EPTInstead, he's pushed with better consistent survivability early-midgame and better non-Chrono fight contribution without being insanely farmed.
[Hero] Faceless Void - Page 16
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
Instead, he's pushed with better consistent survivability early-midgame and better non-Chrono fight contribution without being insanely farmed. | ||
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Wineandbread
United States2065 Posts
You can conditionally absorb damage with time walk if they focus you, or you get a good time dilation off which would have been like 'landing' a time walk pre6.86. I assume the whole idea is a) try to get team to focus you, b) after they use spells on you, turn around and Q, c) time dilation and try to get your team to follow up That entirely revolves around you surviving the skills they use on you though I guess he would want to build tanky early then? Maybe treads, drum? | ||
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
You would blink in chrono first, and get a potential pick off Or if no chrono just run in and try to hit shit You would then use time dilation, maybe even while inside the chrono Enemy would try to then burst you because you're out of position, but they cannot chain combos or stuns, you time-walk away the damage I believe the new build would be focused on increasing health and fighting potential. Blink/Armlet/Treads/Wand is my take. You would use toggle along with time walk to reset damage. Then build BKB wait they can still chain combo and stun you. this hero makes no sense then. | ||
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
Looking at the cooldown: Timewalk: 24/18/12/6 Time Dilation: 34/28/22/16 Basically they are both kind of blow. If you use timewalk to initiate you might just be dead. Iono still seems kind of a shit hiro to use | ||
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Archeon
3253 Posts
Tbh I think timewalk is really good now, because it leaves the opponent in the situation to either try to burst and end up loosing a lot of damage, or to ignore a hero with that kind of initiation power. I think the main problem is that he deals no damage and lacks flash farm. He definitely needs a force or blink dagger and lots of damage from other sources. I think something like void+phoenix might become a thing, with either of the two as offlaner and the other one as support. | ||
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synapse
China13814 Posts
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
Say you lane a void, you hit lvl 6, what does your skill set look like? His skillset looks a lot like ember, where it's really good on high level but really shit on low level. So ideally you would max out 1 skill first and leave the other at 1 point. For ember the choice is simple. Flameguard is fucking OP at lower level so you max that first. But what do you even max first as a void? Max timewalk first, in early game you have no hp they'll burst you down, plus you deal no damage Max time dilation first, okay you have a 20 second cd on timewalk, good luck running up to ppl and (maybe) silence them, also you deal no damage Max stun first, before your time-walk has 700 range lvl1, AND it slows, now you have a super short range timewalk and need to cast the time dilation for a possbility of slow. Pray to rnjesus? Now you're super squish and without timewalk to offset. It just seems like he's a squish hero that can't do anything beside a huge cd chrono, which he can't really initiate because of a 550 range leap. He wants other ppl to hit him yet he has no hp, he deals no damage and need to run at people to maybe slow them if they cast a spell. Compare that to void before patch. You can just offlane, buy pms or vanguard even, max out back-track and hurp durp in the lane for no cost. lvl1 time walk wonder point for chrono ganks and farm out some jungles with mask of madness into a semi=legit carry anyways. Maybe someone would figure out how to use him. But it just seems he's very awkward hero, he wants people to dump spells on him yet he's no bristleback. edit: maybe mid or safelane. I don't know. I think he'll be super fun to play still with armlet etc but doesn't seem very viable. I don't really know how strong 10% movement speed slow actually is. | ||
CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
I feel he's a bad choice as an offlaner. He needs too many items to do what others can do with 1-2. Not to mention he lacks the combination potential that's a staple of even the greedier offlaners. On December 18 2015 05:37 Blackfeather wrote: I think the main problem is that he deals no damage and lacks flash farm. He definitely needs a force or blink dagger and lots of damage from other sources. He does plenty of damage at level 7 if you inflate his AS with MoM. But Time Lock damage hits a wall after a certain point and his AGI gain is mediocre. Not to mention supports can afford defensive items in this patch, so you can't stick on MoM if you want to kill them going into the lategame. If you go Blink Dagger you might as well farm Aghs. You won't be doing any relevant damage in a team fight. On December 18 2015 06:01 evanthebouncy! wrote: Compare that to void before patch. You can just offlane, buy pms or vanguard even, max out back-track and hurp durp in the lane for no cost. lvl1 time walk wonder point for chrono ganks and farm out some jungles with mask of madness into a semi=legit carry anyways. Maybe someone would figure out how to use him. But it just seems he's very awkward hero. Well, pre-patch Void wouldn't work now for a number of reasons anyway. On December 18 2015 06:01 evanthebouncy! wrote: edit: maybe mid or safelane. I don't know. I think he'll be super fun to play still with armlet etc but doesn't seem very viable. I don't really know how strong 10% movement speed slow actually is. It's shit. Better with Oov, but still bad. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 18 2015 06:03 CosmicSpiral wrote: It's shit. Better with Oov, but still bad. It's 10% per spell CD locked. Which means it's only going to kick in strong later when you can get like 30%+ slows for locking people out of a full rotation. | ||
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On December 18 2015 06:19 TheYango wrote: TBH the biggest problem with offlane is that he's actually a WORSE ganker from offlane for pressuring mid than he was before because Time Walk's range is shit now and Time Dilation does nothing if the enemy has no spells on CD. It's 10% per spell CD locked. Which means it's only going to kick in strong later when you can get like 30%+ slows for locking people out of a full rotation. Don't think he even qualifies as a ganker anymore rofl. The cumulative effect is fine if you can time it correctly without dying. Since it's both MS and AS slow, I imagine you'd want to stack the debuff with another one while having enough survivability to force a retreat. Skadi might work (orb + stats) if one can find a decent enough farming build. There's also the problem of mana pool. If this new version wants to be relevant in a fight, he needs to expend a lot more mana than he did before. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
Like Time Dilation would be great to lock down blinking targets... except you have no way to chase them when they blink without going like blink + force (lol) and it only helps delay the 2nd blink. And for Ember & Storm their fake blinks don't have cool downs to exploit anyways. It almost seems like instead of being a slow you'd want time dilation to give Faceless Void increase AS/MS so he would be a good counter initiator. But even then that only partially works because BKB would block the time dilation. Still maybe the hero would have some use against QoP by being able to rewind/dodge the ult damage then lock her out of escaping without having to devout the ulty. | ||
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BoZiffer
United States1841 Posts
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
On December 18 2015 10:32 BoZiffer wrote: Waga played him with RoA, Diffusal, manta on stream today. Looked interesting but he had a nice early start with a super solid support. safelane? i mean this guy is like... if u run him as carry he doesn't do enough damage (glimmer cape owns him) and if you run him offlane he has crap gank. | ||
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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Shock710
Australia6097 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
I want to try some tanky builds for early team fighting. I think he is to item hungry to be a carry sadly, and I don't know where this new Time Dilation fits in. | ||
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On December 18 2015 20:47 ahswtini wrote: doesnt chrono reveal stealth?? Yes, but the magic resistance makes Time Lock useless. On December 19 2015 00:35 Plansix wrote: Time walk seems crappy, but if they lack lock down that is longer than 2 seconds, void can shrug off almost any damage. I've seen a couple pro streamers just dance a fight taking almost no damage and being able lane forever with minor health and mana regen. I want to try some tanky builds for early team fighting. I think he is to item hungry to be a carry sadly, and I don't know where this new Time Dilation fits in. I've had decent success with Mjolnir -> Skadi/Manta. For him to be useful as a carry, I think non-BKB item builds are necessary. Hero would be decent if they returned his MS/AS slow. No idea why Icefrog thought it was so important to remove those traits. | ||
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tehh4ck3r
Magrathea7043 Posts
On December 19 2015 04:59 CosmicSpiral wrote: Yes, but the magic resistance makes Time Lock useless. I've had decent success with Mjolnir -> Skadi/Manta. For him to be useful as a carry, I think non-BKB item builds are necessary. Hero would be decent if they returned his MS/AS slow. No idea why Icefrog thought it was so important to remove those traits. I'd rather have the full range on time walk back rather than the MS/AS slow | ||
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Belisarius
Australia6230 Posts
As a 1pos he needs to itemise damage, mobility and bulk. I feel like the intention was to create a fighting core by adding some AoE CC, but compared to gyro etc. chrono's cd is just way too long and his combat buildup doesn't seem smooth. I've had a bit of success rushing midas from safelane with proper support - levels seem really important for him - or just going Treads/RoA/mael etc. Every game the lane has been contested at all, I've been useless. I feel like I need at least 2k more than the other carry to compete. idk. MoM seems especially awkward. More than ever he wants that powerspike to be able to kill things in chrono, but living through lockdown to timewalk it off is almost impossible with mask on. As an offlaner he's okay, and timewalk does make him very hard to kill, but it doesn't work against sustained harass and he's quite easy to zone. Even if he gets a free 6 he still only contributes once every 2 minutes, and hits like a wet noodle unless his lane was so easy he could max timelock first. Blink rush seems okay out of offlane and MoM is more forgivable since if I get blown up after chrono I'm at least not the main carry... but mostly I've just ended up wishing I'd picked magnus or something. If I were to describe him in a single word, that word would be "awkward". | ||
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