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On May 19 2017 05:38 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 03:32 vndestiny wrote:On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. First it would remove chaos dmg thematic favor. Second I think remove specialization option for the sake of (?) is a horrible idea. A better game and better balance beats thematic flavor. It never worked well. It was always Path of Life or Path of CI. Time to admit defeat and fix it in a different way.
You say this like changing it to Path of Hybrid as you suggest is actually superior. How is that any different?
Even in a balance utopia where GGG manage to perfectly balance life, es, and hybrid builds it is likely that opinion would make it appear like something else anyways.
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On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important.
Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ?
What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ?
"Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~"
Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ?
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On May 19 2017 06:07 SkrollK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ? What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ? "Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~" Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ?
I don't care what you did, but I do care what GGG does to me. And with this change they fucked my fun.
And I am serious about my fun. Life builds suck, they don't buff them but nerf CI builds. Go go useless GGG
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On May 19 2017 06:07 SkrollK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ? What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ? "Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~" Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ?
This is not a single player game, balance matters
Archangels suggestion is awful tho
If they rebalance volatiles and reflect i'm fine with the nerfs, this game had way too much powercreep in the last 2 years
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On May 19 2017 17:05 kju wrote:
If they rebalance volatiles and reflect i'm fine with the nerfs, this game had way too much powercreep in the last 2 years
This so much, i havent been playing for too long, but seeing how difficult some bosses seemed to have been and how easy they can be made nowadays (facetanking) i dont mind if things become more difficult survival wise, especially if they change volatile/reflect.
Also with ES nerfs we shouldnt forget that we get that Pantheon thingy, who knows maybe theres something for ES again like the stun immunity and more?
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On May 19 2017 06:58 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 06:07 SkrollK wrote:On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ? What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ? "Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~" Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ? I don't care what you did, but I do care what GGG does to me. And with this change they fucked my fun. And I am serious about my fun. Life builds suck, they don't buff them but nerf CI builds. Go go useless GGG
are you saying that they didnt buff life builds? they literally did, you can get more life on every piece.
sorry if you hate playing life builds but they don't all suck. if you're basing your experiences off of 6.5k life berserker (has 10% more damage taken lul), you don't have full perspective. some top tier life builds:
nuigyen Bladeflurry Life/MoM Pathfinder - one of the first to kill Tul in Breach HC, chain farmed T15s into HH first week
Waggle Explosive Arrow - speed farmer; has ~10k EHP, got to 98, didn't die. chain farmed chayula breachstones
Zizaran FB Warchief - first to kill Shaper, albeit with support
It would be ridiculous to call these builds weak. Most can agree that ES was generally better, especially with gear/currency, but there are plenty of builds that were relatively competitive. and they should be getting better
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Keep in mind that blade flurry got hit pretty hard, Explosive arrow is losing most of it's single target ignite damage, and Warchief also got nerfed pretty hard.
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i feel like a lot of these nerfs are to offset the pantheon buffs. imo we probably couldve used a round of nerfs when ascendancy was added in already.
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It's been a while since we've seen any new pantheon info but the original stuff looked wholly unexciting if I'm honest
neat system concept, but unexciting rewards. Wish you just got ascendancy passives from beating the gods and kill lab lol
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On May 19 2017 18:59 EchelonTee wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 06:58 -Archangel- wrote:On May 19 2017 06:07 SkrollK wrote:On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ? What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ? "Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~" Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ? I don't care what you did, but I do care what GGG does to me. And with this change they fucked my fun. And I am serious about my fun. Life builds suck, they don't buff them but nerf CI builds. Go go useless GGG are you saying that they didnt buff life builds? they literally did, you can get more life on every piece. sorry if you hate playing life builds but they don't all suck. if you're basing your experiences off of 6.5k life berserker (has 10% more damage taken lul), you don't have full perspective. some top tier life builds: nuigyen Bladeflurry Life/MoM Pathfinder - one of the first to kill Tul in Breach HC, chain farmed T15s into HH first week Waggle Explosive Arrow - speed farmer; has ~10k EHP, got to 98, didn't die. chain farmed chayula breachstones Zizaran FB Warchief - first to kill Shaper, albeit with support It would be ridiculous to call these builds weak. Most can agree that ES was generally better, especially with gear/currency, but there are plenty of builds that were relatively competitive. and they should be getting better
You are giving me builds by people that play 10h per day for months?
What are they, 1% of total PoE population?
You think the game can survive by catering to 1% ?
Life builds take too much effort for average players, that is why CI was so popular. Most people could make useful characters and play the game without too much frustration.
And now they are nerfing that without really buffing life for average players.
You guys seem to be missing my point.
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so your point is you want the game to be easier?
no thanks.
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On May 19 2017 23:16 Sn0_Man wrote:
Keep in mind that blade flurry got hit pretty hard, Explosive arrow is losing most of it's single target ignite damage, and Warchief also got nerfed pretty hard.
for explosive arrow, yea that's prty crappy
the blade flurry / warchief nerfs, are you referring to 2.6 or 3.0? I havent read all the 3.0 changes
if you are talking about 2.6, those nerfs didn't do enough, blade flurry and warchief totem are still the best melee skills and the builds are intact (for legacy league at least)
my point tho was just that there have always been competitive life builds. and come on, warchief totem and explosive arrow are super cookie cutter, noob friendly builds. you dont have to play 10h a day to buy facebreakers and place some totems
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Just 2.6 since the selling points that you listed for the builds were pre-2.6 nerfs.
Regardless. It's certainly true that life isn't utterly unviable. I do think that life required a much higher standard of play though. I'm not trying to say that "you have to be really good" but one part of surviving in hardcore is maintaining a standard of play, rather than getting lazy or slipping up too often.
My playgroup intends on playing 3.0 in hardcore but all the builds that I keep theorising are the kind that CERTAINLY will die at some point. Maybe i should do them in beta.
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ES got to the point where you could run red maps while holding your dick with one hand. it was pretty dumb.
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On May 20 2017 00:25 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2017 18:59 EchelonTee wrote:On May 19 2017 06:58 -Archangel- wrote:On May 19 2017 06:07 SkrollK wrote:On May 19 2017 02:57 -Archangel- wrote:
What they should actually do is remove CI, make chaos not ignore ES and then let people build characters. Everyone would be a hybrid, it would become more complicated to upkeep both ES and life, you could no longer not use life pots and chaos resistance would become more important. Are you actually being serious ? Are you actually trying to bring in the balance topic to a fucking PvE game ? What the fuck is wrong in your damn mind ? Are you unhappy because you are actually bound to your chair with a gun pointing to your head which is gonna fire if you do something else than an ES build ? "Yes, they need to suppress the diversity of the way of building character because this Is not balanced the way I want yo~" Kinda sorry for the rant but i'm si fucking fed up with people being overly interested in what the other are doing... How the balance between hybrid ES and life build is affecting your fun while playing ? Are you actually jealous cause you built life and someone from your /f l built ES and he can run T16 while your stuck T<10 ? I don't care what you did, but I do care what GGG does to me. And with this change they fucked my fun. And I am serious about my fun. Life builds suck, they don't buff them but nerf CI builds. Go go useless GGG are you saying that they didnt buff life builds? they literally did, you can get more life on every piece. sorry if you hate playing life builds but they don't all suck. if you're basing your experiences off of 6.5k life berserker (has 10% more damage taken lul), you don't have full perspective. some top tier life builds: nuigyen Bladeflurry Life/MoM Pathfinder - one of the first to kill Tul in Breach HC, chain farmed T15s into HH first week Waggle Explosive Arrow - speed farmer; has ~10k EHP, got to 98, didn't die. chain farmed chayula breachstones Zizaran FB Warchief - first to kill Shaper, albeit with support It would be ridiculous to call these builds weak. Most can agree that ES was generally better, especially with gear/currency, but there are plenty of builds that were relatively competitive. and they should be getting better You are giving me builds by people that play 10h per day for months? What are they, 1% of total PoE population? You think the game can survive by catering to 1% ? Life builds take too much effort for average players, that is why CI was so popular. Most people could make useful characters and play the game without too much frustration. And now they are nerfing that without really buffing life for average players. You guys seem to be missing my point.
PoE right now is in the by far most accessible and "easiest" state it ever was since its inception.
"Accessible" here means that it's extremely hard to make builds that can't clear including yellow maps reasonably well and "easy" here means that it's never been this easy to see most of the games content with the least amount of playtime.
This game was initially literally designed and marketed for the 1% you're talking about and this has been 'watered down' in the sense that more people can play higher tier builds over pretty much the entire lifespan of the game, especially if we look at the timeperiod since Forsaken Masters with another massive ramp up since Ascendancy.
CI specifically was not something for "average players" for an extremely long time, that's why CI gear was underpriced for ages. The myth of "CI gear is really hard to get and super expensive" wasn't actually true since Forsaken Masters anymore but only in the last couple leagues we've seen it as something that's more and more mainstream.
While I personally don't agree with the specifics (I'm mostly a massive opponent of any instant leech and think CI needs a bit more pool than what it sounds like it has now) a nerf to CI was long overdue. Massive effective healthpools and instant leech / occultist regen have been a CI specific problem for a few leagues in a row now. That's on top of five slots for utility flasks that have been growing more and more OP (mostly due to more choices being available) as time moved on as well.
Apart from all that GGG announced a rework of reflect and volatiles (and we should all pray that the former wont get removed completely) and said they'll look what the Beta looks like to see how the CI nerfs work out in practice. Even if GGG doesn't have a great history on getting these things right it's about the best we can get to address this type of issue.
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reflect and volatile are only a problem to same 1% of players. Other 99% die from groups of enemies or critical hits in 1s when their life or ES is not above 9k. It is just not possible to play fast enough and react in time if your EHP is not high enough. Damage spikes appear randomly and you cannot really plan for them unless you play super slow which is super boring and only for some players.
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@Sn0 yeah I agree life builds overall required a higher standard of play, since CI was just simply better. I thought you played HC in the past? don't remember
does anyone own an xbox one & will try out PoE on it? I'm really curious how it will turn out. I only own a PS4 but playing Diablo on it is actually pretty enjoyable
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Is anyone in guild still playing, especially with Haku 7 who is trustworthy? I'd love an invite.
@FastTraps
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On May 23 2017 08:12 sob3k wrote:
Is anyone in guild still playing, especially with Haku 7 who is trustworthy? I'd love an invite.
@FastTraps
We're full now actually so I'll have to pester Evo again.
If you need Haku 7 in lsc can pm Epileptic_SkyParty.
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After looking into this we have a lot of activity that, to my surprise, is still going on. Legacy seems like a massive success. I kicked one alt (sintflut2000) and spent the last 100 points on +10 slots since getting that sweet guildslot sale proves to be too hard. We currently have ten slots available and a total of 110 slots.
There are a few things we can do from here since I do expect another influx of people for 3.0:
1) We break with the policy of keeping vets around basically indefinitely. There's roughly ten or so people who I've kept around so far despite not logging in for 6+ months at some point. This list includes Tongar, Tennet, Capped, Blindrawr, Waveofshadow and Sintflut. Basically all either TL vets or people who were highly active in the guild at some points.
I don't mind doing that but to me it's just some good old TL courtesy to be nice to your veterans. If the majority of regulars in this thread end up deciding that's a stupid thing to do we can swap this approach up.
2) We kick harsher than usual at the end of Legacy. Usually cleanups affect people who weren't around for 6+ months to avoid grabbing those who missed one league but planned on being around for the next. This would affect at least ~15 people. Basically everyone without a single achievement for Legacy on the overall list would be up for the chopping block in that case.
3) A few people chip in points for more guildslots. Every 100 points buys 10 slots - I'll throw in 100 on top of the first person who chips in that amount (50 pts for a stashtab btw if anyone *really* wants to see more more of them for guild). This would be the laziest option that pretty much means delaying a cleanup until after 3.0.
DISCUSS~
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EPT
