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On May 12 2015 10:37 zev318 wrote:
if only the nfl was good at enforcing its own rules lol.
the pa should fight for this as well, this will serve as a precedent to get suspended for "more probable than not".
That's the standard of proof in civil litigation... Its why OJ owed tons of money to the family even though he was acquitted.
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51582 Posts
everything seems fine except for the first rounder that's a bit harsh
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United States97276 Posts
Do they add more compensatory picks in the draft to get the same number of picks overall or is there just less picks in the draft during those years?
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Good thing for Pats that bill wont miss any games. He made Matt cassle look top tier.
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On May 12 2015 11:13 Shellshock wrote:
Do they add more compensatory picks in the draft to get the same number of picks overall or is there just less picks in the draft during those years?
Dunno, but there will only be 31 first round picks. The first pick of the second will be considered 32.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_NFL_draft
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On May 12 2015 08:57 giftdgecko wrote:
Legit question: if this gets appealed and an independent party deems the report to be insufficeint evidence for the punishment, how long does Goodell have left after alienating one of his only remaining supporters and mishandling every major event of the past year?
Also, don't worry ghost; Brady will be back just in time to hand the ball off against the Colts
I'm fairly certain that is not going to happen. The punishment might be reduced to a 2 game ban, but the evidence is pretty damning so I doubt it will be deemed entirely insufficient.
I'm actually glad that Brady will be back for the Colts game. Winning over the Patriots without him would be an empty victory and I would rather my team lost with the Pats at full (legal) strength. The only negative is going to be the media storm that is going to surround the game as it will (currently) be Brady's first game back.
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I hate cheaters who think they can get away with it. NFL still hypocritical and corrupt, but sucks to be Brady today, ha!
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Brady is guilty of trying to play "tough guy" to a bunch of rich, old men who have thousands of their underlings beg at the feet decade after decade.
That is the real transgression he is being punished for.
Now that the posturing is complete can a real negotiation process can begin now?
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From the report: Physics
Measurements
Remember that the sample size for the Colts was 4 and the Pats 12. The Colts numbers can be replicated using 4 of the Pats balls as well. Walt stated that he used the needle Prioleau used but isn't 100%, the report said he is misremembering and assumes going forward he used the other.
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I was going with Seahawks to win the Superbowl this year but now im going Patriots. The more shit you pile on Brady and Bill, the better they preform. The NFL just stomped on the Gadsden Flag and their will be hell to pay.
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He isn't getting suspended just because he deflated some balls. He's also getting suspended because he willingly witheld information. The league is looking for transperancy, that was stated multiple times.
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The problem with that is, to give an example to the real world, if you're testifying for a minor crime (ball deflation) then you perjure yourself in court, you should be punished on the basis of perjury not homicide. A 4 game suspension for withholding information is harsh.
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I don't think the punishment is harsh at all. I think it's spot on. The problem is as a standard of comparison you have Greg Hardy being out for 10 games for (allegedly) throwing his girlfriend onto a bed covered with assault weapons and threatening to kill her. Do I think what Brady did is 40% as bad as that? No. But he's also not being punished for cheating the rules, or lying about said cheating, it's a cumulative effect of all of those things. It's not the kind of thing where you get caught the first and only time you do it. The string of text messages between the equipment managers went back for quite some time, so you have to wonder that even if it didn't effect the outcome of the 45-7 AFC title game, what about any one possession games that could have been Pats losses before that? The Pats as an organization have a history of bending the rules to begin with, and it would be reasonable to expectt that Brady has been a part of that.
I remember in the AFC title game a few years ago he slid down on a scramble in front of Ed Reed but as he was doing so threw a foot up in the air in a clear Ty Cobb-esque effort to put a spike in Reed's leg. I really can't believe nobody gave any attention to that, but in my mind it was one of the dirtiest plays I've ever seen. It's like a Suh stepping on someones leg, there's a clear intent to injure. Except Suh doesn't get 15 yard penalties every time somebody breathes in his direction, and the irony of Brady trying to spike someone's knee in the midst of an act that says "I give up, don't touch me or you get a penalty" is mindblowing. It doesn't help Brady that he smugly suggested the Ravens "read the rulebook" the week before he got caught...breaking the rules. And as far as the picks and the fine go, I think Kraft didn't do his team any favors when he said he "expects an apology from the NFL" before the investigation even happened.
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On May 13 2015 04:02 JimmiC wrote:
I think it's so funny that people are mad that there isn't 100% proof. When everyone who knows anything about the way equipment people work and way the pats are run that of course they knew. What they should have said was," I thought the balls felt a little too full so I asked the guys to take some air out, I never meant below the legal limit but I can see how it happened, sorry". And that would have been the end of it, maybe a fine.
But then instead they did the big deny deny which was insulting to anyone who knew anything about how it would work and did not cooperate, had press conferences about how they would never do it and blah blah blah. The cleaner you create of a image plus the more you lie about things the more people want to prove you wrong.
edit* it doesn't sound like people's complaint is that Tom didn't do it but rather that they can't 100% prove it. Which sounds pretty homerish to me.
I'm saying I don't think Tom did it. Wells said today that he didn't think anybody could view any of those text messages as a joke, but half of NE on reading it, did. They did cooperate for a more than reasonable amount of the time, denying a fourth interview in person and offered it over the phone which Wells declined. Brady didn't hand over personal information and the NFLPA and his lawyers are going to attack the suspension based on the fact that it is one of the driving reasons for it being so high.
Also, if Brady was texting the other two, why do they need his phone when they have theirs? The texts show up on both sides...
The texts also include one from one of the main targets to his fiance back in Oct. after a Jets game saying that "They were supposed to be 12.5 and they were 16. They fucked us". Sounds to me like they wanted 12.5, but hey, I'm just a homer.
If the patriots were going to cheat, as thorough as they prepare for everything else (which often is what gets them in trouble), it would have been every ball ~2.0 PSI under as was initially reported. I was ready to apologize then.
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On May 13 2015 04:02 JimmiC wrote:
I think it's so funny that people are mad that there isn't 100% proof. When everyone who knows anything about the way equipment people work and way the pats are run that of course they knew. What they should have said was," I thought the balls felt a little too full so I asked the guys to take some air out, I never meant below the legal limit but I can see how it happened, sorry". And that would have been the end of it, maybe a fine.
But then instead they did the big deny deny which was insulting to anyone who knew anything about how it would work and did not cooperate, had press conferences about how they would never do it and blah blah blah. The cleaner you create of a image plus the more you lie about things the more people want to prove you wrong.
edit* it doesn't sound like people's complaint is that Tom didn't do it but rather that they can't 100% prove it. Which sounds pretty homerish to me.
They're suspending him for 4 games for texts that don't show that he ordered the balls to be illegally deflated. That's the point that most people are up in arms about. Since it happened (and that seems a bit flimsy since the entire report hinges on that needles thing) obviously the organization gets hit. But I don't see how you can suspend Brady unless you specifically have some concrete proof that shows he ordered the balls to be illegally deflated. I mean logic points to the balls being deflated to benefit the guy who touches them all game, but I think to suspend the player there have to be crystal clear evidence that he was the one who did it
as far as not cooperating, he refused to turn over his phone to a body that doesn't have authority for that, but he spoke with them. IANAL but as far as I know there's not anything in the CBA that says turn over your phone or else.
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Penalizing him for not turning the phone over when his attorney advised him not to is pretty weak. Like Hawk said there's nothing in the CBA that demands total compliance in that regard, but I guess they're going to hold that against him. I wonder what the punishment would have been had the Patriots complied with all their wishes and there was no obstruction. $500k, a second round draft pick, and 2 game suspension for Brady?
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He is not being punished for not turning over his phone. He is being punished for lying in an attempt to cover up his cheating.
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He is being punished for not turning over his phone. He's also being punished for withholding information. Just because there's other things wrong with the situation don't mean he's off the hook for other things that the NFL deems that he interfered with.
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EPT
