EPTOverall, BREAD doesn't work as well as it does in most draft formats for ISD block.
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bobbob
United States368 Posts
Overall, BREAD doesn't work as well as it does in most draft formats for ISD block. | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On March 24 2012 04:22 bobbob wrote: The one problem with that is that a lot of the removal in ISD is actually really awful compared to most formats, the only excellent piece of removal is brimstone volley, maybe burden of guilt and fires of undeath, but burden is bad in multiples. Victim, Bonds, Dead Weight are all conditional, they are good in ISD but bad overall, pretty sure I'd be happier with a pacifism over bonds 90% of the time, doom blade over victim, etc. There's really a point in this draft where you take darkthicket wolf over some removal (IE rebuke is removal, but I'd probably take darkthicket over it, and it's hard to justify darkthicket as a bomb.) Overall, BREAD doesn't work as well as it does in most draft formats for ISD block. I agree with you to an extent, but I think the basic foundation of bread holds, it's just been switched into something like BARED or something (not saying that's the exact order, just randomly threw the letters around sans bomb) | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
Removal is as removal goes, but everyone has this problem, but the tempo issue is more of a draft defining aspect. But yes, mill decks, stupidly hard to beat simply because you need specific cards to disrupt their plan, racing it is a risky proposition and certainly not possible in every deck. Plus mill effectively turns every put back on top of library card a removal, in blue. The deck is stupidly dumb, but I think that's been true in any draft format where mill was a realistic option (like in Scars block). | ||
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wunsun
Canada622 Posts
On March 24 2012 02:49 Shotcoder wrote: When you're drafting just remember... B – Bombs R – Removal E – Efficient Spells A – Aggro D – Dregs It's really the best way to draft. keeps you on the right drafting page and makes sure you know your pick orders. Mill is probably the most viable strategy in my opinion. If you see the cards and you don't take them expect to lose, because someone else is getting them. I've drafted a 3 Curse, 4 dream twist deck and didnt drop a single game. Also in the format with Traveler's amulet, Evolving wilds, shimmering grotto, Pilgrim, I feel 3 colors is 100% viable if you grab those early, and to me they are an easy 5-6 pick depending on your cards earlier in the pack. 4 colors is also viable depending on how color dependent your cards are. I've been going blue white evasion, with some bombs....but they're not that necessary with all the blue control that is out there. Your mill deck is gross. Just gross. Three colors is very viable, dropped one game in 4 rounds running 2 colors main and splashing green for 3 cards. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + <DeeznutsNYoMouf> wow <DeeznutsNYoMouf> no creatures <DeeznutsNYoMouf> gg <Impulsive> .. DeeznutsNYoMouf draws a card <Impulsive> lol DeeznutsNYoMouf draws a card <Impulsive> you ponder <Impulsive> and kept <Impulsive> that? <Impulsive> like i said <Impulsive> you play poorly <DeeznutsNYoMouf> dude 15 years <Impulsive> 15 years <Impulsive> means nothing <DeeznutsNYoMouf> so I don't wanna hear it <Impulsive> you still <Impulsive> play <Impulsive> poorly <Impulsive> just the truth <DeeznutsNYoMouf> and you suck dick <Impulsive> if you pondered <DeeznutsNYoMouf> so who cares <Impulsive> and kept that <DeeznutsNYoMouf> life is what matters <Impulsive> ROFL <Impulsive> OK <Impulsive> 15 years <Impulsive> of magic <Impulsive> LOL <Impulsive> kk <Impulsive> life matters <System> Player Lost <Impulsive> you can't drop those 2 lines This is after I commented on his play after game 1 where he tried dealing 13 damage with a Geist and Runchanters Pike when I had double Ratchets out and he phyrexian manas himself down to lethal. I should just screenshot the stupid shit people do and say. | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On March 25 2012 10:20 Judicator wrote: Anyways, I need to start an adventures of magic workstation segment or something...I was playtesting a Tezzert deck and after I beat a Delver player by the name "Deeznutsnyomouf" this conversation went down: + Show Spoiler + <DeeznutsNYoMouf> wow <DeeznutsNYoMouf> no creatures <DeeznutsNYoMouf> gg <Impulsive> .. DeeznutsNYoMouf draws a card <Impulsive> lol DeeznutsNYoMouf draws a card <Impulsive> you ponder <Impulsive> and kept <Impulsive> that? <Impulsive> like i said <Impulsive> you play poorly <DeeznutsNYoMouf> dude 15 years <Impulsive> 15 years <Impulsive> means nothing <DeeznutsNYoMouf> so I don't wanna hear it <Impulsive> you still <Impulsive> play <Impulsive> poorly <Impulsive> just the truth <DeeznutsNYoMouf> and you suck dick <Impulsive> if you pondered <DeeznutsNYoMouf> so who cares <Impulsive> and kept that <DeeznutsNYoMouf> life is what matters <Impulsive> ROFL <Impulsive> OK <Impulsive> 15 years <Impulsive> of magic <Impulsive> LOL <Impulsive> kk <Impulsive> life matters <System> Player Lost <Impulsive> you can't drop those 2 lines This is after I commented on his play after game 1 where he tried dealing 13 damage with a Geist and Runchanters Pike when I had double Ratchets out and he phyrexian manas himself down to lethal. I should just screenshot the stupid shit people do and say. My friends and I would love shit like that. Makes our day. | ||
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bobbob
United States368 Posts
EDIT: Qasali Pridemage in Extended was also apparently not legal. Humility Mishra's Factory activation is also a 1/1, Elspeth pump of a Humilty dude is still a 1/1 no abilities. Some people are just retarded and can't learn rules. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
Boros humans was something I tried to force with the release of innistrad because of Stormblood and Grim lavamancer, but it didnt bode too well. But with Justin trying it out I thought I might too. What do you guys think of this list? + Show Spoiler + Creatures 4x Mirran Crusader 2x Hellrider 4x Stormblood Berserker 4x Champion of the Parish 4x Doomed Traveler 2x Fiend Hunter 2x Instigator Gang 3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben Land 4x Clifftop Retreat 12x Plains 6x Mountain 2x Evolving Wilds Spells 4x Rally the Peasants 4x Gather the Townsfolk 3x Increasing Devotion sideboard Sideboard 2x Divine Offering 3x Dismember 2x Surgical Extraction 3x Celestial Purge 1x Oblivion Ring 3x Elite Inquisitor 1x Fiend Hunter Looks fun to me and rally is just an insane card. | ||
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BlueBird.
United States3890 Posts
If your just looking for a fun deck to play then by all means play it though. | ||
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On March 29 2012 05:00 BlueBird. wrote: I believe he's trying to play it in block, and I feel like it doesn't really port over to standard very well, especially since the mana base is just awful. For block it's fine, but trying to go Champion into Stormblood into Crusader into Hellrider means you need to draw perfect mana without any evolving wilds usage. If your just looking for a fun deck to play then by all means play it though. that's just the optimal line, goin turn two gather into turn 3 crusader into turn 4 instigator gang or something is just as effective. yes i know its for block but the power level of cards like crusader and stormblood should put it over the top. Also looking at the Lingering peasants build which seems hilariously awesome. | ||
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MCMcEmcee
United States1609 Posts
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bobbob
United States368 Posts
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
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DCLXVI
United States729 Posts
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huameng
United States1133 Posts
In my opinion, from playing the block RW humans deck, this deck should start with 4x hellrider. Hellrider (with burn) was good enough to make you forgo playing Sorin and Garruk and Vault of the Archangels in tokens builds, so if you aren't maximizing its potential by playing 4 of them and enough red sources to make it work, I don't see why you aren't just playing a regular humans list. I feel like the inconsistency (and lack of honor of the pure) isn't worth it unless you are adding a lot of punch to the deck, which is what Hellrider is best at. | ||
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wunsun
Canada622 Posts
The overall question is who get to decide what happens first during each step (untap, upkeep, draw, etc...) For example, during upkeep, if my opponent has a Curse of Bloody Tome on me, and I have a Delver that wants to flip, what happens first. Another example is that who has to first to act during declare attackers, declare blockers steps. Who get to decide to pump/instant first? Thanks XD | ||
520
United States2822 Posts
On March 29 2012 12:18 wunsun wrote: Hey guys. I need some help to play better. The overall question is who get to decide what happens first during each step (untap, upkeep, draw, etc...) For example, during upkeep, if my opponent has a Curse of Bloody Tome on me, and I have a Delver that wants to flip, what happens first. Another example is that who has to first to act during declare attackers, declare blockers steps. Who get to decide to pump/instant first? Thanks XD Remember the rule AP-NAP. The active player's effects go on the stack first, followed by the non-active player's. So in the first case, you would put the Delver trigger on the stack, then the Curse of the Bloody Tome trigger on the stack. The Curse would resolve first, causing you to mill two. Then you would resolve the Delver trigger and check the top card of your library. During the declare attackers and declare blockers steps, you always get priority first. Only after passing priority to your opponent do they get to do anything in response. You can use this to, for example, cast a Sorcery and then immediately respond to it using an Instant before your opponent can do anything. It's also why you will always get one activation out of a Planeswalker - they can't do anything between it resolving and you declaring that you're using one of its abilities. | ||
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wunsun
Canada622 Posts
On March 29 2012 12:27 scintilliaSD wrote: Remember the rule AP-NAP. The active player's effects go on the stack first, followed by the non-active player's. So in the first case, you would put the Delver trigger on the stack, then the Curse of the Bloody Tome trigger on the stack. The Curse would resolve first, causing you to mill two. Then you would resolve the Delver trigger and check the top card of your library. During the declare attackers and declare blockers steps, you always get priority first. Only after passing priority to your opponent do they get to do anything in response. You can use this to, for example, cast a Sorcery and then immediately respond to it using an Instant before your opponent can do anything. It's also why you will always get one activation out of a Planeswalker - they can't do anything between it resolving and you declaring that you're using one of its abilities. Hmm... never learned that rule o.O So, the person's who's turn it is has their tripper/abilities/effects go on the stack first? So for example, if I am attacking, I get priority, then passes it to my opponent. Then during blockers, he get's priority first? Or is it still me. Just to test my knowledge, had this happen between both me and my friends. We were both on one life, and we both had a huntmaster, and they were gonna flip to the moon side. Therefore, since he was passing the turn to me (i.e. it was his turn), his huntmaster flips, then mine flips, but mine is on the stack, so I would win? | ||
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bobbob
United States368 Posts
AP places flip trigger on stack. NAP places flip trigger on stack. NAP flips huntmaster. NAP puts new 2 damage trigger on stack, presumably targeting your huntmaster. 2 damage is dealt to your huntmaster, it goes to the yard before getting its own flip in. The active player is the player whose turn it is. The next NAP is the next player in turn order (or just the other player in 1v1). So for combat, there is the begin combat step. Person whose turn it is has his chance to cast spells/activate abilities. If he chooses to not do any, then NAP gets his chance to do whatever. If he does nothing, it goes to declare attackers. AP declares all attacking creatures at the same time, pays any costs for attacking. Then he has priority to cast/use stuff. If nothing priority goes back to NAP. Then if nothing, goes to declare blockers, NAP declares all blockers. Then AP can cast stuff, then NAP. Then combat damage. Naturally if someone uses an ability, the AP gets priority after it goes on the stack, and will need to pass priority back to the NAP, and if he does nothing, the ability/spell resolves. If someone were to flash in a Cunning Sparkmage somehow, then the AP could Sudden Shock it before it could use its ability. | ||
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