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On May 18 2010 10:34 oberon wrote:Why? I mean, I know it looks insane, but CD reduction is great on Fiddle (more fear is always good, and it makes jungling buffs faster), and one of Fiddle's biggest issues is being FFed, especially when storming in. If the other team is DPS heavy, it seems like a reasonable counter. The active just makes you even better for AoE blasting teamfights, which is one of Fiddle's main jobs. first off, the bolded part is bullshit. by the time you have omen you shouldn't have a problem with jungling anyways. seconldy, if you're really worried about CDR then frozen heart does just as much but gives more CDR and an arguably better passive. third, CDR is overrated IMO. with flat CDRs and 9/0/21 (staple of most casters), omen will reduce terrify cdr from 10.64 to 8.77. those aren't amazing benefits (<2 second CDR reduc) for the ridiculous price you're paying. i'd rather get a zhonyas and do invincible crowstorm with massively higher damage.
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On May 18 2010 09:59 redtooth wrote:
phreak is bad too. some of solomid players (elementz in particular) are still cool. reginald is a bitch.
yeah omen on fiddle is a bad idea.
also the "metagame" change southlight is always talking about is making kat a better and better mid. her midgame burst damage makes her a great ganker so she can roam like a boss. haunting guise + Q gives her a pretty decent selfheal too.
Am I the only one who thinks that Kat is the strongest mid in the game? Shunpo and Bouncing Blade are really strong harass moves and Death Lotus/KI make it really hard to stay in the lane if you're under around 50% hp.
Also, and this is unrelated to your post, as much as I respect the whole 5 man premade thing, there are players in this thread that are really good and just don't play 10 games a day. Just because the win ratio and amount isn't super high doesn't mean we're not good at the game. Lots of us queue with players who are way worse because hey, we want to play with friends, and when we do, we don't take it super seriously because we don't care about our records, and it's not like the game is 1v1 anyway. If your team sucks, there's nothing you can do about it.
I still stand by my claim that I'm the sickest chogath in the game :D.
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Suppose that I am nidalee, playing mid, and I decide to go to the sidelanes because my teammates are getting pushed quite hard. There's almost no chance of getting a kill because my enemies are full HP, but I can at least hurt one enough to force them to warp back or at least blow some summoner spells. Is it worth going for it?
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It depends on what you're trading for it. Do you have to fountain afterwards? Will mid push your tower? Will you be able to push side lane?
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Kat is most definitely one of the best mids. She can threaten almost anybody, and the people she can't threaten, she can outfarm.
Assuming Kat gets ignite, of course, which she should, 100% of the time.
Edit: Btw, what is the cost effectiveness of regrowth pendent vs just buying 12 health pots?
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Regen pendant is a better choice for keeping you topped off, potions are better if you expect to face burst. But you should never buy 12 :D.
I'm so pissed right now. I was just saying how people queue with a bunch of noobs and lose but it just happened to me every game I played today. None of them ever take a tank or support so I'm stuck playing cho and they force mid on me so I'm stuck side-laning as the only CC or tank on our side. Eventually i say fuck it and go trist and who's mid? Ryze, raping my shit with his burst. Jesus christ.
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12 health pot (at 200 HP each) = 2400 HP healed.
Regrowth pendent heals you 15HP/5sec. That averages to 3 per sec. You'll get the same benefits as 12 health pots over 800 seconds assuming you're never at full HP, which is 13 minutes. I don't see regrowth pendent being of any value after 13 minutes. So I am wondering if it's REALLLLLLLLY better if you don't plan on doing anything with it afterwards.
Edit: on second thought, I suppose you could sell it, and it make it far more cost-effective. Yeah
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Honestly, kat won't touch a decent Sivir in mid, nor will most other champs.
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On May 18 2010 21:02 fspikec wrote:
Honestly, kat won't touch a decent Sivir in mid, nor will most other champs.
Sivir's range has been nerfed into the ground and most champs rape her mid now, and Kat is ridiculously strong with burst and escape. Sivir has sustained damage and pushing abilities, but her burst is shit. Boomerang hits twice at best and that's her only nuke. Saying something like that is a pretty good indicator that you're a baddie.
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Kat is definitely insane solo mid. When I go Kat mid I'm always super confident I'll destroy whoever I'm against (unless it's another Kat).
Except for Heimerdinger. That matchup blows.
Randuin costs so much I don't even recommend it for TANKS. The item blows. If you're worried about slowing people on Fiddle just get Rylai ffs.
^-- edit: except for Rammus. DefCurl + Randuin is pretty funny.
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On May 18 2010 17:45 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I still stand by my claim that I'm the sickest chogath in the game :D.
I'd like to see you prove it, mostly because I might pick up a trick or two  .
Now for some more Cho'Gath remarks and questions:
Also, in this thread on runeterra, there iss a discussion going regarding who's the best for mid, and Cho'Gath got no love whatsoever, while he simply destroys many champions on mid who usually take it, like Ashe, Twisted Fate or Tristana. Twisted Fate has to be the easiest matchup ever for Cho, at least the few TF's I've encountered on mid were a complete joke for Cho. Is Cho'Gath so undervalued because simply so few people actually play him? And I know he's far from top tier, but you'd think his capacity to make a carry's life so miserable would get some respect.
And besides the rupture aiming, what exactly makes him so hard? Though rupture alone makes it hard enough, because missing a rupture, especially in a team fight, wastes so much damage and spikey slowing nastiness. And long cooldowns on all active spells make every spell fired count for so much more I'd guess.
And huzzah for the upcoming Feast buff, at least one won't feel so horribly small after death now, and it eliminates part of his problem with tanking, to wit, the loss of health upon death.
Also, Cho eats raw faces for breakfast on TT, with a glass of orphan's tears as beverage and lamentations of the enemy's women as background music. (even with my relatively limited experience).
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No, Cho actually gets hulk-smashed by the majority of competent mid players, including heroes. As has been numerously mentioned in this thread, TF after his rework a month or two ago is a dreadful, dreadful solo mid. So dreadful, in fact, that he even loses to the nerfed Sivir, who is on my list of top most worst heroes to go mid.
Cho should never beat Trist or Ashe, both of whom outrange him too much. Not to mention the Ezreals and Kats and Nidalees of the world.
He's hard because it's hard to balance being a threat and actually doing "his job," which is to tank. You can't tank if they don't attack you because you're not worth attacking. And you also can't tank if you die in 2 seconds.
It's why I mention he's a "whatever" hero, in that he's neither ranged DPS, a ranged nuker, nor a tank. He's essentially an off-tank nuker support, which is okay but in comparison to other top-tier "support" heroes he's got a lot less utility.
Edit:
It's also why I keep saying the biggest pro of Cho is his massive AoE silence that can swing a teamfight if you nail a whole team in it.
That's not to say he "sucks" per se. Just yesterday I had a Cho (granted, I laned with him with Janna against a stupid solo Sion who got his face bashed in) semi-carry us to a win. It happens.
Edit2:
I guess my big pet-peeve is how people argue a certain hero is viable mid because they smash TF. Newsflash, guys. For at least the past month or two, TF has been one of the single worst laning heroes in the game. Congratulations you defeated a terribly weak hero in laning phase!
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On May 18 2010 02:50 Mogwai wrote:
I'm about ready to punch a baby if those armor penetration changes go through \o/. wtf are they thinking!?!?!?!?
They are not.
Brackhar posted:
Thanks for all the feedback on the new penetration system. A number of you raised some very credible issues with the current system, and after listening to the volume of feedback on the topic we've decided to pull the new system from the build. Gathering opinions so we can make tough decisions like this is exactly what the PTR is for, and it's great to see the number of insightful posts that analyzed both the new and old paradigm. We at Riot really care about the opinion of our players, so thanks once again for letting us know how you feel in a constructive manner.
Many of you pointed out flaws in the old system that we'll attempt to address slowly going forward. Below contains a small list of the issues we'll be looking into over the next few patches:
1. Swap the order that flat penetration and % penetration are applied so that it is more difficult to reduce someone to 0 defenses.
2. Increase the cost of Last Whisper if the above change doesn't have a large enough effect on its balance.
3. Improve attack speed itemization so that there are more, better options than solely the ones with penetration.
4. Improve the % penetration itemization.
5. Potentially modify flat penetration runes so they are more effective against tanks/end game.
If and when all of these issues will be implemented is still up in the air, but I tried to order them in the priority I expect they'll be addressed. And, as always, we'll encourage feedback from our community at each step along the way.
They were aiming to make Armor/Magic Penetration a counterstat instead of just one of the best Damagestats.
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On May 18 2010 21:21 Southlight wrote:
^-- edit: except for Rammus. DefCurl + Randuin is pretty funny.
But Tremors + Zhonyas is more fun ^_^
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Pantheon's godly mid. He's like Kat, but they have to start worrying about dying under 50% at level 3 instead of level 6.
EDIT: zomg, that's great news. so happy they actually listened to us in the PTR ^_^.
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Oh, that's cool o/ Thanks for the update :D
On May 19 2010 00:01 hasuprotoss wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2010 21:21 Southlight wrote:
^-- edit: except for Rammus. DefCurl + Randuin is pretty funny. But Tremors + Zhonyas is more fun ^_^
Indeed.
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oh sweet, adds for some game called League of Legends up top! sounds fun :p
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Been seeing that since yesterday, it was really confusing at first.
I really think the nerf they needed to make on Janna was to give Howling Gale at least a minimum cast time, but whatever. I fear an overnerf incoming  Running around last night with KawaiiRice playing Zilean/Janna was pretty funny though. The sheer map control and unkillableness was nasty.
Edit:
Also loved how they ragged on their Udyr. No, no, your Udyr was actually good, managed to fight off the constant warding and jungle-stealing, too. Stats would look much better if Janna and Zilean didn't rob him of so many kills :D
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gogo Nidalee faceroll to 6/0/6!
are they ever going to actually nerf her?
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On May 18 2010 10:32 oberon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2010 09:55 ichangedmyname wrote:
Fiddle doesn't scale very well off AP
Really? +2.4, +3.5, +1.75 isn't scaling well with AP? Yes, it requires maximum time/bounces to get that, so it's usually lower, but even half that is best-in-the-game scaling. In other news, your RoA advice contradicts your AP advice -- if you don't care much about AP, why not build that catalyst into veil? Anyway, I appreciate your attempt to help, but I'm looking for people who have actually tried those items, not theorycrafting.
Fiddle doesn't scale well off AP. Dark wind is about the silence, not the damage. His drain requires your opponent to sit in it, meanwhile you are completely vulnerable. And his ult does enough damage, its much more important to get all the damage from your ult with magic pen than it is to add another couple hundred damage but have most of it mitigated.
Also, the RoA is for the HP and mana, not the AP. Its one of the best items in the game for casters, and catalyst is still hands down the best item for mid game laning.
@ whoever said phreak was bad: Hate bandwagon for his champion spotlights maybe? How many times have you played with him. He's amazingly smart. I do agree with you elementz is cool, but thats about it.
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EPT
