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Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup - Page 46

Forum Index > General Games
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Resistentialism
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada688 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-09 20:22:57
July 09 2012 20:22 GMT
#901
Don't use a shield for the first few levels of the D because the attack penalties probably aren't worth it. After that it's a matter of preference, but you'll probably stick with using a shield or stick with not using one. I hear a lot of smart cookies with lots of wins saying it's quite a bit better not to use one, but I don't really agree.
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
July 09 2012 20:28 GMT
#902
Don't use a shield. Get better at positioning instead and you eliminate most of the situations where a shield is better than just dealing more damage.
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
worldsnap
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada222 Posts
July 09 2012 20:43 GMT
#903
Thanks. So as a Berserker, do you just put enough points in STR to use armor properly (3x the penalty, i think, so 18 for full plate), and then the rest in dex?
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
July 09 2012 20:51 GMT
#904
On July 10 2012 05:43 worldsnap wrote:
Thanks. So as a Berserker, do you just put enough points in STR to use armor properly (3x the penalty, i think, so 18 for full plate), and then the rest in dex?

Yes
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
July 09 2012 22:35 GMT
#905
I'm still hopelessly bad at this game (read: dive into retarded situations for no reason all the time)

Writer
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
July 09 2012 22:54 GMT
#906
Two big tips to playing better:

Learn from every single one of your deaths (it is exceedingly unlikely that you died a truly unavoidable death, though deaths that are very annoying to avoid are possible); and always assume that your character is terrible.
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
worldsnap
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada222 Posts
July 10 2012 00:11 GMT
#907
On July 10 2012 07:35 ]343[ wrote:
I'm still hopelessly bad at this game (read: dive into retarded situations for no reason all the time)



Wands and scrolls of teleportation are extremely valuable. If you get below 1/4 hp and there's still a big fight ahead of you... hit that panic button. Blink works less effectively, but can sometimes get you to a staircase.
myopia
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2928 Posts
July 10 2012 00:32 GMT
#908
stat growth checklist

1. are you a non-felid with <7 str? get str
2. do you have <3*evp of your desired armour in str? get str
3. are you going to be casting lots of spells where power or hunger might matter? get int
4. else, get dex

This applies to 99% of all cases
it's my first day
Zahir
Profile Joined March 2012
United States947 Posts
July 10 2012 00:38 GMT
#909
anyone here played nethack? im currently addicted to that game. i'd play stone soup too, but they dont have it for iphone. how does crawl compare to hack? better, more challenging?
What is best? To crush the Zerg, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the Protoss.
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
July 10 2012 00:45 GMT
#910
I find that nethack is a bit more unforgiving with random deaths etc. DCSS is just as tough...I havne't made it to the endgame of DCSS yet though.
worldsnap
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada222 Posts
July 10 2012 00:57 GMT
#911
As a melee character (especially berserker getting a lot of weapons from togg), do you train more than 1 weapon category? Or just pick 1 and stick with it.
myopia
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2928 Posts
July 10 2012 01:10 GMT
#912
On July 10 2012 09:38 Zahir wrote:
anyone here played nethack? im currently addicted to that game. i'd play stone soup too, but they dont have it for iphone. how does crawl compare to hack? better, more challenging?


Crawl is magnitudes better than NetHack in just about every way imaginable. I'd try and list specifics but I don't even know where to start. And you can play it on a smartphone, you just have to use a telnet app to connect to CAO.

On July 10 2012 09:57 worldsnap wrote:
As a melee character (especially berserker getting a lot of weapons from togg), do you train more than 1 weapon category? Or just pick 1 and stick with it.


Pick one and stick with it. Trog and Oka gift weapons according to your skills, so you'll eventually end up with something really awesome from them.
it's my first day
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-10 01:26:22
July 10 2012 01:26 GMT
#913
edit: wrong thread.
Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
July 10 2012 02:19 GMT
#914
I've been playing ToME lately and it might be of interest to some here (http://te4.org). It has a lot more character customization, but it's fairly linear, and you have a lot fewer game decisions that impact your survival. After getting some 15-runers on Crawl, I have the complaint that it's a bit restrictive in endgame builds. Maybe that's why many people seem to prefer runs of 3 or 5?
We found Dove in a soapless place.
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
July 10 2012 02:39 GMT
#915
I am curious how you find crawl "restrictive" in endgame builds. Either you are complaining that there is too much xp so all characters become good at everything and then feel kind of similar (which is true), or you are probably wrong. Certainly other than the xp thing extended does not feel like it forces you down one path any more than the rest of the game does.
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
July 10 2012 11:31 GMT
#916
On July 10 2012 11:39 crate wrote:
I am curious how you find crawl "restrictive" in endgame builds. Either you are complaining that there is too much xp so all characters become good at everything and then feel kind of similar (which is true), or you are probably wrong. Certainly other than the xp thing extended does not feel like it forces you down one path any more than the rest of the game does.


There are essentially only two types of characters in endgame: Warrior-types who generally follow TSO/Zin, and Mage-types who get Necromutation and then spam level 9 spells with CBoH. It might be partially due to the xp overflow, but I don't think so; there just aren't that many options. I'm sure it's beatable with other combinations, but those combinations are very far from optimal. I'd rather see a larger variety of strategies be viable in endgame, or see the different types of warriors and mages play differently from each other. For me right now, the early/midgame is still interesting, but once I get a few runes it feels like every game is the same regardless of my combination.
We found Dove in a soapless place.
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
July 10 2012 11:54 GMT
#917
On July 10 2012 20:31 Cel.erity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2012 11:39 crate wrote:
I am curious how you find crawl "restrictive" in endgame builds. Either you are complaining that there is too much xp so all characters become good at everything and then feel kind of similar (which is true), or you are probably wrong. Certainly other than the xp thing extended does not feel like it forces you down one path any more than the rest of the game does.


There are essentially only two types of characters in endgame: Warrior-types who generally follow TSO/Zin, and Mage-types who get Necromutation and then spam level 9 spells with CBoH. It might be partially due to the xp overflow, but I don't think so; there just aren't that many options. I'm sure it's beatable with other combinations, but those combinations are very far from optimal. I'd rather see a larger variety of strategies be viable in endgame, or see the different types of warriors and mages play differently from each other. For me right now, the early/midgame is still interesting, but once I get a few runes it feels like every game is the same regardless of my combination.


I don't really think that having multiple viable options for endgame is what we want in a dungeon crawl.

Half the fun of nethack was trying to beat it with conducts.
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
July 10 2012 12:30 GMT
#918
On July 10 2012 20:31 Cel.erity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2012 11:39 crate wrote:
I am curious how you find crawl "restrictive" in endgame builds. Either you are complaining that there is too much xp so all characters become good at everything and then feel kind of similar (which is true), or you are probably wrong. Certainly other than the xp thing extended does not feel like it forces you down one path any more than the rest of the game does.


There are essentially only two types of characters in endgame: Warrior-types who generally follow TSO/Zin, and Mage-types who get Necromutation and then spam level 9 spells with CBoH. It might be partially due to the xp overflow, but I don't think so; there just aren't that many options. I'm sure it's beatable with other combinations, but those combinations are very far from optimal. I'd rather see a larger variety of strategies be viable in endgame, or see the different types of warriors and mages play differently from each other. For me right now, the early/midgame is still interesting, but once I get a few runes it feels like every game is the same regardless of my combination.

Yeah I think I would say you are just wrong.

Saying gods other than TSO/Zin are "very far from optimal" for melee dudes in extended is, I would say, very far from correct (other gods who are comparably strong: Ely, Nemelex, Makhleb, Jiyva, Ash, Lugonu; which is the best depends on your character and what you want from your god). Necromutation is often not worth the xp to learn (other ways of dealing with torment: getting better at using LOS, killing the dudes who torment you).

If your character is built for it it is quite easy to just ninja through all of extended, particularly if you have cblink (also shatter and lugonu are very helpful for wall-destroying, or ash for warning).

As far as all spellcasters feeling the same I guess you can say that if you want, though I think that the different elements still have some important differences as far as conjurations go and there is obviously summoning as well.

I agree that extended is pretty boring most of the time but my arguments are that there are too many areas that are just demons and that it is too easy, not that all characters there are same-y.

Anyway I don't feel like extended has any more problems with characters all feeling the same than crawl in general has by about Vaults (since by that time the fact that crawl has too much xp starts to really kick in so your characters can be good at melee and casting spells).
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
worldsnap
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada222 Posts
July 11 2012 03:29 GMT
#919
How many skills do you get going at once? I've got a DeWiz, and I feel like fighting, dodging, stealth, spellcasting, all need to be on right from the start. And then I probably want some stabbing... and that's not even counting all of the spell-school skills. I could turn a lot of those on too.....help?
myopia
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2928 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-11 03:41:46
July 11 2012 03:41 GMT
#920
Keep one or two skills on at a time. Tops. And level whatever will get you the most benefit now. Fighting scales with experience level, so even 27 of it at lvl 1 doesn't do much. Leave it alone for a while. You don't want stealth or stabbing as a DEWz, you want to kill everyone with your spells. Get everything to sub 10% cast failure then worry about defensive skills.

I also typically don't get any t&d until lair, and no more than 5 until vaults.
it's my first day
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