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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
On May 08 2013 11:26 renfree wrote: I hear this tale for more than a year, it never gets old. Right? I think it's pretty fair to say that Na'Vi doesn't give a fuck about online tournaments. They've even slacked off in Starladder with the opposition getting tougher. I would definitely not bet against them on LAN against anyone in the West bar maybe NTH though. | ||
Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
If they lose they lose because they don't care, if they win its because they are that good that they still win despite not caring. Atleast that is what I have heard quite often, then they shut us all up at a LAN event. | ||
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
At TI2 they definitely could have played the early days better, and maybe if they'd practiced more they would've beaten iG, but that run was damn impressive given how little was expected of them following their online results. | ||
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teapoted
United Kingdom24425 Posts
1. Na'Vi play extremely well online for the most part. They have some matches they play poorly. 2. Na'Vi don't play perfectly on Lan or crush every Lan they go to. Pretty much exactly the same as online. Do they care more about Lan than Online? Probably. Do they 'change into some different team when they play on Lan'? No. Na'Vi play about the same on Lan, while several teams play worse. People seem to forget every Lan Na'Vi doesn't win. And even at EMS One which is the only Lan they've performed well in since like 2 StarLadder's ago. They only played Fnatic/Mouz/Rox which is quite frankly not a great indicator of anything. | ||
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
It's easy to say that Na'Vi have only performed well at one LAN when there haven't been many to begin with in the recent past. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
Besides, they have a pretty changed roster this time around, so it still remains to be seen whether they get the same (or even nearly the same) big event LAN chemistry going. | ||
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teapoted
United Kingdom24425 Posts
TI2 group stages. Every Dreamhack ever. Asus final battle. I didn't say they performed bad. I said they didn't crush. They played as they play online, for the most part. Again. People need to get over this stupid idea. Na'Vi are good online, they've won tons online. They are good on Lan, they've won tons on Lan. They haven't won everything or played terribly in either. So stop making excuses for when they play bad online and say that wouldn't happen on Lan. Who beat Na'Vi at dreamhack? EG. If we had as many Lan matches as we had online matches we'd have more of these examples. I'm ignoring games where they show up 60 minutes late with 3 stand-ins and pick 4 carries and clearly have no interest in playing, that's a different story and rarely applicable. | ||
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Seraphic
United States3849 Posts
Na'Vi in general have shown, in LANs, they WILL show up no matter what. There are a few cases of them failing and in general they accept that they just didn't practice or do well enough. In most other cases, like EMS, they shown up, dropped 1 game total all the way to the title. Yes they didn't play Alliance, but that was Alliance's fault for losing to mouz 0-2. I'm not making excuses for Na'Vi, but you are right on the lack of LANs. I don't know what happened at ASUS, maybe that was the patch. But in regards to their old line-up, you should at least at the end, put a question mark when they don't preform. TI2 group stages, LD and others said this already, Puppey was sick, they didn't play well and it showed. But what happened at the end? They placed 2nd and were the only Western Team to beat each and one of the Top Chinese teams at least once in a BO3. Who else can even say that? I don't make excuses for Na'Vi when they lose, nor do I care for Na'Vi fans who do, but they are a LAN team. Even their CS team is a LAN team. It's just how they play, they feed off of the crowd, they play better when they are next to each other. It isn't anything new in esports. | ||
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teapoted
United Kingdom24425 Posts
TI2 group stages, LD and others said this already, Puppey was sick, they didn't play well and it showed. But what happened at the end? They placed 2nd and were the only Western Team to beat each and one of the Top Chinese teams at least once in a BO3. Who else can even say that? What else can be said? They played 3 very close matches against Chinese teams who didn't know how to play against them. I don't believe in this whole "in the end they make it and that's what matters", they could have very easily gotten knocked into the losers bracket given how those games played out. If you want a real idea of their strength on Lan then you have to look at the group stages as well.Either way, this is a stupid argument. I've made the point that Na'Vi aren't that different online and Lan and people just want to give excuses for every Lan tournament they don't win while online if they don't win 'they didn't care'. It's gotten silly. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On May 08 2013 17:26 Seraphic wrote: Na'Vi in general have shown, in LANs, they WILL show up no matter what. This statement is inconsistent with the rest of your post. You can't claim they perform "no matter what", and then go on to outline all the numerous "whats" that have caused them to perform badly. | ||
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hfglgg
Germany5372 Posts
On May 08 2013 16:30 wherebugsgo wrote: At what LANs have Na'Vi performed badly? Techlabs? Hardly so, since those were BO1's and the event was riddled with technical issues. It's easy to say that Na'Vi have only performed well at one LAN when there haven't been many to begin with in the recent past. dreamhacks for example. navis lan-record isnt all that flawless. edit: navis winrate online is still bigger than everyones else and probably even higher than their lan winrate. but yeah navi fanboys will make up excuses for every single bad game navi has... | ||
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Seraphic
United States3849 Posts
If you don't, then you want to find any excuse to dislike them. If you like them, you just defend them. It won't matter in the end for me, really. | ||
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teapoted
United Kingdom24425 Posts
On May 08 2013 19:15 Seraphic wrote: Don't be ridiculous. Me, and I'm sure those who made similar comments, don't dislike Na'Vi. It's just facing reality that the image that they have isn't all that true. If anything I've complimented them by saying that they've in the past performed just as well online as they have on Lan, which people seem to forget just as easily as they forget them playing poorly on Lan.I'll end it with this because regardless, with Na'Vi you either like them or you don't. I'm a fan due to their CS team, DotA 2 came a long time after for me. If you don't, then you want to find any excuse to dislike them. If you like them, you just defend them. It won't matter in the end for me, really. It's not about liking or disliking a team, at all. It's about, as a fan, accepting losses and acknowledging the achievement of the other team. | ||
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Luftmensch
277 Posts
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Kraznaya
United States3711 Posts
On May 08 2013 20:52 Luftmensch wrote: Why does it say QPAD vs Dignitas in the calendar on the right instead of Kaipi vs Dignitas? EternaLEnVy @EternaLEnVy1991 6h Kaipi will not be playing the WePlay Tournament due to scheduling issues with the new roster. Sorry to everyone who wanted to see us play | ||
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hfglgg
Germany5372 Posts
On May 08 2013 19:15 Seraphic wrote: I'll end it with this because regardless, with Na'Vi you either like them or you don't. I'm a fan due to their CS team, DotA 2 came a long time after for me. If you don't, then you want to find any excuse to dislike them. If you like them, you just defend them. It won't matter in the end for me, really. as teapoted said, its not about liking or disliking them its about see the things how they are. (on a sidenot: if my football team plays bad because "they do not care" i would not support that team anymore if the management does not fire all those players immediatly. but that has nothing to do with the teams, but with the dota community). back in late 2011 / early 2012 navi had an aura of invincible to them and they played really weird heroes in important matches which looked like they can win every game when they only cared enough. people still have that mindset for some reason. in reality, navi isnt the team playing on a totally different level than everyone else anymore. they are beatable and and lose games like everyone else. be it because they have a bad day or the opponent has a good day. they are still a very strong team and have recently proofed that by winning the ems as well as doing ok-ish against alliance in the g1 league qualifier (although they lost 2-1). but they lose games and they lose games because even if they care about the matches they play worse than the opponent. those things happen, no team is unbeatable and it doesnt need excuses for that. | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On May 08 2013 19:15 Seraphic wrote: I'll end it with this because regardless, with Na'Vi you either like them or you don't. I'm a fan due to their CS team, DotA 2 came a long time after for me. If you don't, then you want to find any excuse to dislike them. If you like them, you just defend them. It won't matter in the end for me, really. When Na`Vi loses and people say well Na`Vi doesn't care about online tournaments it sort of devalues the win by the other team. | ||
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weiliem
2071 Posts
On May 08 2013 19:15 Seraphic wrote: I'll end it with this because regardless, with Na'Vi you either like them or you don't. I'm a fan due to their CS team, DotA 2 came a long time after for me. If you don't, then you want to find any excuse to dislike them. If you like them, you just defend them. It won't matter in the end for me, really. This comment itself is so biased. When u dislike them, its find excuses but when u defend them u dont? And yet u gave out so many excuses to defend them. lol. Though I still feel the magic in NaVi and strongly believe that they will perform well in TI3. But finding excuses for their past bad performance is just not the way..... | ||
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Dexington
Canada7276 Posts
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cecek
Czech Republic18921 Posts
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