I find the game far more amusing when playing with others, and the # of times I've been stomped by a 4+man premade is funny, and sad simultaneously.
MechWarrior Online (New) - Page 39
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Obsidian
United States350 Posts
I find the game far more amusing when playing with others, and the # of times I've been stomped by a 4+man premade is funny, and sad simultaneously. | ||
PassiveAce
United States18076 Posts
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On June 24 2013 01:04 PassiveAce wrote: Can someone link me to a page with information on the basics of equipping a mech? im looking at the loadout menu trying to get a grip on it and there is just too much stuff that I dont understand. http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/ has basically all the information one needs. If you look for a build for a specific mech just ask here. Also you can find guides and bulds for mechs on the official forums. http://mwomercs.com/forums/forum/96-battlemech-guides/ Basic guides on how to use the mech lab: http://www.ign.com/wikis/mechwarrior-online/Mech_Lab | ||
daemir
Finland8662 Posts
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TrickyGilligan
United States641 Posts
On June 24 2013 03:10 daemir wrote: Can a atlas D-DC fire lrm 15s in one salvo? It has 16 tubes there, but can LRMs use the SRM tubes? The only thing that matters is the number of tubes, it doesn't matter if they were originally SRM or LRMs. So yes, it can shoot a LRM 15 in one shot. Also, it's a little funky, but if you have 15 tubes, you can shoot multiple LRM-15s in one volley. Again, same with SRMs. | ||
woody60707
United States1863 Posts
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CuLane
United States160 Posts
On June 23 2013 23:02 PassiveAce wrote: I had a similar experience so far Tarias, iv played about 8 or so games and have only won the ones where I am playing as a big trial mech, either the hunchback with a bajillion pewpew laz0rs or the atlas(i think thats what it is) with the missile launcher. I think I like playing the light mechs more but I have had 0 success with them because I am still clunky with the controls and obviously thats something you need to be good at if your gonna play the mobile mechs. I am still fiddling around in the loadout menu trying to get a feel for the rules of equipment, this game is damn complex in that regard. I bought a light mech with many weapons but found that in practice it overheats far too quickly to actually make use of them, lesson learned. im really liking the complexity of the balance for mechs. Which light mech did you buy? Sounds like a Cicada or a Jenner, maybe the Jenner F? At any rate, with the light mechs, you have to spend a LOT to upgrade them, Double Heat Sinks, Endo Steel structure, and a big XL engine, for the Jenner's it's an XL 300. Jenner's are great mechs, but you have to spend 2x the cost of the original mech to make it good, so it's a big expense, but worth it if you like to go fast and hit hard! | ||
CuLane
United States160 Posts
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PassiveAce
United States18076 Posts
If you have any other advice id be happy to hear it ![]() My hope was to be a reasonably powerful anklebiter kind of thing. Honestly i just want to be the scout from tf2 cuz thats what I know how to do. I know I can be fast but what I dont know is if it is actually possible to rotate the 6 lasers in a way that makes it an efficient dps machine without overheating, will it actually be reasonable in practice to mount 6 of them with proper heatsinks or am I wasting my time? | ||
rwrzr
United States1980 Posts
Looking to drop some c-bills into a mech but don't want to blow the cadet money on something too specialized. Someone drop some knowledge on my noob ass. | ||
TrickyGilligan
United States641 Posts
On June 24 2013 10:31 PassiveAce wrote: Bingo on the Jenner F haha! Didnt realize what I was getting myself into but I have my cadets bonus for like another dozen game and about 5 mil cb to go to finish my build, so im just gonna go for it. I was planning on going for 6 medium lasers with a nice xl engine as you say and double heat sinks. I really didnt realize that I was gonna have to spend like 3x the cost of the mech itself to outfit it the way I want to XD, should I expect this with all mech purchases? If you have any other advice id be happy to hear it ![]() My hope was to be a reasonably powerful anklebiter kind of thing. Honestly i just want to be the scout from tf2 cuz thats what I know how to do. I know I can be fast but what I dont know is if it is actually possible to rotate the 6 lasers in a way that makes it an efficient dps machine without overheating, will it actually be reasonable in practice to mount 6 of them with proper heatsinks or am I wasting my time? Light mechs are the worst for the additional hidden cost. They don't have many weapons, so you're going to want both endosteel and ferro-fiberous to trade some of those empty slots for more weight. Pretty much every mech needs double heatsinks too, there's actually not a good reason to skip them on any chassis. That leaves the XL engine, which is also not cheap. But the good news there is if you don't mind a little clicking, you can use that same XL in any mech. So if you're strategic with your engine purchases, you can have 2-3 XLs which will work in any mech class. 300 XL is kind of the go-to, it has extra heatsink capacity and works in a huge variety of mechs. I use mine in everything from my Jenner, to my Catapult and Stalker. On June 24 2013 10:41 rwrzr wrote: Whats the most flexible mech in terms of builds? Looking to drop some c-bills into a mech but don't want to blow the cadet money on something too specialized. Someone drop some knowledge on my noob ass. I'd suggest a heavy mech if you want flexibility. I'm a big fan of the Cataphract 2X, here's how mine is set up: CTF-2x Since you don't need an XL to get a nice weapon loadout, it's cheap, tough, and effective. The Jagermech is also a great heavy with a large variety of hardpoint types, but I don't own one personally so can't really comment. I just know they kill me a lot. | ||
Yoav
United States1874 Posts
On June 23 2013 15:57 CuLane wrote: I didn't think several of the existant mechs had enough variants. Pretty sure every variant in game right now is canon, even if rare or obsolete. On June 23 2013 21:49 PassiveAce wrote: Hi! Im just getting into this game, can someone give me some advice on what mech I should be looking at working towards as a noob? Yoav's posts have been really helpful but there are still some simple things that I dont understand yet, like even the f2p model for this game and how points are acquired and spent. Im even still grappling with the controls XD Happy to help. Tell me anything you want a guide about and I'll make it happen! On June 24 2013 10:41 rwrzr wrote: Whats the most flexible mech in terms of builds? Looking to drop some c-bills into a mech but don't want to blow the cadet money on something too specialized. Someone drop some knowledge on my noob ass. Atlas or Highlander. Assault 'mechs get the most flexibility, at the cost of speed. If you're counting speed in the flexibility, perhaps the Cataphract, which can do almost anything in different variants. Centurion similar deal (A:missiles, D:speed, AL:lasers/PPC sniper, A or D:ballistics). Player list updated. Check you're on it and name spelled right. New Guide (from post on slots)! Known TLers on MWO: + Show Spoiler + Khanahar (TL: Yoav) Erish II (TL: daemir) Rwrzr MeatLoaf Raddmiral (TL: hp.Shell) Unkkz Redoxin Aym (TL: CuLane) Vanir (TL: Obsidian) Black Snooty (TL: ObiWanPwnobi) Tarias MoonfireSpam TrickyGilligan Some Guides + Show Spoiler + New Player Quick-List + Show Spoiler + 1. Use the local Champion 'mech. It'll be the trial 'mech with a (c ) after its name.. 2. Stick with your team at all times, no matter what, unless you're leading 2:1 or more. And usually even then. 3. Try to always shoot at something other people are shooting at. 4. Generally, aim for center body mass. If you have FPS/Mechwarrior experience, try legging lights and zippy mediums. 5. http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab 6. Read other guides here and on the MWO forums! Mechlab Basics + Show Spoiler + 1. Always get faster engine than stock 2. Always max armor -No exceptions for lights. But for mediums/heavies/assaults, only 3/4 or 1/2 armor on legs is ok -Front/Back ratio should be 2:1 for scouts, 3:1 for most builds, and 4:1 for snipers 3. Always get Double Heat Sinks (DHS) 4. Usually get Endo Steel 5. Almost never get Ferro Fibrous, unless you have everything else you want and need more slots. It doesn't increase your armor cap, just slightly reduces your weight. 6. XL engines vary by 'mech. They are expensive, so get a 300XL and use it for everything that can fit it (swap it around, dont' sell it. only a handful of 'mechs can't take it.) With an XL, you die if you lose a side torso, but the XL is much lighter than the standard. Good Mechs for an XL: Any light: Commando, Jenner, Spider, Raven Faster mediums: Cicada, Trebuchets Big 'mechs with small side torsos: Catapult, Dragon Bad Mechs for an XL: Atlas, Awesome, Stalker (deceptively large side torsos) Build Dependent Mechs: Centurion: SRM focused should get fast XL--note: cannot fit 300 except in CN9-D AC/Laser focused should get fast Standard Cataphract, Jagermech Really better not to go XL, but some builds, like the 2xAC/20 Jager, require it for function. CN9 Builds + Show Spoiler + With Centurions, you really get to pick from 2 options: 1) AC-based Right arm cannon, backed up by CT lasers and streaks (the latter to fend off scouts). Uncommonly feature LRMs, but this is sub-optimal. 2) SRM-based No cannon, but using multiple large SRM-packs. 3x6 is possible. Occasionally uses XL engine, particularly in CN9-D variant. Be aware that these go for the A, D, and YLW variants. The AL is a different beast and can be set up as a scout hunter (lasers and streaks) or pinch sniper (2xPPCs in RA). Never use a CN9 with a <250 engine rating. Max engine rating is preferable. ZOMBIE CENTURIONS: Cn9s can be really good "zombie 'mechs." This means they can limp around the battlefield on one leg, both side torsos and attached arms destroyed, and still put out respectable damage after the enemy has decided you aren't worth focusing on. This is because of (1) good hitboxes that soak damage and (2) all variants can pack 2 ML or MPL in the center torso, giving you moderate DPS way after you should be dead. The best zombie is actually the hero CN9-YLW, because it has superior torso twist to compensate for now having elbows. Mechs with XL engines obviously cannot zombie. Slots and You! + Show Spoiler + Standard abreviations in MechWarrior/Battletech include: H=Head (1 slot) CT= Center Torso (2) RT/LT= Right/Left Torso (12 standard, if XL engine, only 9) CTR/RTR/LTR= Center/Right/Left Torso Rear (shares internals and slots with respective front section) RL/LL= Right/Left Leg (2) RA/LA= Right/Left Arm (slots complicated) Slots in Arms: 10 Slots: Unarticulated Arms Vertical Tracking only; cannot track horizontally beyond torso. Can mount more serious weaponry, such as dual UAC/5s or single AC/20s. 'Mechs with Unarticulated Arms are usually able to rotate their torsos farther than comparable 'mechs with Articulated Arms (including on the same chassis). Mechs: + Show Spoiler + Jenner Raven Cicada Blackjack CN9-YLW (hero Centurion) Catapult Jagermech Stalker HGN-733C <--Actually Minimally Articulated; 10 slots, but can traverse 10 degrees horizontally 9 Slots: Articulated Arms--No Hands Horizontal and vertical tracking make for better aiming, particularly against faster targets. Tradeoff is less ability to mount some weapon setups. Mechs: + Show Spoiler + Dragon CTF-4X 9/8 Slots: Articulated Arms--LA Hand only Some 'mechs have a Left Hand but no Right. When melee is implemented, they will have a good LA punch to back up their RA weapons. Mechs: + Show Spoiler + Centurion (except YLW) Trebuchet Cataphract (except 4X) Awesome Highlander (733C is wierd; Minimally articulated RA, hand on LA, but both arms track together. 10/8 slots) 8 Slots: Articulated Arms--With Hands Currently, no advantage exists to 'mechs with hands. Eventually, hands will matter in the melee system, due to be part of the Solaris expansion, a year or so out from September release. Don't hold your breath. Mechs: + Show Spoiler + Commando Spider Hunchback Quickdraw Atlas Loadout Implications of Articulation Some examples of the kinda of loadouts that are restricted by certain arrangements of actuators. Note that several of these loadouts are possible on only a single 'mech chassis, due to hardpoint restrictions. Always use Smurfy to check out possible loadouts. Loadouts Exclusive to Unarticulated (10 slot) Arms: Note that XL 'mechs cannot run these loadouts in their side torsos + Show Spoiler + 1x AC/20 2x UAC/5 GR + PPC AC/10+PPC 2x LRM20 Loadouts Only Possible for Handless (10 or 9 slot) Arms: + Show Spoiler + UAC/5 + AC/5 3x PPC GR + LL AC/10+LL LBX+PPC Weapon Ranges and You + Show Spoiler + All energy weapons in the game do max damage between 0 and [listed range] meters, then drop off linearly to do 0 damage at 2x[listed range]. All ballistic weapons are the same, but only drop off to 0 at 3x listed range (giving them better range per listed number, though they compensate with lower acuracy). Missile weapons just blow up at listed max range, doing no damage. LRMs have a 180m arming range. Critical Hits + Show Spoiler + Critical Hits In MechWarrior, MechCommander, or the board game version, Battletech, critical hits are one of the most important systems to understand. It is also one of the most misunderstood. This is how the MWO version works. See those "slots" in the 'mechlab? Every Arm and Torso segment has 12, and every Head and Leg has 6, no matter what the 'mech is (a Commando at 25 tons and an Atlas at 100 have the same number of slots). Some of those are filled by "built-in" equipment like engines, gyros, the cockpit, various actuators (joints). As of right now, these cannot take critical damage. This may change later on. The "dynamic slots" added by Endo or Ferro (never get Ferro before Endo) cannot take critical hits, and never will. CASE ammo storage cannot take critical damage. Everything else on your 'mech can take critical damage: heat sinks, weapons, electronics, ammunition. Your 'mech is protected by armor plating and internal structure. On your 'mech doll in the HUD, internal structure is the filling, and the armor is the shell. Critical hits cannot currently go through armor, so a mech segment (a component) is safe from critical hits while armored. However, when the armor is stripped off a component on your 'mech, the items inside become vulnerable. Luckily, most shots won't do any critical damage; they'll just hurt your internal structure and increase the chance of that component being destroyed. However, 42% of shots will do damage to both your internal structure and some items in the component. The amount of damage dealt is based on weapon damage, according to the below: 58% of the time, no critical damage. 25% chance 1x weapon damage, dealt to a random available critical slot in the component. 14% chance 2x weapon damage, dealt in packets like the above to 2 random available critical slots (can be the same one) 3% chance 3x weapon damage. A few special weapons deal extra critical damage. Break these out against exposed internals. They are the Machine Gun, Flamer, and LB 10-X AC. Be aware that the MG and Flamer are underpowered due to being essentially only good at this. Debate exists on the LBX (shotgun autocannon). Special critical values 33% 0 crits 33% 1 crit 28% 2 crits 6% 3 crits Most items have 10 HP, and will be destroyed upon accumulating 10 damage. Gauss Rifles and ECMs are particularly fragile. AC/20s are particularly durable... but this is offset by their large slot count, meaning they are likely to take crit hits. Destroyed items do not work, and ammo bins have a 10% chance of detonation on being destroyed, leading to a happy pop-pop-pop that will shell the poor 'mech unless the explosion is vented by a CASE system. CASE will not protect the side torso it is in, but will prevent the damage from going on to kill the center torso. Damage will naturally progress toward the center of a 'mech, from Arm or Leg to Side Torso to Center Torso. Passing each barrier reduces damage by 50%. Gauss Rifles also have a 90% chance of detonation, and do 20 damage. Gauss Rifle ammo itself is inert. When a component with a Gauss Rifle or Ammo Bin are destroyed (regularly, not critical damage) they still have the same chance to go up in smoke. Crits just make it happen earlier. Implications of Critical Hit System Scoring Critical Hits Your best bet to score good critical hits is just to hammer weakened body parts. Anything packing a Gauss Rifle is a juicy target. LBXs are good at this, but so are any weapon with a high enough damage value that a single crit will destroy a component. These include PPCs, AC10s, Gauss Rifles, and AC/20s. Defending against Critical Hits Don't get shot. Also, "crit pad." Crit Padding is when you make use of the "damage is dealt to a random hittable location" mechanic. If you have a Gauss Rifle as the only thing in a component, when the component takes a single AC/10 hit, you have a 38% chance of having a real bad day. If, however, you throw in a Double Heat sink and 2 tons of Gauss Ammo, you have a little more than half that chance. Whenever you have something explosive in a segment, try not to leave any empty slots there. And if you use Gauss, you really should use CASE. Understanding Autocannons + Show Spoiler + Understanding Autocannons All ACs have about 150 damage per ton of ammo. This means a single AC type for the 'mech will need 3-5 tons. If you have 2 types of AC, each needs 1-3 tons. The below listed by increasing weight AC/2: +Long range, +Excellent DPS per tonnage +Rocks the enemy like a wagonwheel +High projectile speed -Terrible heat/damage ratio (for a ballistic... similar to missiles but still better than lasers) -Damage scattered all over target -Need lots of ammo due to damage inefficency AC/5: +Can be useful due to lowish weight and ability to aim shots +Most heat efficient AC, so good if tight on heat and spare on tons ~Only useful if extremely skilled and using as direct fire support (high RoF sniper) -Low DPS -Sucks UAC/5: +Absurd DPS +Best noise in game ~Generally similar pros and cons to AC/2. Pairs well with it. -Biggest ammo-hog in game -Jams make firepower unreliable. Best used if cover available to hid during jams. But boated, can just stand ground and press trigger. LB10-X AC: +Scattershot +Good if you can't hit things ++Bonus to crit damage +Lightish for job -Scattershot -Limited range -Low striking power, DPS AC/10: +Biggest AC that can fit on arms with lower actuators (elbows, which allow horizontal arm articulation) +Most versitile weapon in game except ML, with which it pairs nicely +Style points ~Basically a bigger AC/5. Shorter range, more concentrated damage -Generally better to trade up to AC/20, though you lose range -Lowish DPS AC20: +20 f*ckin' points of m*therf*ckin' damage per hit +2 head hits drops any 'mech in game (pairing these on a Jagermech or Cat K2 is often a good idea). Means auto-kill on Catapults that let you get to close range if you can nail your shots. +High damage and low RoF great for popping in and out of cover +Efficient kills mean you KS a lot, and use relatively little ammo. (Flipside: can't use damage score for E-Peening) -Really easy to lose to critical hits -Low projectile velocity and RoF means you have to be on top of your shots -Really heavy -Can't mount in a torso if have XL engine -Can't mount in the arm of a 'mech with lower arm actuators (see note for AC/10). Mechs that can mount an AC/20 in their arms: Highlander 733C Jagermech (all can mount 1 in each arm... result of using both is the dreaded "Jagerbomb") Centurion YLW (Hero variant) Raven 4X Any 'mech with a ballistic hardpoint in the torso can mount an AC/20, but many are ill advised to use XL engines. All of this said, try different weapons out and see what works for you. I love AC/10s, despite them being the 2nd weakest AC. My lancemate is even crazier: he uses a 4 AC/5 Cataphract 4X. Does amazing with it. Really nails his shots, because the AC/5 cooldown gives him a moment to line each up and fire with clicks rather than mashing. Each volley hits like an AC/20, and can reach out really far. But it's a very difficult build to pull off unless you really have a lot of faith in your ability to keep hitting the legs of jumping 'mechs at 1000m. Oh, and remember that each ballistic still does damage out to almost 3x its max listed range! (Linearly less from it though.) | ||
rwrzr
United States1980 Posts
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Yoav
United States1874 Posts
On June 24 2013 12:10 rwrzr wrote: Also is there any reason to run a medium mech? Or is it just a mediocre middle point? Balancing is by weight class... also, better turning for speed is one real advantage. | ||
daemir
Finland8662 Posts
38 Erish II 1,797 | ||
CuLane
United States160 Posts
On June 24 2013 10:31 PassiveAce wrote: Bingo on the Jenner F haha! Didnt realize what I was getting myself into but I have my cadets bonus for like another dozen game and about 5 mil cb to go to finish my build, so im just gonna go for it. I was planning on going for 6 medium lasers with a nice xl engine as you say and double heat sinks. I really didnt realize that I was gonna have to spend like 3x the cost of the mech itself to outfit it the way I want to XD, should I expect this with all mech purchases? If you have any other advice id be happy to hear it ![]() My hope was to be a reasonably powerful anklebiter kind of thing. Honestly i just want to be the scout from tf2 cuz thats what I know how to do. I know I can be fast but what I dont know is if it is actually possible to rotate the 6 lasers in a way that makes it an efficient dps machine without overheating, will it actually be reasonable in practice to mount 6 of them with proper heatsinks or am I wasting my time? Well, light mech, lots of weapons, HAD to be the Jenny F :-D Well, I mean, others have as many hard points but I suspected you were talking about lots of lasers. Anyway, yes, it's TOTALLY reasonable and a very popular mech right now. 300LX, Endo steel, maybe ferro fibrous, max armor (maybe take some down on the arms to make an even tonnage to get the extra heat sink or jump jet in). 6 Medium Lasers works good, but if you want to be funny against enemy lights/mediums you can do 6 small pulse lasers, with their new buff they could be a lot of fun at 150 kph! Either way it really does work, and with the 9 by 9 coolant module it's a very effective fighter. Someone else addressed the "hidden cost" ratio for mechs, and I'll elaborate. Every mech wants double heat sinks (ok ok like literally 3 builds don't but ignore that, you can do better with double heat sinks). So that's 1.5 million on top of any purchase that doesn't come with them. All light mechs and almost all medium mechs and some heavy mechs want Endosteel, so that's... I forget, but some c-bills, at least 750k. Every light mech wants an XL engine, so that's many millions more. Some medium mechs and some heavy mechs want an XL engine as well. Assault mechs all want DHS, some want Endo, few want an XL engine. Anyhow, that's the idea behind the hidden costs, assume 1.5 to 2.25 mil on top of every purchase in addition to weapons and bigger engines, which EVERY mech wants. Since light mechs have the least available tonnage to give to weapons they can stick endo steel and ferro fibrous, and an xl engine into those slots with a lower opportunity cost. Therefore they're natural candidates for more upgrades. Coupled with their lower base cost, the final cost is often 3-4x the initial cost. However that ratio goes down the bigger the mech gets, and so far tops out with the big Atlas mechs really only wanting to add double heat sinks and a 325 standard engine, and once you have one of those you can swap it out between atlai. | ||
Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On June 24 2013 12:31 daemir wrote: I guess the even is over/soon done? I don't think I did half bad considering I only had basic efficiencies and an XL engine to kill me fast in my quad ac2 jager :D 38 Erish II 1,797 Yeah especially considering the build it is really good. This kind of competition is very much about getting the killing blow, so double AC20 would have probably been much better. Also, have you tried out 2 Ac2, 2 Ac5? Imo it should be better than quad ac2 because of better heat efficiency. I got rank 11 at the end for Dragons. | ||
PassiveAce
United States18076 Posts
I'm working on the grind towards the XL engine, the first one I was looking at was the XL270 instead of the XL300 because its a little lighter and I read on a forum somewhere that with the "speed tweak" exp bonus thingy-ma-jigger I can hit the speed cap of 150 with just the 270~ish and still have a little weight left over. Should I do this or should I just go for the 300 because it can be used in a wider variety of mechs? | ||
Yoav
United States1874 Posts
On June 24 2013 21:17 PassiveAce wrote: Thanks a ton Culane!! I'm working on the grind towards the XL engine, the first one I was looking at was the XL270 instead of the XL300 because its a little lighter and I read on a forum somewhere that with the "speed tweak" exp bonus thingy-ma-jigger I can hit the speed cap of 150 with just the 270~ish and still have a little weight left over. Should I do this or should I just go for the 300 because it can be used in a wider variety of mechs? Get the 300. Never look back. Edit: This is because XL engine cost a ton. I literally use my 2 XL 300 engines on almost every 'mech I have that runs XLs. It's a ton of money (as you may have found out when your new player bonus runs out) so you want to minimize engine purchases. An XL300 will serve you well in a Jenner, Cicada, Speed CN9, Trebuchet, Dragon, Quickdraw, Catapult, some JM6 builds, and many CTF builds. Rare exceptions only because they're too small or slow to take one, but these are quite rare. | ||
PassiveAce
United States18076 Posts
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