward to it as the next god of MMO's and think it looks way better then swtor that is why I picked that game out of the billion games coming out." ...What? I'm not going to talk about GW2 with you because this isn't the thread for GW2. If you want to discuss my opinions about Guild Wars 2, go to the Guild Wars 2 thread. I am here to talk about SWTOR. Stop trying to derail the thread with arbitrary bullshit. I asked you a question. Why is it okay, in the MMO community and the MMO community alone, to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy products for the simple matter of them being "new"? How is that in any way acceptable? Why is people wanting to get a finished product with their money make them stupid, immature, childish, or WoW fanboys? I don't want to hear about how exceedingly complex making an MMO is -- I want to hear your reasoning of that question.
As I thought. you avoid the question because it directly conflicts with your argument on how SWTOR should be perfect at launch.
And I already reasoned what the fuck did you not read my post?
I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO.
I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? Do you want to know how long that would take? 10 years. That isn't worth it to any game company to work on an MMO for 10 years if not longer to hopefully get every single bug.
Its fucking impossible please read my post before you respond. Just hope you are looking forward to GW2 when its all buggy as well like every other MMO. You should wait to buy it or you'll complain about all the bugs as well
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On January 06 2012 14:03 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 14:01 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:57 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:57 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:56 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:53 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Why is this an accepted standard of the MMO community? That you are paying for an unfinished product and that developers are free from criticism because "MMO's are always filled with problems at launch"? Literally no other game community is like that. It's even most ironic that you're doing this argument on a Starcraft website, because Starcraft players in general are the very antithesis of the person and community you are describing. Yes, when I purchase a product, I do not want it to be incomplete. This is, quite literally, the only thing approached with that kind of stigma. That it's okay to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy mess' on the simple fact that it's "new." Furthermore, you're incessant nature of insinuating I am stupid because I feel people should get finished products when they pay for them is getting rather trite. On January 06 2012 13:51 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:13 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:41 Arkless wrote:On January 06 2012 08:33 Dfgj wrote:
[quote]
Are you kidding? Expecting a finished product when purchasing something is whining and acting entitled? Make an analogy to any other good imaginable and that logic collapses hilariously hard. Man this thread has just turned into a place for people who play wow to come in and QQ. With that said, I was in the wow beta/ and there for vanilla launch. And I can say that the problems WOW had at launch were farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse then the problems TOR have.Infact every WOW expansion launch has sucked way worse than TORS initial release. IMO any bug you find in TOR (which I personally have not come across yet and have been loving the game thus far) is just you being nitpicky. Honestly, name one game released in the past 4 years that didn't need a patch/have bugs when they put it out. I mean FFS, most console games have glitches and bugs that we have accepted with no way of fixing them. If you want to cry, either don't play, keep your comments to yourself, or go to reddit. Stop assuming all negativity is coming from disgruntled WoW players. Stop trying to compare the production value of a game released in 2004 and a game released in almost 2012. Stop with this totalitarian-esque shit of "IF YOU DISLIKE ANY PART OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME WHATSOEVER THEN YOU'RE OPINION NO LONGER MATTERS, SHOO." Also, TOR is competing with current day WoW -- not Vanilla WoW. So comparing it to Vanilla WoW is fallacious. I haven't seen 1 positive thing you have said about this game in this thread and I wish there was an ignore button so I wouldn't ever have to see your posts in this thread again. This is just a testament to you not actually reading my posts. Because I have said, multiple times, this game is great. I am curious what are you going to do when GW2 comes out? Are you going to go bug youtubing like for swtor? Because you do know that GW2 is going to have the exact same problems right? Or hell any game you are looking forward to now of days? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? The fuck? Where did GW2 come from? Do you want to talk about my poodle next? Read my post so you understand where GW2 came from. I knew you were going to ask that lmao. ""where the fuck did GW2 come from" I know you are looking forward to it as the next god of MMO's and think it looks way better then swtor that is why I picked that game out of the billion games coming out." ...What? I'm not going to talk about GW2 with you because this isn't the thread for GW2. If you want to discuss my opinions about Guild Wars 2, go to the Guild Wars 2 thread. I am here to talk about SWTOR. Stop trying to derail the thread with arbitrary bullshit. I asked you a question. Why is it okay, in the MMO community and the MMO community alone, to release unfinished, unpolished, buggy products for the simple matter of them being "new"? How is that in any way acceptable? Why is people wanting to get a finished product with their money make them stupid, immature, childish, or WoW fanboys? I don't want to hear about how exceedingly complex making an MMO is -- I want to hear your reasoning of that question. As I thought. you avoid the question because it directly conflicts with your argument on how SWTOR should be perfect at launch. And I already reasoned what the fuck did you not read my post? I also realize that MMO's take a LOT more work then any other game genre out there. This isn't some single player game that is meant to entertain you for 20 hours and be done. This game is made with more content then any RTS game/RPG/FPS game will ever have. With current games that are way smaller then MMO's like skyrim and what not have bugs and those aren't even half the size of an MMO. I am wondering if you understand how much more complicated it is to make an MMO, let alone test every single quest to make sure it works perfect and every single thing works as it should? Do you know how impossible that is for an MMO or most games in general? Do you want to know how long that would take? 10 years. That isn't worth it to any game company to work on an MMO for 10 years if not longer to hopefully get every single bug. Its fucking impossible please read my post before you respond. Just hope you are looking forward to GW2 when its all buggy as well like every other MMO. You should wait to buy it or you'll complain about all the bugs as well
I avoided no question. You started asking me what my opinions were on a completely separate game that is not even part of the discussion and I told you this wasn't the thread for it. I don't expect SWTOR to be perfect, no game is perfect. Hell, NOTHING is perfect. I'm asking why it's okay for incomplete things to be released simply because they are new. There is a quintessential difference between "perfect" and "complete." A circle can be a complete circle, it doesn't mean it's by any stretch a perfect one, however. If you get what I'm saying. I'm just trying to understand how someone can justify someone being stupid for wanting a complete product they purchased.
Again, why do you keep bringing up GW2? I'm so confused right now, I can't comprehend your point. There's a game called Guild Wars 2 coming out? That's great. What does that have to do with the philosophy of the stigma that games should be released unfinished just because they are new and that people should stop "whining" about getting unfinished products they paid for.
Yes yes, MMO's are made for far more content, etc. They are also made in production for 5 years and have extensive beta testing periods that singleplayer games don't have where thousands, if not tens of thousands are supposed to be testing the game and finding issues and Bioware is supposed to be fixing them in the development Beta process. That's why the Beta exists. To compensate for that shit ton of content.
Also, can you stop with the excessive cursing? It's getting redundant.
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I give up. You are so hopeless going back to when I see your name I just ignore whatever you type. have fun trolling this thread some more.
User was warned for this post
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Why is there so much hate? There are bugs, but with 200+ hours of gameplay per character that is expected......
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On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there...
Pretty sure most of them(/us?) don't expected it to be completely polished and bugfree at launch, and probably also like the game, but complaints are still just as valid as all the positive comments in here.
Someone says "game is great, story is awesome" and you think thats somehow fine and adds something to this thread while negative comments doesn't?
Both are equally valid comments and equally pointless, so if you don't like them just don't read them and move the fuck on instead of arguing like a "whiny little child" for 2-3 pages.
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On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Every single one. That is why I think its retarded to complain. Every MMO I have heard of has had launch issues, bugs. Why would this MMO be any different then the thousands out there? Oh but you purchased so it should be 100% perfect, if that were true in any MMO no MMO would have been released until 10 years in the making probably. Am I the only one who finds it hilarious that you seem to think this MMO should be different then every other and be 100% perfect? Seriously your posting in this topic makes my brain hurt especially with your logic rofl.
Rift had a completely smooth launch, it was even a little bizarre, but it happened, dont act like theres no precedent.
A lot of you seem to really dont know about this, well rift had a smooth and practicly bug free launch, mechanics were smooth, servers were stables, lines were minimum, pvp and pve worked very smoothly, no crashes, mechanics were solid, class balance was the only thing that was not near perfect, and it improved a lot in the first few weeks.
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Russian Federation114 Posts
On January 06 2012 14:21 Ighox wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... Pretty sure most of them(/us?) don't expected it to be completely polished and bugfree at launch, and probably also like the game, but complaints are still just as valid as all the positive comments in here. Someone says "game is great, story is awesome" and you think thats somehow fine and adds something to this thread while negative comments doesn't? Both are equally valid comments and equally pointless, so if you don't like them just don't read them and move the fuck on instead of arguing like a "whiny little child" for 2-3 pages.
When I checked some forums during the beta to see if the game was worth it, everyone was like "this is the best game ever" and those who dared to add negative comments were flammed and considered as trolls.
This attitude is terrible imo, I would have liked to know how the game is really like before purchasing it, instead all I have found were biased opinions.
I know that a mmo on launch has less features / more bugs than other mmos, but some bugs are game breaking and some are not. MMOs on launch are expected to have minor bugs, major issues should not be tolerated.
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Osaka27118 Posts
If Fruscainte posts in this thread again, please PM me. If blade55555 argues about stupid shit again, PM me. Thanks.
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On January 06 2012 14:33 D10 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Every single one. That is why I think its retarded to complain. Every MMO I have heard of has had launch issues, bugs. Why would this MMO be any different then the thousands out there? Oh but you purchased so it should be 100% perfect, if that were true in any MMO no MMO would have been released until 10 years in the making probably. Am I the only one who finds it hilarious that you seem to think this MMO should be different then every other and be 100% perfect? Seriously your posting in this topic makes my brain hurt especially with your logic rofl. Rift had a completely smooth launch, it was even a little bizarre, but it happened, dont act like theres no precedent. A lot of you seem to really dont know about this, well rift had a smooth and practicly bug free launch, mechanics were smooth, servers were stables, lines were minimum, pvp and pve worked very smoothly, no crashes, mechanics were solid, class balance was the only thing that was not near perfect, and it improved a lot in the first few weeks.
It happened for you maybe, not for me, we had a ton of lagg the first night and a few hours queue time the first couple of weeks.
Still one of the better MMO launches out there though I'll agree on that, but it still had problems.
Trion were amazing at speed though, even in the beta while we did dungeons/raid and had problems one or two developers even came in-game, talked, then made the changes right away and were just like "try the boss now, should be fixed".
Never seen anything like that before but I hope to see it again. :D
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On January 06 2012 14:52 Ighox wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 14:33 D10 wrote:On January 06 2012 13:49 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:23 Fruscainte wrote:On January 06 2012 12:20 blade55555 wrote:On January 06 2012 12:18 Fruscainte wrote:
So is it anyone who is frustrated that their $60 + $180/yr product isn't living up to their standards because of X, Y, Z (despite how intelligently they lay out their issues, as I'm sure you're referring to extensive reviews others have posted in recent pages) that makes them a "whiny little child", or is it the simple fact that they disagree with you that makes them such? Yeah it can make them whiny children if they expect to the game to be as polished as WoW, LOTRO, or previous MMO's before those that have been out for many many years compared to an MMO that just released not even a month ago. If people are worried about bugs and shit and it being an MMO that just came out they should realize it will have bugs. There is no getting around it, there will be issues there will be flaws. If this bothers you people so much why did you buy the game? Why didn't you wait? You should know there will be issues as there is with every other MMO out there... I'm not speaking for everyone, but some people expect to be purchasing a finished product when they drop the amount of money MMO's these day require. $60 + $15/mo ($180/yr)? Some people get frustrated that shit isn't polished and isn't properly balanced. ESPECIALLY when they have as open a beta and testing process as they did. Yes, new MMO's are buggy piles of trash. Why should that be the standard, however? You're honestly insulting people for wanting to purchase a finished product? For wanting the standard of modern game production not to be "We'll fix it eventually."? Again, if you're having fun. Good for you. But not everyone is, and you shouldn't berate those who are not and tell them that they have to get out and that they are childish or insinuate that their opinions are worthless because "MMO's are expected to be shit at first." Also, don't contradict yourself. You and your companions say "DON'T MAKE OPINIONS ON THE GAME UNLESS YOU PLAY IT", and then people play it and dislike it, and you go "IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR PLAYING THINGS YOU DIDN'T RESEARCH!" There are problems with this game, clear ones. Some are really fucking huge to some and arbitrary to others. However, you only make the community look bad when you insult people for finding something wrong. Especially if they approach it intelligently, as a lot of people in this thread and other threads are. EDIT: Am I the only one who finds it hilariously odd that you are comparing the initial production value of a game released in 2004, and one released in 2011/almost 2012? That just hit me like a truck when I reread your post. The hell? Again EVERY MMO has problems at launch. Every single one. That is why I think its retarded to complain. Every MMO I have heard of has had launch issues, bugs. Why would this MMO be any different then the thousands out there? Oh but you purchased so it should be 100% perfect, if that were true in any MMO no MMO would have been released until 10 years in the making probably. Am I the only one who finds it hilarious that you seem to think this MMO should be different then every other and be 100% perfect? Seriously your posting in this topic makes my brain hurt especially with your logic rofl. Rift had a completely smooth launch, it was even a little bizarre, but it happened, dont act like theres no precedent. A lot of you seem to really dont know about this, well rift had a smooth and practicly bug free launch, mechanics were smooth, servers were stables, lines were minimum, pvp and pve worked very smoothly, no crashes, mechanics were solid, class balance was the only thing that was not near perfect, and it improved a lot in the first few weeks. It happened for you maybe, not for me, we had a ton of lagg the first night and a few hours queue time the first couple of weeks. Still one of the better MMO launches out there though I'll agree on that, but it still had problems. Trion were amazing at speed though, even in the beta while we did dungeons/raid and had problems one or two developers even came in-game, talked, then made the changes right away and were just like "try the boss now, should be fixed". Never seen anything like that before but I hope to see it again. :D
Sadly we wont see it in SWTOR =(
Heaing makes me feel like im being tortured by Darth vader
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Thank you Manifesto7.
Anyway, now that there are more players hitting 50, I am hoping they start seperating 50's from the rest soon. I reallly had a good time in the beginning with PvP but now, someone with full champion gear will easily kill half a team of lower levels single handedly.
Does anyone know of any dps-class theory crafting? I have been putting together some sort of simulation for Operatives and hopefully I want to start on Mercenaries soon.
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EPT
