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On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around.
I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though.
Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot.
In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor.
Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there.
Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough?
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On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough?
I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor.
But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise.
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On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise.
What if you had a royal marriage with the target, fabricated a claim, and warred to make a PU? I've noticed that option takes a lot less war points than making them be a vassal.
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On October 29 2011 13:12 unsmart wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. What if you had a royal marriage with the target, fabricated a claim, and warred to make a PU? I've noticed that option takes a lot less war points than making them be a vassal.
That is always possible (when their legitimacy is low enough, also you don't even need to marry for fabricate claims) as is marrying and claiming their throne if they lack an heir. It always needs 84/90(-10) Warscore no matter how large the country is.
However, it produces a PU, and not a vassal, and they work fundamentally different. Depending on situation you might prefer the one or the other. A Vassal will pay you half their tax income, a PU will not. You can annex one vassal each 10 years for 1 infamy/province, but only one PU each 50 years. However, each time you ruler dies and you are at positive relations and positive prestige, you have a chance a of inheriting your PU for free. Noone knows exactly what influences that chance, but from my experience it often happens pretty fast (usually about 1-5 rulers).
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On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise.
Right, but you lose the CB fairly quickly, and the countries we're talking about takes several years to beat.
Beating France especially takes ages, especially on very hard when you get maxed war exhaustion almost instantly, so rebellions will ravage your homeland.
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Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty.
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in the Death and Taxes mod Grenada starts out as Castilles vassal. This makes it a bit more playable in the beginning and gives you time to build up a decent trade so you get money.
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On October 30 2011 02:15 Skilledblob wrote:
in the Death and Taxes mod Grenada starts out as Castilles vassal. This makes it a bit more playable in the beginning and gives you time to build up a decent trade so you get money.
Granada has terrible sliders for trade though. -4 on the Mercantilism/Free Trade slider.
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On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise.
You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before.
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On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty.
A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression.
He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this:
Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways.
If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back.
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On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise.
Alternatively, you can just offer vassalization through diplomacy if you are strong enough and your diplo skill is high enough.
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On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back.
That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen.
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On October 30 2011 02:49 Pewt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before.
How? You can't go over 100 in the peace deal, and vassilizing France / Burgundy takes ALOT more than 100, even with the subjugation casus belli.
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On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen.
I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you.
I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though.
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On October 30 2011 03:17 Candadar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen. I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you. I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though.
Either way it still requires quite a bit of luck to manage.
I'm interested in this Death & Taxes mod. I'm impatient and I like the game to move quickly when things get boring so most mods drive me insane but D&T doesn't slow it down too much? What I'm mostly looking for is something to add more flavor to lesser played countries
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On October 30 2011 03:13 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 02:49 Pewt wrote:On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before. How? You can't go over 100 in the peace deal, and vassilizing France / Burgundy takes ALOT more than 100, even with the subjugation casus belli.
The longer you wait the less war score the demands become, that's why he had to wait a long time.
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On October 30 2011 03:35 RvB wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:13 Euronyme wrote:On October 30 2011 02:49 Pewt wrote:On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before. How? You can't go over 100 in the peace deal, and vassilizing France / Burgundy takes ALOT more than 100, even with the subjugation casus belli. The longer you wait the less war score the demands become, that's why he had to wait a long time.
But if you wait too long you'll just end up white peacing them.. How do you balance that?
I guess I'll simply have to try ^_^
On October 30 2011 03:25 MattBarry wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:17 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen. I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you. I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though. Either way it still requires quite a bit of luck to manage. I'm interested in this Death & Taxes mod. I'm impatient and I like the game to move quickly when things get boring so most mods drive me insane but D&T doesn't slow it down too much? What I'm mostly looking for is something to add more flavor to lesser played countries
D&T basically give stronger advisors that cost 25 instead of 20 culture. Sliders are more powerful, but not only for the good. For instance plutocracy decreases force limits, and innovative decreases relation to the true faith alot.
The map looks different (uglier imo) and countries are different in size, provinces have different shape, and you can form more countries. For instance the Roman Empire as Byzantium.
Doesn't slow the game down afaik.
Try it out.
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On October 30 2011 03:25 MattBarry wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:17 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen. I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you. I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though. Either way it still requires quite a bit of luck to manage. I'm interested in this Death & Taxes mod. I'm impatient and I like the game to move quickly when things get boring so most mods drive me insane but D&T doesn't slow it down too much? What I'm mostly looking for is something to add more flavor to lesser played countries
that is excatly what the D&T mod does. It gives more depth to smaller countries 
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On October 30 2011 03:54 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:35 RvB wrote:On October 30 2011 03:13 Euronyme wrote:On October 30 2011 02:49 Pewt wrote:On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before. How? You can't go over 100 in the peace deal, and vassilizing France / Burgundy takes ALOT more than 100, even with the subjugation casus belli. The longer you wait the less war score the demands become, that's why he had to wait a long time. But if you wait too long you'll just end up white peacing them.. How do you balance that? I guess I'll simply have to try ^_^ Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:25 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 03:17 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen. I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you. I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though. Either way it still requires quite a bit of luck to manage. I'm interested in this Death & Taxes mod. I'm impatient and I like the game to move quickly when things get boring so most mods drive me insane but D&T doesn't slow it down too much? What I'm mostly looking for is something to add more flavor to lesser played countries D&T basically give stronger advisors that cost 25 instead of 20 culture. Sliders are more powerful, but not only for the good. For instance plutocracy decreases force limits, and innovative decreases relation to the true faith alot. The map looks different (uglier imo) and countries are different in size, provinces have different shape, and you can form more countries. For instance the Roman Empire as Byzantium. Doesn't slow the game down afaik. Try it out.
You can decline it manually then it won't white peace I think.
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On October 30 2011 04:28 RvB wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:54 Euronyme wrote:On October 30 2011 03:35 RvB wrote:On October 30 2011 03:13 Euronyme wrote:On October 30 2011 02:49 Pewt wrote:On October 29 2011 12:57 Simberto wrote:On October 29 2011 08:17 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:46 Candadar wrote:On October 29 2011 07:27 Euronyme wrote:On October 29 2011 07:23 Candadar wrote:
So yeah, Vassaling is great.
Split France up into a shit ton of countries, Austria, Milan, Burgundy and a bunch of OPM or TPM's as my Vassals. Went to war with Poland/Lithuania/Denmark/Sweden/Norway/Teutonic Order
Let's just say. I sat back with my ~90k army, and my Vassals ANNIHILATED all of those countries themselves. I remember looking over in Lithuania, and there was a stack of ~77 regiments of a bunch of combined vassals just steamrolling everything for me. Even the Navies. I went to war with England, and all my Vassals combined gave me a navy like twice the size of theirs and I just completely annihilated them.
I'm thinking of spicing it up a bit too. Pausing, removing all of my alliances, vassalation, etc. and go load the game as another country. Every single country in Europe, essentially, will be without any forms of royal marriage, alliances, military access. NOTHING. Not even the HRE exists anymore. The chaos will be astounding. So like.. 1399? What country did you play as? It's not like 1399 at all, if I were to do that. In 1399 you have the Emperor, Unlawful Territory, and massive trees of Alliances and Vassals to stop warmongering. In my situation, there is no Emperor. There is no Alliances outside of being allied with myself in Europe with a few minor exceptions. There is no Royal Marriages, no Vassals or Personal Unions. When I let everyone go, there is nothing to stop anyone from attacking their neighbor granted the CB. Also, this is my aforementioned Bavaria game. Basically dicking around. I'm pretty sure vassals can marry eachother though, right? Dunno if the AI actually does that though. Afaik they almost instantly ally up when you release them. I have some experience of this when you for some reason want to conquer a vasall a little quicker than diplo annex. Basically they ally up in about a month with atleast one nation. There are also defenders of faith and whatnot. In the long term there probably will be some blobs in Europe though for sure, as they don't hand back their conquered provinces to the emperor. Edit. So guys. These missions you get to vassilize major nations.. do those actually work? For instance England has a mission to vassilize France, and Austria has a mission to vassilize Burgundy, and there are probably more out there. Does anyone know if this is actually possible, or do you have to take province after province, eating those 4 infamy until they're small enough? I think when you get a mission to vassalize something, you also get a -50% cost CB, so you can vassalize countries up to the double of the usual size. However, this does not mean that you can nessessarily vassalize your target country in a single war, and if i remember correctly either after a single war, or after some time that CB disappears, making the vassalisation of a just slightly to large country quite annoying since you have to beat them down to a 3-4 province minor. But, for example, if you get a mission you can vassalize scotland in a single war as england. That would not be possible otherwise. You can vassalize very large countries if you're willing to wait. For example, I've vassalized a full-sized burgundy as Austria before. How? You can't go over 100 in the peace deal, and vassilizing France / Burgundy takes ALOT more than 100, even with the subjugation casus belli. The longer you wait the less war score the demands become, that's why he had to wait a long time. But if you wait too long you'll just end up white peacing them.. How do you balance that? I guess I'll simply have to try ^_^ On October 30 2011 03:25 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 03:17 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 MattBarry wrote:On October 30 2011 02:52 Candadar wrote:On October 30 2011 02:11 MattBarry wrote:
Surviving as Granada without doing something stupidly gamey liking taking irish minors is obscenely hard and takes ridiculous amounts of luck. By some act of god I managed to survive the first 2 wars with white peace. During the first 15 years Morrocco, my ally, decided to annex algiers and tunisia but I managed to snatch Algiers' best 3 provinces. Then Castille got ganked by France, Aragon, and England so I managed to snatch all the Andalusian provinces. Then another once in a lifetime lucky thing happened and I got Morocco AND the ottomans in a PU. I went on to annex all of Iberia before 1470. I also have 0 infamy cause I accidentally inherited the ottomans and released them as vassals.
Playing as countries like Granada is so dull though, it takes a bunch of tries and you have to get lucky. The accomplishment feels empty. A friend of mine conquered all of Europe as Granada. Very Hard, no cheats, High Aggression. He had it down to a science. From what I remember, his strategy was this: Before you unpause, you take 3 loans. No more, no less. You take Military Drill as soon as possible, and you build a shit ton of mercenaries. Preferably in your two most left territories, only building one in your furthest right (that's the one Castille goes for first almost 100% of the time, the further right) As you build up a shit ton of mercenaries, Ally Algiers. When Castille declares on you, Algiers + Morocco's navy can take out Castille's. They will come to your aid. Your job? Take out all the reinforcing Castillan army. I think they start with a 7 stack and a 2 stack. You let the 7 stack just stand on a province while you just keep annihilating the reinforcing regiments that are in production for as long as you can. Then you go back and fuck up the final army in your province. If you really want to take a shot, you can burn earth the province too. However, this is VERY dicey and basically puts you "all in", per se. However, the fact that you are going Granada makes it like that anyways. If you can win your first war, that's when the real fun begins. Take as much territory as possible from them, preferably on the coast. If you can destroy alliances in the treaty, do so as well. Then you destroy your Mercs, build up an actual army over the treaty period while getting your economy back in check (take some inflation hits if you have to) and then declare again, with Morocco and Algiers on your back. That wouldn't work in Divine Wind. Castille allies Portugal every single game and Portugal + Castille's navy is invincible. Also Morocco and Algiers never fucking help me(God I hate them). I managed to hold of Castille on my own with taking loans and killing reinforcements but my game simply won't allow the scenario you described to happen. I just tried it. Portugal does not have ally with Castille, since Castille basically day 1 declares you. I actually got pretty lucky too. When I took the Aristocracy slider, I got a revolt of 8 in Granada which wore down their main army and let me fuck their shit up right after. Was still a bitch to do though. Either way it still requires quite a bit of luck to manage. I'm interested in this Death & Taxes mod. I'm impatient and I like the game to move quickly when things get boring so most mods drive me insane but D&T doesn't slow it down too much? What I'm mostly looking for is something to add more flavor to lesser played countries D&T basically give stronger advisors that cost 25 instead of 20 culture. Sliders are more powerful, but not only for the good. For instance plutocracy decreases force limits, and innovative decreases relation to the true faith alot. The map looks different (uglier imo) and countries are different in size, provinces have different shape, and you can form more countries. For instance the Roman Empire as Byzantium. Doesn't slow the game down afaik. Try it out. You can decline it manually then it won't white peace I think.
What do you mean?
I think it is either if not enough is going on in terms of sieging and fighting for a couple of years, or if you have too high of a war exhaustion or war capacity, you will simply automatically white peace your enemy, and the message says something like "After a long time of struggle, peace is finally achieved" or some shit like that.
I think it's so you can't occupy a country forever - especially in a multiplayer game - as they'd be unnecessarely punished in the long run with raging inflation, loans, war exhaustion and rebellion without the possibility to create an army.
Basically this mechanic makes it risky to occupy a country for long enough until the price for vassilizing goes down to 100.
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EPT
