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Well currently the most common way to get rid of Thrun in control is Phantasmal Image. Also consider when a deck running traveller runs into a deck running vanguard. So they turn 1 traveller vs turn 1 vanguard. So while neither can attack into each other, the guy running the traveller won't have problems trying to trade him off, since he gets value. The vanguard is better when goldfishing, but the traveler has more practical use. UW humans runs DoJ in the board, so not only can they handle early vanguards, but they will just dominate you if you overextend. It's not like a control deck is going to be draw go for 3 turns in a row either, and a midrange like solar flare will just beat you out after a wrath. The travellers with gavony township means that turn 5 if you have nothing you can just pump the spirits and beat in for 4 or something. If an opponent wants to get rid of them, he has to blow a card on them.
Tell me, in a mirror, how does the other GW deck handle spirits beating in? I see Oring and Fiend Hunter, pretty inefficient. Other than that, Garruk works, I suppose, but while my Garruk can just flip off a Vanguard, the spirits can poke Garruk if he cannot remove them all. Pretty clear to me that a deck running travelers is at an advantage to a deck running vanguards. So it is at an advantage in the mirror, as well as vs most aggressive matchups (trade/chumps memnite/other durdle better than vanguard, flier blocks idols and glint hawks, with township it can trade). Travelers pay off like crazy on the draw since you have an extra card and no 1 drop in any humans deck wants to trade with them, excepting Champion of the Parish.
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On December 04 2011 18:01 Shotcoder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2011 17:40 Meta wrote:Regarding Elite Vanguard vs Doomed Traveler in GW Humans Frankly, both cards are bad. If you NEED to run either, I still say run Vanguard. You guys are too scared of turn 4 day. This is far and away the most aggressive format in years. 1 or 2 spirits after a wrath isn't going to win you the game, and the extra damage you'd deal on turns 2-3-4 from the Vanguard will usually make up for it. Furthermore, of the 4 G/W Humans decks that did well at states, the only two of them that ran either card picked Elite Vanguard. + Show Spoiler +http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/deckshow.php?t[T1]=1&deck_name[]=G%2FW+Humans&event_ID=&feedin=&start_date=2011-09-11&end_date=2011-12-04&city=&state=&country=&start=1&finish=8&exp=&p_first=&p_last=&simple_card_name[1]=&simple_card_name[2]=&simple_card_name[3]=&simple_card_name[4]=&simple_card_name[5]=&w_perc=0&g_perc=0&r_perc=0&b_perc=0&u_perc=0&a_perc=0&comparison[1]=%3E%3D&card_qty[1]=1&card_name[1]=&comparison[2]=%3E%3D&card_qty[2]=1&card_name[2]=&comparison[3]=%3E%3D&card_qty[3]=1&card_name[3]=&comparison[4]=%3E%3D&card_qty[4]=1&card_name[4]=&comparison[5]=%3E%3D&card_qty[5]=1&card_name[5]=&sb_comparison[1]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[1]=1&sb_card_name[1]=&sb_comparison[2]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[2]=1&sb_card_name[2]=&card_not[1]=&card_not[2]=&card_not[3]=&card_not[4]=&card_not[5]=&order_1=finish&order_2=&limit=25&action=Show+Decks Clearly there's a reason these guys picked Vanguard over Traveler, and I think it's because they predicted lots of aggro in the format. Traveler is WAY worse than Vanguard vs Tempered Steel and basically any other aggro deck you'll face. 1/1 flyers aren't going to win you a game? they wear a sword and angelic destiny(or battle cry/overrun if you run those) just as well as any other creature plus it puts pressure on your opponent. This is why Humans decks are splashing blue for moorland haunt. The fact is the card gives you that extra reach after a wrath affect, it's affected by honor of the pure in both forms, and is still a 1/1 for 1 with a higher upside than elite vanguard. You're also using decks from October before the standard meta game was set, and when card values were actually found out. I mean the one deck is running 4 green suns while the others are running mentor of the meek and Adaptive automaton. all sub optimal cards in the build in my opinion.
You wouldn't run Adaptive Automaton in GW Humans?? Having 8 lords to pump your Mirran Crusader is pretty fucking legit. Also, I don't see a reason to run Swords in this deck, all they do is slow you down. You wanna play GW Humans like it's Fish, super aggro that deals 20 damage in 5 turns.
If you're gonna build your aggro deck to stall out the game and win with flyers that have swords on them, that's fine, Doomed Traveler is your card.
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You're playing shitty cards in a GW Humans deck if you're running Adaptive Automaton, what cards out of your 60 cards are you taking out for it? 8 Lords to pump a Crusader....right....do you think about mana curves at all?
GW is not Fish, Fish has access to countermagic, Illusions is Fish. Mentor is ass in the deck at 3 and you think AA is worth a spot? Jokes.
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On December 04 2011 23:45 Meta wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2011 18:01 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 17:40 Meta wrote:Regarding Elite Vanguard vs Doomed Traveler in GW Humans Frankly, both cards are bad. If you NEED to run either, I still say run Vanguard. You guys are too scared of turn 4 day. This is far and away the most aggressive format in years. 1 or 2 spirits after a wrath isn't going to win you the game, and the extra damage you'd deal on turns 2-3-4 from the Vanguard will usually make up for it. Furthermore, of the 4 G/W Humans decks that did well at states, the only two of them that ran either card picked Elite Vanguard. + Show Spoiler +http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/deckshow.php?t[T1]=1&deck_name[]=G%2FW+Humans&event_ID=&feedin=&start_date=2011-09-11&end_date=2011-12-04&city=&state=&country=&start=1&finish=8&exp=&p_first=&p_last=&simple_card_name[1]=&simple_card_name[2]=&simple_card_name[3]=&simple_card_name[4]=&simple_card_name[5]=&w_perc=0&g_perc=0&r_perc=0&b_perc=0&u_perc=0&a_perc=0&comparison[1]=%3E%3D&card_qty[1]=1&card_name[1]=&comparison[2]=%3E%3D&card_qty[2]=1&card_name[2]=&comparison[3]=%3E%3D&card_qty[3]=1&card_name[3]=&comparison[4]=%3E%3D&card_qty[4]=1&card_name[4]=&comparison[5]=%3E%3D&card_qty[5]=1&card_name[5]=&sb_comparison[1]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[1]=1&sb_card_name[1]=&sb_comparison[2]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[2]=1&sb_card_name[2]=&card_not[1]=&card_not[2]=&card_not[3]=&card_not[4]=&card_not[5]=&order_1=finish&order_2=&limit=25&action=Show+Decks Clearly there's a reason these guys picked Vanguard over Traveler, and I think it's because they predicted lots of aggro in the format. Traveler is WAY worse than Vanguard vs Tempered Steel and basically any other aggro deck you'll face. 1/1 flyers aren't going to win you a game? they wear a sword and angelic destiny(or battle cry/overrun if you run those) just as well as any other creature plus it puts pressure on your opponent. This is why Humans decks are splashing blue for moorland haunt. The fact is the card gives you that extra reach after a wrath affect, it's affected by honor of the pure in both forms, and is still a 1/1 for 1 with a higher upside than elite vanguard. You're also using decks from October before the standard meta game was set, and when card values were actually found out. I mean the one deck is running 4 green suns while the others are running mentor of the meek and Adaptive automaton. all sub optimal cards in the build in my opinion. You wouldn't run Adaptive Automaton in GW Humans?? Having 8 lords to pump your Mirran Crusader is pretty fucking legit. Also, I don't see a reason to run Swords in this deck, all they do is slow you down. You wanna play GW Humans like it's Fish, super aggro that deals 20 damage in 5 turns. If you're gonna build your aggro deck to stall out the game and win with flyers that have swords on them, that's fine, Doomed Traveler is your card.
No I wouldn't use Adaptive Automaton. It sits at the same spot as Mirran Crusader, Fiend hunter, and Oblivion ring and is a vastly inferior card in every way. GW should seriously splash green for 2 maybe 3 cards. Hamlet Captain, Mayor, and Pilgrim. but the fact is mono white has good enough humans to not even warrant the splash for green. Champion, doomed traveler, gideon's lawkeeper, leonin relic warder, and grand abolisher further the deck a lot more than either of those three cards do.
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How swords slow down the damage output from humans is beyond me. Double sword effects with +2/+2 or +1/+1 from a lord? Answer seems pretty obvious to me.
You are playing the wrong deck if you are going all in for a turn 5 kill.
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On December 05 2011 01:45 Shotcoder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2011 23:45 Meta wrote:On December 04 2011 18:01 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 17:40 Meta wrote:Regarding Elite Vanguard vs Doomed Traveler in GW Humans Frankly, both cards are bad. If you NEED to run either, I still say run Vanguard. You guys are too scared of turn 4 day. This is far and away the most aggressive format in years. 1 or 2 spirits after a wrath isn't going to win you the game, and the extra damage you'd deal on turns 2-3-4 from the Vanguard will usually make up for it. Furthermore, of the 4 G/W Humans decks that did well at states, the only two of them that ran either card picked Elite Vanguard. + Show Spoiler +http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/deckshow.php?t[T1]=1&deck_name[]=G%2FW+Humans&event_ID=&feedin=&start_date=2011-09-11&end_date=2011-12-04&city=&state=&country=&start=1&finish=8&exp=&p_first=&p_last=&simple_card_name[1]=&simple_card_name[2]=&simple_card_name[3]=&simple_card_name[4]=&simple_card_name[5]=&w_perc=0&g_perc=0&r_perc=0&b_perc=0&u_perc=0&a_perc=0&comparison[1]=%3E%3D&card_qty[1]=1&card_name[1]=&comparison[2]=%3E%3D&card_qty[2]=1&card_name[2]=&comparison[3]=%3E%3D&card_qty[3]=1&card_name[3]=&comparison[4]=%3E%3D&card_qty[4]=1&card_name[4]=&comparison[5]=%3E%3D&card_qty[5]=1&card_name[5]=&sb_comparison[1]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[1]=1&sb_card_name[1]=&sb_comparison[2]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[2]=1&sb_card_name[2]=&card_not[1]=&card_not[2]=&card_not[3]=&card_not[4]=&card_not[5]=&order_1=finish&order_2=&limit=25&action=Show+Decks Clearly there's a reason these guys picked Vanguard over Traveler, and I think it's because they predicted lots of aggro in the format. Traveler is WAY worse than Vanguard vs Tempered Steel and basically any other aggro deck you'll face. 1/1 flyers aren't going to win you a game? they wear a sword and angelic destiny(or battle cry/overrun if you run those) just as well as any other creature plus it puts pressure on your opponent. This is why Humans decks are splashing blue for moorland haunt. The fact is the card gives you that extra reach after a wrath affect, it's affected by honor of the pure in both forms, and is still a 1/1 for 1 with a higher upside than elite vanguard. You're also using decks from October before the standard meta game was set, and when card values were actually found out. I mean the one deck is running 4 green suns while the others are running mentor of the meek and Adaptive automaton. all sub optimal cards in the build in my opinion. You wouldn't run Adaptive Automaton in GW Humans?? Having 8 lords to pump your Mirran Crusader is pretty fucking legit. Also, I don't see a reason to run Swords in this deck, all they do is slow you down. You wanna play GW Humans like it's Fish, super aggro that deals 20 damage in 5 turns. If you're gonna build your aggro deck to stall out the game and win with flyers that have swords on them, that's fine, Doomed Traveler is your card. No I wouldn't use Adaptive Automaton. It sits at the same spot as Mirran Crusader, Fiend hunter, and Oblivion ring and is a vastly inferior card in every way. GW should seriously splash green for 2 maybe 3 cards. Hamlet Captain, Mayor, and Pilgrim. but the fact is mono white has good enough humans to not even warrant the splash for green. Champion, doomed traveler, gideon's lawkeeper, leonin relic warder, and grand abolisher further the deck a lot more than either of those three cards do.
Hamlet Captain is complete junk in the deck, he's quite often just flat out deadweight, drop him for a 4 of HotP, i've been brewing with GW since ISD came out and post a fair bit in the GW Humans thread on MTG Salvation, as for the Swords v Destiny argument that's one that flips back and forth constantly, going Pilgrim, Crusader, Destiny swing for 12 turn 3 is pretty nuts, but SoWaP is amazing protection and a HUGE gap closer v aggro, and if you get one on a Crusader lolol... Anyways, current decklisting -
http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=238031
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In sealed, is 5 land (2 of both main and 1 of the splash color) Stromkirk Noble, Instigator gang a greedy keep when your curve is primarily 2/3?
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Depends on the matchup, if you are running vs red or black, if they can geistflame or dead weight or typhoid rats it seems pretty sketchy. Seems acceptable vs white blue green though.
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dunno what the rest of your deck looks like but i don't think i would keep that, too many cards crush you (even more if you are on the draw)
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Well, I've been trying out puresteel, since it seems to still have a majority of good cards. Mono-white with some fairly standard stuff. Playing doomed traveler over vault skirge has been fun, I'm not sure if it's the right choice though. I'm not crazy about splashing blue, though moorland haunt would be guarenteed useful. Also 2 mox > 1 mox dont let anyone tell you different 
+ Show Spoiler +3 Hero of Bladehold
2 Mirran Crusader
4 Puresteel Paladin
4 Flayer Husk
4 Mortarpod
2 Mox Opal
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Sword of Feast and Famine
3 Sword of War and Peace
4 Inkmoth Nexus
18 Plains
3 Dispatch
4 Doomed Traveler
2 Accorder's Shield
1 Silver-Inlaid Dagger
2 Etched Champion
1 Dismember
SB: 1 Dismember
SB: 1 Oblivion Ring
SB: 3 Timely Reinforcements
SB: 2 Mirran Crusader
SB: 1 Etched Champion
SB: 2 Nihil Spellbomb
SB: 1 Sword of War and Peace
SB: 2 Spellskite
SB: 2 Grand Abolisher
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I think you might want to run the vault skirge for the sole reason that it can activate the moxen and dispatch easier. You have 23 artifacts counting swords and inkmoths, and ideally you won't need to use inkmoth as a shimmering grotto, and can in fact use it for extra mana. You essentially have an artifact count of things that come down before swords of 14, which seems pretty low, but I don't know the deck particularly well.
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On December 06 2011 01:26 deth2munkies wrote:
In sealed, is 5 land (2 of both main and 1 of the splash color) Stromkirk Noble, Instigator gang a greedy keep when your curve is primarily 2/3?
If you have a weaker one drop in your main colors, I'd just cut Stromkirk Noble altogether. He isn't going to do anything for you after turn 3 and he is at his most effective, obviously, on turn 1. So to get maximum value out of him, you need an opening hand of a Mountain and the Noble. Obviously, this could happen but, without running the numbers and just approximating, you're looking at like...10-12%?
Actually, that's not bad. Yeah, but I'd still cut it. You're also sacrificing mana-base. So if you had a Selfless Cathar or a Typhoid Rats or a Delver of Secrets, I'd run those instead - if they were your main colors.
EDIT: So I'd play Instigator Gang, obviously. But I'd probably only play 3 Mountains at the very most. Definitely less if you had other fixing.
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It's a terrible deck, don't bother. My playgroup already tried every notable variation of Puresteel including the Pod one and it's just bad. It's not exploiting some niche in the meta and it's weaker than the GW and WW/Illusions builds and the hate cards overlap. It has the potential to be more threatening than the aforementioned decks, but it's just as swingy. The match up against Flare is a joke and I don't see it being any better against Grixis and that's not even mentioning what Wolf-Run has for you.
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I adore Puresteel Paladin. But I'm probably with Judicator on this one. It's just not going to be a particularly competitive card unless the next two sets of the block drop some monster equipment on us. I mean consider its design - it basically forces the deck builder to put in Flayer Husks and Mortapods. Although, I do love playing with Dispatch and the deck is fun when you imagine it like Gundam and your Sword is just that extra super laser gun for the Gundam to go pewpewpew.
Have you tried Origin Spellbomb in there, btw? That or Stave Off, I've always wanted to try in a Puresteel Deck.
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Like the problem with the deck is that once a player knows how to play against it, it simply won't win outside of godly draws and even then it still won't win consistently. It's one of the few decks as a Flare player that I let them resolve Sword of Feast and Famine and just keep them off of their guys the entire time (make them spend their turns trying to equip) and then time my O-Rings on those equipment to just fuck their board state with counter-magic back up (like how you would play those janky Heartless decks).
The match up is easily 80-20 in Puresteel player's favor if they don't identify the problem cards correctly and its like 30-70 if they do. That's not counting the board either.
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On December 05 2011 07:29 Skithiryx wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 01:45 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 23:45 Meta wrote:On December 04 2011 18:01 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 17:40 Meta wrote:Regarding Elite Vanguard vs Doomed Traveler in GW Humans Frankly, both cards are bad. If you NEED to run either, I still say run Vanguard. You guys are too scared of turn 4 day. This is far and away the most aggressive format in years. 1 or 2 spirits after a wrath isn't going to win you the game, and the extra damage you'd deal on turns 2-3-4 from the Vanguard will usually make up for it. Furthermore, of the 4 G/W Humans decks that did well at states, the only two of them that ran either card picked Elite Vanguard. + Show Spoiler +http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/deckshow.php?t[T1]=1&deck_name[]=G%2FW+Humans&event_ID=&feedin=&start_date=2011-09-11&end_date=2011-12-04&city=&state=&country=&start=1&finish=8&exp=&p_first=&p_last=&simple_card_name[1]=&simple_card_name[2]=&simple_card_name[3]=&simple_card_name[4]=&simple_card_name[5]=&w_perc=0&g_perc=0&r_perc=0&b_perc=0&u_perc=0&a_perc=0&comparison[1]=%3E%3D&card_qty[1]=1&card_name[1]=&comparison[2]=%3E%3D&card_qty[2]=1&card_name[2]=&comparison[3]=%3E%3D&card_qty[3]=1&card_name[3]=&comparison[4]=%3E%3D&card_qty[4]=1&card_name[4]=&comparison[5]=%3E%3D&card_qty[5]=1&card_name[5]=&sb_comparison[1]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[1]=1&sb_card_name[1]=&sb_comparison[2]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[2]=1&sb_card_name[2]=&card_not[1]=&card_not[2]=&card_not[3]=&card_not[4]=&card_not[5]=&order_1=finish&order_2=&limit=25&action=Show+Decks Clearly there's a reason these guys picked Vanguard over Traveler, and I think it's because they predicted lots of aggro in the format. Traveler is WAY worse than Vanguard vs Tempered Steel and basically any other aggro deck you'll face. 1/1 flyers aren't going to win you a game? they wear a sword and angelic destiny(or battle cry/overrun if you run those) just as well as any other creature plus it puts pressure on your opponent. This is why Humans decks are splashing blue for moorland haunt. The fact is the card gives you that extra reach after a wrath affect, it's affected by honor of the pure in both forms, and is still a 1/1 for 1 with a higher upside than elite vanguard. You're also using decks from October before the standard meta game was set, and when card values were actually found out. I mean the one deck is running 4 green suns while the others are running mentor of the meek and Adaptive automaton. all sub optimal cards in the build in my opinion. You wouldn't run Adaptive Automaton in GW Humans?? Having 8 lords to pump your Mirran Crusader is pretty fucking legit. Also, I don't see a reason to run Swords in this deck, all they do is slow you down. You wanna play GW Humans like it's Fish, super aggro that deals 20 damage in 5 turns. If you're gonna build your aggro deck to stall out the game and win with flyers that have swords on them, that's fine, Doomed Traveler is your card. No I wouldn't use Adaptive Automaton. It sits at the same spot as Mirran Crusader, Fiend hunter, and Oblivion ring and is a vastly inferior card in every way. GW should seriously splash green for 2 maybe 3 cards. Hamlet Captain, Mayor, and Pilgrim. but the fact is mono white has good enough humans to not even warrant the splash for green. Champion, doomed traveler, gideon's lawkeeper, leonin relic warder, and grand abolisher further the deck a lot more than either of those three cards do. Hamlet Captain is complete junk in the deck, he's quite often just flat out deadweight, drop him for a 4 of HotP, i've been brewing with GW since ISD came out and post a fair bit in the GW Humans thread on MTG Salvation, as for the Swords v Destiny argument that's one that flips back and forth constantly, going Pilgrim, Crusader, Destiny swing for 12 turn 3 is pretty nuts, but SoWaP is amazing protection and a HUGE gap closer v aggro, and if you get one on a Crusader lolol... Anyways, current decklisting - http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=238031
so basicly there's really almost no point in getting Green? >_>
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On December 06 2011 07:47 zhurai wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 07:29 Skithiryx wrote:On December 05 2011 01:45 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 23:45 Meta wrote:On December 04 2011 18:01 Shotcoder wrote:On December 04 2011 17:40 Meta wrote:Regarding Elite Vanguard vs Doomed Traveler in GW Humans Frankly, both cards are bad. If you NEED to run either, I still say run Vanguard. You guys are too scared of turn 4 day. This is far and away the most aggressive format in years. 1 or 2 spirits after a wrath isn't going to win you the game, and the extra damage you'd deal on turns 2-3-4 from the Vanguard will usually make up for it. Furthermore, of the 4 G/W Humans decks that did well at states, the only two of them that ran either card picked Elite Vanguard. + Show Spoiler +http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/deckshow.php?t[T1]=1&deck_name[]=G%2FW+Humans&event_ID=&feedin=&start_date=2011-09-11&end_date=2011-12-04&city=&state=&country=&start=1&finish=8&exp=&p_first=&p_last=&simple_card_name[1]=&simple_card_name[2]=&simple_card_name[3]=&simple_card_name[4]=&simple_card_name[5]=&w_perc=0&g_perc=0&r_perc=0&b_perc=0&u_perc=0&a_perc=0&comparison[1]=%3E%3D&card_qty[1]=1&card_name[1]=&comparison[2]=%3E%3D&card_qty[2]=1&card_name[2]=&comparison[3]=%3E%3D&card_qty[3]=1&card_name[3]=&comparison[4]=%3E%3D&card_qty[4]=1&card_name[4]=&comparison[5]=%3E%3D&card_qty[5]=1&card_name[5]=&sb_comparison[1]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[1]=1&sb_card_name[1]=&sb_comparison[2]=%3E%3D&sb_card_qty[2]=1&sb_card_name[2]=&card_not[1]=&card_not[2]=&card_not[3]=&card_not[4]=&card_not[5]=&order_1=finish&order_2=&limit=25&action=Show+Decks Clearly there's a reason these guys picked Vanguard over Traveler, and I think it's because they predicted lots of aggro in the format. Traveler is WAY worse than Vanguard vs Tempered Steel and basically any other aggro deck you'll face. 1/1 flyers aren't going to win you a game? they wear a sword and angelic destiny(or battle cry/overrun if you run those) just as well as any other creature plus it puts pressure on your opponent. This is why Humans decks are splashing blue for moorland haunt. The fact is the card gives you that extra reach after a wrath affect, it's affected by honor of the pure in both forms, and is still a 1/1 for 1 with a higher upside than elite vanguard. You're also using decks from October before the standard meta game was set, and when card values were actually found out. I mean the one deck is running 4 green suns while the others are running mentor of the meek and Adaptive automaton. all sub optimal cards in the build in my opinion. You wouldn't run Adaptive Automaton in GW Humans?? Having 8 lords to pump your Mirran Crusader is pretty fucking legit. Also, I don't see a reason to run Swords in this deck, all they do is slow you down. You wanna play GW Humans like it's Fish, super aggro that deals 20 damage in 5 turns. If you're gonna build your aggro deck to stall out the game and win with flyers that have swords on them, that's fine, Doomed Traveler is your card. No I wouldn't use Adaptive Automaton. It sits at the same spot as Mirran Crusader, Fiend hunter, and Oblivion ring and is a vastly inferior card in every way. GW should seriously splash green for 2 maybe 3 cards. Hamlet Captain, Mayor, and Pilgrim. but the fact is mono white has good enough humans to not even warrant the splash for green. Champion, doomed traveler, gideon's lawkeeper, leonin relic warder, and grand abolisher further the deck a lot more than either of those three cards do. Hamlet Captain is complete junk in the deck, he's quite often just flat out deadweight, drop him for a 4 of HotP, i've been brewing with GW since ISD came out and post a fair bit in the GW Humans thread on MTG Salvation, as for the Swords v Destiny argument that's one that flips back and forth constantly, going Pilgrim, Crusader, Destiny swing for 12 turn 3 is pretty nuts, but SoWaP is amazing protection and a HUGE gap closer v aggro, and if you get one on a Crusader lolol... Anyways, current decklisting - http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=238031 so basicly there's really almost no point in getting Green? >_>
Garruk and Overrun are things to consider. Access to more sideboard options isn't bad either.
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On December 06 2011 06:36 Judicator wrote:
Like the problem with the deck is that once a player knows how to play against it, it simply won't win outside of godly draws and even then it still won't win consistently. It's one of the few decks as a Flare player that I let them resolve Sword of Feast and Famine and just keep them off of their guys the entire time (make them spend their turns trying to equip) and then time my O-Rings on those equipment to just fuck their board state with counter-magic back up (like how you would play those janky Heartless decks).
The match up is easily 80-20 in Puresteel player's favor if they don't identify the problem cards correctly and its like 30-70 if they do. That's not counting the board either.
ah that makes me sad, I had a pretty good 50/50 against wolfrun against my buddy even against 4 ancient grudges. I never tested against flare, thought it was on the decline. RDW, GW and UW humans seemed to be even fights as well. Illusons was rough though, so I'd imagine other control variants would be as well.
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On December 06 2011 06:29 slyboogie wrote:
I adore Puresteel Paladin. But I'm probably with Judicator on this one. It's just not going to be a particularly competitive card unless the next two sets of the block drop some monster equipment on us. I mean consider its design - it basically forces the deck builder to put in Flayer Husks and Mortapods. Although, I do love playing with Dispatch and the deck is fun when you imagine it like Gundam and your Sword is just that extra super laser gun for the Gundam to go pewpewpew.
Have you tried Origin Spellbomb in there, btw? That or Stave Off, I've always wanted to try in a Puresteel Deck.
Apostle's blessing > stave off from my experience, but it's a complete sideboard card, and hardly a 3 of against the most hateful decks. Mortarpod/Etched/doomed are absolute heroes though, from what I've been facing.
Hopefully we get a basilisk collar clone in DKA. Hell, I'd pay 3 mana for my deathtouch machine gun.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/gvla0.jpg)
