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All book discussion in this thread is now allowed. |
On June 27 2016 21:51 Scorch wrote:
By being released from the Kingsguard, Jaime regained his name, claims and titles, right? Wouldn't that make him the rightful king after Tommen's death? I believe the king's male next of kin comes before the former king's wife in the succession rules. Not that any of it matters, because those who can back it up just claim power for themselves, but I mean if we're going strictly by the rules. Patriarchy has gone down the drain anyway. We now have Cersei, Daenerys, Ellaria and Olenna heading their houses, with Jon and Littlefinger as the only males in power.
well Tyrion still has power, and Varys is still scheming, altho it looks like he's doing it for Dany and not himself
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Wow what an amazing episode, leaves so much excitement for the next season!
- So I guess Jon Snow is half Targaryen and half Stark?
- Lady Mormont best character ever
- Awesome looking ships + dragons
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On June 27 2016 21:53 zeo wrote:
So is Jon king of the North and the Vale now?
What a great episode.
Vale is controlled by the son of Lysa Arryn
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Australia18228 Posts
On June 27 2016 21:55 Sent. wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2016 21:53 zeo wrote:
So is Jon king of the North and the Vale now?
What a great episode. Vale is controlled by the son of Lysa Arryn
Didn't Littlefinger say he was going to back the Starks publicly?
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That's a long way to Dorne... those dragons will need an aircraft carrier for them to land on from time to time.
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On June 27 2016 22:21 Inflicted wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2016 21:55 Sent. wrote:On June 27 2016 21:53 zeo wrote:
So is Jon king of the North and the Vale now?
What a great episode. Vale is controlled by the son of Lysa Arryn Didn't Littlefinger say he was going to back the Starks publicly?
By sending the knights of the vale into that battle to save the starks he already declared them by action
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On June 27 2016 22:22 Hier wrote:
That's a long way to Dorne... those dragons will need an aircraft carrier for them to land on from time to time.
hahaahahahahahaahh :D
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Finland965 Posts
On June 27 2016 15:14 KwarK wrote:
I've no idea, I just find the idea of her using another face of a young girl for anonymity dumb because she already has the face of a young girl on all the time and it's a pretty anonymous one. She could just go around as Arya and nobody would give her a second glance.
This is from a few pages back, but warrants a revisit. Using the face is important for a few reasons:
- it shows what she's learned from her escapades, and now she's being much more careful than when the Waif was hunting her down
- there still might be people who'd recognize her, so wearing the face is smart
- it's also for the viewers, in the next season any random person might actually be Arya, creating suspense
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On June 27 2016 21:55 Sent. wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2016 21:53 zeo wrote:
So is Jon king of the North and the Vale now?
What a great episode. Vale is controlled by the son of Lysa Arryn
I mean Littlefinger already 'declared' support for Jon by by sending the Vale army north to help him. Is it an alliance now or is Jon King of both?
The Vale doesn't have a king, if they are supporting one king that means he is their king..no?
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Vale doesn't have a king just like the North (Jon is the king IN the North, not the king OF the North), little Arryn and Snow are like equals unless one pledges allegiance to another.
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Littlefinger did it for Sansa, not for Jon. He told her he dreams of sitting on the Iron Throne with her at his side. He's trying to drive a wedge between Sansa and Jon. And at the meeting, he didn't declare Jon the King in the North, instead he sat in a corner and exchanged intense looks with Sansa. Littlefinger is allied to Jon for the time being, but should circumstances change, he'll betray him.
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Damn that King's Landing scene was done so well. Tommen's death was probably the most fucked up death I have seen in this show in a long time.. A kind-hearted kid that was put into a situation that he was totally not ready for, and got so mercilessly used by those around him that he fucking jumped.
Man the way he put down the crown and just went for it. Holy fuck.
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Shitty season into OMGWTFBBQ.
Now i can't wait for next season, goddammit.
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I didn't like Jon being proclaimed a king. It was stupid. Robb captures Jamie and defeats Lannister army at Riverrun and frees riverlands and is proclaimed King in the North. He shows great smarts and talent being a battlefield commander.
Jon almost loses a fight for his own family seat due to his own choices, get saved by unexpected allies. And then gets called King in the North? Really?! I does not feel right.
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United States44316 Posts
On June 27 2016 18:55 Jalle wrote:I wonder what the "official" explanation for the great sept of Baelor being blown to smithereens is. A terrible accident, a devious Dornish plot? The fact that it was terribly convenient for Cersei is probably going to slip nobodys mind 
The Sept was poisoned by its enemies.
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On June 27 2016 23:18 -Archangel- wrote:
I didn't like Jon being proclaimed a king. It was stupid. Robb captures Jamie and defeats Lannister army at Riverrun and frees riverlands and is proclaimed King in the North. He shows great smarts and talent being a battlefield commander.
Jon almost loses a fight for his own family seat due to his own choices, get saved by unexpected allies. And then gets called King in the North? Really?! I does not feel right.
Ned Stark became Warden of the north by being friends with Robert, fighting with him and then nearly dying to a dude with two swords. Yet is remembered as a legend and war hero. Have people not read Name of the Wind?
They are pledging loyalty to the Starks and their house being willing to fight for the North. Jon was willing to face death and loss, as opposed to the others who just wanted to wait out the storm.
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If I heard tales of a son of the great Ned Stark's son riding Beyond the Wall, fighting wildlings and White Walkers, becoming Lord Commander, betrayed and left to die, then resurrected, and fighting and beating the Boltons, I'd probably root for that guy too.
Even Ramsay himself said he's heard tales of Jon Snow.
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United States44316 Posts
On June 27 2016 21:51 Scorch wrote:
By being released from the Kingsguard, Jaime regained his name, claims and titles, right? Wouldn't that make him the rightful king after Tommen's death? I believe the king's male next of kin comes before the former king's wife in the succession rules. Not that any of it matters, because those who can back it up just claim power for themselves, but I mean if we're going strictly by the rules. Patriarchy has gone down the drain anyway. We now have Cersei, Daenerys, Ellaria and Olenna heading their houses, with Jon and Littlefinger as the only males in power.
No, it wouldn't.
Succession works as follows.
1) King
2) King's eldest son, next son, last son, eldest daughter, next daughter, last daughter
3) Up one level, retry
However, and this bit is important, for the purpose of who comes next the dead are presumed to be alive and are skipped rather than erased from the order. Here is an example that shows how important that is.
1) Mad King
2) Rhaegar, eldest son of Mad King
3) Even though Rhaegar is dead he counts as alive for succession which passes through him so any legitimate children of his are next following the eldest son, next son, last son, eldest daughter, next daughter, last daughter. Gregor Clegane killed two of his legitimate children by Elia of Dorne in Robert's Rebellion. However Jon may be a third. So Jon?
4) Any legitimate children of Jon.
5) Assuming the line of Rhaegar has been wiped out we then up one level, that takes us back to Aerys, Rhaegar line is wiped out so following eldest son, next son, last son, eldest daughter, next daughter, last daughter that takes us to Viserys. Viserys counts as alive for passing succession but gets skipped for being crowned. No kids that we know of so we up one level back to Aerys. Next comes Dany.
For the Baratheons kings we just up one level a few more times.
1) Robert
2) Joffrey + his heirs, no heirs = up 1 level back to Robert's heirs, skipping Joffrey this time around
3) Tommen + his heirs, no heirs = up 1 level back to Robert's heirs, skipping Joffrey + Tommen this time around
4) Marcella + her heirs, no heirs = up 1 level back to Robert's heirs, skipping Joffrey + Tommen + Marcella this time around
No more Robert heirs, up 1 level to his father's heirs
Robert's dad's heirs, skipping Robert this time around
5) Stannis + his heirs
6) Shireen, no heirs = up 1 level back to Stannis' heirs, skipping Shireen this time around
No more Stannis heirs, up 1 level to his dad's heirs, skipping Robert + Stannis this time around
7) Renly + his heirs, no heirs = up 1 level back to Renly's dad's heirs skipping Robert, Stannis and Renly.
No more Robert's father's heirs (assuming no unseen sisters of Robert etc) so we up one level to Robert Baratheon's grandfather and skip Robert Baratheon's father. We then reapply the rules.
We don't know where that leads but at no point do we end up with Cersei, Jaime or anyone else with yellow hair. We probably end up with some random lord from the Stormlands whose grandmother was Robert's aunt or something. She executed a coup, not a succession. Marrying into royalty does not make you royal.
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On June 27 2016 23:11 Scorch wrote:
Littlefinger did it for Sansa, not for Jon. He told her he dreams of sitting on the Iron Throne with her at his side. He's trying to drive a wedge between Sansa and Jon. And at the meeting, he didn't declare Jon the King in the North, instead he sat in a corner and exchanged intense looks with Sansa. Littlefinger is allied to Jon for the time being, but should circumstances change, he'll betray him.
you can say that, but lord royce and all of the other vale bannermen that were there (I assume, he's the only named one that was shown in the scene) also declared jon King in the north. He may not be king of the vale as well, but at a minimum they're all declaring to support his claim. If LF decides to try to force the armies of the vale to fight the ones of the north it won't end well, they don't like him anyways
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So Jon is confirmed as Rhaegar son. He is ice and fire. Last big question is who is the third dragon ? My bet would be Tyrion. Three targaryens who killed their mothers during born ?
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EPT
