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On May 03 2015 00:07 rabidch wrote:
i expect undying's greatest fan EG.Fear to be making ppd draft this hero over and over
To be honest I expect him to become standard ban/pick material in the current patch. Already saw some matches where he has been first banned.
Buffs together with new items made him a top tier support in my opinion, he also has the best win ration right now.
http://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/winning?date=patch_6.84
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On May 02 2015 23:23 Altsa wrote:
Ye, if you buy headdress as your 1st item you can jungle from level 1. In my first attempt I managed to get Guardian Greaves + Magic Wand and level 11 in 15 minutes. If you practice your route better you might get even more.
build order?
how do you not run out of mana
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On May 03 2015 01:54 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2015 23:23 Altsa wrote:
Ye, if you buy headdress as your 1st item you can jungle from level 1. In my first attempt I managed to get Guardian Greaves + Magic Wand and level 11 in 15 minutes. If you practice your route better you might get even more. build order? how do you not run out of mana
Haven't tried it but you probably aren't spamming anything, just stack creep camps and then farm them with Tombstone, that's my guess.
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you can farm 3 camps at once with a high level tombstone, but its inefficient imo. I used to do that sort of tactics.
Edit:
Just looking at the last ten promatches, the supportbuild that looks most impressive is a general supportbuild with manaboot+wand+mek. If you face a spiritbreaker or similar, euls+wand+mek+naked boot.
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Ok I was wrong, after playing some games I realized that Guardian Greaves are ridiculous on Undying. I didn't think that the mana cost was 0. Guardian Graves negates the huge mana cost that mech has, as well as the Euls mana cost nerf. I believe that the go-to build should be Wand, OoV, Tranquils, Bottle, Mech, Euls, then Guardian. After that pick up whatever item will beneficial to your team the most.
I would like to see some Undying + Dazzle offensive dual lanes in the pro-scene but I doubt it would happen.
I am a dirty pre-6.94 Undying picker but now he feels absurd.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On May 03 2015 03:42 AkipAkip wrote:
Ok I was wrong, after playing some games I realized that Guardian Greaves are ridiculous on Undying. I didn't think that the mana cost was 0. Guardian Graves negates the huge mana cost that mech has, as well as the Euls mana cost nerf. I believe that the go-to build should be Wand, OoV, Tranquils, Bottle, Mech, Euls, then Guardian. After that pick up whatever item will beneficial to your team the most.
I would like to see some Undying + Dazzle offensive dual lanes in the pro-scene but I doubt it would happen.
I am a dirty pre-6.94 Undying picker but now he feels absurd.
How will you handle your mana without arcanes with mek+euls though? Also, the last time i saw Undying+Dazzle lane game lasted 9 minutes, kek.
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doesnt the zombiechange affect the combo negatively or nonexistent?
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Why get euls on undying? Self euls to safely apply the damage amp is ok, but it seems like a lot to spend on an item when that $ can go towards shivas or solar crest or atos. Similar to mek, I think if you're going greaves you want to build it early when the flat heal/armor/regen is more significant. Getting a couple cheap items before greaves makes sense, but euls is pretty expensive for an active that doesn't set anything up and for mana regen that you don't really need with wand/arcanes/later greaves.
I also don't understand the logic of tranqs on the hero. They help you sustain in lane at the very beginning of the game when your mana pool is low, but after the 8-10 minute mark arcanes are a lot more valuable - the larger mana pool helps a lot when you have the cooldowns to use decay/soul rip 3 or 4 times in a fight. Soul rip+being ult'd in fights also solves your hp sustain issue.
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to interrupt the charge of spiritbreaker i guess, else they went standard manaboot in the data i screened.
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On May 03 2015 04:14 lolfail9001 wrote:
How will you handle your mana without arcanes with mek+euls though? Also, the last time i saw Undying+Dazzle lane game lasted 9 minutes, kek.
I get a bottle, with runes spawning at both sides it's not every hard to keep your mana up. Some people do prefer trends + bottles for the stat switching but I personally like tranquils because it's dirt cheap and the moment speed helps you rotate around the map to gank. For me at least I prefer Tranquils + bottle than Arcane Boots + Basilius which is commonly built.
On May 03 2015 04:32 fourthirds wrote:
Why get euls on undying? Self euls to safely apply the damage amp is ok, but it seems like a lot to spend on an item when that $ can go towards shivas or solar crest or atos. Similar to mek, I think if you're going greaves you want to build it early when the flat heal/armor/regen is more significant. Getting a couple cheap items before greaves makes sense, but euls is pretty expensive for an active that doesn't set anything up and for mana regen that you don't really need with wand/arcanes/later greaves.
I also don't understand the logic of tranqs on the hero. They help you sustain in lane at the very beginning of the game when your mana pool is low, but after the 8-10 minute mark arcanes are a lot more valuable - the larger mana pool helps a lot when you have the cooldowns to use decay/soul rip 3 or 4 times in a fight. Soul rip+being ult'd in fights also solves your hp sustain issue.
I get euls over atos to cancel any channeling/prevents blink escapes and the zombies will keep spawning while your target is in the air. Euls is great when initiating a smoke gank. I don't know i just always preferred it over atos. I usually try to get Shiva's right after and I still haven't tried out solar crest.
And at first I didn't understand the logic behind tranqs on undying but one game I built it (+bottle) and it seemed so much better than mana boots. It kind of like picking whether or not you want have full domination during the early game then have some mana issues later or just winning your lane and being fine with mana during the mid game.
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On May 03 2015 01:54 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2015 23:23 Altsa wrote:
Ye, if you buy headdress as your 1st item you can jungle from level 1. In my first attempt I managed to get Guardian Greaves + Magic Wand and level 11 in 15 minutes. If you practice your route better you might get even more. build order? how do you not run out of mana
You only use mana for Tombstone. It has 60 second cooldown and you have rather high int so you will regain a lot of the cost. You might run out of mana around 8-10 in game minutes. I did that practice in a solo lobby and I did not get a courier. In a normal game you most likely need to deliver yourself 1 clarity to regain your mana.
To put it short, you will not have mana problems.
If you are really lazy you can sit at the ancient camp from level one, use 1 Tombstone when the first ancients spawn at 00.30,
(ancients wont die), stack at 00.54, use tombstone instantly when it is off cooldown, stack again at 01.54, use tombstone again when it is off cooldown and repeat. This is a bit slower but I got level 9 and Guardian Greaves in 15 minutes.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
Had opportunity to play the hero.... No way hero got this broken with just those buffs. It almost smells like a bug in a sense that his abilities do so fucking much damage.
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On May 03 2015 04:21 govie wrote:
doesnt the zombiechange affect the combo negatively or nonexistent?
The change means that you can no longer target zombies with Soul Rip and pointlessly heal them by accident. It does not mean that zombies are no longer damage/heal sources, as that would be ridiculous and would negate the obvious intended synergy of those two spells.
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On May 03 2015 07:27 lolfail9001 wrote:
Had opportunity to play the hero.... No way hero got this broken with just those buffs. It almost smells like a bug in a sense that his abilities do so fucking much damage.
He was always ridiculous early. Decay is one of the strongest spells level 1 cause it drains your opponents strengths. And Tombstone is ridiculously good early levels before people can kill it fast.
I feel like it now more that the meta changes make him a lot stronger.
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Northern Ireland22208 Posts
zombie hp change also means if u have a headdress or any other healing aura, they cant be killed by creeps
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Played 4 games of undying last night, running offensive dual lanes, damn, they were not hard games.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On May 03 2015 10:04 the bear jew wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2015 07:27 lolfail9001 wrote:
Had opportunity to play the hero.... No way hero got this broken with just those buffs. It almost smells like a bug in a sense that his abilities do so fucking much damage. He was always ridiculous early. Decay is one of the strongest spells level 1 cause it drains your opponents strengths. And Tombstone is ridiculously good early levels before people can kill it fast. I feel like it now more that the meta changes make him a lot stronger.
I meant ridiculous 25 minutes into the game.
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On May 03 2015 10:04 the bear jew wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2015 07:27 lolfail9001 wrote:
Had opportunity to play the hero.... No way hero got this broken with just those buffs. It almost smells like a bug in a sense that his abilities do so fucking much damage. He was always ridiculous early. Decay is one of the strongest spells level 1 cause it drains your opponents strengths. And Tombstone is ridiculously good early levels before people can kill it fast. I feel like it now more that the meta changes make him a lot stronger.
sniper/jugg/troll/axe were all exceptionally good picks vs dirge (kill tombstone fast or doesn't care about zombies), so 6.83 was a bit painful.
Also, did the jungling get patched? I only just tried it and it doesn't seem to work (first item headdress, zombies dont get healed).
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Ye, it seems like the jungling is patched. Was fun while it lasted. You can still somewhat clear ancient stacks after lvl 7, though.
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On May 04 2015 00:57 Altsa wrote:
Ye, it seems like the jungling is patched. Was fun while it lasted. You can still somewhat clear ancient stacks after lvl 7, though.
How if Zombies don't heal anymore?
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EPT
