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On August 12 2013 16:20 sumsaR wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 14:49 opterown wrote:On August 12 2013 14:40 sumsaR wrote:
The 'Fountain Hook' was an unintended consequence of mechanics, but Valve/icefrog liked it and kept it. It won't be "fixed", because it's now a part of the game. Like many things before it. Neutral creep stacking? That was an unintended bug from the start that was kept because it was a mechanic that was liked. Many of the 'features' that you nowadays see as a part of dota started as an unintended bug, just like fountain hooks. It won't go away, just like stacking didn't. the hook itself won't be fixed, but the visual problem is very much a bug. there's a reason why valve stopped navi from using it further, as well as only showcasing one of those hooks as a highlight. if it was such a play i'm sure they would have top10'd more fountain hooks than just one random one on mu. Yes, the visual bug needs to be fixed, agreed. But the mechanics are here to stay, as it's not been removed even though it's been known since 2011. Sadly many (new to dota, I'd assume) people are under the impression that it's a bug that's being exploited and that needs to be fixed sooner rather than later.
Dude, the mechanic is almost 100% going to be removed. Various pro players according to Synderen have stated that they were very upset with how Navi won that game. Even Puppey himself was pretty hesitant to say that their victory was 'legitimate' in an interview regarding the fountain hooking, as he described abusing the bug as 'hardcore.' If a vast majority of pro players at TI were upset about it, I'm sure it's gonna get removed.
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What's up with the Grand Finals not having any advantage for the Upper Bracket winners by the way? It's a double elim bracket, but the UB winners are at an disadvantage because they don't get that "free loss" the LB winners get. Should have been one game up from the start or something.
On August 12 2013 16:26 superstartran wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:20 sumsaR wrote:On August 12 2013 14:49 opterown wrote:On August 12 2013 14:40 sumsaR wrote:
The 'Fountain Hook' was an unintended consequence of mechanics, but Valve/icefrog liked it and kept it. It won't be "fixed", because it's now a part of the game. Like many things before it. Neutral creep stacking? That was an unintended bug from the start that was kept because it was a mechanic that was liked. Many of the 'features' that you nowadays see as a part of dota started as an unintended bug, just like fountain hooks. It won't go away, just like stacking didn't. the hook itself won't be fixed, but the visual problem is very much a bug. there's a reason why valve stopped navi from using it further, as well as only showcasing one of those hooks as a highlight. if it was such a play i'm sure they would have top10'd more fountain hooks than just one random one on mu. Yes, the visual bug needs to be fixed, agreed. But the mechanics are here to stay, as it's not been removed even though it's been known since 2011. Sadly many (new to dota, I'd assume) people are under the impression that it's a bug that's being exploited and that needs to be fixed sooner rather than later. Dude, the mechanic is almost 100% going to be removed. Various pro players according to Synderen have stated that they were very upset with how Navi won that game. Even Puppey himself was pretty hesitant to say that their victory was 'legitimate' in an interview regarding the fountain hooking, as he described abusing the bug as 'hardcore.' If a vast majority of pro players at TI were upset about it, I'm sure it's gonna get removed.
Some people have been upset with it since 2011. It's now a feature. It won't get removed.
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On August 12 2013 16:26 superstartran wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:20 sumsaR wrote:On August 12 2013 14:49 opterown wrote:On August 12 2013 14:40 sumsaR wrote:
The 'Fountain Hook' was an unintended consequence of mechanics, but Valve/icefrog liked it and kept it. It won't be "fixed", because it's now a part of the game. Like many things before it. Neutral creep stacking? That was an unintended bug from the start that was kept because it was a mechanic that was liked. Many of the 'features' that you nowadays see as a part of dota started as an unintended bug, just like fountain hooks. It won't go away, just like stacking didn't. the hook itself won't be fixed, but the visual problem is very much a bug. there's a reason why valve stopped navi from using it further, as well as only showcasing one of those hooks as a highlight. if it was such a play i'm sure they would have top10'd more fountain hooks than just one random one on mu. Yes, the visual bug needs to be fixed, agreed. But the mechanics are here to stay, as it's not been removed even though it's been known since 2011. Sadly many (new to dota, I'd assume) people are under the impression that it's a bug that's being exploited and that needs to be fixed sooner rather than later. Dude, the mechanic is almost 100% going to be removed. Various pro players according to Synderen have stated that they were very upset with how Navi won that game. Even Puppey himself was pretty hesitant to say that their victory was 'legitimate' in an interview regarding the fountain hooking, as he described abusing the bug as 'hardcore.' If a vast majority of pro players at TI were upset about it, I'm sure it's gonna get removed.
There's equally abusive exploits in the game which are game changing. No other team can do fountain hooks like Na'Vi can, its an incredibly difficult maneuver and Na'Vi practiced fountain hooking alone for days on end.
Its easy to prevent, ban pudge or chen. This is why we have picks and bans.
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On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them...
Of all reasons to want them to loose.
I JUST HAPPEN NOT TO LIKE x's HAIR, FUCK DAT TEAM
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Russian Federation3338 Posts
I think Na'Vi have the best skilled players in the world right now... However, all too often throughout this tournament, I was face palming because their decision-making isn't up to par with their skill... I think they have the best team fight, but small mistakes (they get one or two supports picked off alone) lead to bigger ones (they don't react to the pick offs and then get a core attacked, when they panic and then just one by one try to rescue) resulting in the losses... Of course I'm not saying it's always the case, but I felt like they grouped up together when they could see [A] spread out farming, and they spread out when they had no vision of the opponents... [A] has such great decision making; can't put my finger on it but their play seems the most calculated in the scene right now... With ganking, buy backs, rosh timings, pushes, and if need be, rat dota...
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On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them...
You could see his hair in the intro picture/video, man. Though with a cap on, but still. Pretty visible and no hood.
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On August 12 2013 16:27 sumsaR wrote:
What's up with the Grand Finals not having any advantage for the Upper Bracket winners by the way? It's a double elim bracket, but the UB winners are at an disadvantage because they don't get that "free loss" the LB winners get. Should have been one game up from the start or something.
Yeah, I somewhat agree, but you can make various arguments as to the pros and cons. For example, many tournaments are swiss, where a 10-0 player has no advantage over a 8-2 player entering the elimination matches, beyond seeding. In a tournament like the GSL, the group stages might cause certain players to have different records entering the finals. Basically, the format of TI3 was double elimination to reach the finals, after which it became single elim.
The only problem I really had with the format is the large amount of Bo1's and Bo3's. No series should EVER be decided by a Bo1 in a million dollar tournament, and Bo3 in WF/LF is pretty questionable as well. But Valve is investing a lot into the tournament for spectator hype, and that's what this format provides.
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On August 12 2013 16:20 Bisu-Fan wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:49 toemn wrote:On August 12 2013 13:40 EFermi wrote:On August 12 2013 13:33 toemn wrote:On August 12 2013 13:31 EFermi wrote:On August 12 2013 13:20 BoZiffer wrote:
Man. I honestly feel like no other event can match this hype. The International has to be the gold standard of eSports. Huh? The final game was great but what was so special about the event itself? Definitely not the introduction nor winners cemeronies. The production was better than the last 20 cheaply produced SC2 events combined. Get over it, deal with it. A new era has begun. TB and Artosis switching is only the beginning.  The awards ceremony was much more anticlimactic than the last GSL. Ok, fine. The ending ceremony (0.001% of the whole tournament) could have been done a little bit better. How about the game scheduling with less games played per day? Instead of 5 days how bout like 7 days?
last year it was gaben who celebrated the winners giving them the trophy, this time alliance saw it there and just ran and grabbed it lol. Sure is the prize ceremony has always been quite anticlimactic at The International
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On August 12 2013 16:32 sumsaR wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them... You could see his hair in the intro picture/video, man. Though with a cap on, but still. Pretty visible and no hood.
But why would anyone play with two layers of hats under their headphones? How soundproof is that?
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Ideally the Grand Finals should have used the model the FGC uses for their double elim brackets, with a 'win two BOx if coming from lower bracket or one BOx if coming from upper bracket' grand final. That would have been too time consuming, though, with BO5s.
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Russian Federation3338 Posts
On August 12 2013 16:27 sumsaR wrote:
What's up with the Grand Finals not having any advantage for the Upper Bracket winners by the way? It's a double elim bracket, but the UB winners are at an disadvantage because they don't get that "free loss" the LB winners get. Should have been one game up from the start or something.
What form of an advantage would you give the winner's bracket finalist? I'm not saying it's not warranted, but I find it hard to find a good balance of reward for winners bracket finals vs insurmountable advantage for someone who's already made it to the winner's bracket final... Genuinely curious because Na'Vi lost last year when they were in [A]'s place, and I think the responses were a bit stronger because iG won. However, I kinda like the system right now: the winner's bracket finalist get extra time to rest and study their opponents..
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On August 12 2013 16:35 Zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:32 sumsaR wrote:On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them... You could see his hair in the intro picture/video, man. Though with a cap on, but still. Pretty visible and no hood. But why would anyone play with two layers of hats under their headphones? How soundproof is that?
When you are competing under the weight of all that pressure, something like a familiar hoodie or hat can really help to calm your nerves, and it can make a big difference. Criticizing someone for wearing a hoodie during a tournament is absolutely idiotic if that's what they feel comfortable wearing.
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On August 12 2013 16:35 Zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:32 sumsaR wrote:On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them... You could see his hair in the intro picture/video, man. Though with a cap on, but still. Pretty visible and no hood. But why would anyone play with two layers of hats under their headphones? How soundproof is that?
Why would anyone play with a plushie mascot? Why would anyone play with a warm sweater indoors? Why would anyone hang their jacket on the chair before playing? Everyone's got different 'rituals' and things that make them more comfortable or that are 'supersticious' practices.
I, for example, can't play unless my chair's in a specific height or else I feel my arm position is uncomfortable. We've all got such small things in different aspects of our lives.
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Sweden and Korea the top E-sport nations in the World. Channel 6 in sweden has started to broadcast dota 2 btw
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Russian Federation3338 Posts
On August 12 2013 16:30 Iplaythings wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them... Of all reasons to want them to loose. I JUST HAPPEN NOT TO LIKE x's HAIR, FUCK DAT TEAM
But I was thinking a similar thing of "Why does EGM have to wear that hoodie..." and "ugh Loda's hat is rubbing me the wrong way." Of course as a Na'Vi fan i might be biased; however, I am from Russia and I've hated the teenagers are all hip-hop punk-styled with the hats/hoodies, way too baggy pants, smug face expression, and normally racist attitudes... Maybe The Alliance are just reminding me of all the parts of Russia (and I've been to Finland, which was only a 3 hour drive away, and Sweden >10 times) I did not like whereas Na'Vi are reminding me of the friendlier, cheerful people I played dota with in the computer LAN clubs.
EDIT: clarification, no it was not solely because of their fashion I hate [A]... It's just a contributing factor that reinforces my choice to root against them.
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Just watched the vod of game 5. Na'vi played well and Alliance in all honesty were losing it. But s4 really stepped his game up with those sick coils. Those splitpushes were also some examples of great decision making. Perhaps Navi would've got it if they'd played less aggressively, but they didn't and in all honesty, the (slightly) better team won. Congratulations to Alliance!
s4 mvp of the match
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On August 12 2013 16:36 sumsaR wrote:
Ideally the Grand Finals should have used the model the FGC uses for their double elim brackets, with a 'win two BOx if coming from lower bracket or one BOx if coming from upper bracket' grand final. That would have been too time consuming, though, with BO5s.
IPL4 did this and the finals dragged on for way too long, it was anticlimactic.
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Well anyway congrats to Alliance and Navi for giving us a worthy finals. Hope Team America wins it next year :')
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On August 12 2013 16:43 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:36 sumsaR wrote:
Ideally the Grand Finals should have used the model the FGC uses for their double elim brackets, with a 'win two BOx if coming from lower bracket or one BOx if coming from upper bracket' grand final. That would have been too time consuming, though, with BO5s. IPL4 did this and the finals dragged on for way too long, it was anticlimactic.
That's the issue with potentially long games, yes. The fighting games does it well because games are so short.
It IS the most fair method, though.
A game advantage being the less ideal choice, but better than no advantage at all. I'd figure a BO9 where the UB winner has a 2 game advantage could work well. UB winner needs to win 3 games and LB winner would need to win 5 games. In effect win 1 bo5 (for UB winner) or win almost 2 bo5 (for LB winner). Potentially 8 games might be a bit much though, so perhaps a Bo7 with a 1/2 game advantage would be more time effective.
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On August 12 2013 16:42 Bisu-Fan wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 16:30 Iplaythings wrote:On August 12 2013 16:24 Zeo wrote:
I just wanted Alliance to lose because of Loda's hat and EGM never taking that hoodie off... Has anyone ever seen his hair? Whats up with that? They even put their headphones over them... Of all reasons to want them to loose. I JUST HAPPEN NOT TO LIKE x's HAIR, FUCK DAT TEAM But I was thinking a similar thing of "Why does EGM have to wear that hoodie..." and "ugh Loda's hat is rubbing me the wrong way." Of course as a Na'Vi fan i might be biased; however, I am from Russia and I've hated the teenagers are all hip-hop punk-styled with the hats/hoodies, way too baggy pants, smug face expression, and normally racist attitudes... Maybe The Alliance are just reminding me of all the parts of Russia (and I've been to Finland, which was only a 3 hour drive away, and Sweden >10 times) I did not like whereas Na'Vi are reminding me of the friendlier, cheerful people I played dota with in the computer LAN clubs. EDIT: clarification, no it was not solely because of their fashion I hate [A]... It's just a contributing factor that reinforces my choice to root against them.
loda wears the hat because he's going bald, he used to play without it
given how much he seems to like his hair, i cant blame him for having problems dealing with the loss of it
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EPT
