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On November 20 2010 10:32 travis wrote:
honestly, i still don't even understand what the difference would be in the example i gave with the goblin, and with the actual card (thief of hope)
because it says whenever you "play" not when something comes into play.. you play the card, then it goes on to the stack, then you pass priority etc, then it resolves and comes into play. You won't get the trigger because you already played it..
The oracle text for this has particular card, and all cards with the word "when you play" been changed to "when you cast" because of the confusion caused by the old text
I probably should have scrolled up somebody had already given you that explanation..
well, I'm not really sure how to explain it in another way right now =/
EDIT:
If a creature card read "When you play/cast a goblin, gain 1000 life" 1/1 Goblin, R
This card would not count itself, because it's ability would only trigger if it was in play when it was "cast" which is not possible.
However, if a creature card reads "When a goblin enters the battlefield" or old text, "When a goblin comes into play".... gain 1000 life, then the goblin would enter play, then the game would check for triggers, and the ability would trigger.
If the goblin creature said 1/1 Goblin, R, When "Another" goblin enters the battlefield". Then this card would not trigger for itself, since it says another..
hope this sort of helps, im not best at explaining rules
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United States47024 Posts
On November 20 2010 10:32 travis wrote:
honestly, i still don't even understand what the difference would be in the example i gave with the goblin, and with the actual card (thief of hope)
In the first case, the comes into play ability checks if something entered the battlefield since the game last got to check triggers (e.g. before the goblin resolved). Since the goblin entered the battlefield since then, it triggers the triggered ability.
In the case of Thief of Hope, it checks whether something was put on the stack since the game last got to check triggers. Since Thief of Hope was put on the stack WAY before then, it can't trigger the ability.
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yeah i get it it just seems semantically the same, "coming into play" and "being played". but i guess it's not really
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United States47024 Posts
On November 20 2010 10:42 travis wrote:
yeah i get it it just seems semantically the same, "coming into play" and "being played". but i guess it's not really
Again, that's precisely why they changed the wordings to "enters the battlefield" and "a spell is cast".
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On November 20 2010 10:32 travis wrote:
honestly, i still don't even understand what the difference would be in the example i gave with the goblin, and with the actual card (thief of hope)
They changed it for exactly that reason. Play used to refer to two different things:
- Play the verb, as in "I'm playing lightning bolt"
- and play the noun, as in "my dude is in play"
and you'd figure out which was which based on context.
Play the noun is now 'the battlefield.' Any modern card that works like the goblin would say "whenever X enters the battlefield". Play the verb is now cast.
EDIT: Whoah I missed a lot of posts O_o
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take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth.
put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse.
maybe put in some goblin guides?
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I like Orpheos suggestions, except for goblin guide doesn't feel like it fits in this deck. Im personally not so sure about collar/sparkmage either, but if it works for you, go for it
I think comet storm has a really nice home in this deck as well... you got that big red feel, and you got lots of mana, so I feel you can make good use of comet stom as both board control, card advantage, and a finisher
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Korea (South)922 Posts
On November 20 2010 15:23 BraveGhost wrote:
I like Orpheos suggestions, except for goblin guide doesn't feel like it fits in this deck. Im personally not so sure about collar/sparkmage either, but if it works for you, go for it
I think comet storm has a really nice home in this deck as well... you got that big red feel, and you got lots of mana, so I feel you can make good use of comet stom as both board control, card advantage, and a finisher
i wouldnt play comet storm in the same format with mana leak in it. i like destructive force/mimic vat/masticore
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So I played my first "real" draft the other day. We could only get four guys together, but it was fun none the less  .
It was Scars of Mirrodin and since this was my first time drafting I wasn't totally sure what to do and what not to do.
Anyway at first I decided I was going to go for a White/Red deck with lots of aggro and some burn, I figured since it wasn't constructed my opponents might have trouble with fast damage. I started picking whites and reds, but after a few rounds I noticed all the reds were disappearing, so I changed my strategy and started picking white stuff and equipment. It turned out that one guy had pulled a Koth of the Hammer and was picking all the reds to build a deck around him.
When we were done I was kind of worried about my cards. Since I play constructed I am used to generally smaller and more mana efficient stuff if you will, so I had picked such cards. I was worried about big creatures coming into the battlefield, I have like one card that could efficiently deal with creatures such as Alpha Tyrannax. Everyone built their decks and were ready to play.
We decided to go for some house rules. We would randomly select our opponent first round, winners play eachother, same with losers. All matches would be best of threes. We didn't have any extra boosters, and no one was feeling like putting money in the pot, so in the end we would put all rares and mythics in one pile and the winner would get to choose one first, runner up next etc.
In my first match I was playing against some sort of green/black poison deck. The guy I was playing with hadn't played magic for long, so the games weren't really interesting. I won the first game, the second game he dropped some creature (I can't remember the name right now) which hits for three poison counters. I got up to 6 counters before I could slow him down. Misplay by him lead to me winning (He had a 1/5 creature with poison out almost the whole game, but never attacked with it. I asked him why and he responded "I wanted to leave him for defense". Almost all of my creatures in play this game were flying, and none of his were or had reach).
In the final match my opponent had lots of artifact creatures, some black and some green. First game I got lucky and had three Glint Hawks out by turn three with the help of an Accorder's Shield so I won it fairly quickly. Next game my opponent got out a Prototype Portal imprinted with a Sylvok Replica which was REALLY annoying, I lost that game. Last game I knew I couldn't do anything if he got that prototype portal out, so I decided to go all out. I got some Glint Hawks and a Glint Hawk Idol on the battlefield but he managed to find a Ezuri Archers and a Bladed Pinions so I couldn't really put that much damage on him. Nothing really interesting happened, we just drew and played various creatures without anyone attacking. I managed to get a Kemba, Kha Regent out on the battlefield and soon I overwhelmed him.
All in all it was some of the most fun I've ever had in Magic. I never knew drafting could be so fun, trying to build a deck with so few cards is great fun. I will definitely be doing this more!
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Drafting's alot of fun until someone gets a bunch of ridiculous cards lol. I played a guy who got a foil koth AND a sword of body and mind AND contagion engine!! Needless to say I got rolled pretty hard... Though in the end it was still quite fun :D
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On November 21 2010 01:24 Nub4ever wrote:
Drafting's alot of fun until someone gets a bunch of ridiculous cards lol. I played a guy who got a foil koth AND a sword of body and mind AND contagion engine!! Needless to say I got rolled pretty hard... Though in the end it was still quite fun :D
Hope the dude was cheating 
We had that recently at our local FMN, the dude during M11, week after week would have a Titan and there were a lot of I don't remember seeing this go around our table moments.
How did we catch him? At the Scars release, he had 7 rares in the sealed event with no foils. Hilarity ensures.
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On November 21 2010 01:24 Nub4ever wrote:
Drafting's alot of fun until someone gets a bunch of ridiculous cards lol. I played a guy who got a foil koth AND a sword of body and mind AND contagion engine!! Needless to say I got rolled pretty hard... Though in the end it was still quite fun :D
drafting can sometimes be like that but usally just building a solid deck with a good curve and removal is better then a deck with bombs
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On November 20 2010 15:11 Orpheos wrote:take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth. put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse. maybe put in some goblin guides?
I might switch the lords for one more chalice and a dragonlord, but I'm keeping Chandra cuz it's my favorite card in the game. Haven't really played with the deck yet (I have half of the cards pretty much, got the rest ordered) but if I find Chandra is too useless maybe I'll consider switching her for a sparkmage + something.
Goblin Guides sounds kinda bad, especially vs say ramp builds, you don't really wanna give them more lands.
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Korea (South)922 Posts
On November 21 2010 04:46 Zoler wrote:Show nested quote +On November 20 2010 15:11 Orpheos wrote:take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth. put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse. maybe put in some goblin guides? I might switch the lords for one more chalice and a dragonlord, but I'm keeping Chandra cuz it's my favorite card in the game. Haven't really played with the deck yet (I have half of the cards pretty much, got the rest ordered) but if I find Chandra is too useless maybe I'll consider switching her for a sparkmage + something. Goblin Guides sounds kinda bad, especially vs say ramp builds, you don't really wanna give them more lands.
myrs are fine. i for one like pilgrim's eye though. and i cant stress how good masticore/mimic vat/burst lightning is in this deck, id cut lord of shatterskulls/flameslash/sparkmage/collar for 4 burst lightning/2 mimic vat/3 masticore.
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On November 21 2010 04:46 Zoler wrote:Show nested quote +On November 20 2010 15:11 Orpheos wrote:take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth. put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse. maybe put in some goblin guides? I might switch the lords for one more chalice and a dragonlord, but I'm keeping Chandra cuz it's my favorite card in the game. Haven't really played with the deck yet (I have half of the cards pretty much, got the rest ordered) but if I find Chandra is too useless maybe I'll consider switching her for a sparkmage + something. Goblin Guides sounds kinda bad, especially vs say ramp builds, you don't really wanna give them more lands.
Guide isn't "bad" against ramp, people think it is, but it really isn't that significant. They're going to get their lands, Guide isn't suddenly ramping them into anything obscene. The only way I see Guide helping them out is if they were forced/kept a bad hand.
I would take out the Iron Myrs for some more offense and bump the Chalice to 4 and the Lord to 4. You'll find the Chandra very useless. Coming down at 5 is too slow and you'll find it quite redundant with Mage+Collar.
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On November 21 2010 06:22 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2010 04:46 Zoler wrote:On November 20 2010 15:11 Orpheos wrote:take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth. put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse. maybe put in some goblin guides? I might switch the lords for one more chalice and a dragonlord, but I'm keeping Chandra cuz it's my favorite card in the game. Haven't really played with the deck yet (I have half of the cards pretty much, got the rest ordered) but if I find Chandra is too useless maybe I'll consider switching her for a sparkmage + something. Goblin Guides sounds kinda bad, especially vs say ramp builds, you don't really wanna give them more lands. Guide isn't "bad" against ramp, people think it is, but it really isn't that significant. They're going to get their lands, Guide isn't suddenly ramping them into anything obscene. The only way I see Guide helping them out is if they were forced/kept a bad hand. I would take out the Iron Myrs for some more offense and bump the Chalice to 4 and the Lord to 4. You'll find the Chandra very useless. Coming down at 5 is too slow and you'll find it quite redundant with Mage+Collar.
Guide isn't bad against ramp(I would actually make a case that for decks that want to kill ramp before it can "go off" guide is excellent against ramp, but I still wouldn't play it. Guide just doesn't fit into this deck's plan very much at all.
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I think Guide is fine for big red decks honestly. It gives you something they have to deal with while you get your mana acceleration going. Alternatively, since you're planning on making a lot of mana anyways, you could play Spikeshot Elders. I'm not of the opinion that playing a mana-acceleration-into-mana-sink plan means you shouldn't play powerful one drops.
Not a huge fan of Sparkmage + Collar combo without Mystic to fetch it, but I guess it balances out with the potential for the Inferno Titan + Collar combo...
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On November 21 2010 04:46 Zoler wrote:Show nested quote +On November 20 2010 15:11 Orpheos wrote:take out chandra nalaars. its just not what you want to be doing with 5 mana. take out the lord too. you are already full on high drops with inferno titan, wurmcoil and koth. put in the last copies of everflowing chalice and dragon lord. if you want less mana accel start by taking out iron myrs rather than everflowing chalice because the myr is just worse. maybe put in some goblin guides? I might switch the lords for one more chalice and a dragonlord, but I'm keeping Chandra cuz it's my favorite card in the game. Haven't really played with the deck yet (I have half of the cards pretty much, got the rest ordered) but if I find Chandra is too useless maybe I'll consider switching her for a sparkmage + something. Goblin Guides sounds kinda bad, especially vs say ramp builds, you don't really wanna give them more lands.
This seems like a variation of big red, a deffinate Tier 2 deck in standard right now, but chandra nalar is really meh. If you want to play her its cool but don't expect her to be amazing, also like said above lord of shatterskull pass is very mediocre, molten tail masticore is something to think about as is lux cannon/voltaic key combo a lot of big red decks are playing. more burn would be nice also for defensive creature removal. Don't expect to beat many Tier 1 decks with this though maybe 1/3 of the time only.
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Thinking about the masticores, then my deck would almost be a copy of the one that won Nevada state championship. Might get them after playtesting a bit. This is the first time I'm actually spending money on a deck, but I picked big red because it's always been my favorite. Rather play a worse but fun deck than something I don't like and win.
Thinking of building an u/b control tho, but those goddamn jaces T_T
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EPT
