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On April 03 2012 12:49 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 12:28 NB wrote:
thats was way way way too old school me no know off. And he isnt even streaming :-/...
also that list only apply to westerner while the big scene is always in the east... ~_~ Wouldn't say always. Asian DotA wasn't always strong as it is now. For quite a long time there wasn't a big enough "scene" in China or SEA for you to say anything definitive.
Dota didn't really catch on in China until around 2006-07, and at the start, the Chinese held a few Western legends like merlini in very high regard. It wasn't until probably at least 2008, when Chinese teams started to become well-funded enough to go to SEA and World Championships, that Chinese style became matched up against the SEA and west on a frequent enough and lag-free enough basis to render judgement. At that point, while the Chinese won more often then not, they weren't exactly dominant.
And it really wasn't until 2009/10 that Chinese Dota emerged triumphant, with the development of 3 core pressure -> fast push -> 3 core dual roam -> Trilane 4-1 -> Fast single core push (derived from DTS's allin push) -> Multicore Teamfight developments that's taken place in these years, in which China has dictated its own metagame and always been at its forefront, combined with DotA's decline in the west, that China arrived at the dominant state it did.
Not only did it have superior teamwork, but the high level of competition led also to superlative individual skill, Ehome in the latter half of 2010 was the strongest DotA team ever created, with perhaps the best player in the world at each individual position, leading to comments like "XXX makes vigoss obsolete" being uttered by the western teams it crushed. By 2011 and the breakup of Ehome, the west basically stopped playing DotA competitively and Chinese supremacy became unquestioned fact.
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On April 03 2012 10:45 5-s wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 10:43 Itsmedudeman wrote:On April 03 2012 10:06 Hoban wrote:
I would like to see an all NA team. Even if it is just so I have an 'All American' team to root for. It is always fun to root for your home team, even if they don't win all the time. Plus, Fear went to high school in the same division as myself so I am always rooting for the guy. Not many players have the experience. I doubt players like Fear and Demon would want to sit through 2 years of mediocrity watching million dollar tournaments fly by so they could train them to compete with professionals who have 5+ years experience. That's not the problem, it's more personality / synergy issues. 5 of America's strongest players could in theory compete with every team in the world, but it's hard to get them together. America has more competitive players than any country besides Russia/Ukraine and Asian countries.
sweden pretty good as well, i heard : )
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On April 03 2012 14:34 mdma-_- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 10:45 5-s wrote:On April 03 2012 10:43 Itsmedudeman wrote:On April 03 2012 10:06 Hoban wrote:
I would like to see an all NA team. Even if it is just so I have an 'All American' team to root for. It is always fun to root for your home team, even if they don't win all the time. Plus, Fear went to high school in the same division as myself so I am always rooting for the guy. Not many players have the experience. I doubt players like Fear and Demon would want to sit through 2 years of mediocrity watching million dollar tournaments fly by so they could train them to compete with professionals who have 5+ years experience. That's not the problem, it's more personality / synergy issues. 5 of America's strongest players could in theory compete with every team in the world, but it's hard to get them together. America has more competitive players than any country besides Russia/Ukraine and Asian countries. sweden pretty good as well, i heard : )
In terms of quality it's debatable, but America has more in terms of quantity of players who can compete near the top. We're one of the few countries to run our own inhouse leagues, after all.
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On April 03 2012 10:54 NB wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 09:55 Zlasher wrote:On April 03 2012 09:03 NB wrote:
they wont go all american that for sure... they have learned from all the players they dropped in sc2 squad to get puma JYP...
I wouldnt be surprised if they pick up Zenith tbh... SEA is generally cheaper to sponsor as well. It isn't just about skill or how 'cheap' a team is to sponsor. This is EG, money isn't the option its the return on the investment you get. Demon and Fear are extremely popular, and can plug their sponsors well, they get several hundred to a few thousand viewers on their stream. The Zenith guys don't. Also Zenith never plays in touranments that are seen by north american audiences, due to lag. Yeah, EG started moving towards the path of adding Koreans, but Koreans never even do the generic "I'd like to thank Intel Steelseries Monster Kingston etc." which is why you see Machine and Lz still on the team as opposed to dropping all their american palyers in favor of Koreans. The world of sponsorship is no longer just about performance, it is about the investment. The ROI of Demon Fear and Bulba is way higher than Zenith gives, and 'cheapness' isn't the issue since the EG players are salaried better than any other team. Demon and Fear was NOT popular before they join EG... the ONLY USA player who was popular was merlini and now he is coaching (SK?). Imagine what would happen if EG pick up Zenith and force them to strteam daily basis? The SEA esports scene will explode and its one of the unexplored market along with china(kinda). Its like asking why would they pick up Korean players if the majority of the audience is in US: skill level is higher. Hell twitch was not even available in KR back then and they only recently install kr.twitch.tv for korean streamers. Another point is that if they really was aiming for US audience instead of contest winners, they could have just picked up a LoL team instead (majority of dota english scene is in EU). Lets think about it: maelk leaves EG, EG wont perform as well as they could, lost their spot to The International 2... Thats more harm then good.
Marketability =/= Popularity
You can try to justify them picking up Zenith but its just not going to happen I promise you lol, nor is it the best or safest option to take.
Also, Maelk isn't leaving EG as an outright choice, he clearly said that he wants to stay with Fear but it comes down to if they want to go all NA or not (as well as if they will keep Lacoste, who seems to be attached to Maelk, as Fear seems to be attached wtih Demon so to say).
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Well, 34 invoker games in the last 3 days, man this is exhausting. All I can think about is Quas, Wex, Exort. The builds I am digging the most are Exort/Quas with 1 point of Wex at 10 then max Exort then Wex, and 3xQuas 5xWex max Exort. I have 1v1 mid down now, both builds are quite strong imo. Cold snap is so strong in lane and WW can set up easy kills or forge spirit can trigger cold snap and add dps. Quas/Exort is a little slow, I find ganking fairly tough with it but I have gotten pretty pro at sun strikes! wex/quas is great for ganking. So so great. I haven't really played around with build beyond Phase/Drums/Push/Aghas (or void stone then aghas) or for exort treads/drums/push or bkb/aghas. I want to try Orchid some time, that looks fun. I swear though, i'm going to be dreaming about ice wall -> meteor -> deafening blast combos tonight.
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“item_name”: “Repentant Soul”
“item_description”: “A crystal containing the soul of a saint. Use it to immediately exit the low priority punishment queue. This does not clear leaves or reports from your account.”
if this made into dota2, i will delete anybody on my friendlist who have it!
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United States47024 Posts
On April 03 2012 16:40 NB wrote:Show nested quote +“item_name”: “Repentant Soul”
“item_description”: “A crystal containing the soul of a saint. Use it to immediately exit the low priority punishment queue. This does not clear leaves or reports from your account.” if this made into dota2, i will delete anybody on my friendlist who have it!
One wonders why anyone would pay money for that if DotA 2 is F2P, since you could just play on a smurf account that's not in low priority queue.
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On April 03 2012 16:43 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 16:40 NB wrote:“item_name”: “Repentant Soul”
“item_description”: “A crystal containing the soul of a saint. Use it to immediately exit the low priority punishment queue. This does not clear leaves or reports from your account.” if this made into dota2, i will delete anybody on my friendlist who have it! One wonders why anyone would pay money for that if DotA 2 is F2P, since you could just play on a smurf account that's not in low priority queue.
Don't worry, people seems to love buying things in F2P games. ( see how LoL mademore money than CoD last year, even if the game is free )
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Lalalaland34507 Posts
Man I remember those days. Kuroky pretty much didn't give a shit about anything, going beyond godlike every game with ANY hero, with Ks.int basing their entire strategy around Kuroky. Puppey was an amazing drafter as well, he was probably one of the first guys to popularise the entire 'early game gank them to hell' strategy.
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On April 03 2012 14:58 Hoban wrote:
Well, 34 invoker games in the last 3 days, man this is exhausting. All I can think about is Quas, Wex, Exort. The builds I am digging the most are Exort/Quas with 1 point of Wex at 10 then max Exort then Wex, and 3xQuas 5xWex max Exort. I have 1v1 mid down now, both builds are quite strong imo. Cold snap is so strong in lane and WW can set up easy kills or forge spirit can trigger cold snap and add dps. Quas/Exort is a little slow, I find ganking fairly tough with it but I have gotten pretty pro at sun strikes! wex/quas is great for ganking. So so great. I haven't really played around with build beyond Phase/Drums/Push/Aghas (or void stone then aghas) or for exort treads/drums/push or bkb/aghas. I want to try Orchid some time, that looks fun. I swear though, i'm going to be dreaming about ice wall -> meteor -> deafening blast combos tonight.
If you go Q/E with one point in W, do the max E first, with the rest into Q until E is maxed, then do W until it is even with Q and then go evenly on them, in my opinion. It gives you the big guns like icewall, forge spirits, chaos meteor, deafening blast, but you want to get the Wex up as well to boost so many of the other more important late spells.
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and i was wondering who are these EVO people i got matched with... thought fighting games people are moving to dota2... turns out they are the russian league that tobi gona cast in the next 5 hours.
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On April 03 2012 16:56 Zlasher wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 14:58 Hoban wrote:
Well, 34 invoker games in the last 3 days, man this is exhausting. All I can think about is Quas, Wex, Exort. The builds I am digging the most are Exort/Quas with 1 point of Wex at 10 then max Exort then Wex, and 3xQuas 5xWex max Exort. I have 1v1 mid down now, both builds are quite strong imo. Cold snap is so strong in lane and WW can set up easy kills or forge spirit can trigger cold snap and add dps. Quas/Exort is a little slow, I find ganking fairly tough with it but I have gotten pretty pro at sun strikes! wex/quas is great for ganking. So so great. I haven't really played around with build beyond Phase/Drums/Push/Aghas (or void stone then aghas) or for exort treads/drums/push or bkb/aghas. I want to try Orchid some time, that looks fun. I swear though, i'm going to be dreaming about ice wall -> meteor -> deafening blast combos tonight. If you go Q/E with one point in W, do the max E first, with the rest into Q until E is maxed, then do W until it is even with Q and then go evenly on them, in my opinion. It gives you the big guns like icewall, forge spirits, chaos meteor, deafening blast, but you want to get the Wex up as well to boost so many of the other more important late spells.
Before leveling up E and W to max you should have Q and E togheter on 4 so u get double forge spirits imo.
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Yes well, like I siad you're maxing E but adding Q for the forge spirit but after double forge you're only maxing E, with Q as the second priority, and when E is done, you get W to catch up to Q and then go even on them.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
I SO want Kuroky to make a comeback it hurts  He's like the only old school player I really miss now. I mean, both Loda and Vigoss are playing for christs sakes.
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Lalalaland34507 Posts
Loda and Vigoss are far older school than Kuroky. 
I don't know where he is now but Pusher was part of the 'legendary' MYM team back then.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
Pusher was the core of the old MYM together with Mealk and Mania. He always played the dedicated "die-a-lot" support wardbitch. He's not in a pro team right now, but he's often found on Demon's stream.
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On April 03 2012 16:43 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2012 16:40 NB wrote:“item_name”: “Repentant Soul”
“item_description”: “A crystal containing the soul of a saint. Use it to immediately exit the low priority punishment queue. This does not clear leaves or reports from your account.” if this made into dota2, i will delete anybody on my friendlist who have it! One wonders why anyone would pay money for that if DotA 2 is F2P, since you could just play on a smurf account that's not in low priority queue.
Don't forget, it's attached to your steam account.
My own steam account as it stands right now has 96 games in the library alongside my Dota2
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On April 03 2012 07:51 Velr wrote:
Professionalism tends to make things less fun.
I like fun.
I'd usually agree without you, I nearly always disagree people saying "I don't like this, it's unprofessional" when talking about the sc2 scene, because it's professional enough, and being "professional" isn't a criteria and doesn't mean being good anyway.
But the dota 2 scene need professionalism right now. The amount of no show, of standin from people playing in the very same tournament for multiple teams and of postponed matches is too high right now.
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EPT
