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On June 03 2015 02:11 Shellshock wrote: Adrian Peterson finally calming down and doing shit with the Vikings
I imagine he was pissed they didn't stand up for him. Who knows, if his kids were throwing rocks, the whole country might just celebrate him whoopin his kid.
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United States97276 Posts
On June 03 2015 03:45 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2015 02:11 Shellshock wrote: Adrian Peterson finally calming down and doing shit with the Vikings I imagine he was pissed they didn't stand up for him. Who knows, if his kids were throwing rocks, the whole country might just celebrate him whoopin his kid. As far as I know this is 100% the case
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On June 03 2015 02:22 whatisthisasheep wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2015 16:04 cLutZ wrote:On June 02 2015 15:48 DannyJ wrote: Yeah I'd personally I'd take Luck without a doubt because of the heart and attitude he's displayed.
Cam will get his big bucks. Anyone with that kind of freakish athleticism and potential always does. Success doesn't always follow of course... Oh yes, the heart and attitude. Not that he's the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning (minimum) and is already the 2nd best QB in the NFL. Luck does not have the amount of heart Cam has. Luck lacked the ability to rally during the Patriots and Broncos playoff games. Cam flips his car, breaks his back, and a couple weeks later plays a tough playoff game. Thats heart.
Ya, Luck totally didn't engineer the 2nd biggest comeback in NFL history, let's just count him out because his team lost to the eventual Super Bowl champion a couple times.
It's not like Cam's playoff work has been artistry in comparison. 0 points in the second half at home against the 9ers, and a 21.9 QBR against the Seahawks, basically equal performances to Lucks two Patriots blowouts. But Luck has actual playoff wins in his back pocket, against teams that weren't on their 3rd string QBs.
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Luck should have simply deflated his balls like our boy Tom so that he could win the Superbowl.
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5 year deal, ~20 mill a year? Seems good for both parties. Makes me wonder what Luck is looking for now in his deal since Tannehill and Cam have finalized theirs.
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Rog-God has formally announced that he will hear Brady's appeal. My favorite part of his letter to the NFLPA:
"Third, the NFLPA argues that recusal is required because I have "prejudged" the matter and cannot fairly evaluate the potential testimony of league staff members. After carefully considering this argument, I reject it."
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On June 03 2015 04:05 red_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2015 02:22 whatisthisasheep wrote:On June 02 2015 16:04 cLutZ wrote:On June 02 2015 15:48 DannyJ wrote: Yeah I'd personally I'd take Luck without a doubt because of the heart and attitude he's displayed.
Cam will get his big bucks. Anyone with that kind of freakish athleticism and potential always does. Success doesn't always follow of course... Oh yes, the heart and attitude. Not that he's the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning (minimum) and is already the 2nd best QB in the NFL. Luck does not have the amount of heart Cam has. Luck lacked the ability to rally during the Patriots and Broncos playoff games. Cam flips his car, breaks his back, and a couple weeks later plays a tough playoff game. Thats heart. Ya, Luck totally didn't engineer the 2nd biggest comeback in NFL history, let's just count him out because his team lost to the eventual Super Bowl champion a couple times.
He can thank the football gods for the fact that the Chiefs lost what, at least 5 players that game? He never should've had to make a comeback like that in the first place
(yes I'm still bitter )
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On June 03 2015 02:38 Zdrastochye wrote: Cam Newton has had a great team around him and failed to elevate his game. He's just a second tier QB, and deserves no more praise than his accomplishments. Cam had a great team...for a few games a season until coaching staff and management screw it up (trading Steve Smith Ted Ginn jr. mid season and other crap like that) He never had the luxury of having a fully functional unit like Luck and Wilson which greatly limited his success in the postseason. You cant go just go around bloviating about Cam being a second class QB when you have offered zero satisfactory evidence to back you unmitigated temerity that Luck is superior. What you said about Cam is blasphemous and completely unsubstantiated. I would like to see luck get to playoffs coming off of ankle and back surgery while having broken ribs.
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On June 03 2015 12:23 whatisthisasheep wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2015 02:38 Zdrastochye wrote: Cam Newton has had a great team around him and failed to elevate his game. He's just a second tier QB, and deserves no more praise than his accomplishments. Cam had a great team... for a few games a season until coaching staff and management screw it up (trading Steve Smith Ted Ginn jr. mid season and other crap like that) He never had the luxury of having a fully functional unit like Luck and Wilson which greatly limited his success in the postseason. You cant go just go around bloviating about Cam being a second class QB when you have offered zero satisfactory evidence to back you unmitigated temerity that Luck is superior. What you said about Cam is blasphemous and completely unsubstantiated. I would like to see luck get to playoffs coming off of ankle and back surgery while having broken ribs. Blasphemous huh? You do know that superman nickname is just that, a nickname?
That 2013 season he had Ginn, Smith, LaFell, DeAngelo Williams, Jonathan Stewart, Greg Olsen... You have a hard time putting together a much better offense and still have a defense of that caliber (something luck doesn't have).
QB's like Manning, Brady, Rodgers, Brees; they make mediocre recievers look good-great. Cam doesn't do that yet, and I think that's the biggest reason many people put him below those others. Luck shows signs of being able to do that.
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I think Newton deserves the contract, he is the face of that franchise and if they put some offensive weapons in place he can be a top 5 QB.
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On June 03 2015 12:23 whatisthisasheep wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2015 02:38 Zdrastochye wrote: Cam Newton has had a great team around him and failed to elevate his game. He's just a second tier QB, and deserves no more praise than his accomplishments. Cam had a great team... for a few games a season until coaching staff and management screw it up (trading Steve Smith Ted Ginn jr. mid season and other crap like that) He never had the luxury of having a fully functional unit like Luck and Wilson which greatly limited his success in the postseason. You cant go just go around bloviating about Cam being a second class QB when you have offered zero satisfactory evidence to back you unmitigated temerity that Luck is superior. What you said about Cam is blasphemous and completely unsubstantiated. I would like to see luck get to playoffs coming off of ankle and back surgery while having broken ribs.
Well all evidence I could put in front of you is unsatisfactory evidence, because it argues with what you believe. I'm not trying to sway your opinion, because frankly it doesn't matter to me at all. He's not of the same caliber of QB as the other tier 1 QBs (TB, Rodgers, Big Ben, Luck) yet, but he certainly could grow into a better version then what we've seen out of his first four seasons. He hasn't had a fantastic offense around him, but tier 1 QBs elevate the status of those around him. Cam doesn't do that. That said good on him for getting paid. He's going to be taking a whole lot of shots in his time in the NFL so he likely won't have the same longevity of other skilled athletes at his position, so I'm happy he's getting paid now.
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On June 03 2015 13:56 giftdgecko wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2015 12:23 whatisthisasheep wrote:On June 03 2015 02:38 Zdrastochye wrote: Cam Newton has had a great team around him and failed to elevate his game. He's just a second tier QB, and deserves no more praise than his accomplishments. Cam had a great team... for a few games a season until coaching staff and management screw it up (trading Steve Smith Ted Ginn jr. mid season and other crap like that) He never had the luxury of having a fully functional unit like Luck and Wilson which greatly limited his success in the postseason. You cant go just go around bloviating about Cam being a second class QB when you have offered zero satisfactory evidence to back you unmitigated temerity that Luck is superior. What you said about Cam is blasphemous and completely unsubstantiated. I would like to see luck get to playoffs coming off of ankle and back surgery while having broken ribs. Blasphemous huh? You do know that superman nickname is just that, a nickname? That 2013 season he had Ginn, Smith, LaFell, DeAngelo Williams, Jonathan Stewart, Greg Olsen... You have a hard time putting together a much better offense and still have a defense of that caliber (something luck doesn't have). QB's like Manning, Brady, Rodgers, Brees; they make mediocre recievers look good-great. Cam doesn't do that yet, and I think that's the biggest reason many people put him below those others. Luck shows signs of being able to do that.
The only two people on the list from 2013 who are any good are Smith and Olsen, the rest are the same caliber of players people expect elite QB's to "elevate." He's done OK with a shit hand for the most part, and his offensive line has been pretty terrible. Worth paying this kind of money? Probably, but only because the alternatives are sparse and sparser. If Jay Cutler can make this kind of money, most QB's can whether they are a Top 5 talent or not.
I think Luck is a better QB, but he also has much better receivers, let's not pretend he's working with shit. His problem is his team's defense, but he overcomes that anyways.
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Williams had a bit of a rebound in 2013, with a 4.2 ypc average, but he only rushed for 843 yards and 3 TDs on the season. Stewart was abysmal with 180 yards, but he only played for 6 games. Both of those guys were leaving their primes as Cam was coming online.
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Can we stop throwing Big Ben's name around as a "Tier 1" QB? He's top 10, but the Rodgers', Lucks, Bradys, Peytons, and maybe Brees' of the world are definitely a cut above.
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Without seeing Peyton healthy I wouldn't put him in that group. Not sold with Brees either. I'd say they're in the second class with the Roethlisbergers and Wilsons of the world.
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On June 04 2015 11:19 hatestabkill wrote: Can we stop throwing Big Ben's name around as a "Tier 1" QB? He's top 10, but the Rodgers', Lucks, Bradys, Peytons, and maybe Brees' of the world are definitely a cut above.
I think he's up there for results. Rightly or not QB's get credit for championships and he's got 2.
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On June 04 2015 11:22 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 11:19 hatestabkill wrote: Can we stop throwing Big Ben's name around as a "Tier 1" QB? He's top 10, but the Rodgers', Lucks, Bradys, Peytons, and maybe Brees' of the world are definitely a cut above. I think he's up there for results. Rightly or not QB's get credit for championships and he's got 2.
This is a terrible way to evaluate QBs. His first SB championship there were 20 QBs, minimum, that would have won that title, and the second time at least 12. He only became actually good at quarterbacking after the rest of the team started to collapse around him and they became really good at drafting WRs. The Ben (and Pittsburgh)of today has almost nothing to do with those titles.
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On June 04 2015 12:17 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 11:22 GreenHorizons wrote:On June 04 2015 11:19 hatestabkill wrote: Can we stop throwing Big Ben's name around as a "Tier 1" QB? He's top 10, but the Rodgers', Lucks, Bradys, Peytons, and maybe Brees' of the world are definitely a cut above. I think he's up there for results. Rightly or not QB's get credit for championships and he's got 2. This is a terrible way to evaluate QBs. His first SB championship there were 20 QBs, minimum, that would have won that title, and the second time at least 12. He only became actually good at quarterbacking after the rest of the team started to collapse around him and they became really good at drafting WRs. The Ben (and Pittsburgh)of today has almost nothing to do with those titles.
I guess I coulda been clearer, I'm not a fan, it's just how a lot of people measure, QB's especially. (of all the positions to argue that championships matter QB is the one). But he wouldn't be in my top tier.
I'll just leave it there because I can't talk Pittsburgh without gettin my blood pressure up.
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