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On September 17 2013 14:46 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 12:40 RenSC2 wrote:On September 17 2013 12:26 Forikorder wrote:On September 17 2013 12:15 RenSC2 wrote:On September 17 2013 03:36 Sentenal wrote:On September 16 2013 11:53 RenSC2 wrote:On September 16 2013 11:24 Forikorder wrote:On September 16 2013 11:15 DODswe4 wrote:On September 16 2013 11:03 Forikorder wrote:On September 16 2013 05:13 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
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You could argue that Buggy or even Blueno don't use their fruits to their full potential, but the worst offender is obviously Foxy. how is Foxy the worst offender? the only reason he was even an opponent Luffy didnt one shot 3 seconds into the fight was because of hius creative use of his fruit its not about strenght but about if they are using their fruit to a good extent, and Foxy does not use it very well at all are we talking about the same Foxy? the dude from the wierd crown island thing where they had that wierd contest thing? its been a while since i read it but how is he supposed to use his fruit better? Noro noro beam opponent + slit throat = GG killshot Noro noro beam opponent + kairoseki handcuffs = captured DF user Unless there's some haki way to resist noro noro beams, the fruit truly was overpowered. I wonder if he'll come back someday. Foxy felt like such a filler arc character. I started off watching the anime and then went back and read the manga and was very surprised when Foxy actually showed up in the manga. He's definitely one that underused his fruit, partially due to his own physical weakness. There are many others that really barely scratched the surface of their fruit or completely underutilized it during the fight vs the Strawhats. Many characters could come back and be significantly more powerful if they trained as hard. Wtf, you wanted Foxy to go around slitting people's throats? Just what sort of manga do you want One Piece to be? Wait, this isn't Berserk? LOL. No, I never said that I wanted that to happen. Just that Foxy could use his fruit more effectively. He was a silly character and did silly things and that's fine in One Piece, but I disagreed with the notion that he used his fruit intelligently. He could be a lot scarier and more effective as a fighter if he was more brutal. aside from slitting a heelpless opponents throat (which we cant say for certain he can even do) i cant see how he could ahve gotten more mileage out of his fruit Okay, he can train up his ability so that it could hit a larger area. Then rather than play stupid games, he could use his beam on the enemy's ship before they know what ability he has. Then while the enemy's whole ship is nearly frozen, he can have his crew fire a huge amount of cannonballs at the ship. That way, no opponent will have the ability to defend their ship and any opposing ship will be sunk almost instantly. For any opposing crew trying to escape, he can noro noro beam them, and then have his crew tie something very heavy to each member to drag them down to the bottom. The only group this tactic wouldn't be effective against would be fishmen pirates. There was plenty he could have done if he was willing to be more brutal. I've just scratched the surface of it. Can't believe I'm having an argument over Foxy, last post from me on this topic. why do you assume his beam can be trained to hit larger area at alrger range? and when have we ever seen ship to ship combat between pirate sin OP?
Mihawk destroyed Don Kriegs armada in ship to ship combat.
The strawhats had a battle with Wapol and a battle with the salvage monkey brothers from the Jaya/the Mocktown island. They almost had a sea battle with Blackbeard, but they caught the knockup stream.
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FREEAGLELAND26780 Posts
that was actually sword to ship
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Mihawk did not leave his rowboat and I am willing to count his sword as armament of his floating nutshell.
God knows how he came back to East Blue from the Grand Line in that little thing.
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On September 17 2013 16:22 Mataza wrote:
Mihawk did not leave his rowboat and I am willing to count his sword as armament of his floating nutshell.
God knows how he came back to East Blue from the Grand Line in that little thing.
He's a hawk.
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On September 17 2013 15:11 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 14:46 Forikorder wrote:On September 17 2013 12:40 RenSC2 wrote:On September 17 2013 12:26 Forikorder wrote:On September 17 2013 12:15 RenSC2 wrote:On September 17 2013 03:36 Sentenal wrote:On September 16 2013 11:53 RenSC2 wrote:On September 16 2013 11:24 Forikorder wrote:On September 16 2013 11:15 DODswe4 wrote:On September 16 2013 11:03 Forikorder wrote:
[quote]
how is Foxy the worst offender? the only reason he was even an opponent Luffy didnt one shot 3 seconds into the fight was because of hius creative use of his fruit its not about strenght but about if they are using their fruit to a good extent, and Foxy does not use it very well at all are we talking about the same Foxy? the dude from the wierd crown island thing where they had that wierd contest thing? its been a while since i read it but how is he supposed to use his fruit better? Noro noro beam opponent + slit throat = GG killshot Noro noro beam opponent + kairoseki handcuffs = captured DF user Unless there's some haki way to resist noro noro beams, the fruit truly was overpowered. I wonder if he'll come back someday. Foxy felt like such a filler arc character. I started off watching the anime and then went back and read the manga and was very surprised when Foxy actually showed up in the manga. He's definitely one that underused his fruit, partially due to his own physical weakness. There are many others that really barely scratched the surface of their fruit or completely underutilized it during the fight vs the Strawhats. Many characters could come back and be significantly more powerful if they trained as hard. Wtf, you wanted Foxy to go around slitting people's throats? Just what sort of manga do you want One Piece to be? Wait, this isn't Berserk? LOL. No, I never said that I wanted that to happen. Just that Foxy could use his fruit more effectively. He was a silly character and did silly things and that's fine in One Piece, but I disagreed with the notion that he used his fruit intelligently. He could be a lot scarier and more effective as a fighter if he was more brutal. aside from slitting a heelpless opponents throat (which we cant say for certain he can even do) i cant see how he could ahve gotten more mileage out of his fruit Okay, he can train up his ability so that it could hit a larger area. Then rather than play stupid games, he could use his beam on the enemy's ship before they know what ability he has. Then while the enemy's whole ship is nearly frozen, he can have his crew fire a huge amount of cannonballs at the ship. That way, no opponent will have the ability to defend their ship and any opposing ship will be sunk almost instantly. For any opposing crew trying to escape, he can noro noro beam them, and then have his crew tie something very heavy to each member to drag them down to the bottom. The only group this tactic wouldn't be effective against would be fishmen pirates. There was plenty he could have done if he was willing to be more brutal. I've just scratched the surface of it. Can't believe I'm having an argument over Foxy, last post from me on this topic. why do you assume his beam can be trained to hit larger area at alrger range? and when have we ever seen ship to ship combat between pirate sin OP? Mihawk destroyed Don Kriegs armada in ship to ship combat. The strawhats had a battle with Wapol and a battle with the salvage monkey brothers from the Jaya/the Mocktown island. They almost had a sea battle with Blackbeard, but they caught the knockup stream.
And don't forget in the first episode, with Alvida :D
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On September 17 2013 13:54 Mataza wrote:
One Piece is only bloodfree until Zoro fights.
He uses swords and he cuts his enemies and blood is everywhere.
I can't believe that people act like One Piece has only cartoon violence.
The tone heavily shifts when serious swordfights begin. I think Zoros fight against Monet was the most kid friendly fight Zoro had in the entire manga. At all other times Zoro is at least drenched in his own blood.
You never see Zoro slit someone's throat and watch them drown in the own blood, or hack limbs off, and stuff like that.
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On September 17 2013 23:20 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 13:54 Mataza wrote:
One Piece is only bloodfree until Zoro fights.
He uses swords and he cuts his enemies and blood is everywhere.
I can't believe that people act like One Piece has only cartoon violence.
The tone heavily shifts when serious swordfights begin. I think Zoros fight against Monet was the most kid friendly fight Zoro had in the entire manga. At all other times Zoro is at least drenched in his own blood. You never see Zoro slit someone's throat and watch them drown in the own blood, or hack limbs off, and stuff like that.
Yeah but that's because he's a nice enough guy
Unlike Doflamingo
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On September 17 2013 02:45 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 00:41 sc2holar wrote:On September 16 2013 23:39 Mataza wrote:
Didn't we agree last time that "physical essence" is humbug?
And the darkness fruit did 2 things:
It allowed him to spread darkness and absorb things, including people, into it.
On touch it completely nullifies someones DF ability, similar to seastone.
Haki merely allows you to combat Logia users. It doesn't stop them from using their df powers. I meant physical body. Its established that Logia users cannot use their DF powers to regenerate lets say lost limbs, if you cut it off with haki/seastone or they are simply not in their elemental form at the time. Marco can do this though. What people forget about arnament haki is that its actually (the way Rayleigh explains it to Luffy anyways) mainly a form of "Armor". being able to hit Logia users is a side-effect of the haki warding your body from their element, hence also allowing you to bypass it with your attacks. So the question is, could you use Haki to sheild yourself from the Yami Yami no Mi's DF negating powers? That would imply that Ace wasn't able to do it. And he was worth 500 million back then, too.
I think his bounty was inflated somewhat because he was Roger's son. Bounty isn't just about strength you know.
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On September 17 2013 02:51 sc2holar wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 02:45 Mataza wrote:On September 17 2013 00:41 sc2holar wrote:On September 16 2013 23:39 Mataza wrote:
Didn't we agree last time that "physical essence" is humbug?
And the darkness fruit did 2 things:
It allowed him to spread darkness and absorb things, including people, into it.
On touch it completely nullifies someones DF ability, similar to seastone.
Haki merely allows you to combat Logia users. It doesn't stop them from using their df powers. I meant physical body. Its established that Logia users cannot use their DF powers to regenerate lets say lost limbs, if you cut it off with haki/seastone or they are simply not in their elemental form at the time. Marco can do this though. What people forget about arnament haki is that its actually (the way Rayleigh explains it to Luffy anyways) mainly a form of "Armor". being able to hit Logia users is a side-effect of the haki warding your body from their element, hence also allowing you to bypass it with your attacks. So the question is, could you use Haki to sheild yourself from the Yami Yami no Mi's DF negating powers? That would imply that Ace wasn't able to do it. And he was worth 500 million back then, too. True. Guess you need an ultra strong non-DF user to handle BB. Maybe Mihawk and Garp should team up and go after him.
Yami Yami no Mi's power doesn't inflict physical damage onto its target, so Armament Haki would be out of place in trying to stop it. But I guess a Haki user can just block whatever physical blow that comes after, which is practically how BB actually do damage, and deal damage back to BB.
As for Ace not able to block BB's attack, I'm quite sure it was just Oda not having the Haki idea fully fleshed out at the time. On the other hand, it could just very well mean that Ace was not trained to use Armament Haki or developed it himself.
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On September 18 2013 01:13 LaughingTulkas wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 02:45 Mataza wrote:On September 17 2013 00:41 sc2holar wrote:On September 16 2013 23:39 Mataza wrote:
Didn't we agree last time that "physical essence" is humbug?
And the darkness fruit did 2 things:
It allowed him to spread darkness and absorb things, including people, into it.
On touch it completely nullifies someones DF ability, similar to seastone.
Haki merely allows you to combat Logia users. It doesn't stop them from using their df powers. I meant physical body. Its established that Logia users cannot use their DF powers to regenerate lets say lost limbs, if you cut it off with haki/seastone or they are simply not in their elemental form at the time. Marco can do this though. What people forget about arnament haki is that its actually (the way Rayleigh explains it to Luffy anyways) mainly a form of "Armor". being able to hit Logia users is a side-effect of the haki warding your body from their element, hence also allowing you to bypass it with your attacks. So the question is, could you use Haki to sheild yourself from the Yami Yami no Mi's DF negating powers? That would imply that Ace wasn't able to do it. And he was worth 500 million back then, too. I think his bounty was inflated somewhat because he was Roger's son. Bounty isn't just about strength you know.
Ace being Roger's son was a secret, I doubt his bounty was due to his parentage. It was more likely due to being Whitebeard's 2nd Division Commander.
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On September 18 2013 01:38 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2013 01:13 LaughingTulkas wrote:On September 17 2013 02:45 Mataza wrote:On September 17 2013 00:41 sc2holar wrote:On September 16 2013 23:39 Mataza wrote:
Didn't we agree last time that "physical essence" is humbug?
And the darkness fruit did 2 things:
It allowed him to spread darkness and absorb things, including people, into it.
On touch it completely nullifies someones DF ability, similar to seastone.
Haki merely allows you to combat Logia users. It doesn't stop them from using their df powers. I meant physical body. Its established that Logia users cannot use their DF powers to regenerate lets say lost limbs, if you cut it off with haki/seastone or they are simply not in their elemental form at the time. Marco can do this though. What people forget about arnament haki is that its actually (the way Rayleigh explains it to Luffy anyways) mainly a form of "Armor". being able to hit Logia users is a side-effect of the haki warding your body from their element, hence also allowing you to bypass it with your attacks. So the question is, could you use Haki to sheild yourself from the Yami Yami no Mi's DF negating powers? That would imply that Ace wasn't able to do it. And he was worth 500 million back then, too. I think his bounty was inflated somewhat because he was Roger's son. Bounty isn't just about strength you know. Ace being Roger's son was a secret, I doubt his bounty was due to his parentage. It was more likely due to being Whitebeard's 2nd Division Commander.
Actually it was said that the higher ups of the government knew. He was raised by Garp for crying out loud and Garp knew his parentage.
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On September 18 2013 02:00 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2013 01:38 Sentenal wrote:On September 18 2013 01:13 LaughingTulkas wrote:On September 17 2013 02:45 Mataza wrote:On September 17 2013 00:41 sc2holar wrote:On September 16 2013 23:39 Mataza wrote:
Didn't we agree last time that "physical essence" is humbug?
And the darkness fruit did 2 things:
It allowed him to spread darkness and absorb things, including people, into it.
On touch it completely nullifies someones DF ability, similar to seastone.
Haki merely allows you to combat Logia users. It doesn't stop them from using their df powers. I meant physical body. Its established that Logia users cannot use their DF powers to regenerate lets say lost limbs, if you cut it off with haki/seastone or they are simply not in their elemental form at the time. Marco can do this though. What people forget about arnament haki is that its actually (the way Rayleigh explains it to Luffy anyways) mainly a form of "Armor". being able to hit Logia users is a side-effect of the haki warding your body from their element, hence also allowing you to bypass it with your attacks. So the question is, could you use Haki to sheild yourself from the Yami Yami no Mi's DF negating powers? That would imply that Ace wasn't able to do it. And he was worth 500 million back then, too. I think his bounty was inflated somewhat because he was Roger's son. Bounty isn't just about strength you know. Ace being Roger's son was a secret, I doubt his bounty was due to his parentage. It was more likely due to being Whitebeard's 2nd Division Commander. Actually it was said that the higher ups of the government knew. He was raised by Garp for crying out loud and Garp knew his parentage.
Pretty sure if his bounty was due to being Rogers son his bounty would have been alot higher than 550 mil. If they new he was Rogers son from the start then they probably wouldn't of offered him the shichibukia position, plus his bounty was still rising even after he had become the 2nd division commander due to defeating numerous New World pirates and such. He was considered and extreamely powerful pirate which was why his bounty was so high.
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I honestly do not remember that Ace was offered a post as shichibukai. Source?
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On September 17 2013 16:22 Mataza wrote:
Mihawk did not leave his rowboat and I am willing to count his sword as armament of his floating nutshell.
God knows how he came back to East Blue from the Grand Line in that little thing.
mihawk is just boss... he probably went through the whole grandline like shank did
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On September 18 2013 07:28 Mataza wrote:
I honestly do not remember that Ace was offered a post as shichibukai. Source?
I don't remember the chapter, but it was from the chapters showing Ace's backstory, meeting people like Whitebeard and Jinbei and stuff.
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On September 18 2013 07:28 Mataza wrote:
I honestly do not remember that Ace was offered a post as shichibukai. Source?
http://starkana.com/manga/O/One_Piece/chapter/552/6
Bottom right panel.
Haki fire sounds OP. I don't think Haki would work unless you imbue it on something consistent like a fist.
Speaking of which, I was wondering how a Haki user would fight someone like Akainu. If you punch him then you'd just get your fist burned and there'd be no way to block his giant magma attacks. The only way I see it working is if Busoshoku Haki could repel lava by blasting it. So you'd "punch" through lava by propelling a Haki barrier in order to block it. Rayleigh did something similar to the giant elephant were he seemed to launch an invisible force and knock it down. If a Haki user can shoot forcefields then this means that anyone could execute that super king punch with enough practice. I don't know about you, but that sounds OP as fuck.
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Interesting to be reminded of Ace's hat again after what we now know. There's one nice big smiley face (not quite Doflamingo's, but close) and a big frowny face on it. He was also the captain of the Spade pirates just like Law is captain of the Heart pirates. Finally, we know that Doflamingo has four seats: Diamond, Trebol (clubs), Spades, and Hearts (which he was saving for Law).
Was he originally saving the Spades seat for Ace or are the names just a coincidence?
It's also interesting that Ace was able to get a logia fruit as such a young rookie. And now Doflamingo was able to obtain it after his death. Did Doflamingo help Ace get his start? Does Doflamingo have some connection to the Fire Fruit like perhaps knowing it's "spawning location"?
More things than I originally thought might be coming together on Dressrosa.
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