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Personal attacks in this thread will draw a temp ban. |
On June 14 2011 09:12 Mailing wrote:What do you expect? He leaves on ladder, because 2 bunkers on his ramp isn't something that can happen in a tourney. Theres no reason to play it out. Boxer did a CHEESE, not a PRESSURE. 2 rax bunker on ramp is a pressure on ladder, it requires no luck to pull off. Boxer did a build that would of failed MISERABLY if idras drone saw the 2rax 20 seconds earlier. He rolled the dice idra wouldn't see it and it worked. That's what a real cheese is, a gamble to get you a lead. In the second game, he cheesed AGAIN, but idra found it and held it off, as well as the hellions. Boxer just had a good timing to attack from the choke with siege tanks 1 minute before brood lords were finished. If he had waited even 30 seconds more, IdrA would have 6-7 brood lords during that big attack and would have EASILY held it. It was a close game.
Clearly you dont watch many boxer games, and clearly you didnt watch the second game, boxers 2 rax proxy is standard play for him. He transitions out of it flawlessly most of the time whether it fails or not. It doesnt put him behind even if it doesnt do any damage, i dont see how its any different from 2 rax aside fromm the position of the baracks, and if it looks like its going to do no damage, just lift off and go home.
Sure if you were talking about a protoss doing a 2 gate proxy, that is very all in and would set yoou far behind if no damage was done. 2 rax no matter what you are forcing units out of the zerg, and you can easily expand behind it. In no way is Boxers style of 2 rax a cheese, even in the first game when he commited to it fairly hard, once idras lings where cutting off reinforcements he didnt even send anymore units he picked up his barracks and went home after sending 6 marines 2 idras base, and they were put in 2 bunkers, he was back at home preparing for an expansion and he did not expect to win there, he expected idra to do the proper thing wich would have been too build a spine crawler move it up and take out the bunkers by doing this boxer would have salvaged the bunkers and tried to escape as idra had more than enough lings to take on 6 marines not in bunkers.
Honestly there are lots of people who play 2 rax proxy as a straight up cheese, or even people that play 2 rax like that (and bring all their scv's and what have you) boxer is not one of them.
Even idra wouldnt call that a cheese, he is always complaining about how terran can do pressure builds like 2 rax and it doesnt set them behind in anyway and they can transition out of it very easily.
It does no damage? send home your marines youve been making scv's at home and you prepare for an expansion.....
Alot of times boxer will do a proxy racks puprosely where they can see it just so they overeact and he picks up and goes home. If he scouts and he sees he can do damage he goes for it, but in no way would i call his proxy 2 rax a cheese. Off 1 base you can support alot more than 2 rax pumping out 2 marines at a time, so getting an expansion up is quite easy. Im suprised idra lost to such a simple build usually it can set zerg players slightly behind but its pretty easy to deal with.
Look at nestea on crossfire against top, he got way behind, idra would have left in a second, nestea on the other hand, sticks it out fromm a hugely unfavorable position and ends up winning.
Even in the game on belshir beach, he had a chance to come back, it wasnt impossible and he almost did it.
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Let's not fool ourselves, if top had kept making marines and just sent them in he would have rolled nestea on belshir beach, instead he went into his macro mode he's so familiar with after his pressure did way more damage then expected. but that's not a conversation for this thread...
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On June 15 2011 15:00 purpose wrote:
There are alot of reason people who hate Idra come here. First of Idra is a very bm player and he is often involved in flames and stuff on his stream and out in tourneys (huk, cruncher etc). People come here to read about it since this is the best place to go.
Also Idra stands out being who he is. You cant deny that he has a attitude and almost an arrogance that makes him an easy target for haters. Add in the fact that he consider himself as one of the absolut best players but he never really won anything big, and that will of course bring even more haters.
I still don't think that those are particularly good reasons for coming to a fan club thread. Maybe there needs to be an Idra anti-fan club thread then so you guys can hang out there and bitch about him? I understand why some people dislike him and I'm not questioning it but I still don't feel a fan club thread is the appropriate place for dissing a player. You don't have to respect Idra at all but you should respect that this is a thread for fans not anti-fans.
Anyway I don't want to stir shit up anymore so I'll leave it at that.
Question- Is there any chance of Idra playing against TT1 in this NASL?
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im just reading this thread and out of no where cheesemaster responds to a post from a few pages back. btw i think cheesemaster is right. Boxer wasn't all in and the pressure, although it had to cut scvs, is almost guaranteed to do damage or force non drones out of larva.
And yeah, people might as well make an IdrA Hateclub. It'd be pretty funny to read.
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On June 15 2011 17:27 Aranaukin wrote:
Let's not fool ourselves, if top had kept making marines and just sent them in he would have rolled nestea on belshir beach, instead he went into his macro mode he's so familiar with after his pressure did way more damage then expected. but that's not a conversation for this thread...
Agreed, although he didnt and i wouldnt just expect nestea to GG assuming that top would have done that. Its not like top stopped making marines anyways but if he had made more barracks and commited to doing that i suppose you are right.
Your right though, a discussion for a different time and place.
back on topic, ive always been on the verge of being an idra fan, and then he does something to piss me off or just does something to show that he doesnt give a shit. Some people like that i guess, but i find it childish, hes a very good analyst but then on the other hand the way he talks about balance is obnoxious and immature, he has good and bad qualities (that are very accentuated) but for me the bad usually seems to outweigh the good in idras case.
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Oh shit I have a report button now  1 year on TL with no bans/warns, I feel privileged. Time to start using this bad boy (responsibly of course).
Honestly if you have something negative to say about IdrA say it elsewhere, Unless you really are a fan and are just venting concerns. I was guilty of this during MLG with the MMA game 1.
I'm almost 100% positive no one wants to hear my life story but your going to get a bit. I am a Cleveland Browns fans and as such I have had well over my fair share of disappointment. As an IdrA fan I feel this same urge to want to kill something adorable more often than I should for a person of his skill level. It is ok to get frustrated but I can tell a few people in here are not fans at all and their main goal is to troll.
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On June 15 2011 17:33 Whole wrote:
im just reading this thread and out of no where cheesemaster responds to a post from a few pages back. btw i think cheesemaster is right. Boxer wasn't all in and the pressure, although it had to cut scvs, is almost guaranteed to do damage or force non drones out of larva.
And yeah, people might as well make an IdrA Hateclub. It'd be pretty funny to read.
lol woah i must have clicked on the wrong page then, i thought that was from only 1 page back, ah well its still only fromm a day or 2 ago 
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^except the whole concept of a hateclub is ridiculous. if people want to flame and yell, go to reddit or 4chan
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On June 15 2011 17:51 L3g3nd_ wrote:
^except the whole concept of a hateclub is ridiculous. if people want to flame and yell, go to reddit or 4chan
Which is why the "brilliant" concept of a Cruncher or Major FAN club came up, so they could shit all over IdrA (who cruncher just beat) and InControl (who Major beat) and also the reason their "fan" clubs stagnate around page 30 with the occasional grats on a ultimately meaningless win.
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Who's the mod who made the sticky up top? that has got to be the most retarded logic I've ever seen.
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On June 15 2011 18:07 SweetAs wrote:
Who's the mod who made the sticky up top? that has got to be the most retarded logic I've ever seen.
Dissing the mod isn't a good idea, just like dissing idra isn't a good idea lol!!
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On June 15 2011 18:07 SweetAs wrote:
Who's the mod who made the sticky up top? that has got to be the most retarded logic I've ever seen.
Ask him yourself in a minute lol.
Basically if you are a real fan it is ok to critique his games, but most come to hate/troll.
TL;DR Don't say negative things about IdrA in his fan club.
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Dunno if it has been mentioned before. However, there's a 30 min interview with IdrA and Machine by AskJoshy on youtube, if you guys haven't seen it yet. Also a video of them showing off their gaming gear.
http://www.youtube.com/user/AskJoshy
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On June 14 2011 14:50 Pietro wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2011 11:16 Fubi wrote:
Early 2 rax pressure is a perfectly standard opening for TvZ, why are people complaining it's a cheese? It's not the Terran's fault the zerg dies to the pressure That's like saying "I shot him, but it's not my fault he died!" Also 2 rax pressure would be fine, if it wouldn't be built in the middle of the map. If you would see a zerg proxy hatch or protoss proxy gate, would you still call that pressure?
If proxy hatch or proxy gate can lift off and go back to your base and then transition back into normal build 99% of the time without being at a disadvantage even when it failed, then yes, it isn't a cheese.
And your analogy makes no sense in respect to SC. A better one would be, if a zerg did a pool first into hatchery build, sends his first 6 scouting zerglings into a protoss's base, and the protoss went fast void rays without getting a zealot to block off his ramp. The 6 zerglings kills a bunch of probes, then the Zerg realize it's an opportunity and makes few more lings to send them in. Then the protoss gg's. So can the toss complain it's a cheese? Clearly not, as all the zerg did was one of the standard openers.
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Idra looks at Zerg standard play:
"Interesting, let's just have a play with this here and...."
Idra now doubles all other zergs food, upgrades, tech and bases at every point in the game.
What!?
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On June 15 2011 18:34 Chriscras wrote:![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zcuNa.png) 
Choking the pussy, his relationship is doomed  (A joke OFC for those who take this as srs bzns)
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"Someone like Destiny being bigger someone good"
Best quote ever
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I actually like IdrA, his playstyle and the fact that he's living his dream are things that I respect.
But sometimes ... I just fear that hes to harsh to himself and that that could cost him something huge someday.
But if that happens there'll be a lot of fans to back him up, keep fighting!
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On June 15 2011 17:02 MaleficOR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 14:48 SentinelSC2 wrote:On June 15 2011 14:07 tomatriedes wrote:
Do other fan clubs get so many hater invasions? It's so weird to me that people who don't like Idra keep coming here. I don't really like MKP and you know how many times I've looked at his fan club? Zero.
But yet people seem to think 'oh, I know what will be a good idea- I'll go to the Idra fan club and I'll write about all the things I don't like about Idra and then when anyone disagrees with me I'll accuse them all of being mindless sheep. Yeah that will be a really useful thing to do.' Bizarre. Cruncher fanclub comes to mind, mostly from people who are fans of Idra. Lets all be honest, the Cruncher "fan" club was started as an IdrA "Hate" club. Just like you see sixjax_Major "fan" club start up after he beats InControl, they are founded on the hate/dislike of another player more-so than the like of the actual player. IdrA has more fans than anyone in SC2. Like Wheat said "Either you love him or you love to hate him, either way you love him".
This isn't fair on Major because he is totally awesome and a lot of people genuinely like his play. Or at least I do.
On June 15 2011 17:08 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 17:02 MaleficOR wrote:On June 15 2011 14:48 SentinelSC2 wrote:On June 15 2011 14:07 tomatriedes wrote:
Do other fan clubs get so many hater invasions? It's so weird to me that people who don't like Idra keep coming here. I don't really like MKP and you know how many times I've looked at his fan club? Zero.
But yet people seem to think 'oh, I know what will be a good idea- I'll go to the Idra fan club and I'll write about all the things I don't like about Idra and then when anyone disagrees with me I'll accuse them all of being mindless sheep. Yeah that will be a really useful thing to do.' Bizarre. Cruncher fanclub comes to mind, mostly from people who are fans of Idra. Lets all be honest, the Cruncher "fan" club was started as an IdrA "Hate" club. Just like you see sixjax_Major "fan" club start up after he beats InControl, they are founded on the hate/dislike of another player more-so than the like of the actual player. IdrA has more fans than anyone in SC2. Like Wheat said "Either you love him or you love to hate him, either way you love him". apart from Day9's I guess, who's controversial in the opposite direction as he's like a Gandi who doesn't believe in counters or imbalance
It wasn't that long ago when Day9 was talking about imbalance openly.. Just listen to some old SotG episodes, for example. However, he has become aware of the fact that a lot of people/players - especially those who watch the D9D to learn and not to be entertained - jump on easy explanations instead of critically analysing and trying to find solutions, so he has to be more careful.
On June 15 2011 17:13 neocron wrote:
Cant wait to see IdrA and MC at the Homestorycup III chillin in one flat for four days :D
MC only does it for the show and Idra hardly cares, so I doubt it that anything entertaining will happen as long as there are no cameras around.
On June 15 2011 17:36 MaleficOR wrote:Oh shit I have a report button now 1 year on TL with no bans/warns, I feel privileged. Time to start using this bad boy (responsibly of course).
You'll find that most posts are reported already.. The problem is that the mods can't possibly do anything to help threads like this. Punishing people doesn't make things better and leaving it as it is won't help either because of the amount of posters on TL these days.
post whatever negative comments about Idra you like, but if your post creates a furor and mucks up the thread, I will ban you.
I quite like this, actually. Unlike a lot of people here, I don't have a problem with negative posts about Idra. I also don't see the problem with a fan being critical of the player/team they support. However, most of the problems here are caused not by the regular haters but by some random guy who only ever posts once here - and it is usually something against the flow of discussion that has been repeated again and again by others.
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EPT
