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For Honor: Swordsmanship "Shooter"

Forum Index > General Games
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Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-27 04:31:57
June 17 2016 06:48 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Described as a "shooter with swords," this game is, for me, the coolest thing to come out of the last two E3s. Play as a Knight, Viking, or Samurai and duel with a unique combat system "The Art of Battle." Attacks and blocking is directional, so if you see your enemy shifting their sword right, you'd better block that way. You can also bodyslam, pommel-strike, throw a knife, or call for archers if you want to even the odds a little. The combat feels extremely physical and visceral, with a weight to one's weapons and motions that most games lack.

The game is multiplayer at its core, but does have a campaign where you play as a nameless hero from each of the three factions. In normal games, you play shooter modes (e.g. point capture) while streams of AI grunts give the game a bit of that MOBA feel. The campaign can be played co-op, and is meant as an entry point to the multiplayer.

+ Show Spoiler +

+ Show Spoiler +

+ Show Spoiler +


Release is currently scheduled for Valentines Day next year. Happy Valentines!

What we know so far:
+ Show Spoiler +
Classes
+ Show Spoiler +

NB: all stats are estimates, and rough ones at that.

KNIGHTS+ Show Spoiler +

A: Peacekeeper (arming sword + parry dagger)
Light armor, agile.

V: Warden (longsword)
Medium armor, versatile but middle-of-the-road.
HP: ~130.
Light Attack: ~10-15
Heavy Attack: ~20-40

H: Conqueror (shield + flail)
Heavy warrior, tough and shielded.
HP: ~140

Y: Lawbringer (poleaxe)
Very heavily armored, carries poleaxe. Powerful but unwieldy?


VIKINGS+ Show Spoiler +

A: Berserker (dual axes)
Fast attack speed.

V: Raider (great axe)
Heavy armor, but no shirt. Just a beast. Slower attacks, but powerful.
HP: ~140.
Light Attack: ~10-15
Heavy Attack: ~30-50

H: Warlord (shield + sword)
Heavy warrior, tough and shielded.

Y: Valkyrie (spear)
Lighter armor, but shielded.


SAMURAI
+ Show Spoiler +
A: Orochi (katana)
Quick attacks, good dodge. Weak blocking.
HP: ~120
Light Attack: ~10-15
Heavy Attack: ~20-40

V: Kensei (nodachi)
Less durable than other Vanguards but better on some attacks.
HP: ~120.
Light Attack: ~15-25
Heavy Attack: ~20-40

H: Shugoki (club)
Heavy warrior. Powerful but slow attacks, capable of significant knockback.

Y: Nobushi (spear)
Light armor. Agile.




Blocking and hitting:
+ Show Spoiler +
Lock on combat. You pick a stance: left, right, or top. Your enemy does too. You can shift back and forth, and the idea is to either avoid their stance and attack to score a hit, or match their stance to block, staggering them and allowing you to counter. If you block successfully, you have a moment to get your own hit in. A block or parry makes you invulnerable for a few moments, which is essential if outnumbered.


Moves
+ Show Spoiler +
Light Attack: Quick attack. Does 10-20 damage for classes we've seen so far. Variable damage, like all attacks.

Heavy Attack: Wind-up attack. 20-50 damage for classes we've seen so far. Can be cancelled mid-animation to feint and switch to another move or direction. Does chip damage through blocks.

Execution: Finish him! If you kill an enemy with a heavy attack, you have a few moments where you can execute them. The animation leaves you vulnerable for a few seconds, but grants bonus XP (and maybe victory points?), increases their respawn delay, and makes them unable to revive. You regain some health as well.

Parry: Advanced block. Perform a heavy attack at the moment of contact during a block to stun the enemy and drain their stamina.

Guard Break: Interrupts guards (and I think attacks?). A shove that stuns the enemy for a second. Double hitting the button causes a more powerful version, depends on class. This more powerful version is usable to knock enemies off heights or into dangerous objects like spikes and fire. + Show Spoiler +
Raider does a linebacker grab and run, Warden is I think a kick, Orochi maybe flips over enemy and pushes them? Hard to tell what moves come from what button combos, and I know Warden has a shoulder-charge too.
You can stop an enemy from successfully guard-breaking you by performing a break yourself at the same time.

Combos: Little is known about these so far except that they exist. There's a lot of fighting game kind of combinations each class can do that do cool things. A few unblockable attacks exist as parts of combos. The third sequential attack seems to have special power. The Orochi seems to be able to attack seemlessly after a dodge, and the Warden has a few different melee attacks we've seen, and r/forhonor is convinced they can do an autoattack after upward block, though I've seen no evidence of this (Correction: this is a thing. Watch the Polygon video at 20:30 to see the seamless counter, similar to how the Orochi counter works). Again, I'm pretty sure the level of play we've seen so far makes it hard to say much about combos, but we do know many exist.

Dodges: Sidestepping, jumping back, and dodge-rolls are all a part of the game.

Feats: Various special abilities are available in game and seem to vary so they are probably chosen pre-game. Apparently at least faction-locked, maybe class-locked. You earn XP as the game goes on, allowing you to unlock up to 4 feats. They are generally not very high impact compared to skills in other games... the fighting part stays as the core of the game. Known feats include (I'm sure I missed a ton, and they were ignored by many players):
+ Show Spoiler +
Knights:
-Flashbang (blind enemies at target area for a moment)
-Fire grenade (target area deals damage over second to enemies in it)
-Catapult Strike (after a few moments, anything in target area gets smashed by big rock)
-Rally (your dudes get stronger)
Vikings
-Speed Boost (you run fast)
-Berserk (gain speed/stamina/attack)
Samurai
-Smoke grenade (obscure UI and block vision for several seconds in a large area)
-Self heal
-Throwing knife


Game Modes
+ Show Spoiler +

CAMPAIGN: Kill 'dem AIs. Bossfights aplenty. Knight campaign, then Viking, then Samurai, BW-style. Endboss named Apollyon.

1v1: Yup. Duel somebody and fuck 'em up gud.
2v2: Find a buddy and kill somebody else and their buddy.
4v4: You kinda get the idea. Straight 4v4 is called ELIMINATION.

CONQUEST: The primary game mode, and the only multiplayer one we've seen footage of so far.

Left, Right, and Center capture points. At Center point, called "the Front," swarms of little AI dudes fight each other. You can kill these guys in one hit (some cleave attacks can get a few at a go.) They are able to hurt you in larger numbers, but as long as you don't get surrounded you're pretty safe.

Left/Right are uncontested by the AI, so you can fight your glorious duels here. Fewer points per second to hold these, but they can heal you if you stand in them while they are held uncontested by your team.

You get 1pt for killing minions, 5 for killing players, some for holding a point, and 2/s for guarding a point (standing on it uncontested). XP/Renown is a separate system that earns you points personally for feats, using basically the same sources of points, but with granularity for how you scored the kill etc.

You also get 100 points for each point you hold. Confusingly, these points are not permanent. If you have 1001 pts and lose a point, you are at 901. This turns out to be really important because...

At 1000 pts, the enemy team is "breaking." This means their heroes stop respawning. Kill them to end the game. However, if they are able to take a point and get back under 1000, they stop breaking and their dead heroes respawn. Some cool comebacks are possible because of this. There is some kind of stalemate resolution, which I think is auto-lose after 4 min while breaking. + Show Spoiler +
The final game of that Paragon video has the attackers lose with the defenders at 1583 pts. After they were breaking, the attackers clumped into a 4 man ball and played it safe, but surrendered map control and fell increasingly behind in points. I think it might be time sensitive: the team is continuously breaking for 4min0sec.



Team Play
+ Show Spoiler +
As anyone who has ever been in a fight knows, it is VERY hard to fight 2v1. Don't do it. Communicate with your team-mates, try to fight on even numbers, and if outnumbered just try to keep them busy so your buddies have a better time of things elsewhere.

Blocking: A red arrow will indicate an attack from an enemy other than the one you're locked onto. You don't need to match their guard to block, only the side they are coming from. Some evidence indicates you need to block top to stop top attacks even from the side (which makes intuitive sense). If you block an attack, you cannot be hit for a second, so get some damage or distance.

Revenge: If you block enough attacks or take enough damage, you enter revenge mode. After a little animation (which leaves you vulnerable and during which half the youtubers got killed like chumps), you knock down adjacent enemies and gain super-blocks and faster attack speed. Your revenge bar fills faster if multiple opponents are locked on to you. This means a clever player can really fuck up multiple opponents if they play smart and stay alive until revenge allows them to take the fight to the other guys.

Why you shouldn't fight when outnumbered
-The enemy, if coordinated, can attack from two sides and make it very hard to block (though, if you catch the first one to connect, you can auto-block the other).
-If you die, you're pretty dead. If they lose a guy, they can revive him if they kill you quick enough.
-If you're on the Right or Left point, they can heal all the way after killing you unless it gets contested.

Do note though, that there can be an advantage to having a guy 2v1 the bad guys then have another guy sneak up on them. The tank can fill up with revenge, while the reinforcement guy can eliminate a weak enemy from behind, and can revive the tank if the tank dies. Because of this, it can be a good idea to pair off in even number group fights rather than ganging up.


gingerfluffmuff
Profile Joined January 2011
Austria4570 Posts
June 17 2016 07:09 GMT
#2
Chivalry for consoles i guess. Combat looks better in chiv though, no need for all that lock-on crap.

Graphics are nice i guess. Knowing Ubisoft one can only judge the final product
・゚✧:・゚+..。✧・゚:・..。 ✧・゚ :・゚ ゜・:・ ✧・゚:・゚:.。 ✧・゚ SPARKULING *・゜・:・゚✧:・゚✧。゚+..。 ✧・゚: ✧・゚:・゜・:・゚✧::・・:・゚・゚
Foxxan
Profile Joined October 2004
Sweden3427 Posts
June 17 2016 07:15 GMT
#3
This game looks badass but its ubisoft so well guess i need to pray :S
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
June 17 2016 07:31 GMT
#4
On June 17 2016 16:09 gingerfluffmuff wrote:
Chivalry for consoles i guess. Combat looks better in chiv though, no need for all that lock-on crap.

Graphics are nice i guess. Knowing Ubisoft one can only judge the final product


Eh. I was unimpressed by Chivalry, honestly. Combat always felt a little "gamey."

But yeah, Ubisoft so one has to be a little wary.
TaShadan
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany1970 Posts
June 17 2016 07:50 GMT
#5
Looks nice but Ubisoft? OMG...
Total Annihilation Zero
NukeD
Profile Joined October 2010
Croatia1612 Posts
June 17 2016 13:36 GMT
#6
It looks bad.
sorry for dem one liners
Latham
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
9560 Posts
June 17 2016 13:49 GMT
#7
I mean it looks nice, but Ubisoft? LMAO it's malformed and defective even before birth.
For the curse of life is the curse of want. PC = https://be.pcpartpicker.com/list/4JknvV
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
June 17 2016 14:17 GMT
#8
On June 17 2016 22:49 Latham wrote:
I mean it looks nice, but Ubisoft? LMAO it's malformed and defective even before birth.

Yeah, the chance of it being a nightmare is high. But Ubisoft is so big that they do make some good games. I liked the Farcry games and some of the AC games. The feedback I hear from E3 is that the game is fun against other humans. But this is one I want for it to release and then wait some more.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
June 17 2016 14:32 GMT
#9
It looks kinda decent tbh

problem is that since its melee combat based on timed parry and stuff, i can see it being a mess with a little lag
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
Jaedrik
Profile Joined June 2015
113 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-17 15:18:34
June 17 2016 15:17 GMT
#10
Judge each game per se and not on its publisher, though the publisher may give a general indication of likely game quality beforehand.

Anyways, I'm really hopeful for it--primarily because the knights have badass halfswording, a real life technique. Regardless, it's still a game, ain't nothing gonna get real fighting. Though... they can get close, because real fighting is all about time and distance, two characteristics that can be copied and gamified. BUT this game with its lock-on fighting seems to remove the 'distance' part.
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10673 Posts
June 17 2016 15:42 GMT
#11
Looks amazing
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
OtherWorld
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
France17333 Posts
June 17 2016 15:54 GMT
#12
Concept looks nice, but I'm not convinced. Will have to see game in hands, though
Used Sigs - New Sigs - Cheap Sigs - Buy the Best Cheap Sig near You at www.cheapsigforsale.com
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
June 17 2016 16:01 GMT
#13
Looks pretty awesome. Only complaint I have is it seems like everyone has big slow weapons and I hate slow .
When I think of something else, something will go here
plated.rawr
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Norway1676 Posts
June 17 2016 16:16 GMT
#14
I remember seeing this presented during E3 2015, and I loved what I saw back then. It surely looks powermetal as fuck, and if the controls feels right, I can imagine it being awesome.

However, it being Ubisoft makes me scared as well.
Savior broke my heart ;_; || twitch.tv/onnings
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-18 11:38:24
August 18 2016 11:32 GMT
#15
Some new info on classes:

At least in 4v4, you can have mixed faction teams.

Each faction has four basic class types, signifying overall roles. The classes are Assassin, Vanguard, Heavy, and Hybrid. Each faction has fairly different versions of each class archetype. Please note that my descriptions are based on screenshots, and things like armor types may be more aesthetic than mechanical.

ASSASSIN
Knight: Peacekeeper (arming sword + parry dagger). Leather armor.
Viking: Berserker (bearded axe + bearded axe). Cloth armor.
Samurai: Orochi (katana). Partial segmented armor.

VANGUARD
K: Warden (longsword). Chain and partial plate. Described by devs as “medium armor”
V: Raider (great axe). Almost no real armor.
S: Kensei (nodachi (long katana)). Partial plate armor.

HEAVY
K: Conqueror (flail + shield). Partial plate.
V: Warlord (viking sword + shield). Chain and leather.
S: Shugoki (kanabo (spiked club)). Segmented.

HYBRID
K: Lawbringer (poleaxe). Heavy plate.
V: Valkyrie (spear + small shield). Cloth and leather.
S: Nobushi (naginata (spear with curved blade on end)). Cloth.

I’ve not seen any gameplay footage of any classes other than Orochi, Warden, Raider, and Kensei.

Images:
Knights
Vikings
Samurai

Video:
Faction/Classes trailer
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-18 12:03:34
August 18 2016 12:03 GMT
#16
Thanks for the Gamescom info, Yoav, great job. I'm also very interested in this game, simply because I like swordfights, vikings, samurais and knights :D.

I would be satisfied with it ending up being a slightly more technical, multiplayer Dynasty Warriors.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
August 18 2016 12:46 GMT
#17
I liked the discussion about “evoking history” rather than any delusion of accuracy. As someone who studied history, I’m glad that at least one developer is trying claim any type of accuracy in their crazy action game.

I want to get some hands on time with this game. It looks like a lot of fun if the stuff you do beyond dueling in meaningful. I’m also into any game that embraces slow, deliberate combat.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-27 04:05:53
August 26 2016 22:36 GMT
#18
So I've watched a bit of the gameplay that came out of gamescom. A lot of it is very hampered by really, really bad players. I wish we got some more competent players going for it. That said, the Polygon video is decent. Some obvious decision-making failures, but also some decent understanding of at least the basic mechanics.

Also, it's got the first PvP gameplay I've seen of the fifth class, the Conqueror (Knight Heavy, flail and shield). It's brief and towards the end, and the guy gets wrekt, but still cool. + Show Spoiler +
You can briefly glimpse a Conqueror setting up a ladder in the Knight campaign mission released. Similarly, you can spot the Valkyrie and Shugoki (and very briefly the Warlord) in the Viking campaign mission.


+ Show Spoiler +
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTZWASv-fmk


Speaking of mechanics, here is what we know so far:

Blocking and hitting:
+ Show Spoiler +
Lock on combat. You pick a stance: left, right, or top. Your enemy does too. You can shift back and forth, and the idea is to either avoid their stance and attack to score a hit, or match their stance to block, staggering them and allowing you to counter. If you block successfully, you have a moment to get your own hit in. A block or parry makes you invulnerable for a few moments, which is essential if outnumbered.


Moves
+ Show Spoiler +
Light Attack: Quick attack. Does 10-20 damage for classes we've seen so far. Variable damage, like all attacks.

Heavy Attack: Wind-up attack. 20-50 damage for classes we've seen so far. Can be cancelled mid-animation to feint and switch to another move or direction. Does chip damage through blocks.

Execution: Finish him! If you kill an enemy with a heavy attack, you have a few moments where you can execute them. The animation leaves you vulnerable for a few seconds, but grants bonus XP (and maybe victory points?), increases their respawn delay, and makes them unable to revive. You regain some health as well.

Parry: Advanced block. Perform a heavy attack at the moment of contact during a block to stun the enemy and drain their stamina.

Guard Break: Interrupts guards (and I think attacks?). A shove that stuns the enemy for a second. Double hitting the button causes a more powerful version, depends on class. This more powerful version is usable to knock enemies off heights or into dangerous objects like spikes and fire. + Show Spoiler +
Raider does a linebacker grab and run, Warden is I think a kick, Orochi maybe flips over enemy and pushes them? Hard to tell what moves come from what button combos, and I know Warden has a shoulder-charge too.
You can stop an enemy from successfully guard-breaking you by performing a break yourself at the same time.

Combos: Little is known about these so far except that they exist. There's a lot of fighting game kind of combinations each class can do that do cool things. A few unblockable attacks exist as parts of combos. The third sequential attack seems to have special power. The Orochi seems to be able to attack seemlessly after a dodge, and the Warden has a few different melee attacks we've seen, and r/forhonor is convinced they can do an autoattack after upward block, though I've seen no evidence of this (Correction: this is a thing. Watch the Polygon video at 20:30 to see the seamless counter, similar to how the Orochi counter works). Again, I'm pretty sure the level of play we've seen so far makes it hard to say much about combos, but we do know many exist.

Dodges: Sidestepping, jumping back, and dodge-rolls are all a part of the game.

Feats: Various special abilities are available in game and seem to vary so they are probably chosen pre-game. Apparently at least faction-locked, maybe class-locked. You earn XP as the game goes on, allowing you to unlock up to 4 feats. They are generally not very high impact compared to skills in other games... the fighting part stays as the core of the game. Known feats include (I'm sure I missed a ton, and they were ignored by many players):
+ Show Spoiler +
Knights:
-Flashbang (blind enemies at target area for a moment)
-Fire grenade (target area deals damage over second to enemies in it)
-Catapult Strike (after a few moments, anything in target area gets smashed by big rock)
-Rally (your dudes get stronger)
Vikings
-Speed Boost (you run fast)
-Berserk (gain speed/stamina/attack)
Samurai
-Smoke grenade (obscure UI and block vision for several seconds in a large area)
-Self heal
-Throwing knife


Game Modes
+ Show Spoiler +

CAMPAIGN: Kill 'dem AIs. Bossfights aplenty. Knight campaign, then Viking, then Samurai, BW-style. Endboss named Apollyon.

1v1: Yup. Duel somebody and fuck 'em up gud.
2v2: Find a buddy and kill somebody else and their buddy.
4v4: You kinda get the idea. Straight 4v4 is called ELIMINATION.

CONQUEST: The primary game mode, and the only multiplayer one we've seen footage of so far.

Left, Right, and Center capture points. At Center point, called "the Front," swarms of little AI dudes fight each other. You can kill these guys in one hit (some cleave attacks can get a few at a go.) They are able to hurt you in larger numbers, but as long as you don't get surrounded you're pretty safe.

Left/Right are uncontested by the AI, so you can fight your glorious duels here. Fewer points per second to hold these, but they can heal you if you stand in them while they are held uncontested by your team.

You get 1pt for killing minions, 5 for killing players, some for holding a point, and 2/s for guarding a point (standing on it uncontested). XP/Renown is a separate system that earns you points personally for feats, using basically the same sources of points, but with granularity for how you scored the kill etc.

You also get 100 points for each point you hold. Confusingly, these points are not permanent. If you have 1001 pts and lose a point, you are at 901. This turns out to be really important because...

At 1000 pts, the enemy team is "breaking." This means their heroes stop respawning. Kill them to end the game. However, if they are able to take a point and get back under 1000, they stop breaking and their dead heroes respawn. Some cool comebacks are possible because of this. There is some kind of stalemate resolution, which I think is auto-lose after 4 min while breaking. + Show Spoiler +
The final game of that Paragon video has the attackers lose with the defenders at 1583 pts. After they were breaking, the attackers clumped into a 4 man ball and played it safe, but surrendered map control and fell increasingly behind in points. I think it might be time sensitive: the team is continuously breaking for 4min0sec.



Team Play
+ Show Spoiler +
As anyone who has ever been in a fight knows, it is VERY hard to fight 2v1. Don't do it. Communicate with your team-mates, try to fight on even numbers, and if outnumbered just try to keep them busy so your buddies have a better time of things elsewhere.

Blocking: A red arrow will indicate an attack from an enemy other than the one you're locked onto. You don't need to match their guard to block, only the side they are coming from. Some evidence indicates you need to block top to stop top attacks even from the side (which makes intuitive sense). If you block an attack, you cannot be hit for a second, so get some damage or distance.

Revenge: If you block enough attacks or take enough damage, you enter revenge mode. After a little animation (which leaves you vulnerable and during which half the youtubers got killed like chumps), you knock down adjacent enemies and gain super-blocks and faster attack speed. Your revenge bar fills faster if multiple opponents are locked on to you. This means a clever player can really fuck up multiple opponents if they play smart and stay alive until revenge allows them to take the fight to the other guys.

Why you shouldn't fight when outnumbered
-The enemy, if coordinated, can attack from two sides and make it very hard to block (though, if you catch the first one to connect, you can auto-block the other).
-If you die, you're pretty dead. If they lose a guy, they can revive him if they kill you quick enough.
-If you're on the Right or Left point, they can heal all the way after killing you unless it gets contested.

Do note though, that there can be an advantage to having a guy 2v1 the bad guys then have another guy sneak up on them. The tank can fill up with revenge, while the reinforcement guy can eliminate a weak enemy from behind, and can revive the tank if the tank dies. Because of this, it can be a good idea to pair off in even number group fights rather than ganging up.


Edited: caught video evidence of the quick counter from top attack by the Warden. It's a part of the moveset.
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
September 17 2016 01:27 GMT
#19
So the alpha NDA got lifted for this round of testing.

Which means there's a ton of new footage... but since it's a brand new genre (pretty much), the overall quality of play is laughable, which is a pity since so much of what is cool about ForHonor is the interactions skilled players have with one another. This guy is pretty skilled though, and plays with several different classes:

Generally for information, there's a great overview of the classes at 00:31:22 in the official reveal video:

Ton of new information, too much to post now (mostly I sucked enough dick to get in the alpha and am too busy killing Vikings to go through it all right now).

Overview:
The Knight Conqueror (Flail+Shield) and Viking Berserker (Twin Axes) have been added to the already shown classes. This means we've now seen 6 of the 12. Conqueror is a tanky beast who interrupts attack chains when he blocks, can channel an omnidirectional block at the cost of stamina, has a heavy attack where he is still guarded and spins the flail behind him for momentum, and a wicked channeled sweeping attack where he takes a knee and just spins the flail in a circle. Berserker is similar to the Samurai Orochi... quick, combo-based, low HP. Good at dodging, and has a strong leap attack. (Also, a sick execute where he puts the axes behind the enemy's head and pops it off like a cork.) We also just got our first look at customization, which is beast. Duel mode (1v1) and Brawl (2v2) are now in game, but I'd hold off on watching much until we get more people who know how to play. Duels are dumb if both people are hacking mindlessly, but are great if both are playing well.
Mannerheim
Profile Joined April 2007
766 Posts
September 17 2016 19:10 GMT
#20
I've been watching some streamers play this and it looks nice, but the movement and attacks seem so delayed and stiff compared to something like Dark Souls PvP. Of course watching isn't the same as playing, so I'll have to wait and try it out myself before judging.
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