EPT[TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion - Page 517
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SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and Fire Click Here for the spoiler-free thread. | ||
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Lylat
France8575 Posts
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karazax
United States3737 Posts
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Koerage
Netherlands1220 Posts
On June 05 2014 23:05 karazax wrote: Did "most people" really deduce that in the first book though, or did most people hear about the theory online and then agree that it's a good one? I certainly didn't pick up on it my first read thru. It's a common theory floated around in just about every book discussion online, but I'd be curious to know how many people figured it out without ever having heard about it from someone else. i figured there was something with him but i didnt connect it to R+L=J, so i only got it from reading stuff online On June 05 2014 23:53 karazax wrote: Well the poison was designed to not kill, but to be extremely painful in the books if I remember correctly. Thought one of the sandsnakes said "nobody survives that poison" or something like that, so it prolly kills very slowly | ||
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karazax
United States3737 Posts
"He is dying of the venom, but slowly, and in exquisite agony.” – Qyburn to Cersei Lannister “The flesh mortifies and the wounds ooze pus. Even maggots will not touch such foulness. His convulsions are so violent that I have had to gag him to prevent him from biting off his own tongue. I have cut away as much tissue as I dare, and treated the rot with boiling wine and bread mold, to no avail. The veins in his arms are turning black. When I leeched him, all the leeches died." - Pycelle to the small council | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16125 Posts
On June 05 2014 23:53 karazax wrote: Well the poison was designed to not kill immediately, but to be extremely painful in the books if I remember correctly. It's extremely lethal, which is the main reason for Oberyn's incessant show boating after he had stabbed him successfully once. Gregor was dead the moment the poison infected him, Oberyn had gotten his revenge. Now he just needed the confession, he needed for everyone to hear it. The real question is, was his ultimate goal for Dorne to have just cause for a war with the Lannisters, or was it to simply implicate Tywin in his sister's murder? Or was it neither of those, did he just need to hear it for himself? | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
I've noticed that mainstream Western audiences seem to prefer their sci-fi dystopian and their fantasy utopian. That mentality is just really weird to me. The medieval times sucked ass and George is just being faithful to the historical source material that provides inspiration for his setting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wars_of_the_Roses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Spanish_Succession http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Years'_War Almost every atrocity in the book has a historical parallel, sometimes multiple historical parallel. Seems to me like your average Westerner has a really, really warped view of the middle ages. | ||
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Nyxisto
Germany6287 Posts
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Hyperbola
United States2554 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12502 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:46 Hyperbola wrote: So Oberyn like Theon could have fathered many bastards before his... accident right? I'm not sure what exactly his lands or inheritance were if he had any, but it's very possible that he has an heir even if he didn't have a son per say. It's not could have, we know that he has many bastards. And if you meant 'male bastards', Dorne doesn't give a fuck about genders so his female bastards are as apt to inherit as male bastards would be | ||
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way2mash4u
Germany183 Posts
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:58 Nebuchad wrote: It's not could have, we know that he has many bastards. And if you meant 'male bastards', Dorne doesn't give a fuck about genders so his female bastards are as apt to inherit as male bastards would be Oberyn is the younger brother of Doran Martell who is the Prince of Drone. The heiress to the kingdom of Dorne is Arianne because shes the oldest child of Doran. So Oberyn's death doesnt affect the succession at all. He has 8 bastard daughters called the sand snakes though. Gonna be interesting when they show more of Dorne in the show. I guess it makes sense to have Jaime go there for some context to kinda introduce all the characters and that they dont seem so isolated from the rest of the story. I didnt like that deviation at first but i guess like that its gonna be easier for the show. and tbh.. i found the Dorne chapters quite boring in the books.. | ||
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Dunmer
United Kingdom568 Posts
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sung_moon
United States10110 Posts
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Vindicare605
United States16125 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:35 andrewlt wrote: I find it sad that there are a lot of people who accuse George Martin of having a nihilistic view of the world. Many of those people wouldn't say the same thing about other stories like Hunger Games and Divergent, sci-fi stories aimed at much younger audiences that show a really fucked up future. I've noticed that mainstream Western audiences seem to prefer their sci-fi dystopian and their fantasy utopian. That mentality is just really weird to me. The medieval times sucked ass and George is just being faithful to the historical source material that provides inspiration for his setting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wars_of_the_Roses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Spanish_Succession http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Years'_War Almost every atrocity in the book has a historical parallel, sometimes multiple historical parallel. Seems to me like your average Westerner has a really, really warped view of the middle ages. Does that really surprise you? People are always very willing to look past the dark ass shit that took place in their country's history. Perfect example is the American conquest of the Native Americans. A genocide in every sense of the word but Americans don't want to talk about it because it makes them look bad. Or better yet, look at all the backlash movies like 12 years a slave and even fucking Django got for continuing to showcase the brutality and inhumanity of American Slavery? Try bringing up either of those topics with your average American. You'll quickly find yourself very unpopular. | ||
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Conti
Germany2516 Posts
Looks like we'll get Varamyr, weirdly enough. I thought he was replaced by that other guy and then killed by Jon? Oh well. And we're really getting the first ever flashback, too, showing Cersei's prophecy. I approve. | ||
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:35 andrewlt wrote: I find it sad that there are a lot of people who accuse George Martin of having a nihilistic view of the world. Many of those people wouldn't say the same thing about other stories like Hunger Games and Divergent, sci-fi stories aimed at much younger audiences that show a really fucked up future. I've noticed that mainstream Western audiences seem to prefer their sci-fi dystopian and their fantasy utopian. That mentality is just really weird to me. The medieval times sucked ass and George is just being faithful to the historical source material that provides inspiration for his setting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wars_of_the_Roses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Spanish_Succession http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Years'_War Almost every atrocity in the book has a historical parallel, sometimes multiple historical parallel. Seems to me like your average Westerner has a really, really warped view of the middle ages. You're quite the guy to give history lessons and to give the spanish succession war as an example of Middle Age horrors. Also should we speak about what happened in the XXth century ? If anything people have a much darker image of the middle age than what they were. Also Martin's nihilism is probably derived from his characters, overall a great bunch of great guys even by history's standards. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:54 Vindicare605 wrote: Does that really surprise you? People are always very willing to look past the dark ass shit that took place in their country's history. Perfect example is the American conquest of the Native Americans. A genocide in every sense of the word but Americans don't want to talk about it because it makes them look bad. Or better yet, look at all the backlash movies like 12 years a slave and even fucking Django got for continuing to showcase the brutality and inhumanity of American Slavery? Try bringing up either of those topics with your average American. You'll quickly find yourself very unpopular. The weird part to me is the contrast. People are very willing to look past the dark ass shit that took place in their country's history but they seem to be very willing to imagine their children, grandchildren and future generations to perform the same dark ass shit in the future. On June 06 2014 03:01 corumjhaelen wrote: You're quite the guy to give history lessons and to give the spanish succession war as an example of Middle Age horrors. Also should we speak about what happened in the XXth century ? If anything people have a much darker image of the middle age than what they were. Also Martin's nihilism is probably derived from his characters, overall a great bunch of great guys even by history's standards. The Spanish Succession War was one of the first to come to mind, even though it came later. Fantasy is mostly based in the middle ages, though authors routinely pull material from the classical ages all the way to the industrial ages. As an example, Joffrey's death is kinda like Attila's death. That happened way back in 453. I totally disagree that people have a much darker image of the middle ages. The middle ages have been completely whitewashed, especially in most modern fantasy. | ||
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
The Spanish Succession War was one of the first to come to mind, even though it came later. Fantasy is mostly based in the middle ages, though authors routinely pull material from the classical ages all the way to the industrial ages. As an example, Joffrey's death is kinda like Attila's death. That happened way back in 453. I totally disagree that people have a much darker image of the middle ages. The middle ages have been completely whitewashed, especially in most modern fantasy. I think that very wrong example is very telling. I think equating the image of fantasy's world and the image of middle age is completely dumb, and you're only doing it because of the point you're trying to make. Middle age is still seen as dark ages where people died of the plague, waited for their death and were the victim of their sadistic lords' wars. | ||
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karazax
United States3737 Posts
I expect Bran will meet the Three Eyed Crow, perhaps a dragon will eat a child instead of a sheep for Dany, Tyrion kills off Tywin, the Hound "dies" and Arya gets on the ship to Braavos. I expect the battle for the wall to conclude next week, so aftermath the following week, though I'm not sure if they will get to the vote and election of Jon to lord commander. With the battle we should have plenty of Stannis. Jon Snow doesn't have nearly the relationship he did in the books with any of the Wildlings outside of Ygritte, so having him go treat with Mance prior to the attack by Stannis might not work. I expect some Jon Snow/leadership of the watch/Stannis interactions. I expect Lady Stoneheart to be the closing scene for the season, though whether it involves Brienne and completely skipping all of her Feast for Crows content (most of which won't work now since there is no Shagwell the fool, Rorge or Biter for her to fight), or just Lady Stoneheart hanging some Frey like in the storm of Swords epilogue I'm not sure. Brienne should have at least one more scene, but at this point her story will be significantly different from the books no matter what. I don't see any meaningful scenes left this season for the Boltons, Greyjoys, Martels, Tyrells, Littlefinger/Sansa. I'm sure there will be some more "original" scenes too like Messendei/Greyworm eunuch romance. | ||
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Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
I think the Batlle of the Wall will be the big focus, with Stannis' arrival and victory as a finish. I think Tywin will die in the last ep. It will leave Tyrion's fate hanging, which is good. I think we know that the next ep focuses a lot on Jon, Stannis and Bran. We will probably see very little of King's Landing. Maybe a set up scene for Jaime forcing Varys to help Tyrion. At this point, I'm just praying that they don't butcher Stannis during that episode... At least that one... | ||
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