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[HoN/DotA] Let's Play~!! - Page 1441

Forum Index > General Games
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xZiGGY
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom801 Posts
July 30 2011 20:44 GMT
#28801
<-- only person in the world who actually doesnt mind drunken master too much simply because he gets +80 movement speed and damage at lv7 and this is the kind of crap I like to play around with since I am trash pub player
Meh.
supdubdup
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States916 Posts
July 30 2011 20:46 GMT
#28802
On July 31 2011 01:28 Nancomerian wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 30 2011 19:03 supdubdup wrote:
On July 30 2011 17:45 xZiGGY wrote:
hon is dead 100%

hopefully. long live dota 2 (god i hope it's going to be great).


why so much hate towards HON? (

No hate. Here's to hoping Dota 2 will be good enough to grab members from the HoN community and LoL community and Dota community to make it the primary MOBA game.
Turn it Up
tempestulti
Profile Joined July 2011
14 Posts
July 30 2011 20:56 GMT
#28803
On July 31 2011 04:19 FinestHour wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 03:23 tempestulti wrote:
Oh does anyone have the problem where it won't let you run HoN with openGL ?
Can't get that thing working )=

Dont be bad hurrrrrrrrdurrrrrrr


Sound familiar?


Are you Ganfei3? Thanks for being a dick and not helping at the same time about it though.



User was banned for this post.
Ganfei2
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
473 Posts
July 30 2011 21:07 GMT
#28804
O R U GANFEI4???

User was warned for this post
NotJack
Profile Joined December 2009
United States737 Posts
July 30 2011 21:38 GMT
#28805
On July 31 2011 05:46 supdubdup wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 01:28 Nancomerian wrote:
On July 30 2011 19:03 supdubdup wrote:
On July 30 2011 17:45 xZiGGY wrote:
hon is dead 100%

hopefully. long live dota 2 (god i hope it's going to be great).


why so much hate towards HON? (

No hate. Here's to hoping Dota 2 will be good enough to grab members from the HoN community and LoL community and Dota community to make it the primary MOBA game.


Saying a game is hopefully dead constitutes hate. I don't understand how the first two of those posts don't get warnings. Seems the mods don't like HoN as much as other games.

I'm seeing as drunken master not being that great of a hero at the moment. He does have nice abilities to keep him alive but he doesn't have as big of a role in teamfights as someone like Kraken.

Monkey king's awesome as there's a lot of nuances to his combo's, and definitely can dish out the hurt better (even if it's way too similar to pandamonium).


rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-30 21:58:46
July 30 2011 21:53 GMT
#28806
On July 31 2011 06:38 NotJack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 05:46 supdubdup wrote:
On July 31 2011 01:28 Nancomerian wrote:
On July 30 2011 19:03 supdubdup wrote:
On July 30 2011 17:45 xZiGGY wrote:
hon is dead 100%

hopefully. long live dota 2 (god i hope it's going to be great).


why so much hate towards HON? (

No hate. Here's to hoping Dota 2 will be good enough to grab members from the HoN community and LoL community and Dota community to make it the primary MOBA game.


Saying a game is hopefully dead constitutes hate. I don't understand how the first two of those posts don't get warnings. Seems the mods don't like HoN as much as other games.

I'm seeing as drunken master not being that great of a hero at the moment. He does have nice abilities to keep him alive but he doesn't have as big of a role in teamfights as someone like Kraken.

Monkey king's awesome as there's a lot of nuances to his combo's, and definitely can dish out the hurt better (even if it's way too similar to pandamonium).



because some people play hon and hate some aspects of the game. cant love all games all the way

the first comment is somewhat true, if you look at up and coming tourneys, are there any other big ones other than NASL2 and dreamhack winter? i think theres one other LAN too, i dont remember what it was, but even dota still has ESWC, SMM, WDC
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
GhostKorean
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States2330 Posts
July 30 2011 23:17 GMT
#28807
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL
lepape
Profile Joined November 2005
Canada557 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-30 23:24:15
July 30 2011 23:17 GMT
#28808
On July 31 2011 05:44 xZiGGY wrote:
<-- only person in the world who actually doesnt mind drunken master too much simply because he gets +80 movement speed and damage at lv7 and this is the kind of crap I like to play around with since I am trash pub player


Drunken Master is fun, but not that well designed imo. He's interesting and certainly has the potential to own, but there's just better heroes to fill the same roles. If someone has a replay of someone completely owning with DM agaisnt a good team, I'd love to watch it.

It's either hit or miss with S2 lately, some heroes are really awesome (Emerald Warden), while others are fun, but don't seem to fill a specific role well (Parasite).

At least Drunken Master has the best alt avatar in the game so far.
NotJack
Profile Joined December 2009
United States737 Posts
July 30 2011 23:32 GMT
#28809
On July 31 2011 04:26 LordWeird wrote:
TMM with TL:

Queue against Testie. Highest MMR player rages that bubbles takes farm and dcs. We remake. Dodge a bullet. Whew. Then...

Get raped on Jiggle_Billy's stream


Sorry about that, we just had a better teamfight team imo. Top lane was fun though in the beginning, myrm sitting is always strange.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
July 30 2011 23:42 GMT
#28810
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL

competitive scene is not esports, a competitive video game scene doesnt need esports. and anyway, we all know esports is a farce
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Alaron
Profile Joined August 2010
United States225 Posts
July 30 2011 23:46 GMT
#28811
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL


Competitive HoN is dying? This is news to me. Proof?
GhostKorean
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States2330 Posts
July 31 2011 00:01 GMT
#28812
On July 31 2011 08:42 rabidch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL

competitive scene is not esports, a competitive video game scene doesnt need esports. and anyway, we all know esports is a farce

That's an interesting perspective. Couldn't you argue that viewers fuel tournaments, and tournaments drive competition
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 31 2011 00:08 GMT
#28813
On July 31 2011 09:01 GhostKorean wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 08:42 rabidch wrote:
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL

competitive scene is not esports, a competitive video game scene doesnt need esports. and anyway, we all know esports is a farce

That's an interesting perspective. Couldn't you argue that viewers fuel tournaments, and tournaments drive competition


No, you can't argue for that in a 5v5 team game where the players shuffle with no end. Stability builds popularity.
Get it by your hands...
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
July 31 2011 00:12 GMT
#28814
On July 31 2011 09:01 GhostKorean wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 08:42 rabidch wrote:
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL

competitive scene is not esports, a competitive video game scene doesnt need esports. and anyway, we all know esports is a farce

That's an interesting perspective. Couldn't you argue that viewers fuel tournaments, and tournaments drive competition

competitive scenes have existed for decades without need of streams. viewers correlates a little with more money but it shouldnt determine whether or not a game gets a scene. how the players feel about the game should
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
GhostKorean
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States2330 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-31 00:31:55
July 31 2011 00:28 GMT
#28815
But with the constant shuffling of players and teams you can never achieve stability in the scene and therefore no popularity. Sponsors start looking elsewhere to invest and you stop getting tournaments and people move on to different games for competition

Competition will obviously still exist even without sponsors but how big the scene is able to get relies entirely on how much money someone is willing to put into it. Without an incentive to stick around, competitive players will constantly shuffle around as Judicator pointed out and eventually the scene will die when the game is forgotten for other games

And rabidch I disagree with your statement. I feel that a competitive scene correlates directly with the number of viewers a tournament can get. Look at Brood War outside of Korea for an example. No doubt it was a great game and it had a huge following even 10 years after it's release but it had no viewers to fuel a competitive scene. The community could argue all it wants how great of a game it was and it could even point to the Korean scene as proof but outside of Korea not enough people cared about the game enough for someone to come out set up tournaments for foreigners outside of the one TSL event Brood War had.
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 31 2011 00:38 GMT
#28816
No, competitive scene will exist, but not within that artificial "esports" framework that people like bring up nowadays.

It's just a different trajectory to mainstream, whether it's actually achievable or not. I mentioned earlier that DotA/HoN/LoL doesn't hinge on the players or teams as much as it does on the commentators, more so than any other game. Right now, there's no face of DotA/HoN/LoL, no personality that just sits in the back of your mind when you think of these games; there are players and teams for sure, but no personality. There isn't a Day[9], a Mike Ross/Gootecks, or anything of the sort, and given the 5v5 nature of the scene, there won't be one from the players side.
Get it by your hands...
Fatmatt2000
Profile Joined January 2006
United States159 Posts
July 31 2011 00:43 GMT
#28817
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL


I dont disagree with you in principle, but I do honestly believe that Street Fighter is actually a very good spectator game. All the action is clear and on the screen, and it doesn't take more than 5 minutes of watching to understand the tensions going on between the players/ in the game.
Quote?
Alaron
Profile Joined August 2010
United States225 Posts
July 31 2011 00:50 GMT
#28818
www.honcast.com

Competitive HoN is dead? What a joke...
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 31 2011 01:03 GMT
#28819
On July 31 2011 09:43 Fatmatt2000 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2011 08:17 GhostKorean wrote:
Isn't NASL pretty big.

My opinion is that all eSports are bad spectator games so the only thing that matters for viewers is how big the playerbase is. The more players a game has, the more spectators it will have. It doesn't matter if a game is better suited for competition or not, a game with more players will have more spectators. Why do you think CoD has such huge tournaments?

That being said, competitive HoN is dying pretty steadily, and with NASL HoN coming up and the game going free, HoN might gain a surge of new players but who knows. The community isn't exactly welcoming towards new players either, and to a fresh, casual player HoN and LoL are the same thing, and their friends probably play LoL


I dont disagree with you in principle, but I do honestly believe that Street Fighter is actually a very good spectator game. All the action is clear and on the screen, and it doesn't take more than 5 minutes of watching to understand the tensions going on between the players/ in the game.


So is DotA when its well-casted...the problem is there aren't any good English casters. It honestly doesn't take that much to understand what is going on in a team fight, the casters should have primed the audience what is going on with the line ups, hell you have like at least 5 minutes to slowly get the audience use to the critical aspects...except nobody does it and the most popular casters are busy jerking off to each hero without really saying anything worthwhile to drag the casuals in.
Get it by your hands...
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
July 31 2011 01:07 GMT
#28820
On July 31 2011 09:28 GhostKorean wrote:
But with the constant shuffling of players and teams you can never achieve stability in the scene and therefore no popularity. Sponsors start looking elsewhere to invest and you stop getting tournaments and people move on to different games for competition

Competition will obviously still exist even without sponsors but how big the scene is able to get relies entirely on how much money someone is willing to put into it. Without an incentive to stick around, competitive players will constantly shuffle around as Judicator pointed out and eventually the scene will die when the game is forgotten for other games

And rabidch I disagree with your statement. I feel that a competitive scene correlates directly with the number of viewers a tournament can get. Look at Brood War outside of Korea for an example. No doubt it was a great game and it had a huge following even 10 years after it's release but it had no viewers to fuel a competitive scene. The community could argue all it wants how great of a game it was and it could even point to the Korean scene as proof but outside of Korea not enough people cared about the game enough for someone to come out set up tournaments for foreigners outside of the one TSL event Brood War had.

Brood War outside of Korea is a special case because there existed Brood War in Korea that was highly well known and had televised matches. Therefore the competitive scene outside Korea could never really be legitimized because it was always well known there were better people and more money in Korea, which was really where the competitive scene was.

But if you look at ST and its variants, SSBM, and the early Quake and CS scenes there wasn't much of "viewership" as we know it today in stream numbers, but there was still a highly competitive scene. In fact it was only until recent years that Japan's most popular fighting game scenes opened up to sponsors, but for many fighting games are very low compared to some of the ESPORTS games thrown around today, but that doesn't mean they don't have a scene.

Competition from these games shouldn't arise from wanting to win money, but from the game being fun to play and natural spirit of competition, so all it comes down to is how players feel about the game. Of course video game generations don't always cross over, so games will come and go but if a scene dies, viewer decrease is only one factor of many. Again, it's how the players feel about the game.
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
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