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And I don't get where you're getting your elitism from. So you're saying that those of us who enjoy K-Pop, only enjoy it to be cool? To be part of a social group? You're claiming that it's the lowest form of music. That's cool. I don't like most 70s/80s music, you don't see me entering a '70s/80s music discussion thread' throwing my pretentiousness around.
I don't know why people in this thread constantly have to defend their tastes. There's a metal thread too, you know.
On December 17 2009 03:22 StarBrift wrote: They are pretty young girls with no apparent singing or dancing talent. Put them in a different society and they won't be stars in a million years. Because they don't have any remarkable talent.
On December 11 2009 16:54 StarBrift wrote: I can't believe so many people i this thread is discussing this as if it was actual music. THe thread started out hillariously (and rightfully) about how extremely bad K-pop is in all aspects. Atleast the music that mainstream korean idiot kids listen to.
Korea has had alot of good singers in the past but none of them bitched out and went for this plastic fake fucking shit. A lot of male singers doing ballads whom I can not name and Younha come to mind. It's still pop music but it's not "Act like a disoriented idiotic 14 year old girl and giggle your way through music videos" style.
This thread really confirms my theory that about 90% of people do not hear music as the rest of us. They just listen to it do be cool. What makes them cool is different based on where they come from and in which clicks they hang out. Basically 90% of people are posers.
what do you listen to
That's what I'm interested in since it is apparently superior to every single Korean young person's taste and 90% of the world's populations' preferences as well. HOSHIT. Only 10% of the world has the 'correct' listening skills to appreciate 'real' music. We must look to our new musical savior Starbrift to tell us how to reform our terrible poser habits of liking music that deviates from his personal taste. What happened to the joy of finding a new genre that you enjoy? Does one's personal evolution in musical taste/exposure immediately make a person a 'poser'? If so then I am one of the biggest posers on the planet. Heaven help music journalists....
Also it's 'hilariously' and 'cliques' - if you're going to be a condescending ass-hat/our musical redeemer then at least try and spell your narrow-minded ramblings correctly. Only being able to name drop a single artist implies that really Starbrift hasn't got the slightest clue what he's going on about in terms of the diversity of Korean music. From the more traditional genres such as Trot which are aimed at the senior generations to the globalizing influence of modern Hip Hop acts such as Epik High who are breaking down the boundaries of nationality and distance with projects like Map the Soul.
Basically if you don't like Korean music then don't post in this thread - stop raining on peoples' perfectly valid parade. We don't want your negativity.
One last thing - I've been a teacher of those so-called 'idiotic' Korean children and the majority of the ones I've come into contact through my profession have been sweet, caring and wonderful individuals. Their musical taste has no bearing on their levels of intelligence whatsoever. However, Starbrift's comments definitely seem to indicate he is lacking in certain areas such as tolerance and the notion of individuality in relation to musical (or otherwise.) inclinations.
(Hoo boy, scathing rants are pleasurable to write at times...)
In all fairness I was raging when I wrote my last post because I was banned from a starcraft stream earlier when pointing out (in a respectable way btw) that alot of people on the stream doesn't like K-pop and additionally that he might get banned if they continuously pump copyrighted material on their streams (this wasn't Solinren btw). oh the Irony. So yes my post was extreme and it doesn't really reflect what I think about K-pop or the people listening to it. But it's very obvious that I've struck a nerve here. You went straight into defensive mode and totally missed the point of my post.
The point being that when you listen to music because it makes you feel cool or it makes you part of a group of people then you are not listening to the music, you are signing up for a social network. A lot of people listen to music like this. It's the same thing as a large portion of black teenargers from urban areas listening to rap and young teen girls from the suburbs listening to pop music or young gamer guys blasting death metal to be anti mainstream. Alot of people listen to it just to be cool or part of a social group. This also happens all around the world. Even here in Sweden there are bandwagon mainstream music that kids listen to just because they are bombarded with it.
In my opinion this is all due to lack of variety in music. People around you tell you that one type of music is the best so you only listen to that. You don't even give other music a chance. As soon as you hear something else it's either uncool or boring. People often likes to think about their own life as being 100% chosen by themselves but in terms of music their culture chose for them, atleast for young people following the norm.
My beef with K-pop is that it's the lowest form of music. It's a product with fake vocals and bad dancing. Not unlike the talent shows from my early school years when 10 year old girls would dance the macarena and similar beginner class dances. This I think is the main point of why alot of K-pop is so bad. Everything from the vocals to the actual performances can be duplicated by just about any person in the stadium after maybe a week or rehearsing. Atleast when Christina aguilera disguists me with her happy pop and girlpower lyrics she's got one hell of a pipe to back it up. What do these girl bands have? Absolutely nothing. They are pretty young girls with no apparent singing or dancing talent. Put them in a different society and they won't be stars in a million years. Because they don't have any remarkable talent.
Obviously there is good korean music out there and especially very good korean vocals. Some of the singers in K-pop girl bands are even decent but then you have the other 5 who has 0 talent. If you don't understand what pisses me off about people with low talent getting famous and respected for musical accomplishments then I am at a loss for words. And yes I'm obviously aware that this shithole of a downwards spiral is taking place in alot of countries around the world.
As for my musical taste. I don't listen to genres so sorry I can't give you any advice on how to rip my musical taste apart. I listen to mostly 70s/ 80s / 90s music atm (the days when people still sang live and did it well).
Don't quite know what to say about you pointing out my spelling errors. I don't know if you're aware of this but the first language of people from Sweden is swedish, not english. I will take that criticism seriously the day you can write a full post in swedish without any mistakes in the grammar.
On December 11 2009 16:54 StarBrift wrote: Obviously there is good korean music out there and especially very good korean vocals. Some of the singers in K-pop girl bands are even decent but then you have the other 5 who has 0 talent. If you don't understand what pisses me off about people with low talent getting famous and respected for musical accomplishments then I am at a loss for words. And yes I'm obviously aware that this shithole of a downwards spiral is taking place in alot of countries around the world.
KPop is not about just the music...These stars are famous not solely for music. They may start out in music but lots of them eventually became idolized because of TV.
On December 11 2009 19:28 NeverGG wrote: Basically if you don't like Korean music then don't post in this thread - stop raining on peoples' perfectly valid parade. We don't want your negativity.
Is this too hard for you? Seriously what do you want from us? An explanation demanding why we listen to Kpop? I repeat again, We don't have to try and make you understand why we like Korean pop. Why do you want to understand? Either you like it or you don't...Why do you even care that we like Korean pop?
Can you leave us alone now so we can go listen to the "lowest form" of music now?
Oh the so called trash "K-Pop" people, Wonder Girls being the main example, actually is getting kinda appreciated here in the States
1. When it comes to dancing and singing (which is hard to begin with) I'm sure Koreans have it down to more of a science than other countries because THEY PERFORM EVERY FRACKING WEEK LIVE. Yes I remember when groups got busted for straight up lip-syncing back in the day. In eastern asian countries like Japan and Korea they can perform live like that because of how their country is built (kinda small, centralized, compared to USA).
2. No actual talent? Are you talking about natural because I can KINDA give it to you there. Although if you've noticed anything about the progaming scene for them its about their work ethic and development, and the same thing applies in the K-Pop scene as well.
Seriously the LOWEST form of music? Get the fuck out of here plz, Mr "I so know what real music is". You're complaining about getting banned from a stream, it probably was me for crying out loud, especially if you got the repeated banning treatment.
How did you come the conclusion that people like kpop cause they want to be cool? That doesn't make sense at all because KPop is a very small niche in Western Countries. Don't tell us that we haven't listened to a variety of music. I first heard Kpop 2 years ago.
Do you know KPop is probably the only genre of music where artists would have to perform live many times a week on national tv? They get tested all the time. In comparison, Western artists don't have to perform live. People just listen to albums that were made in studio. Western artists have plenty of opportunities to put in fake vocals.
On December 11 2009 16:54 StarBrift wrote: Obviously there is good korean music out there and especially very good korean vocals. Some of the singers in K-pop girl bands are even decent but then you have the other 5 who has 0 talent. If you don't understand what pisses me off about people with low talent getting famous and respected for musical accomplishments then I am at a loss for words. And yes I'm obviously aware that this shithole of a downwards spiral is taking place in alot of countries around the world.
KPop is not about just the music...These stars are famous not solely for music. They may start out in music but lots of them eventually became idolized because of TV.
This so much. I become a fan of groups/solo artists mostly through variety TV. The fact that they sing is practically just a bonus, and I'm pretty sure it's like this for most fans, especially of the idol groups. Their music might not be good (I don't even listen to full Korean albums lol, just the promoted singles), but as long as they are entertaining, I could care less.
cool AS posts. I'm not a fan of their songs and performances, but I did like So Young, who recently left the group for medical reasons. It's a good move imo since I thought her image didn't really mesh with AS. Here's two vids that shows that she's better off being cute than being sexy (lol)
On December 11 2009 16:54 StarBrift wrote: I can't believe so many people i this thread is discussing this as if it was actual music. THe thread started out hillariously (and rightfully) about how extremely bad K-pop is in all aspects. Atleast the music that mainstream korean idiot kids listen to.
Korea has had alot of good singers in the past but none of them bitched out and went for this plastic fake fucking shit. A lot of male singers doing ballads whom I can not name and Younha come to mind. It's still pop music but it's not "Act like a disoriented idiotic 14 year old girl and giggle your way through music videos" style.
This thread really confirms my theory that about 90% of people do not hear music as the rest of us. They just listen to it do be cool. What makes them cool is different based on where they come from and in which clicks they hang out. Basically 90% of people are posers.
what do you listen to
That's what I'm interested in since it is apparently superior to every single Korean young person's taste and 90% of the world's populations' preferences as well. HOSHIT. Only 10% of the world has the 'correct' listening skills to appreciate 'real' music. We must look to our new musical savior Starbrift to tell us how to reform our terrible poser habits of liking music that deviates from his personal taste. What happened to the joy of finding a new genre that you enjoy? Does one's personal evolution in musical taste/exposure immediately make a person a 'poser'? If so then I am one of the biggest posers on the planet. Heaven help music journalists....
Also it's 'hilariously' and 'cliques' - if you're going to be a condescending ass-hat/our musical redeemer then at least try and spell your narrow-minded ramblings correctly. Only being able to name drop a single artist implies that really Starbrift hasn't got the slightest clue what he's going on about in terms of the diversity of Korean music. From the more traditional genres such as Trot which are aimed at the senior generations to the globalizing influence of modern Hip Hop acts such as Epik High who are breaking down the boundaries of nationality and distance with projects like Map the Soul.
Basically if you don't like Korean music then don't post in this thread - stop raining on peoples' perfectly valid parade. We don't want your negativity.
One last thing - I've been a teacher of those so-called 'idiotic' Korean children and the majority of the ones I've come into contact through my profession have been sweet, caring and wonderful individuals. Their musical taste has no bearing on their levels of intelligence whatsoever. However, Starbrift's comments definitely seem to indicate he is lacking in certain areas such as tolerance and the notion of individuality in relation to musical (or otherwise.) inclinations.
(Hoo boy, scathing rants are pleasurable to write at times...)
In all fairness I was raging when I wrote my last post because I was banned from a starcraft stream earlier when pointing out (in a respectable way btw) that alot of people on the stream doesn't like K-pop and additionally that he might get banned if they continuously pump copyrighted material on their streams (this wasn't Solinren btw). oh the Irony. So yes my post was extreme and it doesn't really reflect what I think about K-pop or the people listening to it. But it's very obvious that I've struck a nerve here. You went straight into defensive mode and totally missed the point of my post.
The point being that when you listen to music because it makes you feel cool or it makes you part of a group of people then you are not listening to the music, you are signing up for a social network. A lot of people listen to music like this. It's the same thing as a large portion of black teenargers from urban areas listening to rap and young teen girls from the suburbs listening to pop music or young gamer guys blasting death metal to be anti mainstream. Alot of people listen to it just to be cool or part of a social group. This also happens all around the world. Even here in Sweden there are bandwagon mainstream music that kids listen to just because they are bombarded with it.
In my opinion this is all due to lack of variety in music. People around you tell you that one type of music is the best so you only listen to that. You don't even give other music a chance. As soon as you hear something else it's either uncool or boring. People often likes to think about their own life as being 100% chosen by themselves but in terms of music their culture chose for them, atleast for young people following the norm.
My beef with K-pop is that it's the lowest form of music. It's a product with fake vocals and bad dancing. Not unlike the talent shows from my early school years when 10 year old girls would dance the macarena and similar beginner class dances. This I think is the main point of why alot of K-pop is so bad. Everything from the vocals to the actual performances can be duplicated by just about any person in the stadium after maybe a week or rehearsing. Atleast when Christina aguilera disguists me with her happy pop and girlpower lyrics she's got one hell of a pipe to back it up. What do these girl bands have? Absolutely nothing. They are pretty young girls with no apparent singing or dancing talent. Put them in a different society and they won't be stars in a million years. Because they don't have any remarkable talent.
Obviously there is good korean music out there and especially very good korean vocals. Some of the singers in K-pop girl bands are even decent but then you have the other 5 who has 0 talent. If you don't understand what pisses me off about people with low talent getting famous and respected for musical accomplishments then I am at a loss for words. And yes I'm obviously aware that this shithole of a downwards spiral is taking place in alot of countries around the world.
As for my musical taste. I don't listen to genres so sorry I can't give you any advice on how to rip my musical taste apart. I listen to mostly 70s/ 80s / 90s music atm (the days when people still sang live and did it well).
Don't quite know what to say about you pointing out my spelling errors. I don't know if you're aware of this but the first language of people from Sweden is swedish, not english. I will take that criticism seriously the day you can write a full post in swedish without any mistakes in the grammar.
'My beef with K-pop is that it's the lowest form of music. It's a product with fake vocals and bad dancing. Not unlike the talent shows from my early school years when 10 year old girls would dance the macarena and similar beginner class dances. This I think is the main point of why alot of K-pop is so bad. Everything from the vocals to the actual performances can be duplicated by just about any person in the stadium after maybe a week or rehearsing.'
Again congratulations on proving you know absolutely nothing about Korean music. You just have to go look at any live performance by the ballad/pop group 2am or any pre-Heartbeat live from 2pm to see that many Korean idols have the high levels of talent which is basically demanded of them from both their management companies and the ruthless Korean netizens. What about more indies bands such as W&Whale or Humming Urban Stereo (who mix a huge amount of different languages into their songs.) How about Epik High and Seo Taiji who have both defined their own eras in Hip Hop and in Seo Taiji's case Pop/Rap/any genre he chooses to turn his hand to. It sounds as though you've listened to a tiny cross-section of the music available in Korea and damned it all in one go.
Some of these artists took years to debut (G-Dragon for example debuted age 12/13 with YG, but him and Taeyang took a further five years plus to get their own group. Also Jo Kwon was a trainee with JYP since he was 13 and didn't debut until around a year ago.) They spent large chunks of their youth practicing and preparing for debut so you have no right to suggest that idols work could be reproduced with only a small amount of time/no one actually in the studio. That's an ignorant over generalization that only serves to highlight your narrow minded and ill-informed views.
Korean teenagers aren't looking for some elevated form of high art when they listen to music. As the target demographic of Korean idol/pop music they want something fun, fresh and well choreographed to enjoy on a daily basis. They want big personalities to admire and fashionable images to look to for their own style inspiration. Their lives are dominated by the pressure to study and in many cases to conform to the ideas of their families so pop music provides not only a social network, but a release for them.
You're not the target demographic so stop acting as though Korean pop music is beneath you. It isn't directly intended for you because you are not a Korean who can purchase the CDs or go to the concerts. No one is forcing you to listen and no one wants to hear your opinions. We just want to discuss Kpop and other genres of Asian music in a positive and interesting light. Not make sweeping generalizations that only demonstrate our ignorance and low opinion of other people.
Yes here are groups and individual members who lack certain talents, but this is true of *all* countries who produce pop music. Anyway, I'd say TDLR much, but I don't want to get in trouble with the mods.
The bottom line is if you don't like it then don't post in here. We listen to Kpop because we enjoy it and you clearly do not so please return to your own genre of choice and leave us to discuss the genre we like.
Also and finally, for your information I too listen to 70s/80s/90s music (mainly from the US and England.) due to my upbringing. However, I am not so close-minded that I would dismiss an entire country and its prominent genre because of my clearly limited knowledge of it. Why don't you just chill out and try to experience the music of different countries without judging it so harshly.
(Okay, finished with this now. I won't be replying again because I refuse to justify my own taste in music.)
How do they not have talent? Sure not all of them do but when you see groups perform on stage they have the dance moves down so well that you don't even realize when someone who was singing moves in with the group to dance. And there are plenty of people who can sing.
Just like most people here I enjoy Kpop because of the live performances and TV programs. Because it shows that even though their idols and have worked hard to get where they are atm, their still human. They laugh, cry, care and love just like us. And shit like Jaebums story just breaks my hearth.
And listening to Kpop doesn't mean you listen to different kinds of music. I am from Mongolia and I listen to Mongolian music here and there, also I listen to Immortal Technique you prob never heard of any these artists / music so why are you judging? What makes your music so much better than this? Its matter of opinion.
Man shit like this piss me of and went on a rant... Sorry for the horrendous grammar since people here seems to care a little.
Let me repeat this again since repetition is the best way to learn and since your too dumb to know that people don't want you here. If you don't like Kpop then gtfo and let us be because we do.
On December 17 2009 07:46 broz0rs wrote: cool AS posts. I'm not a fan of their songs and performances, but I did like So Young, who recently left the group for medical reasons. It's a good move imo since I thought her image didn't really mesh with AS. Here's two vids that shows that she's better off being cute than being sexy (lol)
EPT
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