On February 12 2012 07:00 Hoban wrote: Well I am a big fan of Drow and me, being the nub I am, was like "Omg click invis YES" so I got Lothars every time on her. How should I switch this up? Go Yasha, Drums, BKB, Manta? Or if I have some good supports who ward, Helm of the Dominator then Yasha BkB ect ect? To me she is super fun to play as a mid-game ganker. The 2nd night that hits, you have some items and a huge vision range. Time to fuck shit up! And then you just carry like a boss in late game. Hello silencing their team then killing them all before a spell gets off.
I usually build drow, some gg branches etc starter kit, get treads/dominator(helm first over treads if you need the regen) Yasha, Manta then check if its worth getting a BKB if not you can go mkb/daedelus or butterfly.
This is the standard way to play Drow, and is probably the safest. You might want Wraith Bands before HotD to buffer your early game stats a bit, and often you will need to buy BKB before finishing Manta, but those are situational things. Don't forget to finish Helm into Satanic lategame.
It is also possible to build Drow toward a more aggressive midgame. It's not the best way to play her (the aforementioned, more defensive farm-based way is better suited to her), but you might find this way more fun (since you have to farm for quite a while for the above build to kick in), or more suited to a particular game (for example a pub game where your team already has other carries, and if you don't pick up the midgame tempo, nobody else will). With this style, you get Janggo as your first major item, and get your Yasha before you HotD. Helm gives you stayability for farming and gives you a dominated creep to stack camps, but Janggo/Yasha gives you fighting stats immediately, so you can gank/fight with them right off the bat, and hopefully use your early advantage to create space for you to farm after you've picked up Helm.
Getting lothars on drow/sniper is just a symptom of the dota pub culture. People don't really try to make optimal picks or item builds and are more than happy to have a 40% win rate on lothars drow provided when they win they go 10/0. Having said that, I think if you were trying to win pubs in the most optimal way you would just not pick these heroes. However, if you were to then it's not a bad move to buy lothars since it does give you that escape mechanism, and you probably will get your moneys worth out of the stealth (assuming its just vs other bad players). Obviously in a real game it is a trash item for them and you would do a standard carry build while relying on your team to protect you.
It actually interests me to see if Valve add the equivilent of LoL's ranked solo queue, as in LoL this brought about a community essentially focused on how best to win in pubs where your team would basically give up at the start if you didn't make a try-hard pick.
On February 12 2012 07:32 rob.au wrote: Getting lothars on drow/sniper is just a symptom of the dota pub culture. People don't really try to make optimal picks or item builds and are more than happy to have a 40% win rate on lothars drow provided when they win they go 10/0. Having said that, I think if you were trying to win pubs in the most optimal way you would just not pick these heroes. However, if you were to then it's not a bad move to buy lothars since it does give you that escape mechanism, and you probably will get your moneys worth out of the stealth (assuming its just vs other bad players). Obviously in a real game it is a trash item for them and you would do a standard carry build while relying on your team to protect you.
It actually interests me to see if Valve add the equivilent of LoL's ranked solo queue, as in LoL this brought about a community essentially focused on how best to win in pubs where your team would basically give up at the start if you didn't make a try-hard pick.
Drow is probably the least fun hero(besides alchemist) to play for me, i just basically only play random. I get Lothar's on her because nobody counters it. Nobody wards anywhere(for the most part) except for rune spots, and nobody ever places sentries even when you get Lothar's. If i was playing in a higher mmr or playing a "real" game( i.e. cm) then I wouldn't get Lothars on her. But it works wonders against bad players.
On February 12 2012 07:32 rob.au wrote: Getting lothars on drow/sniper is just a symptom of the dota pub culture. People don't really try to make optimal picks or item builds and are more than happy to have a 40% win rate on lothars drow provided when they win they go 10/0. Having said that, I think if you were trying to win pubs in the most optimal way you would just not pick these heroes. However, if you were to then it's not a bad move to buy lothars since it does give you that escape mechanism, and you probably will get your moneys worth out of the stealth (assuming its just vs other bad players). Obviously in a real game it is a trash item for them and you would do a standard carry build while relying on your team to protect you.
It actually interests me to see if Valve add the equivilent of LoL's ranked solo queue, as in LoL this brought about a community essentially focused on how best to win in pubs where your team would basically give up at the start if you didn't make a try-hard pick.
There's a big difference between heroes that use Lothar's to ENGAGE and heroes that are only using it as an escape. You don't have to play at a very high level for people to reactively Dust you when you suddenly go invisible, but even at very high levels, you can't expect Sentries to catch that invisible SF trying to get in the middle of your team to ulti every time--and that one 5-person ultimate from nowhere could team-wipe you and win the game.
Lothar's is a pub item, sure, but for some heroes, it's an extremely GOOD pub item because the payoff from being able to use it to engage properly is extremely high compared to the possibility that you might get sentried/dusted. On Drow, that reward isn't even that high.
I will start trying treads/dominator/Yasha ect. As far as ancient stacking goes, is there ever a point where stacking any more would just be too much? Say, I have been safely farming dire top lane all day and have a good 5-6 stacks on the ancients. Too much? Never too much?
As far as the LoL solo queue goes. I find it much much more difficult to carry a bad team in LoL than a bad team in Dota. Reason being, a BKB eliminates the ability to completely shut someone down for a specific period of time. If you pick a strong mid hero, you can win your lane and at least one other lane. That makes a huge advantage that isn't there in LoL. It is so much tougher to have a single person dominate the other team in LoL than in Dota. I don't think Valve adding a similar solo queuing system would have the same effect as it does to LoL. I could be wrong though but LoL feels like a single player game where you do the best you can and hope your team doesn't suck whereas Dota feels like you can have a substantial impact on the flow of the game if you play well.
On February 12 2012 07:56 Hoban wrote: I will start trying treads/dominator/Yasha ect. As far as ancient stacking goes, is there ever a point where stacking any more would just be too much? Say, I have been safely farming dire top lane all day and have a good 5-6 stacks on the ancients. Too much? Never too much?
As far as the LoL solo queue goes. I find it much much more difficult to carry a bad team in LoL than a bad team in Dota. Reason being, a BKB eliminates the ability to completely shut someone down for a specific period of time. If you pick a strong mid hero, you can win your lane and at least one other lane. That makes a huge advantage that isn't there in LoL. It is so much tougher to have a single person dominate the other team in LoL than in Dota. I don't think Valve adding a similar solo queuing system would have the same effect as it does to LoL. I could be wrong though but LoL feels like a single player game where you do the best you can and hope your team doesn't suck whereas Dota feels like you can have a substantial impact on the flow of the game if you play well.
I agree with this quite a bit. In LoL solo queue the only role that you can really have a big impact on the game is if you pick a jungler(assuming that people are last hitting decently well). In Dota any role can really make a difference.
On February 12 2012 07:56 Hoban wrote: I will start trying treads/dominator/Yasha ect. As far as ancient stacking goes, is there ever a point where stacking any more would just be too much? Say, I have been safely farming dire top lane all day and have a good 5-6 stacks on the ancients. Too much? Never too much?
As far as the LoL solo queue goes. I find it much much more difficult to carry a bad team in LoL than a bad team in Dota. Reason being, a BKB eliminates the ability to completely shut someone down for a specific period of time. If you pick a strong mid hero, you can win your lane and at least one other lane. That makes a huge advantage that isn't there in LoL. It is so much tougher to have a single person dominate the other team in LoL than in Dota. I don't think Valve adding a similar solo queuing system would have the same effect as it does to LoL. I could be wrong though but LoL feels like a single player game where you do the best you can and hope your team doesn't suck whereas Dota feels like you can have a substantial impact on the flow of the game if you play well.
As far as ancients go - the more the merrier (but getting more than 5 stacks running is hard because of the cluttering when you pull), the only exception is if you're playing a hero that needs to tank them in order to kill them, in that case you can't touch the stack if it's too strong.
4 stacks is the max possible on ancients is it not?
Either way, ancient stacking is very risky though (espescially as Radiant) but the reward is high and then again in pubs they usually won't pay attention to it.
100% their own words, seriously (except for a single sentence)
Oh my god. So reported for being awesome. Maybe if he see's this he will realize why the temp ban. I also didn't realize that channeling keeps you invisible until the channel is over. I have had so many bad games with SK but maybe I will try the troll lothars build.
On February 12 2012 08:03 Kipsate wrote: 4 stacks is the max possible on ancients is it not?
Either way, ancient stacking is very risky though (espescially as Radiant) but the reward is high and then again in pubs they usually won't pay attention to it.
I think the max was 4 in HoN but unlimited in Dota. I may be wrong though. I know regular neutrals the stacks can be unlimited.
On February 12 2012 08:12 Hoban wrote: Oh my god. So reported for being awesome. Maybe if he see's this he will realize why the temp ban. I also didn't realize that channeling keeps you invisible until the channel is over. I have had so many bad games with SK but maybe I will try the troll lothars build.
It doesn't work with SK because SK's ult is a true channeled spell, so starting the channel breaks your invisibility. It works with Shadowfiend and Furion because Requiem and Teleport aren't true channeled spells, but just have long cast times (i.e. if they get interrupted, the mana and cooldown isn't wasted), so they don't break invis until the end of the cast.
On February 12 2012 08:03 Kipsate wrote: 4 stacks is the max possible on ancients is it not?
Either way, ancient stacking is very risky though (espescially as Radiant) but the reward is high and then again in pubs they usually won't pay attention to it.
I think the max was 4 in HoN but unlimited in Dota. I may be wrong though. I know regular neutrals the stacks can be unlimited.
I think both normal and ancients can both stack at most 3 or 4 times
So what is hindering all of you who claim that it is only possible to stack them 3 or 4 times to try it out instead of polluting the thread with false information ? Theoretical it is possible to stack them an infinite amounts of time, but due to all that cluttering when there are many mobs in practice its only possible to stack em 6-7 times (As Alur allready said)
Still sad to see how TL works. A bunch of less intelligent people call everything they don't understand trolling, then the "troller" (who is actually correct) gets a little mad at that and tries to argue with them, but gets banned while the people who started it all go free. I don't think I've ever seen a forum as badly moderated as TL.
On February 12 2012 08:58 ACatInTheHat wrote: Still sad to see how TL works. A bunch of less intelligent people call everything they don't understand trolling, then the "troller" (who is actually correct) gets a little mad at that and tries to argue with them, but gets banned while the people who started it all go free. I don't think I've ever seen a forum as badly moderated as TL.
On February 12 2012 08:58 ACatInTheHat wrote: Still sad to see how TL works. A bunch of less intelligent people call everything they don't understand trolling, then the "troller" (who is actually correct) gets a little mad at that and tries to argue with them, but gets banned while the people who started it all go free. I don't think I've ever seen a forum as badly moderated as TL.
1/2 of the "troller"s posts were advertising for his stream, and the other half were talking down to people and calling them idiots. It makes you sad that people like that get a temp ban ?
EPT
