My opinion of something isn't based on someone else's opinion of something. I don't give two shits if the masses like it. The masses are generally not very smart, and it seems to me like this show is more interested in being watched than being good (I don't mean for that to be an insult against you personally, by the way).
I think it was already mentioned in this thread, but it's a good example of the writing completely falling flat on its face as of late:
In a vacuum; yeah, the Demogorgon was probably a bit over the top in season 1. But it was also a nice tie-in with the DnD stuff, which was a cute way of giving these kids a backstory as to how they might be surprisingly capable of handling such a monster. It's not the most amazing writing concept of all time, but it at least made enough sense to not be distracting.
How, then, are we justifying a bunch of teenagers cracking secret Russian codes and infiltrating a massive, well-armed, underground base? Even if they went with a "Hey this is just like X video game or Y comic book! We can do this!" it would have been an ATTEMPT at storywriting. Something. Anything.
But yeah, when I say "failing", I'm not at all interested in the numbers.
only lame part was Robin being gay, was this part of the dumb subverting expectations trope? she was clearly supposed to be the love interest, ok cool way to subvert expectations. not as bad as last jedi or game of thrones expectation subversion but pretty lame
On July 17 2019 18:05 z0rz wrote: Nah, I'm 100% standing by it.
My opinion of something isn't based on someone else's opinion of something. I don't give two shits if the masses like it. The masses are generally not very smart, and it seems to me like this show is more interested in being watched than being good (I don't mean for that to be an insult against you personally, by the way).
I think it was already mentioned in this thread, but it's a good example of the writing completely falling flat on its face as of late:
In a vacuum; yeah, the Demogorgon was probably a bit over the top in season 1. But it was also a nice tie-in with the DnD stuff, which was a cute way of giving these kids a backstory as to how they might be surprisingly capable of handling such a monster. It's not the most amazing writing concept of all time, but it at least made enough sense to not be distracting.
How, then, are we justifying a bunch of teenagers cracking secret Russian codes and infiltrating a massive, well-armed, underground base? Even if they went with a "Hey this is just like X video game or Y comic book! We can do this!" it would have been an ATTEMPT at storywriting. Something. Anything.
But yeah, when I say "failing", I'm not at all interested in the numbers.
Sure, be the contrarian if you really want to, but your opinion won't be taken that seriously then. Trivializing it to "the ignorant masses like it" doesn't give your opinion any credibility.
Your criticisms have already been answered here and elsewhere.
only lame part was Robin being gay, was this part of the dumb subverting expectations trope? she was clearly supposed to be the love interest, ok cool way to subvert expectations. not as bad as last jedi or game of thrones expectation subversion but pretty lame
You don't think its a fairly normal character trait?
Like, 3.5% of Americans are gay, so it would make sense that in a show that has had 30+ characters throughout the seasons one of them would be gay, right? I mean its probably got more to do with representation (Netflix are into this) than subverting expectations.
I don't really see what's lame about it to be honest.
On July 17 2019 18:05 z0rz wrote: Nah, I'm 100% standing by it.
My opinion of something isn't based on someone else's opinion of something. I don't give two shits if the masses like it. The masses are generally not very smart, and it seems to me like this show is more interested in being watched than being good (I don't mean for that to be an insult against you personally, by the way).
I think it was already mentioned in this thread, but it's a good example of the writing completely falling flat on its face as of late:
In a vacuum; yeah, the Demogorgon was probably a bit over the top in season 1. But it was also a nice tie-in with the DnD stuff, which was a cute way of giving these kids a backstory as to how they might be surprisingly capable of handling such a monster. It's not the most amazing writing concept of all time, but it at least made enough sense to not be distracting.
How, then, are we justifying a bunch of teenagers cracking secret Russian codes and infiltrating a massive, well-armed, underground base? Even if they went with a "Hey this is just like X video game or Y comic book! We can do this!" it would have been an ATTEMPT at storywriting. Something. Anything.
But yeah, when I say "failing", I'm not at all interested in the numbers.
Sure, be the contrarian if you really want to, but your opinion won't be taken that seriously then. Trivializing it to "the ignorant masses like it" doesn't give your opinion any credibility. Your criticisms have already been answered here and elsewhere.
Relax, I already said I wasn't attacking you personally.
If you think I'm wrong, feel free to enlighten me. We're on a forum. Discussions are neat!
And I'm sorry, but when have my criticisms been answered here? Not that they necessarily NEED to be answered, but all I'm seeing is you saying "but muh ratings!"
(Again, I don't really put much stake into this and it's not the ultimate decider, but since you care: season 3 is definitively the lowest rated season on Rotten Tomatoes, albeit a good score nonetheless. Setting viewership records =/= quality. I don't think that's a very a bold statement to make.
Also worth noting: the premiere of Season 8 of GoT shattered viewership records. And, by your own admission, it was not a good season. See where I'm going?)
Unless the answer is "the show changed, get over it"? In which case: fair enough, but that feels a lot more trivializing to me than wanting the same attention to detail and identity that a show had already given us before.
I already used the Michael Bay reference, but let's go there again. A LOT of people watched the Transformers movies. They made a LOT of money. Billions of dollars.
They were fun. They were visually stimulating. But they weren't masterpieces that will go down in the history of great cinema. And that's okay. That's the space those movies chose to occupy.
And now, I'm starting to put Stranger Things in that space. It's not fully there yet, but it feels like it's headed in that direction. I find that disappointing.
Like most here said, I liked Robin, Dustin and Steve, and I'll add Jim to the list, but thats about it. Its not like I wasnt entertained, but I think it strayed too much from the tone of the 1st season,which had a good balance between 80's cliches and mystery, while S3 was cliche after cliche ... The balance between the serious parts and the goofy parts was not there imo.
It was a nice watch, but there's so much loss potential for me. I feel like a lot of my favorite part of season 1 and 2 were dropped, but than again I never was big fan of the kids story, the El story was nice but Joyce was my personnal highlight of the show (mostly season 1) so seeing her and Jim turning into commic relief was quite sad for me.
Dropping Will trauma was also a waste (especially to turn it into a "boy vs girl" storyline). On the plus side Steve was great Dustin too definitly better than their adult counter part in the Russian plotline, altought Erica was the worst caracter I have seen in a long time ( it's like they mixed the sassy black friend ans the sassy child trope togheter to create an walking punchline machine).
Overall I feel like we went from Alien and ET to James Bond, Terminator and Ferris Buller, non are bad I just happen to like the drama stuff more personnaly.
I don't regret watching it but I can't see myself watch the next season.
The acting was pretty terrible this season. All of the characters seem to either be overacting or behaving like cartoon characters. I don't really remember this being an issue in the first season.
The only characters which I wound up liking are Bald Eagle, Billy, and Alexi. The rest of the cast are just cardboard cutouts of tv tropes. And I suppose that might be the point, given that this is supposed to be an homage to 80s movies, but the novelty has worn off for me years ago and all is left is just a mediocre TV show.
Also, why the fuck did they add so much awkward romance to the plot? The target market for this show is people with 80s nostalgia, not teenagers.
On July 22 2019 22:59 Hyperbola wrote: The acting was pretty terrible this season. All of the characters seem to either be overacting or behaving like cartoon characters. I don't really remember this being an issue in the first season.
The only characters which I wound up liking are Bald Eagle, Billy, and Alexi. The rest of the cast are just cardboard cutouts of tv tropes. And I suppose that might be the point, given that this is supposed to be an homage to 80s movies, but the novelty has worn off for me years ago and all is left is just a mediocre TV show.
Also, why the fuck did they add so much awkward romance to the plot? The target market for this show is people with 80s nostalgia, not teenagers.
How many middle schoolers are not awkward when learning about romance? This show, from my anecdotal experience is quite popular with teenagers. My younger sister was the one who suggested it to me, and there’s a ton of fan/stan twitter accounts presumably run by teenagers.
Caricaturist Russian villains. The leader and the doctor? Is this a joke?
Scene after scene of corny '80s shit ('member this?) that everyone has already seen 10 times before. People don't use those kinds of tropes anymore because it's been figured out. Doing it now doesn't do the '80s any justice, but rather feels like a cheap trip down memory lane while pissing all over every mailbox while simultaneously waking up everyone in the neighborhood just so they could see you do it.
Joyce and Hopper have nothing but silliness, because they couldn't figure out another kind of dynamic for them than having them squabble all the time?
The plot was uninspired and completely unbelievable. Where do Russians get the time/materials/men to build a super secret huge as fuck government installation?
Characters did nonsensical things all the time. Hey guys, let's yell in a secret Russian base!! Let's sing Never Ending Story while the world is at risk of being fucked forever (oh and by the way, great job portraying Suzie as the biggest control freak and asshole that you could for a 13 year old). Let's just believe Billy is eating dinner with people, because he's never shown you to be an antisocial jerk, ever, Maxine.
People excuse the awkward romance or teen stuff as them being teens. I don't. It's portrayed in the worst way possible. Children are also awkward and they were good previous seasons, so I feel like the writers and directors completely missed the boat here, or it's the pubescent children being pubescent children, which means they should've never made this season.
The only thing Will, you know, the guy with the intimate connection to the Mind Flayer, does for the entirety of the story is complain and feel his neck, only to utter the words: "he's here". At the very least he was a plot vessel in previous seasons..
I absolutely LOATHED Lucas' sister. Her tone and her facial expressions just pissed me the fuck off every single time without fail. I mean, sure, she's cocky and she's smart, but she doesn't need to be the same thing the whole time through even when facing grave danger? It would've been nice for her to have her be scared and cry for a scene when shit went down for example, just to show people she's actually still a child (or a human).
For some reason Joyce's facial expressions also irked me more than usual, but that might be because I had nothing else to focus on.
I swear, the moment the sang The Never Ending Story theme, I thought they'd turned it into a satire.
Oh and one last thing, they talk about the Planck constant and then talk about a mathematical equation. A constant is not a mathematical equation. It's part of it, but it's not a mathematical equation in se. If you're trying to be nerdy, like letting her say random stuff about astronomy just to show how much she loves Dustin, at least get every part right.
I give it a 3/10. El has amazing crying faces; Billy was serviceable; Mike's mom was probably the best character on the show. Oh yes, and [ominous synth music]
On July 25 2019 07:35 Uldridge wrote: So after watching the season completely, I've become even more sour about it. So, it didn't get better, it got worse.. way worse.
Caricaturist Russian villains. The leader and the doctor? Is this a joke?
Scene after scene of corny '80s shit ('member this?) that everyone has already seen 10 times before. People don't use those kinds of tropes anymore because it's been figured out. Doing it now doesn't do the '80s any justice, but rather feels like a cheap trip down memory lane while pissing all over every mailbox while simultaneously waking up everyone in the neighborhood just so they could see you do it.
Joyce and Hopper have nothing but silliness, because they couldn't figure out another kind of dynamic for them than having them squabble all the time?
The plot was uninspired and completely unbelievable. Where do Russians get the time/materials/men to build a super secret huge as fuck government installation?
Characters did nonsensical things all the time. Hey guys, let's yell in a secret Russian base!! Let's sing Never Ending Story while the world is at risk of being fucked forever (oh and by the way, great job portraying Suzie as the biggest control freak and asshole that you could for a 13 year old). Let's just believe Billy is eating dinner with people, because he's never shown you to be an antisocial jerk, ever, Maxine.
People excuse the awkward romance or teen stuff as them being teens. I don't. It's portrayed in the worst way possible. Children are also awkward and they were good previous seasons, so I feel like the writers and directors completely missed the boat here, or it's the pubescent children being pubescent children, which means they should've never made this season.
The only thing Will, you know, the guy with the intimate connection to the Mind Flayer, does for the entirety of the story is complain and feel his neck, only to utter the words: "he's here". At the very least he was a plot vessel in previous seasons..
I absolutely LOATHED Lucas' sister. Her tone and her facial expressions just pissed me the fuck off every single time without fail. I mean, sure, she's cocky and she's smart, but she doesn't need to be the same thing the whole time through even when facing grave danger? It would've been nice for her to have her be scared and cry for a scene when shit went down for example, just to show people she's actually still a child (or a human).
For some reason Joyce's facial expressions also irked me more than usual, but that might be because I had nothing else to focus on.
I swear, the moment the sang The Never Ending Story theme, I thought they'd turned it into a satire.
Oh and one last thing, they talk about the Planck constant and then talk about a mathematical equation. A constant is not a mathematical equation. It's part of it, but it's not a mathematical equation in se. If you're trying to be nerdy, like letting her say random stuff about astronomy just to show how much she loves Dustin, at least get every part right.
I give it a 3/10. El has amazing crying faces; Billy was serviceable; Mike's mom was probably the best character on the show. Oh yes, and [ominous synth music]
I'll never understand why guys like you watch shows that you obviously hate from the beginning.
Every complaint you've mentioned was present in the first season, and yet here you are still watching the third season.
Why put yourself through it? Just to hate on something popular? Is that the only reason?
I have zero reason to believe you actually enjoyed the first two seasons after reading everything you just wrote. And if you didn't enjoy the first two seasons and still watched the third, then I don't know what to think of your rationality on what you choose to partake in as entertainment.
Me? I don't like a show, I don't watch it. It's as simple as that. you? You sound masochistic to me.
First season was great, what are you talkig about? Characters pmayed great and the atmosphere was one full of mystery and discovery. Season 2 was obviously inferior, but had some redeeming qualities and season 3 was hoping for an improvement/surprise.
On July 25 2019 14:14 Uldridge wrote: First season was great, what are you talkig about? Characters pmayed great and the atmosphere was one full of mystery and discovery. Season 2 was obviously inferior, but had some redeeming qualities and season 3 was hoping for an improvement/surprise.
So you enjoyed the tropes, 80's nostalgia, teenage hijinks and suspension of disbelief plot in Season 1 but at some point stopped after 2 seasons of it?
Season 3 is great IMO because it manages to keep that fomula going without it feeling worn out. I can guarantee the show writers wanted it that way.
On July 25 2019 14:14 Uldridge wrote: First season was great, what are you talkig about? Characters pmayed great and the atmosphere was one full of mystery and discovery. Season 2 was obviously inferior, but had some redeeming qualities and season 3 was hoping for an improvement/surprise.
So you enjoyed the tropes, 80's nostalgia, teenage hijinks and suspension of disbelief plot in Season 1 but at some point stopped after 2 seasons of it?
Season 3 is great IMO because it manages to keep that fomula going without it feeling worn out. I can guarantee the show writers wanted it that way.
I guess this pretty much sums up what those of us who didn't like S3 so much think:
Sure it was '80s themed in S1 and it didn't feel jarring or over the top. In S3 it was a caricature, how many times do I have to tell you? Like actually LOOK at the face of the evil Russian boss man? In S1 the villains took themselves seriously, in this season, the entire Russian base infiltration was a mockery.
And, sorry, but a government facility that experiments on interdimensional stuff is infinitely more believable than a super secret billion dollar underground operation.
The atmosphere was flat. In S1 it was immersive. There's night and day difference between these seasons.. I actually cant believe you'd compare both because the could very well be different shows. With S3 taking place in Looney Tunes universe. Even my gf, who is generally not very hard to please couldn't help but comment and keep commenting on how superficial and immature this season was.
Also, people kept watching GoT from S5 onwards, even though the show was officially shit (imo) from them on . I didn't really have any interest in it any longer, but kept watching for several reasons. One of them is obviously the sunk cost fallacy people (myself included) indulge in. So don't tell me I shouldn't watch something I had high expectations for (or could still be pleasantly surprised with), just because I'm massively dissapointed by it.
Well you brought up the Sunk Cost fallacy not me. It is a fallacy for a reason. I stopped watching GoT as soon as Ramsey Bolton fought off an Ironborn Raid without a shirt, because that was a red flag that the show had officially lost its own credibility.
That said, there is a difference I can understand, I have the books to look forward to to finish the story properly. Stranger Things doesn't have that option, but even as a fan of the show I'd have been more than happy to cut the series off after Season 2 which had a really nice conclusive ending of sorts if I didn't like where season 3 was going, but I didn't because I enjoyed Episode 1 and was totally engaged by Episode 3.
I wouldn't have kept going if I had not liked the first episode.
On July 25 2019 07:35 Uldridge wrote: So after watching the season completely, I've become even more sour about it. So, it didn't get better, it got worse.. way worse.
Caricaturist Russian villains. The leader and the doctor? Is this a joke?
Scene after scene of corny '80s shit ('member this?) that everyone has already seen 10 times before. People don't use those kinds of tropes anymore because it's been figured out. Doing it now doesn't do the '80s any justice, but rather feels like a cheap trip down memory lane while pissing all over every mailbox while simultaneously waking up everyone in the neighborhood just so they could see you do it.
Joyce and Hopper have nothing but silliness, because they couldn't figure out another kind of dynamic for them than having them squabble all the time?
The plot was uninspired and completely unbelievable. Where do Russians get the time/materials/men to build a super secret huge as fuck government installation?
Characters did nonsensical things all the time. Hey guys, let's yell in a secret Russian base!! Let's sing Never Ending Story while the world is at risk of being fucked forever (oh and by the way, great job portraying Suzie as the biggest control freak and asshole that you could for a 13 year old). Let's just believe Billy is eating dinner with people, because he's never shown you to be an antisocial jerk, ever, Maxine.
People excuse the awkward romance or teen stuff as them being teens. I don't. It's portrayed in the worst way possible. Children are also awkward and they were good previous seasons, so I feel like the writers and directors completely missed the boat here, or it's the pubescent children being pubescent children, which means they should've never made this season.
The only thing Will, you know, the guy with the intimate connection to the Mind Flayer, does for the entirety of the story is complain and feel his neck, only to utter the words: "he's here". At the very least he was a plot vessel in previous seasons..
I absolutely LOATHED Lucas' sister. Her tone and her facial expressions just pissed me the fuck off every single time without fail. I mean, sure, she's cocky and she's smart, but she doesn't need to be the same thing the whole time through even when facing grave danger? It would've been nice for her to have her be scared and cry for a scene when shit went down for example, just to show people she's actually still a child (or a human).
For some reason Joyce's facial expressions also irked me more than usual, but that might be because I had nothing else to focus on.
I swear, the moment the sang The Never Ending Story theme, I thought they'd turned it into a satire.
Oh and one last thing, they talk about the Planck constant and then talk about a mathematical equation. A constant is not a mathematical equation. It's part of it, but it's not a mathematical equation in se. If you're trying to be nerdy, like letting her say random stuff about astronomy just to show how much she loves Dustin, at least get every part right.
I give it a 3/10. El has amazing crying faces; Billy was serviceable; Mike's mom was probably the best character on the show. Oh yes, and [ominous synth music]
I don't want to go into detail here because it would be a waste of time, but a lot of these complaints are so superficial and nitpicky, disregarding the tone/genre this show is going for and searching for realism (?) instead. I blame bad faith youtube film/media criticism, people just cannot stop to do the same afterwards :/
EPT
