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[Manga] One Piece - Page 225

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This is a thread that is dedicated to discussing One Piece. Do not read this thread if you are not currently caught up as there are spoilers in here.

If an episode or a chapter has already been officially released, then it is not necessary to post using spoilers.

If you have knowledge on a chapter that has not been officially released yet, do NOT post it in this thread. Ignoring this public note will result in a mod action.
risk.nuke
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden2825 Posts
October 20 2012 14:11 GMT
#4481
On October 20 2012 22:59 b3n3tt3 wrote:
Am I the only one hoping for momonosuke to join luffy's crew. lol

Yes, that dragon can go and lower the series elsewhere.
Neo.G Soulkey, Best, firebathero. // http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
Dark_Chill
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada3353 Posts
October 20 2012 14:21 GMT
#4482
On October 20 2012 22:59 b3n3tt3 wrote:
Am I the only one hoping for momonosuke to join luffy's crew. lol


Not sure, I'd find it really weird and I have doubts that he could mesh with the crew well.
Then again, I'm still hoping for Monet.
CUTE MAKES RIGHT
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
October 20 2012 19:20 GMT
#4483
I doubt Momonosuke would actually join given his age. There would have to be some sort of plot reason he would want to be with a pirate crew even if friendly instead of his father. If Momo can't transform back because the DF is flawed and the flaw results in not being able to transform back it would be possible for Chopper to cure him as others have pointed out. Although the rumble ball features are temporary, at least were, for Chopper so maybe only temporarily human?

An aside it seems like Chopper and Franky would both make good research assistants to Vegapunk even though he is a marine scientist which prevents a cooperative effort.
grush57
Profile Joined March 2011
Korea (South)2582 Posts
October 20 2012 19:22 GMT
#4484
Momo would only be with strawhats if his dad is in the crew aswell.
"Every thing is either simply awful or awfully simple." | "Weaklings can't pick... their way of death."
sharkie
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Austria18628 Posts
October 20 2012 19:45 GMT
#4485
On October 20 2012 22:59 b3n3tt3 wrote:
Am I the only one hoping for momonosuke to join luffy's crew. lol


it would be kinda cute, but useless since he'd get destroyed in the new world
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-20 20:04:14
October 20 2012 20:03 GMT
#4486
On October 21 2012 04:22 grush57 wrote:
Momo would only be with strawhats if his dad is in the crew aswell.

Which I could be similar to when Vivi joined the crew in a temporary fashion. Most of the children will be rescued by the Marines but I could see Momo and his dad staying with the Strawhats making Japan their next destination. He also might be useful just because of his DF if it's a mythical zoan level of usefulness even though I doubt he would be permanent member even if useful.
terranghost
Profile Joined May 2010
United States980 Posts
October 21 2012 00:04 GMT
#4487
Just thought I would note this I did not bother to read the walls of text going on and on about the different DF abilities but Logia do have to consciously turn on their ability. The only Logia we have seen always have their ability activated seems to be Ceaser.

+ Show Spoiler +
"It is amazing that people who think we cannot afford to pay for doctors, hospitals, and medication somehow think that we can afford to pay for doctors, hospitals, medication and a government bureaucracy to administer it." - Thomas Sowell
The Roots
Profile Joined September 2012
Canada10 Posts
October 21 2012 01:07 GMT
#4488
On October 21 2012 09:04 terranghost wrote:
Just thought I would note this I did not bother to read the walls of text going on and on about the different DF abilities but Logia do have to consciously turn on their ability. The only Logia we have seen always have their ability activated seems to be Ceaser.

+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTKFtpKMqP4


Not sure about that as a proof as anime sometimes tends to deviate from the rules set in the manga, especially if it's for a funny scene :p. But yeah I'm pretty sure that they must do it conciously, or else their DF would need a ''mind'' of their own or something like that to know when to activate.
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-21 02:19:42
October 21 2012 02:10 GMT
#4489
No it's been said in the manga too that Logia have to train in order to use their powers too. They can become elemental to dodge bullets/slashes and also choose not to become elemental hence the swamp guy hiding his DF power to the Strawhats by letting himself get beat up. In the above scene Ace and Smoker are blindsided by Luffy so they do not activate their powers (the scene is in the manga too).

Zoan need to get used to transforming too although both sides have a point. I think Logia/Zoan could transform even untrained or on accident even if Momo never understood what a DF was eventually he would accidentally turn into his human form assuming it is possible. We just don't know if it is possible given he has only had his DF power for a short time and we just met his character.
b3n3tt3
Profile Joined January 2012
595 Posts
October 21 2012 03:51 GMT
#4490
Chinese dragons are legendary creatures in Chinese mythology and folklore. In Chinese art, dragons are typically portrayed as long, scaled, serpentine creatures with four legs. In yin and yang terminology, a dragon is yang and complements a yin fenghuang ("Chinese phoenix").
Chinese dragons traditionally symbolize potent and auspicious powers, particularly control over water, rainfall, hurricane, and floods. The dragon is also a symbol of power, strength, and good luck. With this, the Emperor of China usually used the dragon as a symbol of his imperial power and strength.
In Chinese daily language, excellent and outstanding people are compared to the dragon while incapable people with no achievements are compared with other, disesteemed creatures, such as the worm. A number of Chinese proverbs and idioms feature references to the dragon, for example: "Hoping one's son will become a dragon" (望子成龍, i.e. be as a dragon).


My expectations on momonosuke. Please deliver, Oda.:D
Forikorder
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada8840 Posts
October 21 2012 05:03 GMT
#4491
Activating and deactivating is a willfull decision, else Luffy would have been unable to hit Enel or Smoker ever
.luffy was always unable to hit smoker and could only hit Enel becuase he was rubber which coutners lightning, everytime he missed Enel its cause enel dodged

Forikorder at it again.
You´re bad enough that I recognize you.


so your saying im wrong

Anyway, from a story telling point Momosuke being unable to transform back because of faulty DF seems the most likely.


yet agreeing with me....

Kaku's failed giraffe transformation seems very important here. Kaku tried to get a partial transformation, but got a total transformation instead.


might be to go into half-half you go full transformation and stop half way and he just forgot to stop the transformation


I doubt Momonosuke would actually join given his age. There would have to be some sort of plot reason he would want to be with a pirate crew even if friendly instead of his father. If Momo can't transform back because the DF is flawed and the flaw results in not being able to transform back it would be possible for Chopper to cure him as others have pointed out. Although the rumble ball features are temporary, at least were, for Chopper so maybe only temporarily human?

An aside it seems like Chopper and Franky would both make good research assistants to Vegapunk even though he is a marine scientist which prevents a cooperative effort.


Momosuke and daddy could travel with the strawhats becuase it will take chopper a long time to manage to completely transform him back into a kid, or they feel so indebted to the SH that they feel its there duty to travel with them as repayment, or maybe there leaving Wano made them perma-exiles and they cant return it would definently be easy for them to join the crew full time as a true member and daddy at least does fit into the SH crew, plus then theyd have Brook (one sword and ice sword) Samurai (2 sword, fire sword) and Zoro (3 sword)

Momosuke being weak (unconfirmed really he is a dragon) doesnt mean anything, Nami and Usopp survived for a long time being weak and the rumble ball could make him strong (imagine Choppers giant form.... but a DRAGON)
Mataza
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Germany5364 Posts
October 21 2012 20:10 GMT
#4492
On October 21 2012 14:03 Forikorder wrote:
Show nested quote +
Activating and deactivating is a willfull decision, else Luffy would have been unable to hit Enel or Smoker ever
.luffy was always unable to hit smoker and could only hit Enel becuase he was rubber which coutners lightning, everytime he missed Enel its cause enel dodged

Show nested quote +
Forikorder at it again.
You´re bad enough that I recognize you.


so your saying im wrong

Show nested quote +
Anyway, from a story telling point Momosuke being unable to transform back because of faulty DF seems the most likely.


yet agreeing with me....

Show nested quote +
Kaku's failed giraffe transformation seems very important here. Kaku tried to get a partial transformation, but got a total transformation instead.


might be to go into half-half you go full transformation and stop half way and he just forgot to stop the transformation


Show nested quote +
I doubt Momonosuke would actually join given his age. There would have to be some sort of plot reason he would want to be with a pirate crew even if friendly instead of his father. If Momo can't transform back because the DF is flawed and the flaw results in not being able to transform back it would be possible for Chopper to cure him as others have pointed out. Although the rumble ball features are temporary, at least were, for Chopper so maybe only temporarily human?

An aside it seems like Chopper and Franky would both make good research assistants to Vegapunk even though he is a marine scientist which prevents a cooperative effort.


Momosuke and daddy could travel with the strawhats becuase it will take chopper a long time to manage to completely transform him back into a kid, or they feel so indebted to the SH that they feel its there duty to travel with them as repayment, or maybe there leaving Wano made them perma-exiles and they cant return it would definently be easy for them to join the crew full time as a true member and daddy at least does fit into the SH crew, plus then theyd have Brook (one sword and ice sword) Samurai (2 sword, fire sword) and Zoro (3 sword)

Momosuke being weak (unconfirmed really he is a dragon) doesnt mean anything, Nami and Usopp survived for a long time being weak and the rumble ball could make him strong (imagine Choppers giant form.... but a DRAGON)

Sorry, did you say Luffy never was able to hit Smoker?
On October 21 2012 09:04 terranghost wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTKFtpKMqP4


I´m saying you´re bad because your reasoning is bad, i.e. look at the smoker logia argument


You might have a point I agree with, but your arguments can still be faulty. Logia are not automatic.
My paragraph about the different type of df fruit was particularly aimed at you as you seem to have faulty ideas about how they work.
I don´t mean you harm, but I urge you to doublecheck your facts or reread your posts before posting them.
If nobody hates you, you´re doing something wrong. However someone hating you doesn´t make you right
Forikorder
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada8840 Posts
October 22 2012 03:31 GMT
#4493
On October 22 2012 05:10 Mataza wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 21 2012 14:03 Forikorder wrote:
Activating and deactivating is a willfull decision, else Luffy would have been unable to hit Enel or Smoker ever
.luffy was always unable to hit smoker and could only hit Enel becuase he was rubber which coutners lightning, everytime he missed Enel its cause enel dodged

Forikorder at it again.
You´re bad enough that I recognize you.


so your saying im wrong

Anyway, from a story telling point Momosuke being unable to transform back because of faulty DF seems the most likely.


yet agreeing with me....

Kaku's failed giraffe transformation seems very important here. Kaku tried to get a partial transformation, but got a total transformation instead.


might be to go into half-half you go full transformation and stop half way and he just forgot to stop the transformation


I doubt Momonosuke would actually join given his age. There would have to be some sort of plot reason he would want to be with a pirate crew even if friendly instead of his father. If Momo can't transform back because the DF is flawed and the flaw results in not being able to transform back it would be possible for Chopper to cure him as others have pointed out. Although the rumble ball features are temporary, at least were, for Chopper so maybe only temporarily human?

An aside it seems like Chopper and Franky would both make good research assistants to Vegapunk even though he is a marine scientist which prevents a cooperative effort.


Momosuke and daddy could travel with the strawhats becuase it will take chopper a long time to manage to completely transform him back into a kid, or they feel so indebted to the SH that they feel its there duty to travel with them as repayment, or maybe there leaving Wano made them perma-exiles and they cant return it would definently be easy for them to join the crew full time as a true member and daddy at least does fit into the SH crew, plus then theyd have Brook (one sword and ice sword) Samurai (2 sword, fire sword) and Zoro (3 sword)

Momosuke being weak (unconfirmed really he is a dragon) doesnt mean anything, Nami and Usopp survived for a long time being weak and the rumble ball could make him strong (imagine Choppers giant form.... but a DRAGON)

Sorry, did you say Luffy never was able to hit Smoker?
Show nested quote +
On October 21 2012 09:04 terranghost wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTKFtpKMqP4


I´m saying you´re bad because your reasoning is bad, i.e. look at the smoker logia argument


You might have a point I agree with, but your arguments can still be faulty. Logia are not automatic.
My paragraph about the different type of df fruit was particularly aimed at you as you seem to have faulty ideas about how they work.
I don´t mean you harm, but I urge you to doublecheck your facts or reread your posts before posting them.

so riddle me this, if Logias do turn on and off, and Smoker was about to fight a freaking division leader of Whitebeard, with no idea of how many troops ace had, why the fuck was his logia power off?

and if Ace was about to be attacked by a mad dog like smoker, why was his logia off?

also what chapter does that correspond to in manga? cause Anime isnt as cannon as manga
Fiveandahalf
Profile Joined January 2011
United States10 Posts
October 22 2012 04:02 GMT
#4494
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-2265-6/one-piece/chapter-158.html

Read the few pages after that. Luffy not only hits both of them, he knocks them through several walls, and afterwards smokers shoves Ace's face into the ground. How can any of those things happen if they were always their element? Just read the logia article: http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Logia. All the info there is based on the manga. They can train to reflexively turn their element on to dodge/avoid surprise attacks, and they can transform parts of their body or the whole thing.

Obviously, their power is not "on" all the time.
Forikorder
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada8840 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-22 04:25:26
October 22 2012 04:15 GMT
#4495
On October 22 2012 13:02 Fiveandahalf wrote:
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-2265-6/one-piece/chapter-158.html

Read the few pages after that. Luffy not only hits both of them, he knocks them through several walls, and afterwards smokers shoves Ace's face into the ground. How can any of those things happen if they were always their element? Just read the logia article: http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Logia. All the info there is based on the manga. They can train to reflexively turn their element on to dodge/avoid surprise attacks, and they can transform parts of their body or the whole thing.

Obviously, their power is not "on" all the time.

but both of them were raring to go for a fight, smoker was one second away from leaping at Aces throat, why would there logia powers be off aside from rule of funny? and why does Ace have such bad reflexs that he couldnt have turned it on in time for smoker to pass through?

course its possible the DF can tell if something is an "attack aimed at me" or not, and since Luffy was only rocketing to get to the restaurant and hit them by accident, and Smoker only pushed ace as "something between me and luffy" the fruits didnt auto defend

imo smoker and ace got hit cause its funny
Mataza
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Germany5364 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-22 04:34:28
October 22 2012 04:28 GMT
#4496
On October 22 2012 12:31 Forikorder wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2012 05:10 Mataza wrote:
On October 21 2012 14:03 Forikorder wrote:
Activating and deactivating is a willfull decision, else Luffy would have been unable to hit Enel or Smoker ever
.luffy was always unable to hit smoker and could only hit Enel becuase he was rubber which coutners lightning, everytime he missed Enel its cause enel dodged

Forikorder at it again.
You´re bad enough that I recognize you.


so your saying im wrong

Anyway, from a story telling point Momosuke being unable to transform back because of faulty DF seems the most likely.


yet agreeing with me....

Kaku's failed giraffe transformation seems very important here. Kaku tried to get a partial transformation, but got a total transformation instead.


might be to go into half-half you go full transformation and stop half way and he just forgot to stop the transformation


I doubt Momonosuke would actually join given his age. There would have to be some sort of plot reason he would want to be with a pirate crew even if friendly instead of his father. If Momo can't transform back because the DF is flawed and the flaw results in not being able to transform back it would be possible for Chopper to cure him as others have pointed out. Although the rumble ball features are temporary, at least were, for Chopper so maybe only temporarily human?

An aside it seems like Chopper and Franky would both make good research assistants to Vegapunk even though he is a marine scientist which prevents a cooperative effort.


Momosuke and daddy could travel with the strawhats becuase it will take chopper a long time to manage to completely transform him back into a kid, or they feel so indebted to the SH that they feel its there duty to travel with them as repayment, or maybe there leaving Wano made them perma-exiles and they cant return it would definently be easy for them to join the crew full time as a true member and daddy at least does fit into the SH crew, plus then theyd have Brook (one sword and ice sword) Samurai (2 sword, fire sword) and Zoro (3 sword)

Momosuke being weak (unconfirmed really he is a dragon) doesnt mean anything, Nami and Usopp survived for a long time being weak and the rumble ball could make him strong (imagine Choppers giant form.... but a DRAGON)

Sorry, did you say Luffy never was able to hit Smoker?
On October 21 2012 09:04 terranghost wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTKFtpKMqP4


I´m saying you´re bad because your reasoning is bad, i.e. look at the smoker logia argument


You might have a point I agree with, but your arguments can still be faulty. Logia are not automatic.
My paragraph about the different type of df fruit was particularly aimed at you as you seem to have faulty ideas about how they work.
I don´t mean you harm, but I urge you to doublecheck your facts or reread your posts before posting them.

so riddle me this, if Logias do turn on and off, and Smoker was about to fight a freaking division leader of Whitebeard, with no idea of how many troops ace had, why the fuck was his logia power off?

and if Ace was about to be attacked by a mad dog like smoker, why was his logia off?

also what chapter does that correspond to in manga? cause Anime isnt as cannon as manga

Smokers arm was turned to smoke, but not the rest of his body.
It´s btw directly from the manga.+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.mangareader.net/103-2265-6/one-piece/chapter-158.html

See especially how his arm is smoke and he then gets tackled by Luffy.

Why were their powers of? Activating your elemental form is akin to drawing your weapon. The concept of not starting to fight the instant you see someone must be known to you.
Ok, they actually don´t want to fight right then and there. Here´s why.
Ace is just searching for his brother and also he is that very moment at lunch. Follow me here: He doesn´t want to fight Smoker just because he is a marine. He even says exactly that.
Smoker is ready to start fighting, but they´re in a crowded restaurant. Follow me again, Smoker is a marine and doesn´t want to endanger civilians. That´s the same reason cops don´t usually shoot into crowds.

I actually do not mean harm, and I agree on what will probably happen next, but you´re making my point by asking dumb questions like ""Why is smokers logia off".
Especially when you just said that Luffy never ever hit Smoker ever. What you said earlier is wrong. Accept that Logia are turned on by decision and that people can turn only parts of their body into elemental form and then move on.

[edit]
On October 22 2012 13:15 Forikorder wrote:
course its possible the DF can tell if something is an "attack aimed at me" or not, and since Luffy was only rocketing to get to the restaurant and hit them by accident, and Smoker only pushed ace as "something between me and luffy" the fruits didnt auto defend

What? DFs don´t "tell" anything apart. They don´t think, they don´t "autodefend"
Where the fuck are you taking that? Those things are fruit. FRUIT. You eat them and they give you powers.
The fruit do not think for you. They do not decide for you. Where the fuck did you get that misinformation from?

You are harder and harder to take serious.
If nobody hates you, you´re doing something wrong. However someone hating you doesn´t make you right
saltywet
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Hong Kong1316 Posts
October 22 2012 04:35 GMT
#4497
On October 20 2012 14:23 Forikorder wrote:
Ace doesnt have a "non-fire" mode, you dont seem to understand Logias they dont switch states its completely automatic at any point in time if there attacked the attack slips through (aside from specific scenarios like Haki) there is no on or off switch


remember when akainu is about to kill luffy but ace jumps in between and takes the hit? that's when he switched off the fire-mode, otherwise the punch would hit and kill luffy.
bittman
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia8759 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-22 04:47:08
October 22 2012 04:45 GMT
#4498
Hey guys you're clearly looking too much into this. Luffy was very very hungry, so what we witness with the crash tackle into Smoker + Ace is that Luffy awoke haki on that day. Obviously.

On topic: I would put a 95% bet on it being for comedic value. Unless you also think Nami has haki and insane super powers since she can basically beat up any strawhat on any given day so long as it's for comedy. 3% it actually had any meaning. 1% Luffy using haki. 1% Oda forgot how logias worked.

ALSO: Anyone still have any other theories why Doflamingo's "spirit" woke Momosuke up?

P.S. Regarding Akainu's hit if Ace had just been in 'non-fire mode' he wouldn't be fairly bloody there. He'd have a hole in his stomach you could fit a Luffy through. Unless I'm totally misremembering that page and they never showed his newfound stomach hole?
Mvp - Leenock - Dongraegu - MC - Gumiho - Keen - Polt - Squirtle - Jjakji - Genius - Seed - Life - sC - Dream || LG-IM - MVP - FXO
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-22 04:47:11
October 22 2012 04:47 GMT
#4499
Also while Oda has said he doesn't portray logia interaction with clothing accurately ( for example Ace should be naked after he uses his powers) it still wouldn't make sense for logia to always be elemental otherwise they would destroy objects. As for evidence of turning off their powers there is Ace, but also Caribou who let himself get beat up to prevent the Straw Hat crew from finding out he was a logia.
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-58565-19/one-piece/chapter-604.html
Forikorder
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada8840 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-22 04:52:44
October 22 2012 04:48 GMT
#4500
Ace is just searching for his brother and also he is that very moment at lunch. Follow me here: He doesn´t want to fight Smoker just because he is a marine. He even says exactly that.
Smoker is ready to start fighting, but they´re in a crowded restaurant. Follow me again, Smoker is a marine and doesn´t want to endanger civilians. That´s the same reason cops don´t usually shoot into crowds.


except you said it yourself, Smoker had already turned his arm into smoke he was just about to start attacking and even if he hadnt he had already started insitigating a fight against Ace, and Smoker had no problem fighting luffy immediately upon seeing him so theres no way either side actually thought thered be no battle

so not only did Smoker start a fight in a packed restaurant, he then proceeded to chase siad fugitive through the city people had already given them a wide berth its not likely that civs would ahve been drawn in and they would have left as soon as the fight actually started so Smoker was perfectly fine with picking a fight with Ace right then and there

What? DFs don´t "tell" anything apart. They don´t think, they don´t "autodefend"
Where the fuck are you taking that? Those things are fruit. FRUIT. You eat them and they give you powers.
The fruit do not think for you. They do not decide for you. Where the fuck did you get that misinformation from?

You are harder and harder to take serious.


im saying the ability has some auto defence worked into it that can somehow tell when someone attacks you (maybe some innate sort of observation Haki type thing) and then lets the attack pass through logia already gives a huge list of OP bullshit powers giving them a free auto observation Haki wouldnt at all be hard

remember when akainu is about to kill luffy but ace jumps in between and takes the hit? that's when he switched off the fire-mode, otherwise the punch would hit and kill luffy.


i believe akainu said that magma can even burn fire so jsut because he got hit doesnt mean that he turned it off (he even burned Ace earlier) besides he was in a split second decision so its not like he was like "oh luffy is in trouble lets see, command: logia elemental form off alright now i can go die for him"

ALSO: Anyone still have any other theories why Doflamingo's "spirit" woke Momosuke up?


he was kidnapped by Jokers crew, maybe Doflamingo inspected the merchandise

Also while Oda has said he doesn't portray logia interaction with clothing accurately ( for example Ace should be naked after he uses his powers) it still wouldn't make sense for logia to always be elemental otherwise they would destroy objects. As for evidence of turning off their powers there is Ace, but also Caribou who let himself get beat up to prevent the Straw Hat crew from finding out he was a logia.
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-58565-19/one-piece/chapter-604.html


except by that time most of the crew have Haki so they could hit Coribou if they really want to

and even if its possible to have the power "off" that doesnt mean they have to manually turn it "on"

personally i believe Logia works exactly like tobis technique, but instead of the dimensial tansfer its turn into element
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