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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On March 24 2010 01:33 Southlight wrote: I actually think proper T3s make a gigantic difference, but carry on :p I think masteries are a much bigger deal, but runes definitely matter. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On March 24 2010 01:33 Southlight wrote: I actually think proper T3s make a gigantic difference, but carry on :p Yea, I mean, they make a big difference, especially early. But by the end game, you usually don't feel your runes all that much. All I'm really getting at is that slight edge you'd get from spending early IP on T1 runes doesn't seem to be worth how much it would slow down your completion of T3 rune pages. On March 24 2010 01:50 oberon wrote: I think masteries are a much bigger deal, but runes definitely matter. I'd say Runes > Masteries, but it's close. Masteries tend to be less specialized, but the value per point tends to be higher than the value per rune, you're just capped from being able to focus particularly well in masteries. But on the flipside, some particular masteries are very efficient per point compared to runes (such as the level 21 masteries, the 15% magic penetration, nimbleness, etc). Where that analysis falls apart is on the very efficient runes like armor penetration and dodge. You can put up to 9 marks or seals in those, and armor penetration is about as efficient in runes as it is in points (1.96 vs. 2), but you can only invest 3 in masteries, and dodge is actually more efficient in runes (0.75% vs. 0.5%). That's pretty much the whole reason why I think runes > masteries. | ||
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Unentschieden
Germany1471 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
I don't see how it's possible to not see the similarities between them... Yes, the layout is different for them, and one is free and the other must be bought, but they have readily apparent parallels too. | ||
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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briann
United States121 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On March 24 2010 06:10 briann wrote: hmm who to buy Evelynn or Veigar as a first hero no lol, if you're really set on one of them, Veigar. They're both pretty meh though. Veigar is certainly the better of the two. | ||
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briann
United States121 Posts
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
O and Anivia. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Unentschieden
Germany1471 Posts
On March 24 2010 05:06 Mogwai wrote: well, like, for comparisson, you can do 6.75% dodge, 18 armor pen, 1.35 MRpL, and 97 HP from runes. Shooting for similar bonuses from masteries would result is like, 2% increased crit chance, improved exhaust, 3% reduced CDs, 6 Armor pen, 6 MR, 6 Armor, 2% dodge, nimbleness, 2 flat damage redux, 60 Health, and improved cleanse or something. The net worth of the two packages is probably pretty close on paper, but runes are just much more focused. You are discussing it like you´d have to choose. Runes are obviously better because you have to spend IP on them. If you had to chose between them you´d take Runes but in reality you use both no matter how good they are relative to each other. | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On March 24 2010 06:21 Southlight wrote: Annie and Ryze are the best nukers. O and Anivia. Umm...Fiddlesticks is better than any of those. Annie and Anivia are both playable (though I think Annie is better). Ryze is mediocre at best -- Veigar is substantially better (better CC). | ||
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
Ryze's AoE nuking power is ridiculous, the top damage-dealing caster in the game I think. | ||
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briann
United States121 Posts
Poll: who should i buy first (Vote): Veiger (Vote): Twisted Fate (Vote): Fiddlesticks (Vote): Ryze | ||
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
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briann
United States121 Posts
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
Rundown of heroes: Annie is the best nuker in the game, because she has essentially an AoE stun on-call, and if you don't die (which you shouldn't) you can AoE stun twice+ in one fight. Ryze is the nuker that deals the most damage in the game, as his ult + AoE is pretty sickening if they're too bunched up (which they will be a good number of times). But he has no reliable disable and it makes him very vulnerable to ganker heroes. Fiddle's hard as hell to use but he's a top-5 hero because he has two godly disables and a very strong battle-swinging ult. TF got reworked into a ranged DPS hero. Veigar is an okay nuker but he's more like a spellcasting carry, which is really counterproductive because you might as well have an actual carry (Veigar needs to farm with Q to become strong late-game). Now with Merc Tread spam you'll almost never get the Meteor + Stun combo working, so the reliability of Meteor (your #1 damage spell) plummets, and most games end at like level 12 so you won't get there anyways. Edit: Just to be clear, I'm just voting the Annie route because she's bar-none one of the best, and most viable nukers throughout, she's simple, and she's a good placeholder until you really figure out what your playstyle is etc. etc. | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On March 24 2010 07:50 Southlight wrote: Unless you get focused, which you will. Annie's skills don't have much range.Good enough that you're at a disadvantage without, which you'll especially feel matched up against someone else playing the same hero at a competent level :p Rundown of heroes: Annie is the best nuker in the game, because she has essentially an AoE stun on-call, and if you don't die (which you shouldn't) you can AoE stun twice+ in one fight. Ryze is the nuker that deals the most damage in the game, as his ult + AoE is pretty sickening if they're too bunched up (which they will be a good number of times). But he has no reliable disable and it makes him very vulnerable to ganker heroes. Fiddle's hard as hell to use but he's a top-5 hero because he has two godly disables and a very strong battle-swinging ult. TF got reworked into a ranged DPS hero. Veigar is an okay nuker but he's more like a spellcasting carry, which is really counterproductive because you might as well have an actual carry (Veigar needs to farm with Q to become strong late-game). Now with Merc Tread spam you'll almost never get the Meteor + Stun combo working, so the reliability of Meteor (your #1 damage spell) plummets, and most games end at like level 12 so you won't get there anyways. Edit: Just to be clear, I'm just voting the Annie route because she's bar-none one of the best, and most viable nukers throughout, she's simple, and she's a good placeholder until you really figure out what your playstyle is etc. etc. I find Annie harder to play than Fiddle. I have used all of the above champions as my main during one week or another. | ||
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Southlight
United States11766 Posts
Fiddle takes the most intuition, as you have to expect where the enemy will be, and have the confidence and quick-thinking to kill or at least disrupt heavily before you die. Some people will be naturally better at it than others. I find him impossible to play. Some people find him very simple. Pretty much everyone agrees he's a lot less "textbook" to play than almost every other hero. For instance, with Annie you stun, nuke, nuke, run around, rinse repeat. Fiddle it's like wellllll if they're bunched up you can silence them when you think it'll bounce, and you can fear+drain some people if you use that build, etc. etc. | ||
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