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r33k
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Italy3402 Posts
September 23 2010 22:35 GMT
#19801
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.
Phrost
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States4008 Posts
September 23 2010 22:39 GMT
#19802
Garen Guide:


+ Show Spoiler +
DEMACIAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!1111111ONEONEONE
iamphrost.tumblr.com // http://howtobebettermagicplayer.tumblr.com // twitter @phrost_
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
September 23 2010 22:41 GMT
#19803
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
Knix
Profile Joined April 2010
United States67 Posts
September 23 2010 22:48 GMT
#19804
I decided to go with Garen, can someone give me a quick break-down of skill priority and item wish list? Thanks, love you TL.
Drewbie: "Here I realize 'oh shit, I can't kill him' so I double expand."
ArC_man
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States2798 Posts
September 23 2010 22:55 GMT
#19805
R > E > W=Q (depends on other team)
boots + pot (+ ward)
sunfire sunfire sunfire sunfire sunfire sunfire sunfire sunfire.
(oh and FoN is good too, GA isn't bad either)
pokerface
Profile Joined April 2007
507 Posts
September 23 2010 23:00 GMT
#19806
where the hell can i watch hsgg playing nowdays?Becoz http://thesodclan.com/clg_video.htm seems offline to me like 99% times i try.
Any1 pointing me the right direction is much appreciated!
DoctorHelvetica
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States15034 Posts
September 23 2010 23:02 GMT
#19807
On September 24 2010 07:41 UniversalSnip wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.


Is it possible that perhaps that the blue advantage doesn't apply to very high level games in which purple in fact has the advantage?
RIP Aaliyah
Cirn9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
1117 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-23 23:57:14
September 23 2010 23:05 GMT
#19808
On September 24 2010 08:00 pokerface wrote:
where the hell can i watch hsgg playing nowdays?Becoz http://thesodclan.com/clg_video.htm seems offline to me like 99% times i try.
Any1 pointing me the right direction is much appreciated!

http://clgaming.net/index.php?page=livestream

EDIT: Sorry lol. Only looked at links and didn't know it was same. I've not had any issues watching but I've heard a lot of people in the chat say they can't watch. Apologies.
Unprotected sex is like fast expanding in close positions. Its risky, but feels great when it works out
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
September 23 2010 23:08 GMT
#19809
On September 24 2010 08:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:41 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.


Is it possible that perhaps that the blue advantage doesn't apply to very high level games in which purple in fact has the advantage?

Yeah this is what my experience tells me. The high level players are probably correct but it's very possible that they're correct only for their skill level.
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
pokerface
Profile Joined April 2007
507 Posts
September 23 2010 23:08 GMT
#19810
This is exactly the same stream i just linked,but thx anyway!
r33k
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Italy3402 Posts
September 23 2010 23:11 GMT
#19811
On September 24 2010 08:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:41 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.


Is it possible that perhaps that the blue advantage doesn't apply to very high level games in which purple in fact has the advantage?

Since the heavy attention switch to baron, which is taken at any possible opportunity and the loss of interest in baron alongside the lower value of the laning phase (people will try to win lanes by getting a higher cs count rather than taking the tower and trying to end the game by pushing a side lane) is something which derives from the newer playing trend the answer is yes.

And the switch from 4 beefy characters+1 op ranged dps to more support heavy/ranged dps teams also contributed to switching the focus of the game on baron. Basically riot collected data from too many games and they included data from before the latest metagame trend.
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
September 23 2010 23:11 GMT
#19812
On September 24 2010 08:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 07:41 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.


Is it possible that perhaps that the blue advantage doesn't apply to very high level games in which purple in fact has the advantage?


Aside from the fact we didn't specify that, yeah it's possible but there's no reason to think so. It's not like we have any reason to think they discarded high level five mans or whatever.
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
r33k
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Italy3402 Posts
September 23 2010 23:16 GMT
#19813
On September 24 2010 08:08 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 08:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:41 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:35 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 24 2010 07:32 r33k wrote:
On September 24 2010 05:38 ProV1 wrote:
I'm not sure if people saw this but,

- Blue team on summoner's rift ONLY is considered as having an advantage, and will tend to be the weaker of the two teams now to even things out. This advantage is being rated at about 25 elo points. We reached this conclusion by using various statistical techniques on a very large set of games.


I always knew blue had a slight advantage in terms of the map, but now you know which side is the crap side to be on in terms of team elo.

Uhh this is retarded. Purple has so many advantages over blue it's not even funny.

First of all the supposed dragon and baron advantages blue has are completely turned in favor of purple: thanks to the return of lategame carries you will pull dragon out of his caveish area and fight him in the open, so that blue can not steal the kill. Purple will then be able to do baron from behind, or steal it for that matter, since if blue does dragon they have to leave 1 guy over the ledge who will be vulnerable to spotting and quick ganking. It is also still possible to hide a ward under baron, which gives purple spotting and the ability to smitesteal it.

As for river control, HSGG recently started warding blue's jungle opening into the river above golem, which gives him vision of the top river and isn't worth taking down unless you are nidalee/corki/can do it for free. The ward wars on dragon reward the purple team regardless of the outcome, since even if dragon's warded their ganker can come hide in the lane brushes once the lane is being slightly pushed.

Therefore after the slight advantage blue junglers may have in the extremely early game (which won't affect the game much since heavy counterjungling is no longer a deciding factor) throughout the rest of the game the purple team has tons and tons of stacking advantages. Basically blue sucks, purple can autowin games thanks to it position.


hi, my name is data. blue has an advantage.

Hi my name is not HSGG or bigfatjiji or elementz, but purple is OP. And yes they said so too.


No, seriously, blue has an advantage. We know this because riot has parsed the data and blue wins more. That's the definition of an advantage. What hotshot or elementz says is not. Pretty simple.


Is it possible that perhaps that the blue advantage doesn't apply to very high level games in which purple in fact has the advantage?

Yeah this is what my experience tells me. The high level players are probably correct but it's very possible that they're correct only for their skill level.

But the thing is that doing simple stuff such as grabbing dragon on every respawn and getting baron whenever it's available wins games even with a feeding team at low ELOs, I wouldn't consider the 2 playstyles as being 2 separate worlds, I would just say that if we played like the high ELOs purple side definitely turns out to be the team with the big advantage.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-23 23:26:41
September 23 2010 23:26 GMT
#19814
I find "coming back" as well as controlling baron significantly harder as purple team because it's so hard to properly ward the baron area. Contrary to popular belief the quick ward over the wall is not very useful, especially when it comes to baron because you really want to ward the grass.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Scamp
Profile Joined October 2008
United States1086 Posts
September 23 2010 23:29 GMT
#19815
So how do we know that matchmaking isn't biased toward blue team?

I bet whatever system they use makes it so the teams are close, but close doesn't mean equal. Maybe something in the way the teams are picked favors blue more often than purple.
Cheese is good for you!
rredtooth
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
5464 Posts
September 23 2010 23:32 GMT
#19816
FUN FACTS WITH REDTOOTH:
FACT: blue/purple are balanced.
[formerly sponsored by the artist formerly known as Gene]
r33k
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Italy3402 Posts
September 23 2010 23:33 GMT
#19817
On September 24 2010 08:26 Southlight wrote:
I find "coming back" as well as controlling baron significantly harder as purple team because it's so hard to properly ward the baron area. Contrary to popular belief the quick ward over the wall is not very useful, especially when it comes to baron because you really want to ward the grass.

Purple's biggest advantage when it comes to baron is that they can just steal it from blue and it's extremely easy for them to do so, also purple can effectively fight inside the baron area while they keep their ranged dps upstairs. A mostly ranged purple team with say shen can easily do the baron from behind too.

And again, if blue sends a ranged dps behind baron while they do it he'll just get raped.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 23 2010 23:35 GMT
#19818
Purple wards baron.
Blue buys oracle and clears it.
Purple is fawked.

Purple can drop a ward over baron but you never, ever gain baron control.

Blue can lose their ward but have multiple easy paths to the baron that are relatively safe.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
rredtooth
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
5464 Posts
September 23 2010 23:41 GMT
#19819
On September 24 2010 08:32 redtooth wrote:
FUN FACTS WITH REDTOOTH:
FACT: blue/purple are balanced.
[formerly sponsored by the artist formerly known as Gene]
BrownBear
Profile Joined March 2010
United States6894 Posts
September 23 2010 23:43 GMT
#19820
On September 24 2010 08:41 redtooth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 24 2010 08:32 redtooth wrote:
FUN FACTS WITH REDTOOTH:
FACT: blue/purple are balanced.


If there are any imbalances, I haven't noticed them yet. Of course, I've only played ~100 games so far.
SUNSFANNED
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