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On May 20 2010 09:42 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2010 07:41 HeavOnEarth wrote:
what character to u guys think has the most skill/effectiveness ratio. ive been trying out a couple. when I'm mad tired and just wanna right click and win games I play Ashe or Sivir. Sivir's the easiest for it in pubs though, you just spec 0/21/9, get doran's shield + hp pot, w, e, w, q -> r > w > q > e, BF Sword -> treads -> LW -> moar BF Swords -> Bloodthirsters. She still sucks, but when I can't stand to think, this is totally how I win games, lol. EDIT: cause I don't wanna torture Baikin with Sivir drama repeat, I don't actually think she sucks, but I do think she's tier 3, not 1 or 2 like everyone else seems to think.
That build is very similar to the pub stomp build I used to use...which doesn't really work, even at mid ELO. I'd say Sivir isn't easy to play at all, because it's easy to screw up your lane (you'll still farm fine, but you'll hose an ally), you have to land boomerang blades (skillshot), you have to manage auras in teamfights (close enough to teammates for your ult/stark's/aegis, close enough to enemies for stark's armor reduction), and you have to be map aware enough to push whenever you can...and not when you can't.
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ummmmmmm....
wut?
oh, you transitioned mid post from talking about a similar build of DPS Sivir to talking about aura sivir. k, got it.
well, anyway, it still works for me and I'm higher elo than you, so w/e, stopped caring what you had to say about aura management and skill shots. I'm not giving even a detailed build or anything intelligible, I'm giving you what I do when it's 3 AM and I can't sleep and just feel like right clicking on shit and seeing it die and winning sometimes. the only trick I have to playing sivir is the flat hp quints, dodge seals, 21 defensive masteries, and doran's shield so that I'm effectively just an annoying brick sitting around mid farming.
EDIT: oh yea and boomerang blade is for suckers. riccochet is actually better harass because it's reliable and lets you setup a war of attrition without requiring any thought.
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You know, I really don't think Kennen is that bad of a champ. You just have to stagger your stuns so that you're not stunning their whole team at the same time. Max Q first (yes I said it) and grab golem to REALLY spam those shurikens. 5 seconds of 5v4 is a lot better than 1 second of 5v0.
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How good a tank is Alistar nowadays? He's my tank of choice, though partly because I don't have enough IP to buy other ones. As far as I can tell, he's very resilient to harassment in the early game thanks to his heal, can set up kills with Flash > Pulverize > Headbutt, but has terrible damage output (his ultimate mitigates this somewhat) and is slow.
Is Alistar viable in higher ELO play, or should I try to learn other tanks?
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On May 20 2010 13:03 Zato-1 wrote:
How good a tank is Alistar nowadays? He's my tank of choice, though partly because I don't have enough IP to buy other ones. As far as I can tell, he's very resilient to harassment in the early game thanks to his heal, can set up kills with Flash > Pulverize > Headbutt, but has terrible damage output (his ultimate mitigates this somewhat) and is slow.
Is Alistar viable in higher ELO play, or should I try to learn other tanks?
Southlight and others have commented on Alistar's decline in viability due to the changing of the metagame to a more roaming-oriented style; however, Alistar is still easily one of the best tanks out there.
I actually build AP on him now, it's actually just Glacial Shroud into whatever boots I feel like into nabbing as many Kage's Picks as I can make. It's probably really dumb, but whatever. Alistar doesn't need items 
Edit: And I actually take that back, Fiendish Codex would probably be better than Glacial Shroud (I really only got Shroud for the CDR, since getting off multiple Pulverizes in a team fight is crucial).
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I'm really enjoying having Shen/Rammus on my team recently. I don't know if that's due to the shift in metagame or whatnot, but they're where you need them to be more often.
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Wow, that is the worlds best Zilean, and he needs a fucking nerf.
Nothing like getting a free guardian angel every couple minutes for any character on their team.
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On May 20 2010 16:13 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Wow, that is the worlds best Zilean, and he needs a fucking nerf.
Nothing like getting a free guardian angel every couple minutes for any character on their team.
Try every 30 seconds. lol
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Does rewind refresh his ult too?
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Yep >.>
Liking Kennen more and more. He's just so mobile, and can farm like a madman as long as you keep his AP high enough. This results in him having creepscores comparable to heimer by the time the game ends.
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I think they should remove rewind refreshing his ultimate.
But in other news, which of you is soloside and which of you was... shaco... sorry! I forgot your sn. But that was a sick run of games we had. Shaco/Veigar/Cho carry, straight up.
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On May 20 2010 18:56 Juicyfruit wrote:
Yep >.>
Liking Kennen more and more. He's just so mobile, and can farm like a madman as long as you keep his AP high enough. This results in him having creepscores comparable to heimer by the time the game ends.
The problem with AP Kennen is that unless he's massively fed, his damage (relative to enemies' health) takes a pretty big dive towards the late game- Slicing Maelstrom is still decent, but unless you get a lot of energy back from stunning people, he'll be energy starved and mostly just using Shuriken with the occasional Surge.
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On May 20 2010 16:13 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Wow, that is the worlds best Zilean, and he needs a fucking nerf.
Nothing like getting a free guardian angel every couple minutes for any character on their team.
who :O
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speaking of Zilean...
I played some game last night where we had shitty team comp and our Shen DCed at like 3 minutes and he was taking our solo side lane, so I decided it was time to play Locket Ashe, lol. So yea, we 4v5 with Locket Ashe and get rolled and everyone's giving me loads of shit for getting locket on ashe, especially the other team's Zilean, but really I don't care... we were down a man, with no tank vs. a competent team. We had no chance so I felt like being silly.
So then I play another one, go Ashe again with the intent to build like a normal, self respecting human being, but then after my Ashe pick, my team goes Pantheon, Poppy, Pirate, and Kassadin, so I've already thrown in the towel and conceded the game cause that's pretty much the shittiest possible team comp, lol. And whaddya know, same Zil's on the other team. So I decide at the loading screen that I'm just going to talk shit to that Zil all game about how Locket is the best first item on Ashe and how he's a scrub and then if the game is spiraling out of control one way or the other, I'm going to get Locket again to keep trolling this fucker. So then my team gets FB and is up like 12/3 during early laning, so I just go straight for catalyst -> LW -> Locket, talking shit to zil in public speak all game while he feeds to a record of like 1/12 or something. Later I sell my Last Whisper to buy wit's end so that my final build is Locket, Boots of Mobility, Wit's End, Madred's Bloodrazor, Zeal.
I think it's a pretty pro build and I'm sure everyone in that game will be spreading the word of how awesome a locket ashe with that build is cause I ended with some impossibly good score like 6/9 or something. So yea, if you see Locket Ashes with Wit's End dominating every game you're in until Riot nerfs it, that's totally my fault and I'm sorry for letting the cat out of the bag :p.
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Zilean actually got nerfed a while ago. You used to be able to get his ult back every ~23 seconds now I think it's like 29-30 seconds at best. Bummer 
Alistar's immobile and has trouble initiating (because he's slow so he'll just get kited, messing you and your team up) without summoner spells being up (Ghost/Flash) but he's the only tank in the game that's literally almost impervious (late-game tanks drop like flies vs strong DPS... with the sole exception of Alist) and he needs no items to do it.
That perk is offset by his terribad farming.
He's still the best pure tank in the game but his lack of mobility, the difficulty initiating with him, and his complete and utter lack of farming power makes him "so-so" now. Shen is definitely far better (plus Feint does essentially what Alist's ult does) at the moment.
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On May 21 2010 00:45 Southlight wrote:Zilean actually got nerfed a while ago. You used to be able to get his ult back every ~23 seconds now I think it's like 29-30 seconds at best. Bummer Alistar's immobile and has trouble initiating (because he's slow so he'll just get kited, messing you and your team up) without summoner spells being up (Ghost/Flash) but he's the only tank in the game that's literally almost impervious (late-game tanks drop like flies vs strong DPS... with the sole exception of Alist) and he needs no items to do it. That perk is offset by his terribad farming. He's still the best pure tank in the game but his lack of mobility, the difficulty initiating with him, and his complete and utter lack of farming power makes him "so-so" now. Shen is definitely far better (plus Feint does essentially what Alist's ult does) at the moment.
late-game Shen vs. DPS frequently sucks. Shen is just too fucking good.
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What happened to Zilean is they rebalanced Rewind. Previously, it affected itself, so the cooldown was really long at low levels and something like 2 seconds at level 5 with max CDR. Now, it's 18 instead of like 40 (then -10 for effectively 30) at level one, but 3.2 at level 5 with max CDR.
His ult now is up every (140 * .6) / 13.2 * 3.2 = a little over 20 seconds.
NOTE: may be up to 10secs longer since this math treats rewind as a constant -CDR rather than an immediate reduction; also assumes use of Rewind immediately when it's up.
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oh god oh god, AP shaco is, too, much, fun.
So gonna buy him next time I get the IP avaible
What do you guys suggest for runes/item build ?
(so far I use full AP glyphs, flat hp zeals, flat hp quints, attack damage runes)
so far I open with golem kill with AP tome and HP potion. then I go for philophosers stone -> sheen -> boots1 -> mejai -> sorc boots -> lich bane -> abyssal's -> zhonya's.
skills i go WQEEEREQEWRWWWQRQQ
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Shaco drives me crazy. He can gank like a madman, have a massively positive ratio, and still he gets to the end game and is a worthless fuck who makes me want to punch my computer screen.
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On May 21 2010 03:17 Iplaythings wrote:
oh god oh god, AP shaco is, too, much, fun.
So gonna buy him next time I get the IP avaible
What do you guys suggest for runes/item build ?
(so far I use full AP glyphs, flat hp zeals, flat hp quints, attack damage runes)
so far I open with golem kill with AP tome and HP potion. then I go for philophosers stone -> sheen -> boots1 -> mejai -> sorc boots -> lich bane -> abyssal's -> zhonya's.
skills i go WQEEEREQEWRWWWQRQQ
I'd imagine armor pen (or magic pen, don't know which one AP Shaco cares about most) marks would translate into more damage than AD marks.
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EPT
