Pretty much nobody appreciates such comments ^^
You said hardest raid bosses. Which is simply wrong.Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%.
You're forgetting something. That is 3.35% of raiders. The real percentage is even smaller.| Forum Index > General Games |
|
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
June 12 2014 22:19 GMT
#1081
Pretty much nobody appreciates such comments ^^ You said hardest raid bosses. Which is simply wrong.Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. You're forgetting something. That is 3.35% of raiders. The real percentage is even smaller. | ||
|
Cyro
United Kingdom20321 Posts
June 12 2014 22:20 GMT
#1082
On June 13 2014 07:18 Gorsameth wrote: Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:08 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:58 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 06:53 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:47 Targe wrote: ive seen people throwing the wow vs wildstar discussion around in zone chats, i tell to stfu every time this game is truly great thou and can stand on its own without wow I think they're different enough, and i was dreading returning to Warlords of Draenor with stats like 70% of people who hit max level killing the hardest raid bosses 70% != 3.35% Good try tho, I can understand math is hard. 1.3 million players killed deathwing in the ~4-5 weeks after it opened. That's not 3.35% of the playerbase - and it expanded a TON more in the 6+ months after that. Most of my post was pointing towards releasing the only "endgame" content, then adding an "optional" higher difficulty to it that gave rewards that didn't really matter was not a good way to handle things for the players who enjoyed the challenge, experience and reward for killing such bosses. I'm just one on a long list of alienated players from that choice. Even WOTLK or the first few tiers of cata would have been preferable, if the TBC style of doing things wasn't what they wanted any more. They made a choice that they can never really go back on that forever changed the game and the playerbase it attracted after lots of turnover. Your talking about how many killed the hardest raid boss. Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. If you were talking about Cata its 22% of raiders or ~14k people Heck even normal mode Madness was only 53k. Hardly anywhere near the numbers you are trying to pretend. Also if you think that the difference between normal and hc is just more hp/dmg it just serves to show you have no idea what you are talking about. I know the differences, and there's no need to be crazy offensive/defensive about it. The most difficult content in the game is available, almost entirely, on raid finder difficulty, which has those kinds of numbers - 1.3 million unique player kills in a month from launch On June 13 2014 07:19 Thorakh wrote: You said hardest raid bosses. Which is simply wrong. Deathwing and Garrosh are the hardest raid bosses - they are available on raid finder. It's a matter of interpretation, not me being wrong. What's up with all the WoW players lurking and waiting to post when they are offended about something? | ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21953 Posts
June 12 2014 22:21 GMT
#1083
On June 13 2014 07:20 Cyro wrote: Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:18 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 07:08 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:58 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 06:53 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:47 Targe wrote: ive seen people throwing the wow vs wildstar discussion around in zone chats, i tell to stfu every time this game is truly great thou and can stand on its own without wow I think they're different enough, and i was dreading returning to Warlords of Draenor with stats like 70% of people who hit max level killing the hardest raid bosses 70% != 3.35% Good try tho, I can understand math is hard. 1.3 million players killed deathwing in the ~4-5 weeks after it opened. That's not 3.35% of the playerbase - and it expanded a TON more in the 6+ months after that. Most of my post was pointing towards releasing the only "endgame" content, then adding an "optional" higher difficulty to it that gave rewards that didn't really matter was not a good way to handle things for the players who enjoyed the challenge, experience and reward for killing such bosses. I'm just one on a long list of alienated players from that choice. Even WOTLK or the first few tiers of cata would have been preferable, if the TBC style of doing things wasn't what they wanted any more. They made a choice that they can never really go back on that forever changed the game and the playerbase it attracted after lots of turnover. Your talking about how many killed the hardest raid boss. Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. If you were talking about Cata its 22% of raiders or ~14k people Heck even normal mode Madness was only 53k. Hardly anywhere near the numbers you are trying to pretend. Also if you think that the difference between normal and hc is just more hp/dmg it just serves to show you have no idea what you are talking about. I know the differences, and there's no need to be crazy offensive/defensive about it. The most difficult content in the game is available, almost entirely, on raid finder difficulty, which has those kinds of numbers - 1.3 million unique player kills in a month from launch Raid Finder.... Thank you for utterly destroying your own point. | ||
|
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
June 12 2014 22:21 GMT
#1084
On June 13 2014 07:20 Cyro wrote: LFR is not the most difficult content. It doesn't even make sense what you are saying. The most difficult content is available in the lowest difficulty? What?Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:18 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 07:08 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:58 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 06:53 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:47 Targe wrote: ive seen people throwing the wow vs wildstar discussion around in zone chats, i tell to stfu every time this game is truly great thou and can stand on its own without wow I think they're different enough, and i was dreading returning to Warlords of Draenor with stats like 70% of people who hit max level killing the hardest raid bosses 70% != 3.35% Good try tho, I can understand math is hard. 1.3 million players killed deathwing in the ~4-5 weeks after it opened. That's not 3.35% of the playerbase - and it expanded a TON more in the 6+ months after that. Most of my post was pointing towards releasing the only "endgame" content, then adding an "optional" higher difficulty to it that gave rewards that didn't really matter was not a good way to handle things for the players who enjoyed the challenge, experience and reward for killing such bosses. I'm just one on a long list of alienated players from that choice. Even WOTLK or the first few tiers of cata would have been preferable, if the TBC style of doing things wasn't what they wanted any more. They made a choice that they can never really go back on that forever changed the game and the playerbase it attracted after lots of turnover. Your talking about how many killed the hardest raid boss. Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. If you were talking about Cata its 22% of raiders or ~14k people Heck even normal mode Madness was only 53k. Hardly anywhere near the numbers you are trying to pretend. Also if you think that the difference between normal and hc is just more hp/dmg it just serves to show you have no idea what you are talking about. I know the differences, and there's no need to be crazy offensive/defensive about it. The most difficult content in the game is available, almost entirely, on raid finder difficulty, which has those kinds of numbers - 1.3 million unique player kills in a month from launch I personally think a mix of TBC + WotLK would be better than what we have now, but that has its own share of problems too. Regardless, you're still wrong. The most difficult content gets cleared by less than 1% of the total playerbase. | ||
|
Cyro
United Kingdom20321 Posts
June 12 2014 22:22 GMT
#1085
On June 13 2014 07:21 Thorakh wrote: Show nested quote + LFR is not the most difficult content.On June 13 2014 07:20 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 07:18 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 07:08 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:58 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 06:53 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:47 Targe wrote: ive seen people throwing the wow vs wildstar discussion around in zone chats, i tell to stfu every time this game is truly great thou and can stand on its own without wow I think they're different enough, and i was dreading returning to Warlords of Draenor with stats like 70% of people who hit max level killing the hardest raid bosses 70% != 3.35% Good try tho, I can understand math is hard. 1.3 million players killed deathwing in the ~4-5 weeks after it opened. That's not 3.35% of the playerbase - and it expanded a TON more in the 6+ months after that. Most of my post was pointing towards releasing the only "endgame" content, then adding an "optional" higher difficulty to it that gave rewards that didn't really matter was not a good way to handle things for the players who enjoyed the challenge, experience and reward for killing such bosses. I'm just one on a long list of alienated players from that choice. Even WOTLK or the first few tiers of cata would have been preferable, if the TBC style of doing things wasn't what they wanted any more. They made a choice that they can never really go back on that forever changed the game and the playerbase it attracted after lots of turnover. Your talking about how many killed the hardest raid boss. Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. If you were talking about Cata its 22% of raiders or ~14k people Heck even normal mode Madness was only 53k. Hardly anywhere near the numbers you are trying to pretend. Also if you think that the difference between normal and hc is just more hp/dmg it just serves to show you have no idea what you are talking about. I know the differences, and there's no need to be crazy offensive/defensive about it. The most difficult content in the game is available, almost entirely, on raid finder difficulty, which has those kinds of numbers - 1.3 million unique player kills in a month from launch Garrosh and Deathwing were the endgame content. They were available on raid finder. The final boss of the game, the entire raid dungeon content, open for everyone to kill - good or not, competent or not. The most difficult content is available in the lowest difficulty? What? That's exactly my point. Actually, i probably couldn't word it any better. The only people still playing and enjoying the raid content are the ones that don't have a problem with blizzards reasoning, so it's natural to have it defended Regardless, you're still wrong. The most difficult content gets cleared by less than 1% of the total playerbase. That really depends on how you view things. The hardest difficulty mode for the endgame boss? Yea. The content in general? No, 1 in 8 people who are max level killed Deathwing on launch month as i showed - and that was just the first month - there were ~10 more before it was no longer the primary boss to defeat | ||
|
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
June 12 2014 22:24 GMT
#1086
On June 13 2014 07:22 Cyro wrote: Then it's not really the most difficult content, is it now?Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:21 Thorakh wrote: On June 13 2014 07:20 Cyro wrote: LFR is not the most difficult content.On June 13 2014 07:18 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 07:08 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:58 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 06:53 Cyro wrote: On June 13 2014 06:47 Targe wrote: ive seen people throwing the wow vs wildstar discussion around in zone chats, i tell to stfu every time this game is truly great thou and can stand on its own without wow I think they're different enough, and i was dreading returning to Warlords of Draenor with stats like 70% of people who hit max level killing the hardest raid bosses 70% != 3.35% Good try tho, I can understand math is hard. 1.3 million players killed deathwing in the ~4-5 weeks after it opened. That's not 3.35% of the playerbase - and it expanded a TON more in the 6+ months after that. Most of my post was pointing towards releasing the only "endgame" content, then adding an "optional" higher difficulty to it that gave rewards that didn't really matter was not a good way to handle things for the players who enjoyed the challenge, experience and reward for killing such bosses. I'm just one on a long list of alienated players from that choice. Even WOTLK or the first few tiers of cata would have been preferable, if the TBC style of doing things wasn't what they wanted any more. They made a choice that they can never really go back on that forever changed the game and the playerbase it attracted after lots of turnover. Your talking about how many killed the hardest raid boss. Atm that is Hc Garrosh at 3.35%. If you were talking about Cata its 22% of raiders or ~14k people Heck even normal mode Madness was only 53k. Hardly anywhere near the numbers you are trying to pretend. Also if you think that the difference between normal and hc is just more hp/dmg it just serves to show you have no idea what you are talking about. I know the differences, and there's no need to be crazy offensive/defensive about it. The most difficult content in the game is available, almost entirely, on raid finder difficulty, which has those kinds of numbers - 1.3 million unique player kills in a month from launch Garrosh and Deathwing were the endgame content. They were available on raid finder. The final boss of the game, the entire raid dungeon content, open for everyone to kill - good or not, competent or not. That's exactly my point. Actually, i probably couldn't word it any better. The only people still playing and enjoying the raid content are the ones that don't have a problem with blizzards reasoning, so it's natural to have it defended No, the people still raiding don't give a shit what other players are doing and are just enjoying the most challenging content ever (Vanilla and TBC (and to a lesser extent WotLK) are a joke compared to today's standards).I couldn't care either way as long as I have challenging shit to beat. TBC wasn't perfect, guild poaching and hopping, the joy of new recruits and attunements, pointless resistance gear, trying to start a new guild from the bottom up... | ||
|
Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
June 12 2014 22:28 GMT
#1087
(ive never played endgame cataclysm) its less about the very hardest and more about the entirety of endgame being harder | ||
|
Cyro
United Kingdom20321 Posts
June 12 2014 22:28 GMT
#1088
Then it's not really the most difficult content, is it now? You're just looping back to the same thing and attacking other stuff i say - you think my point is invalid, because your opinion is that added difficulty modes to the same content, which is killed by most of the player base, are a valid way of appealing to more skillful gamers, and counts as being its own content. That's fine, but i disagree with that, and if i was alone then i wouldn't be so vocal about it. On June 13 2014 07:28 Targe wrote: basically whilst deathwing may not be the hardest shit to complete it is still considered end game content, wildstar's end game content is looking to be much more difficult to kill than deathwing (ive never played endgame cataclysm) its less about the very hardest and more about the entirety of endgame being harder Hey, add xAeryn ;3 | ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21953 Posts
June 12 2014 22:31 GMT
#1089
On June 13 2014 07:28 Targe wrote: basically whilst deathwing may not be the hardest shit to complete it is still considered end game content, wildstar's end game content is looking to be much more difficult to kill than deathwing (ive never played endgame cataclysm) its less about the very hardest and more about the entirety of endgame being harder What Cyro is talking about is a game-mode meant for casual players to allow them to see content and experience the story/fights. That said yes I can agree with you that Wildstar is looking more difficult then WoW (atleast normal mode, donno about hc) But that is not the argument that Cyro is trying to use. | ||
|
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
June 12 2014 22:32 GMT
#1090
You're just looping back to the same thing and attacking other stuff i say - you think my point is invalid, because added difficulty modes to the same content, which is killed by most of the player base, are a valid way of appealing to more skillful gamers, and counts as being its own content. That's fine, but i disagree, and if i was alone then i wouldn't be so vocal about it. Yes, I believe your point is invalid. You're basically saying that in order for content to appeal to skillful gamers, it needs to exclude the common plebs even touching the same place in a watered down version. That's elitism.Hard content is hard content regardless of what the commoners are doing. Content shouldn't only be appealing to you on the basis of exclusivity. I used to think the same way, but really, why shouldn't everyone be able to experience the story? | ||
|
Cyro
United Kingdom20321 Posts
June 12 2014 22:36 GMT
#1091
It doesn't appear that Wildstar will be that way, and i'm in the crowd that thinks that is a -GOOD- thing, as it adds meaning and reason to work towards higher objectives. It reinforces the skill development > reward cycle, which i've come to love from playing WoW through classic, TBC, WOTLK, early cata - from playing sc2, league of legends and osu etc. Hard content is hard content regardless of what the commoners are doing. Content shouldn't only be appealing to you on the basis of exclusivity. I don't give a damn what most people are doing, but if it's easy for me to kill every boss and i don't need gear, skill or time to do it, then the magic of having to work to kill it is no longer there. | ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21953 Posts
June 12 2014 22:39 GMT
#1092
On June 13 2014 07:36 Cyro wrote: Call it what you want, my opinion is that if half to three quarters of max level players kill the end boss of every raid and you don't need a particular level of gear, skill or time investment to do that, then it's not much of an achievement to kill them - and adding higher difficulty levels to the same content does not fix that. It doesn't appear that Wildstar will be that way, and i'm in the crowd that thinks that is a -GOOD- thing, as it adds meaning and reason to work towards higher objectives. Show nested quote + Hard content is hard content regardless of what the commoners are doing. Content shouldn't only be appealing to you on the basis of exclusivity. I don't give a damn what most people are doing, but if it's easy for me to kill every boss and i don't need gear, skill or time to do it, then the magic of having to work to kill it is no longer there for me. Having the ability to kill every boss, see all the content and then leave with a quarter of the skill and time investment is just a knife in the heart for anybody who doesn't really want to play like that. *Cough*Veteran mode dungeons*Cough* Guess Wildstar isn't the game for you after all. | ||
|
Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
June 12 2014 22:40 GMT
#1093
last mmo i played it was literally unheard of for anyone to complete the hardest raid in the game on eu, players in it for pve were entirely focused on reaching that raid, the best guilds were happy to just complete the first boss or two except for 1 guild it was awesome, knowing that eventually it would be possible | ||
|
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
June 12 2014 22:41 GMT
#1094
It doesn't appear that Wildstar will be that way, and i'm in the crowd that thinks that is a -GOOD- thing, as it adds meaning and reason to work towards higher objectives. I don't really mind either way, but the TBC or Wildstar way brings its own share of problems. Neither system is perfect. | ||
|
Firebolt145
Lalalaland34495 Posts
June 12 2014 22:42 GMT
#1095
| ||
|
Cyro
United Kingdom20321 Posts
June 12 2014 22:43 GMT
#1096
On June 13 2014 07:39 Gorsameth wrote: Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:36 Cyro wrote: Call it what you want, my opinion is that if half to three quarters of max level players kill the end boss of every raid and you don't need a particular level of gear, skill or time investment to do that, then it's not much of an achievement to kill them - and adding higher difficulty levels to the same content does not fix that. It doesn't appear that Wildstar will be that way, and i'm in the crowd that thinks that is a -GOOD- thing, as it adds meaning and reason to work towards higher objectives. Hard content is hard content regardless of what the commoners are doing. Content shouldn't only be appealing to you on the basis of exclusivity. I don't give a damn what most people are doing, but if it's easy for me to kill every boss and i don't need gear, skill or time to do it, then the magic of having to work to kill it is no longer there for me. Having the ability to kill every boss, see all the content and then leave with a quarter of the skill and time investment is just a knife in the heart for anybody who doesn't really want to play like that. *Cough*Veteran mode dungeons*Cough* Guess Wildstar isn't the game for you after all. There is no "veteran mode" past 5-man content. I think heroic dungeons in TBC were pretty great. It'd be nice to have completely different content, but it's fine to have the bar for quality and difficulty set a step above 5-man if it comes to it (TBC, Wildstar). TBC HC in low gear, and i hear wildstar veteran 5-mans, were actually very difficult (some of them, particularly) My problem is more with "easy modes" on content, rather than "hard modes" - and it's amplified 100x if that content happens to be the hard content that i'm supposed to strive to complete, rather than 5-mans which are just a stepping stone. | ||
|
heartlxp
United States1258 Posts
June 12 2014 23:23 GMT
#1097
On June 13 2014 07:43 Cyro wrote: Show nested quote + On June 13 2014 07:39 Gorsameth wrote: On June 13 2014 07:36 Cyro wrote: Call it what you want, my opinion is that if half to three quarters of max level players kill the end boss of every raid and you don't need a particular level of gear, skill or time investment to do that, then it's not much of an achievement to kill them - and adding higher difficulty levels to the same content does not fix that. It doesn't appear that Wildstar will be that way, and i'm in the crowd that thinks that is a -GOOD- thing, as it adds meaning and reason to work towards higher objectives. Hard content is hard content regardless of what the commoners are doing. Content shouldn't only be appealing to you on the basis of exclusivity. I don't give a damn what most people are doing, but if it's easy for me to kill every boss and i don't need gear, skill or time to do it, then the magic of having to work to kill it is no longer there for me. Having the ability to kill every boss, see all the content and then leave with a quarter of the skill and time investment is just a knife in the heart for anybody who doesn't really want to play like that. *Cough*Veteran mode dungeons*Cough* Guess Wildstar isn't the game for you after all. There is no "veteran mode" past 5-man content. I think heroic dungeons in TBC were pretty great. It'd be nice to have completely different content, but it's fine to have the bar for quality and difficulty set a step above 5-man if it comes to it (TBC, Wildstar). TBC HC in low gear, and i hear wildstar veteran 5-mans, were actually very difficult (some of them, particularly) My problem is more with "easy modes" on content, rather than "hard modes" - and it's amplified 100x if that content happens to be the hard content that i'm supposed to strive to complete, rather than 5-mans which are just a stepping stone. Wait, so you'd have a problem if Wildstar had everything it had now, but also released the 40-man content in a manner similar to "Raid Finder" in WoW? | ||
|
killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
June 12 2014 23:26 GMT
#1098
Also veteran dungeons really are hard. My healer set with 3 purples, 1850 support power, can't even keep a tank alive vs the first basic mob in kel voreth for more then 10 seconds, and that's with constant spamming of big focus draining heals >.> | ||
|
Sermokala
United States14047 Posts
June 12 2014 23:50 GMT
#1099
Groups that don't pack interupts kill more tanks then anything else in the game. I would vote for no wow talk in the thread. I'm also officaly mandateing that the teamliquid guild be suggested to go 50/50 on their harvesting split. Also don't harvest peoples crops please they need dem seeds. | ||
|
killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
June 13 2014 00:20 GMT
#1100
On June 13 2014 08:50 Sermokala wrote: In Wildstar I wouldn't question the healer first I'd question the tank first. If its the necromancer in kv you need to interupt her when she starts casting her spells and if its the axe guy you need to just not be in the telegraphs. If its a stalker they need to be more mobile and not get hit by the cleaves so much. if its a warrior they arn't useing their insane damage mitigation right. Groups that don't pack interupts kill more tanks then anything else in the game. I would vote for no wow talk in the thread. I'm also officaly mandateing that the teamliquid guild be suggested to go 50/50 on their harvesting split. Also don't harvest peoples crops please they need dem seeds. It was literally the first mob, where you have to kill 3 guys to make the boar thingy come out, the first of those three guys shredded the tank with his base damage, + the damage of the adds, even with everyone dodging the smash telegraph. He probably wasn't geared too well either, but I was still surprised at quite how wrecked we got. I hadn't meant to queue for dungeons, just misclicked when queueing for adventures I guess, but I'd expected to at least reach the boar~ | ||
| ||
StarCraft 2 StarCraft: Brood War Dota 2 League of Legends Other Games Organizations
StarCraft 2 • Hupsaiya StarCraft: Brood War• Berry_CruncH33 • AfreecaTV YouTube • intothetv • Kozan • IndyKCrew • LaughNgamezSOOP • Migwel • sooper7s League of Legends |
|
CranKy Ducklings
RSL Revival
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
Cure vs Reynor
Classic vs herO
IPSL
ZZZero vs rasowy
Napoleon vs KameZerg
OSC
BSL 21
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
RSL Revival
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
Kung Fu Cup
WardiTV Korean Royale
[ Show More ] BSL 21
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
IPSL
Dewalt vs WolFix
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
Wardi Open
Monday Night Weeklies
WardiTV Korean Royale
BSL: GosuLeague
The PondCast
Replay Cast
RSL Revival
BSL: GosuLeague
RSL Revival
WardiTV Korean Royale
|
|
|