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Hey guys!
I'm currently having trouble with my Night Stalker...
I just want to say I'm still a noob, but I really want to learn more...
I also understand that Night Stalker is a really good hero, though I can't seem to win with him...
My record with Night Stalker in pubs is 2 wins and 8 losses, so I began to worry.
Starting items are 2 gaunts, 2 branches, tango and salve.
Basically I know how to last hit and lane. By night time I can get my boots of speed and urn of shadows finished.
I can kill at the very least 4 heroes by the end of the first night, though I seem kinda lost on what to do next.
Item Build:
Starting: Mentioned above.
Staple: Phase boots, dominator, urn of shadows, battle fury, bkb, skull basher
Luxuries: Divine(friend says so. never dropped it once when using NS), AC, AB, Daedalus, Dagon, Aghanim's
What am I doing wrong? Please help...
PS: Basically I want to carry the team though they're doing poorly. Tips and tricks on where to go/what to do at night/day, who to kill, item suggestions are greatly appreciated.
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konadora
Singapore66155 Posts
dominator and battle fury are not good items on night stalker because he's more of a lockdown hero in teamfights instead of a huge rightclicking hero like antimage or void. balanar isn't a farming-oriented hero like antimage, lone druid or pl either. instead, what you would want are tanking items (BKB, heart, armlet) and/or some utility items (aghanims, casual cloak, sange -> heaven's halberd etc). in teamfights, what you want to do is to lockdown carries (with silence or void slow) or pick off supports quickly or providing the initiation for teamfight by turning on ult, using bkb and charging in, making space for your other heroes (magnus, panda etc) to follow up.
a bottle is more or less a must on night stalker as he does suffer a bit from lack of mana pool/regen. treads is also a better item for this same reason (switching from str treads to int treads when needed).
after the first night, you should be trying to create pressure along lanes, especially on supports. don't be afraid to use ur ult if you can get a pickoff, even on a support. depending on what your team needs (more tank if there isn't one who can charge in, such as heart or bkb, or aghanims if you are playing push-style and you want map control).
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Go mid with 1 tango 3 branches. Buy bottle asap
Go treads + bottle + magic wand + urn
Get BKB and then there are a lot of viable options. Like skull basher / armlet / heart / heavens halbeard / agh scepter etc All depending on what you face
First and Second night are 2 very important moments for you. Especially first night (in pubs). That's when you have quite high moevement speed and supports barely even have boots at this point. Try to get as much kills as possible during this phase.
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Thanks for the inputs guys! Really appreciate it! Especially the Heaven's halberd part...never thought of that item before...
Just a few things...
First, NS really doesn't need lifesteal? All inputs don't mention lifesteal.
Second, how do you deal with jukes as NS?
Third, what is usually done when it's daytime as NS? Kinda lost in this part...
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You don't need Lifesteal with Urn and Bottle, if you need Lifesteal in fights, that won't do much since you don't have high damage for Lifesteal to matters. Lifesteal can be good if you go to the late game, so you already have full inventory, but on NS I would still go with the Heart.
You can gank even when it is daytime, it is just harder. You usually sit on the lane, and farm when it is daytime. Also, if you have trouble on the lane, don't hesitate to use first spell for very needed last hit, since it has very low mana cost, and you need that early bottle.
About leveling up, you should have 2-1-2 at level 5, or 3-1-1, but at level 6 you shouldn't level up ulti, since night will come around that time, and you can level it up next level.
What do you mean by Jukes? I mean, it is not different than with every other hero at day, and at night, you are faster than them + you have Silence and Slow.
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On March 24 2013 21:13 Checkm8 wrote:
Thanks for the inputs guys! Really appreciate it! Especially the Heaven's halberd part...never thought of that item before...
Just a few things...
First, NS really doesn't need lifesteal? All inputs don't mention lifesteal.
Second, how do you deal with jukes as NS?
Third, what is usually done when it's daytime as NS? Kinda lost in this part...
I farm during the day, unless my team really needs me or if i can see a support on his way to ward
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Jukes , you mean after you start with Void, supporter tend to teleport?
If that so , u can start auto attacking + silence on supporter so that he cant jukes tele you (mindgames) 
for jukes spot. its all about experience and play more as NS or any ganking train hero
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Aghanim's scepter is so amazingly good on NS if game heads toward the later stages of the game. Vision is key.
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On March 24 2013 23:06 Unleashing wrote:
Aghanim's scepter is so amazingly good on NS if game heads toward the later stages of the game. Vision is key.
True, you see 1/4 of the map lol(not really but you still see a lot). :D
But to be honest, if they don't have high damage spells or too many disables, you can rush straight for the Aghanim, using only Urn and Treads for HP.
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After the first night cycle, you have to decide what your team needs. NS is more of a utility hero after the first 2 nights of ganking cause he loses effectiveness. There are usually 2 main build, tanking/initiation or map control.
Tanking/initiation build you want to go for cheap cost effective items since NS is naturally quite beefy to start with. Armlet + bkb is generally a good choice as you want to rush in and tank the damage for your team. Most players will panic when they see a NS rushing towards them. Use the chaos that you cause to catch heroes out of position and pick them off.
Map control builds always include a scepter and gem. It gives great vision and you will never be caught out at NIGHT. You can deward and basically blind the opponents map vision. Smokes dont work against Agh+gem NS because You see them before they can get close.
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You don't need the Battle Fury and the Helm as a Nightstalker. Some people actually go Armlet on the hero, it's a great item to have as a Nightstalker and then maybe go for a Vlad's and then BKB. That's usually how I build my Nightstalker as I don't like rushing a BKB. After that, go for an AC if nobody has it on your team yet and then maybe go for your Basher.
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my personal build with ns is like, 2x gauntlet tango and ironwoods into treads urn and armlet. from there it depends on the other teams comp if i get bkb or basher etc. if you want to grab lifesteal youd want to do that fairly mid to late game since you shouldnt be getting in long drawn out fights with him anyway. armlet is the key for ns, it is sooo jacked. urn very helpful for your night time ganks since youll get a lot of hp and some mana regen which lets you stay out longer. you can only really "carry" your team if you are very successful early game and the other team has a squishy hero on the other team you can abuse. otherwise youll be delegated to silencing/slowing in teamfights and going for pickoffs when you can.
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United States47024 Posts
Either start with Stout Shield or with 3 Branch->Bottle Rush. Double gauntlet is inferior to either of those starts, as Stout provides superior low-level survivability due to damage block's high value at low levels. You shouldn't need the +6 damage to lasthit as Night Stalker's base damage is already fairly high.
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I go for Tango+4 Branches for rushing Bottle. I get a fast Bottle and then Phase Boots. After that, I go for Armlet, BKB, and then Basher. If I need aoe, for example against PL, I get BF after BKB.
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The most standard build is urn of shadows. It goes very well with the purpose of killing enemy heroes when your skills have leveled up. Of course, balanar is supposed to do this and you will get the charges.
I disagree with using an armlet of Mordigan. I would go for a vanguard and continue roaming around the map with an ally to do his thing.
There is one small thing that matters very much when playing him. There are some heroes that dish out a powerful spell
that can kill you/slow you down. This usually makes the difference of success in the ganking phase. PLEASE put 1 level of silence at level 4. Unless your opposing lane is kardel/traxex who doesn't do anything but right click.
If the game still somehow goes on with some hard carries, you just have to react with a specific counter item (blademail/halberd). You don't have to be a super carry with buriza and luxury items etc etc.
Magic stick can do wonders if you have the apm. It gives you another round of spells and a reason to tower dive.
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NS is one of my favorite (and best) heroes.
I like an armlet rush on him; generally I go stout + 3 branch + tango to start, but if I'm against a weaker lane opponent and am feeling greedy I'll go 3 branch + tango to bottle rush. Generally the stout pays for itself though, because you take a ton of harassment against ranged lane opponents like QoP.
Urn is usually my first item after bottle, followed generally by armlet. Sometimes if I have enough gold and we need the vision I will rush aghs instead, but aghs costs a lot more and doesn't give you as much in terms in stats/cost in comparison to armlet.
After armlet or aghs I'll usually go one of AC/BKB/Heart. AC is great for pushing and 5 manning, BKB is good for teams with a lot of stuns and magical damage, and heart is just an all-around good item.
Your itemization really just depends on the game and your opponents/needs. Sometimes you might want to get a BKB right away, because there are too many stuns or nukes on the opposing team. Sometimes another player has bought urn, and you might even consider getting medallion or just rushing your first item. Sometimes your team needs you to build vlads. It's all situational and usually it's best to think about what the team needs and what you need to be a good ganker, since that's what NS does best.
I usually itemize treads over phase. I used to get phase, but realized that the active wasn't really that great, particularly after watching ferrari play NS. I also found that it's much better to skip ult until the first night is over, since during the first night you will benefit more from more points in hunter in the night rather than a night extended by 25s. Sometimes Ferrari will even skip the point in silence until level 9; if you don't need it, it's not really worth it over a point in hunter.
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lots of good advice here. i would just like to add that during day time you want to be using your ult as much as possible (the more you use your ult the higher % of the game is played during night). i'm not saying to just blindly use it every cooldown but you should be planning out what you're going to do after first night is over so that you can make the most of your ultimate. you can group up to push a tower or tp gank if you see the opportunity.
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On March 25 2013 18:20 meijin wrote:
lots of good advice here. i would just like to add that during day time you want to be using your ult as much as possible (the more you use your ult the higher % of the game is played during night). i'm not saying to just blindly use it every cooldown but you should be planning out what you're going to do after first night is over so that you can make the most of your ultimate. you can group up to push a tower or tp gank if you see the opportunity.
I assume it's a typo and you meant that you should use your ult during NIGHTIME not daytime. Using your ult during daytime will delay the next night, so don't do it unless to secure a kill.
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Yes you essentially want second night to come as soon as possible so you try not to ult during the daytime unless absolutely necessary.
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On March 25 2013 18:20 meijin wrote:
lots of good advice here. i would just like to add that during day time you want to be using your ult as much as possible (the more you use your ult the higher % of the game is played during night). i'm not saying to just blindly use it every cooldown but you should be planning out what you're going to do after first night is over so that you can make the most of your ultimate. you can group up to push a tower or tp gank if you see the opportunity.
Nah you do NOT use your ult in daytime, you spam it during Night time. NS ult freezes time, thus it should only be used at night if possible to extend the night as long as possible.
Of course feel free to ult during the day to run away/join fights.
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EPT
