EPT[TV] The Walking Dead - Page 95
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Discussing the show and past episodes is fine. Do not put things that have happened in the TV series in spoilers. However, don't spoil things from the books that may happen in future episodes. Put book spoilers in spoiler tags with a CLEAR WARNING that it is from the book. | ||
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Lumin
United States217 Posts
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p4NDemik
United States13896 Posts
A child just took a bullet to the face and the audience felt no sense of loss. There is something wrong there. | ||
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Majynx
United States1431 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:00 Lumin wrote: I want Carl to die so fucking badly. Shane should have killed him on the spot for jacking the guns. I think you mean Dale. Anyways, I'm quite glad this arc is over, but I do not want to wait til February for the next episode. The twist with Sophia was okay, however I did not feel seeing her as a walker and being killed off. I just never felt any attachment to her character. | ||
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Scribble
2077 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:02 p4NDemik wrote: My point is they made the driving arc of the farm "find Sophia." That's fine if they didn't want to focus so much on Hershel, but follow through on that arc and make me care at least a little bit at her death. They didn't really get me invested in it at all. The only time I cared was when I was worried Daryl was going to pay with his life. Show me flashbacks of a mother-daughter moment with Carol and Sophia. I don't know, anything that would have strengthened those characters instead of making them the most immediately expendable, worthless, and hollow shells that they were. A child just took a bullet to the face and the audience felt no sense of loss. There is something wrong there. She felt mostly like a mcguffin to get them to stay on the farm while the real conflict brewed. The Shane/Rick and Hershel's people/Rick's people divides did it for me. | ||
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legendre20
United States316 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:40 p4NDemik wrote: If only that reference wasn't so lame and out of place. Felt like a move of desperation to connect with their audience in some way since the writing is awful. I guess it's good that that arc is done with. Can't say I cared much for it. The twist ... well I was spoiled by this thread, but it didn't do much for me. To those who didn't know - did you see it coming? At a certain point it was like well they have to wrap this up and the only way to do that was to have her come out of the barn like that. In general this part of the story was butchered so bad. Hershel's character undergoes a tremendous transformation in the comics, but outside of just being horrified at seeing his family and friends killed I he hasn't developed at all. It was his farm, his story to tell, and this story pales in comparison. He is devastated, but there is no catharsis at all - he is just more hardened, more the same as he was when the group first came to the farm. It's like they misinterpreted the word for it's literal meaning and thought cleaning the barn of zombies actually fulfilled the definition of the term. (don't get cheeky and say it does, you know what I'm talking about) Instead they replaced that emotional pay-off with the death of a character we hadn't seen in 6 episodes and never gave a shit about in the first place. For goodness sake her own mother just gave up on her earlier in the episode. Seriously if you are writing to pull at the heartstrings of your audience how much worse can you get than this first half of the season if that was the twist. Oh yeah, that girl, the one we all wish was given up for dead 4 episodes ago - she's alive!! And we're gonna have a 2 minute drawn out scene to show her death! Are you weeping? Why not? I guess you could argue that Rick has some kind of a change of heart but honestly it wasn't some awe-inspiring strong moment. Sigh. On to the next half-season, I guess I'll watch just because its a bit of a blank slate (and this is when things are supposed to really heat up), but ... eh ... I'm not excited. I'd imagine Hershel's character will undergo a bigger transformation next episode. He hasn't even had time to think at the end of that episode. So I don't think there's any reason to say that they won't go in to that. As far as the twist goes. It was, unfortunately spoiled by this thread, but I actually thought that they went about it in a really good way. Shane and all of the others hopped right in to shoot the family members of Hershel and the others without hesitation, but what was their reaction when it was Sophia, one of their own? All of them hesitated and it had to be Rick to shoot Sophia. Which of course is interesting because Shane had brought up the point earlier in the episode that Rick wasn't cut out for this world. Clearly he was. I really enjoyed the episode, even though I haven't enjoyed the season very much. Besides all that I have mentioned it was of course interesting to see Shane's character unravel. I honestly wasn't sure if he was going to kill somebody or not. EDIT: Also pan, don't put words in to everyone's mouth. I'm sure a lot of the audience did feel something for Sophia, even though you didn't. Her mother giving up on her after a week of searching is understandable, especially just for that brief moment. Everyone has doubts. | ||
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GGTeMpLaR
United States7226 Posts
On November 28 2011 14:59 FeedMe wrote: how are you any more trustworthy then he is? either way people are going to kill people to stay alive. if anything this post completely validates his ideas and i pretty much agree with him now. to keep this about the show and not get sidetracked, i was pretty surprised that glen wasnt shooting any of the zombies, i didnt think his emotions would cloud him like that, i expected more. really really liked the end of that episode i was afraid it was going to be a cliffhanger and it was more closure then anything. That's like saying someone who imprisons a slaver for enslaving others justifies the slaver's profession to begin with. On November 28 2011 15:02 p4NDemik wrote: My point is they made the driving arc of the farm "find Sophia." That's fine if they didn't want to focus so much on Hershel, but follow through on that arc and make me care at least a little bit at her death. They didn't really get me invested in it at all. The only time I cared was when I was worried Daryl was going to pay with his life. Show me flashbacks of a mother-daughter moment with Carol and Sophia. I don't know, anything that would have strengthened those characters instead of making them the most immediately expendable, worthless, and hollow shells that they were. A child just took a bullet to the face and the audience felt no sense of loss. There is something wrong there. Don't confuse yourself not feeling any sense of loss for the entire audience not feeling any sense of loss, I for one felt it and in the aftershow it was mentioned as well. In fact, I thought that her coming out was a homerun because it put into perspective how Herschel and the farm group about every other walker in the barn | ||
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pure_protoss
152 Posts
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:00 Lumin wrote: I want Carl to die so fucking badly. Shane should have killed him on the spot for jacking the guns. I think you mean Dale. Carl is the boy, Rick and Lori's son. On November 28 2011 15:02 p4NDemik wrote: My point is they made the driving arc of the farm "find Sophia." That's fine if they didn't want to focus so much on Hershel, but follow through on that arc and make me care at least a little bit at her death. They didn't really get me invested in it at all. The only time I cared was when I was worried Daryl was going to pay with his life. Show me flashbacks of a mother-daughter moment with Carol and Sophia. I don't know, anything that would have strengthened those characters instead of making them the most immediately expendable, worthless, and hollow shells that they were. A child just took a bullet to the face and the audience felt no sense of loss. There is something wrong there. I'm not in the same boat as you I suppose. The loss of the character probably hit me more because I've read the comics so I did not entirely expect it until about halfway through the zombie barn massacre, and at that point I hoped it wasn't going to happen for the character, and was going to happen for the show. Now that I think about it though, she doesn't really have much going for her in the comics either, she's just there to help flesh out the dynamics between other characters, that's essentially the purpose she served in the show. I thought she was quite the tragic character to be honest, I guess some Carol/Sophia development could have helped but honestly the only thing I'd possibly change was Carol giving up on his in the beginning of this episode. The girl had a pretty shit father before the end of the world and the apocalypse actually established the removal of the figure that abused her and created a group that cared about her, Carol specifically speaks on this in an earlier episode, it's a tragic situation built around a character more than anything, we know what we need to know to create the situation. It worked for me. | ||
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Uncultured
United States1340 Posts
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RosaParksStoleMySeat
Japan926 Posts
I guess I was just glad to finally see an action-packed episode. I just had to facepalm so hard at them going out into the wild, leashing zombies, and then dragging them to the farmhouse. Honestly, what the fuck? You're telling me that after the world goes to shit people who do not have the basic instinct of "It wants to kill me; run or kill it first" survive? Whatever. The season was overall a pretty huge borefest but the last few episodes picked up. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:24 RosaParksStoleMySeat wrote: Wait, this was the last episode of this season? That kind of ended abruptly. I guess I was just glad to finally see an action-packed episode. I just had to facepalm so hard at them going out into the wild, leashing zombies, and then dragging them to the farmhouse. Honestly, what the fuck? You're telling me that after the world goes to shit people who do not have the basic instinct of "It wants to kill me; run or kill it first" survive? Whatever. The season was overall a pretty huge borefest but the last few episodes picked up. It was a mid-season finale, there is going to be a short break before the show returns, the season isn't over yet. | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
Any other person trolling and posters would be quick to reply: "Then don't watch it/Don't post here then." We get it. You don't like. You have nothing good to say about the show. Why spew negative shit when over half the people here are obviously enjoying the show? | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:02 p4NDemik wrote: A child just took a bullet to the face and the audience felt no sense of loss. There is something wrong there. Negative shit like this. You don't speak for the audience. Matter of fact, I'm sure you're the boring 1 percent who feels this way. As if a mother losing her own child isn't enough for the audience to feel sympathy. The fact that Sophia's mom just came out of an abusive relationship does not effect you? Maybe it's because you can't relate to her, but you can relate to bad ass motherfucker Daryl? Are you a self-sufficient, sometimes philosophical, but not too soft, crossbow-wielding BAMF too? | ||
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wolfhead
23 Posts
On November 28 2011 14:14 Scribble wrote: That last scene revealed a lot about who Shane and Rick are. The whole time there's been this underlying question about who is actually making the hard calls, and when it came down to it in this episode, it was Rick. To force the issue and kill a bunch of people he didn't know and couldn't relate to was the easy call, and it was a short-sighted decision at that. Finally, when he was confronted with somebody he had to humanize, he couldn't do the hard thing anymore. After leading the charge against Hershel's zombies, he can't bring himself to kill a zombified Sophia, and worse yet he forced somebody else to clean up his mess. This point needs to be capitalized for this episode. A lot of people seem to be mulling over the lack of any emotional attachment to the girl Sophia - but honestly the fact that a child turned into a zombie wasn't going through my head when I watched that scene. It was what Scribble neatly summarized. | ||
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p4NDemik
United States13896 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:22 Uncultured wrote: Pandemik If you haven't felt anything for the characters and hate the plot so much, how do you stick through it? Honestly I just stop watching shows I feel that way about. I think the show is good for many of the opposite reasons you think it's bad. I feel for most of those characters so it's awesome watching a show about them, with zombies. Sure, every once in a while there an unrealistic scene. But hell, it's a zombie show. These small issues hardly ruin anything for me. I never said I've always felt nothing towards the entire cast. Daryl has been pretty compelling this season, and I like Glen and Maggie. Dale, Rick, and Shane are passable and have/had potential. Lori, Carol, Andrea, T-Dog, Carl, Hershel, and the rest of the farm group (spare Maggie) are all pretty worthless though. But I'm mostly still watching because the best arc of the comic is coming up right after this, so I'm clinging on the hope that they'll adapt that in a half-way decent fashion. That and I rode through the entirety of season one and the beginning of two on the excitement the pilot generated for me. I figured I've invested this much time I might as well see it through the best part of the comics. I totally forgot, I almost laughed out loud at the T-Dog "OH SHIT!" line this episode. Just kill him off already and make room for a dynamic, strong, black lead ... it's getting sad what they're doing with that character. At least Glen is a fairly strong positive minority lead even if they still play off a lot of the asian stereotypes. | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:56 wolfhead wrote: This point needs to be capitalized for this episode. A lot of people seem to be mulling over the lack of any emotional attachment to the girl Sophia - but honestly the fact that a child turned into a zombie wasn't going through my head when I watched that scene. It was what Scribble neatly summarized. So when you saw Sophia come out, you didn't have a single emotion on your face? Honestly, no "Oh shit! Did not expect that" came across your mind? I mean people say stuff like this which makes the show portray depth so then it's a great show right? But is this what really what the writers of the show intended for the audience to think? Because pandemik would so say otherwise. | ||
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ImFromPortugal
Portugal1368 Posts
On November 28 2011 16:03 matiK23 wrote: So when you saw Sophia come out, you were didn't have a single emotion on your face. Honestly, no "Oh shit!" came across your mind? I mean people say stuff like this which makes the show portray depth so then it's a great show right? But is this what really what the writers of the show intended for the audience to think? Because pandemik would so say otherwise. i was like "OMG O_O" lol great episode : ) | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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mufin
United States616 Posts
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p4NDemik
United States13896 Posts
On November 28 2011 15:54 matiK23 wrote: Negative shit like this. You don't speak for the audience. Matter of fact, I'm sure you're the boring 1 percent who feels this way. As if a mother losing her own child isn't enough for the audience to feel sympathy. The fact that Sophia's mom just came out of an abusive relationship does not effect you? Maybe it's because you can't relate to her, but you can relate to bad ass motherfucker Daryl? Are you a self-sufficient, sometimes philosophical, but not too soft, crossbow-wielding BAMF too? There's no need to get so up-in-arms. The last few weeks I've read comments in this thread and elsewhere in reviews that express they wish they'd just leave the girl for dead, and a frustration with the search, leading me to believe there was very little investment in the girl, and thus not much of a pay off when she died, which seems like a reasonable assumption to me. If people really felt crushed that she died I apologize, but I'm pretty sure most are just relieved that she's dead so the rest of the story can move along. I'm not incapable of feeling sympathy and loss. I've seen good dramas that have just about brought me to tears at the death of mostly ancillary characters. This didn't come anywhere close to that stuff. It hardly made me feel anything, which I feel is a problem. + Show Spoiler [The Wire S1 Spoilers] + http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hor_gOBU_GU FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU  | ||
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