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MLG tried and failed and since then have failed everytime with a fighting game where is T6 the most popular fighting game in the world ? SF4 is only in the US everywhere else is T6. Thats what I don't get they had T6 and it did not work out so what make you think it will for SF4? The people run MLG don't care about there players or community and just care about the bottom line.
Everyone wants the US FGC to blow up like SC2 but its not the same game not the same people that even watch the streams. There is some small crossover but not as much as people think. SC2 is not even that big as SC1 and there having CS 1.6 vs CS S all over again. I am stating facts you guys keep stating opinions at the end of the day.
"MLG is the savior and the only way to make it big in Esports in the US." Not even 5% of the country knows what MLG is or when they find out they could care less we don't want to be followers like the rest of the Esports crowed we will do it on our own terms. The only ones that keep bringing up this supject are the ones that will profit from it directly. Not the actual community I don't see the 500 page post on SRK about how all the players want the game to be in MLG.
Oh and your response on the counter hit combo hit combo is priceless.
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On August 06 2011 01:16 Macroxx wrote:
MLG tried and failed and since then have failed everytime with a fighting game where is T6 the most popular fighting game in the world ? SF4 is only in the US everywhere else is T6. Thats what I don't get they had T6 and it did not work out so what make you think it will for SF4? The people run MLG don't care about there players or community and just care about the bottom line.
Everyone wants the US FGC to blow up like SC2 but its not the same game not the same people that even watch the streams. There is some small crossover but not as much as people think. SC2 is not even that big as SC1 and there having CS 1.6 vs CS S all over again. I am stating facts you guys keep stating opinions at the end of the day.
"MLG is the savior and the only way to make it big in Esports in the US." Not even 5% of the country knows what MLG is or when they find out they could care less we don't want to be followers like the rest of the Esports crowed we will do it on our own terms. The only ones that keep bringing up this supject are the ones that will profit from it directly. Not the actual community I don't see the 500 page post on SRK about how all the players want the game to be in MLG.
Oh and your response on the counter hit combo hit combo is priceless.
Just curious but if you're stating 'facts' why do you have no sources for these so called facts?
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On August 06 2011 01:16 Macroxx wrote:
MLG tried and failed and since then have failed everytime with a fighting game where is T6 the most popular fighting game in the world ? SF4 is only in the US everywhere else is T6. Thats what I don't get they had T6 and it did not work out so what make you think it will for SF4?
You really can't figure this out? You state T6 is most popular but not in the US. SF4 is more popular in the US. MLG takes place in the US...
Also, are you some sort of prominent figure head in the fight game community? My apologies if you are. I'm not very "in the know" when it comes to the fighting game community but I've never heard of Macroxx. What makes you so qualified to speak for the entire community? Maybe just stick to your opinions instead constantly using "we".
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On August 06 2011 01:19 DEN1ED wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2011 01:12 DrBoo wrote:On August 06 2011 01:08 DEN1ED wrote:On August 06 2011 00:30 Macroxx wrote:
Let MLG do there Halo and Starcraft 2 and whatever other game Sony pays them to do. We don't need to be part of the sterilized you can't be yourself MLG program. After what happen to Aris at one of the MLG tournaments I say that its a waste of time to even do that shit.
We a re a way older crowd of gamers anyways the majority of the top players are already over 21 and don't give a fuck we built our scene ourselves and not some outsiders that have no clue what the fighting game community is all about anyways. NASL is a way better product than MLG anyways and I don't even play SC2 Multiplayer and I know that why you can tell that was done out of love for the game not the bottom line.
Plus MLG already tried to do a Capcom games before and it was a total failure. Also 3 years after the game comes ceartain Esports reporters still don't even know what a counterhit combo or even works is just pathetic. Instead of just coming here to shit on everything, why don't you enlighten everyone as to what exactly the fighting game community is all about and actually try to grow your scene. But if you are telling me that pro players don't want to win more money and get more exposure for their sponsors, I'm going to have to hear it from them, not some FGC elitist. I gave a suggestion on how to grow the scene... I stated that if they livestreamed SBO instead of simply having DVD's for it then it would help promote it. I also mentioned that Gootecks and Mike Ross are doing a great job helping promote the fighting game community. I only stated that I don't think MLG is the be all and end all to help raise the fighting game community up to this 'next level' Or did you simply read what you wanted to read, instead of what I actually wrote. I was responding to Macroxx not you. But I agree, I think gootecks and mike ross are doing a great job. I'm not extremely in to the fighting game community but I like to play when I can and love watching cross counter. And no one is saying MLG is the end all be all. Obviously events like EVO, devastation, and SBO will still be bigger. But why not have more big tournaments? I think if SF4 was at MLG, a lot of halo/cod/sc2 players would see how awesome fighting games are and it would really help grow the scene.
I apologize for misreading, you can go ahead and delete that since I've already edited my post.
I just saw yours directly undermine and figured you were talking bout mine since it was both bout the same length.
Guess that's what happens with assuming lol
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EVO 2K5 is what happened with MLG and that is all that has to be said. Ask the Esports journalist to tell you what happened hope he knows that story.
Ok how about this MLG left a bad taste in the mouth of all people that were apart of EVO2k5 and since then we basically said no to them. So you tell me Intel wants to sponsor something fine I am pretty sure the FGC will play ball but if it has MLG attached to it will be no dice for a large chunk of the community.
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I know the fighting game community and have a huge respect for how they created their scene by their own will and combined efforts. This guys are so passionated that they don't do that for money.
The curent scene is very mature and remind me BW scene 2 years ago.
But let's be honest, MLG will bring new blood to the scene, and the prize money is an important factor for top gamers. MLG should have this shot and we'll see what happens. Let's not whine before they even start to do this.
Yes the scene is gonna change. But it's because it is gonna grow. Higher prize money should also be encouraged imo. Just my 2 cents.
I lack knowledge on previous MLG and capcom failures but I think we shall see the future with a fresh eye. Where there is failure, there is experience, so they might know on wich area they should improve. SSF4 deserve big competitive tourneys with large cash prizes. Let's not shoot a bullet in ESPORTS leg.
EDIT : About T6 and SSF4; what make you think the T6 community is bigger outside US ??
I lived in france and belgium and i can assure you that on those countries, SSF4 is way way more popular, I think it's the same for my neighbour countries as well as Japan... If T6 failed, I'm pretty sure SSF4 will do way better.
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in japan i remember a few months ago in the arcadia arcade rankings t6 is always top 3 (usually right behind gundam next or w/e its called). not sure what its like now, but yea....
and korea LOVES tekken
edit: http://www.neoempire.com/?p=9012
there we go
June
1. Gundam vs. Gundam Xtreme Versus
2. Tekken 6 Bloodline Rebellion
3. Blazblue Continuum Shift II
4. Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition
5. Virtua Fighter 5 Final Showdown
6. Arcana Heart 3
7. Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code
8. Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
9. King of Fighters XIII
10. Marvel vs. Capcom 2
July
Arcadia July issue Top 10
1. Gundam vs. Gundam Xtreme Versus
2. Virtua Fighter 5 Final Showdown
3. Blazblue Continuum Shift II
4. Tekken 6 Bloodline Rebellion
5. Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition
6. King Of Fighters 2002 Unlimited Match
7. Arcana Heart 3
8. Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code
9. Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
10. King of Fighters XIII
what da fuqq at mvc2. also i thought ppl liked 98 the most? guess its just dead now and most heads play 02/xiii
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Melbourne5338 Posts
MLG is a business and runs its tournaments as a business.
While they can bring in money and increase prize pools etc. which is obviously positive, as far as I understand. The FGC does not want to sell its soul and entrust itself to MLG.
While MLG and Fighting Game Events both run large tournaments for main games, Fighting Game Events are fundamentally different. Fighting Game Events has a much larger focus to promoting play by offering open brackets for the main tournaments, side tournaments/activities, casual stations/areas. While MLG is spectator focused, a large capped tournament with innovation such as championship pools in order to have a constant stream of high quality matches.
MLG is a giant. If it runs its events and throws around its money it like a drug and people will flock to the money discouraging the number of local events and making the community reliant on MLG. So when MLG drops the game after a year like it did with Tekken 6, its left with pieces to pick up.
I think the scene is growing fine at the moment with the Evo Tournament Season where there was almost a major every month, the growing popularity of streams and the growing presence in media like Fighting Words on G4 and Cross Counter everywhere. The only thing it lacks is the prize pools, which will come with more sponsors like the ones ReveLAtions had and growing interest from places like Justin.tv and NOS.
To DrBoo: SBO has been streamed for years. It was also sold on DVDs because its run by a company who sells DVDs. This year its being run at TGS again. That is how they are promoting it.
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On August 06 2011 00:44 I_Love_Bacon wrote:
I'll never understand what people are afraid of. Let's say MLG picks up SSF4ae or MvC3 and make a really bad event (I'm not even sure how they would, given that they've done fighting games before and it's not like they're new to running tournaments). Ok, it was a bad tourny, players stop going, people don't watch, whatever.... then things go back to the way it was.
I know people want to see the community succeed on its own, but it's not demeaning or insulting to suddenly have more tournaments to play in, just because they weren't created by fighting game players.
i think bad tournaments reflect poorly on the game. i'm not talking about people running best of 1 single elimination in their basement but when organizers draw resources from fans/community and then leave them standing out in the cold.
i think filthierich worked full-time as tekken 6 director for MLG. once they decided not to carry on with t6 for 2011, they waited a long time before dropping him. luckily he was able to find a job as community manager at namco bandai and is doing an awesome job there. but yea, how can you do something like that to players, pulling the carpet out underneath them?
i think that more importantly, most fighting game players and fans are college students and younger. there is only so much money for them to spend to get to tournaments and such. if we give that money to people who don't develop the scene, then yes, it won't be good for SF.
my only experience dealing with mlg from a professional standpoint was when i worked with an anime convention. the bottom line was that they wanted us to give them a free venue, no strings attached. i dunno if things changed.
as a player, i remember in tekken 5 days that people did not get paid until a long time, which was not their understanding. i also remember tekken players showering halo 2 players with insults. however, this event was at a car dealership under a few tents, so i'm sure it's different.
imo, i think it's best that mlg stays separate from capcom.
sometimes forcefully combining two different scenes can lead to horrible results.
just ask smash players and shoryuken.
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man I'm reading some of these anti-MLG posts and I just think some of you guys don't want homeless people to find jobs and make money. What's the worst thing that can happen from MLG showing Street Fighter? If its not hype, turn off the stream and tune in next month for a regional major. Seriously, there's no harm in trying, especially when broke SF players can get paid.
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I think people seem to have this odd notion that if MLG picks up these games, that all of the other tournaments will die off. Nobody will be required to go to these tournaments as I see no reason CEO, Final Round, etc... wouldn't still be ran (unless there was maaaaybe a scheduling conflict).
Having been to a decent number of fighting game tournaments, as well as other games, all of them operate differently when suddenly put in an MLG. It's the nature of running a gigantic tournament under one roof with tens of thousands of people at the live venue. People need to just see MLG as another handful of tournaments they can attend if they want.
As for the notion that a bad tournament reflects on the community, I don't even think it should be worried about. If MLG has proven anything this year, its their ability to adapt, change, and cater to the fans/players to make their experience better and better. MLG has instilled so much faith in me that, while they can obviously do wrong, the odds of them not rectifying any problems doesn't even register to me.
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On August 06 2011 02:05 broz0rs wrote:
man I'm reading some of these anti-MLG posts and I just think some of you guys don't want homeless people to find jobs and make money. What's the worst thing that can happen from MLG showing Street Fighter? If its not hype, turn off the stream and tune in next month for a regional major. Seriously, there's no harm in trying, especially when broke SF players can get paid.
Or we could just donate to the players we support and cut out the mlg middleman
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On August 06 2011 01:57 kainzero wrote:
i think that more importantly, most fighting game players and fans are college students and younger. there is only so much money for them to spend to get to tournaments and such. if we give that money to people who don't develop the scene, then yes, it won't be good for SF.
That's not true, the tournament playerbase for fighting games is significantly older than for other games in general. Several players, like Alex Valle, Viscant and Daigo, are over 30 and still very competitive in major tournaments. I'd put the average age for tournament players well above that of a college student. Casual online players and fans are of course a different matter.
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On August 06 2011 01:52 pachi wrote:
To DrBoo: SBO has been streamed for years. It was also sold on DVDs because its run by a company who sells DVDs. This year its being run at TGS again. That is how they are promoting it.
I appreciate that information, I was under the impression they only sold the DVD's for SBO, I've tried looking for information for streams previous years and came up empty handed. I guess I just wasn't looking hard enough :\
edit: Do you happen to know where they stream SBO?
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Melbourne5338 Posts
On August 06 2011 02:22 DrBoo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2011 01:52 pachi wrote:
To DrBoo: SBO has been streamed for years. It was also sold on DVDs because its run by a company who sells DVDs. This year its being run at TGS again. That is how they are promoting it. I appreciate that information, I was under the impression they only sold the DVD's for SBO, I've tried looking for information for streams previous years and came up empty handed. I guess I just wasn't looking hard enough :\ edit: Do you happen to know where they stream SBO?
niconico were running the premium streams (pay for access/vods maybe) last year. Then they released some/all games as extras to Arcadia magazines.
As far as I know, there has not been anything released about this year.
More MLG Stuff:
Theres no such thing as free money. It seems the FGC thinks it has a good thing going and apparently don't feel like they need big players such as MLG. If your high school bully suddenly walked up to you at prom and gave you a suitcase of money, would you take it no questions or would you err on the side of caution?
I don't think MLG is the worst thing in the world, but it should be understandable if the community doesn't want it because it doesn't mesh with what they have and what they want.
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I'd settle for a logical explanation as to what would be bad if MLG took up those fighting games.
And I don't want a slippery slope argument. I just cant create a plausible scenario that ends with the FGC in worse shape then when it started. There's nothing to lose.
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On August 06 2011 02:33 pachi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2011 02:22 DrBoo wrote:On August 06 2011 01:52 pachi wrote:
To DrBoo: SBO has been streamed for years. It was also sold on DVDs because its run by a company who sells DVDs. This year its being run at TGS again. That is how they are promoting it. I appreciate that information, I was under the impression they only sold the DVD's for SBO, I've tried looking for information for streams previous years and came up empty handed. I guess I just wasn't looking hard enough :\ edit: Do you happen to know where they stream SBO? niconico were running the premium streams (pay for access/vods maybe) last year. Then they released some/all games as extras to Arcadia magazines. As far as I know, there has not been anything released about this year.
Ohh right Niconico videos, oh snap thank you for mentioning that. I totally forgot about it until now. Yeah I wasn't able to make a niconico account since I can't read japanese so I was unable to watch SBO so I kind of forgot they even had a livestream
Also didn't they only accept japanese credit cards or something like that for payment? or am I just remembering incorrectly again?
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On August 06 2011 00:30 Macroxx wrote:
Let MLG do there Halo and Starcraft 2 and whatever other game Sony pays them to do. We don't need to be part of the sterilized you can't be yourself MLG program. After what happen to Aris at one of the MLG tournaments I say that its a waste of time to even do that shit.
We a re a way older crowd of gamers anyways the majority of the top players are already over 21 and don't give a fuck we built our scene ourselves and not some outsiders that have no clue what the fighting game community is all about anyways. NASL is a way better product than MLG anyways and I don't even play SC2 Multiplayer and I know that why you can tell that was done out of love for the game not the bottom line.
Plus MLG already tried to do a Capcom games before and it was a total failure. Also 3 years after the game comes ceartain Esports reporters still don't even know what a counterhit combo or even works is just pathetic.
Wow, you have such a negative outlook on this situation. I don't understand why you or anyone else would want the SF4 community to be segregated. Wouldn't you want the community to grow and welcome new fans? MLG adding SF4 could lead to players living off SF4 like some SC2 pro gamers. From what I understand, there are only a handful of SF4 players who make a decent living off of it.
I hope MLG does add SF4...ESPORTS!!
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United States12235 Posts
The only way MLG adding SF4 would be bad is if it stepped on the toes of existing majors and split up the top players. Maybe that would happen, it's pretty evident that MLG wants a "pro circuit" like they have for their other games, which means a major every month or two. There would have to be pretty seamless integration with the EVO Tournament Season for it not to overlap or become oversaturated, and I don't see the fighting game community tournament organizers giving up their events. That means that either MLG and EVO would have to have some joint venture where the tournament season becomes like CEO, MLG Raleigh, WCW, MLG Columbus, MWC, MLG Providence, etc., and culminating in EVO Vegas, or you'd have crazy situations like overlapping events or an MLG event one weekend and NCR the very next weekend.
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To me it seems like fighting games would be pretty risky for mlg. Halo has a very dedicated community, most people that play/watch the current halo will play/watch the next halo. Starcraft is really safe, has a great community, it is hard to imagine a better rts coming out for a long while and is going to get big boosts with the expansion packs.
Fighting games however are a bit tricky. Ssf4ae is really popular now but where will it be next year? Do you really want to commit to a game before it comes out like umvc3 or sfxt? If they did mk9 and t6 and the capcom games started crushing them in popularity then what? How many games can you do well?
I'd love to see fighting games in mlg. I really liked being able to switch to tekken during breaks in the sc2 stream even though I don't follow that game at all. It seems unlikely, however, that is the best fit for mlg's model. I'd be looking at lol and dota2 first if I were them.
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EPT
