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On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:On September 30 2016 03:17 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now.
While it's not a homogeneous movement by any means, I'm not aware of a single alt-right community that rejects racism. In fact, racism (the self professed kind, not the kind where you argue whether it really is racism or not) is the one element that is persistent between all the places that call themselves 'alt-right', from /r/the_donald to /pol/ to Breitbart comments to The Right Stuff to Daily Stormer and the likes.
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On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now.
The inside battle to determine which shade of racism is the best must be fascinating.
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On September 30 2016 04:31 Evotroid wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. Where/how can one observe this battle? I am serious, I only see the alt-right through what comes through this topic, but I would be interested to see the "battlegrounds" so to say (It was also interesting seeing world war bernie on the dem side until the great saltening)
If you want to see the perspective of the racist elements (as in true Nazis), go look at this article at The Daily Stormer. If you want to see the perspective of the more moderate elements, look at this post (and the comments) in Vox Day's blog.
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Vox day.......talent-less hack why can't he just stop being relevant.? Like who ruins the Hugo Awards because they think science fiction is being taken over by brown people and women?
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On September 30 2016 04:44 Dan HH wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. While it's not a homogeneous movement by any means, I'm not aware of a single alt-right community that rejects racism. In fact, racism (the self professed kind, not the kind where you argue whether it really is racism or not) is the one element that is persistent between all the places that call themselves 'alt-right', from /r/the_donald to /pol/ to Breitbart comments to The Right Stuff to Daily Stormer and the likes.
I guess it depends upon how you define "racism." If you go by Vox Day's dichotomy of the alt right, there's the "alt west" and the "alt white." Alt west cares about culture. Alt white cares about (white) race. In my opinion, the alt west movement isn't racist (it's race neutral), but anyone who adopts one of those over-expansive definitions of racism that I railed against a week or so ago may disagree on that point.
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On September 30 2016 04:30 ticklishmusic wrote:Show nested quote +U.S. lawmakers on Thursday expressed doubts about Sept. 11 legislation they forced on President Barack Obama, saying the new law allowing lawsuits against Saudi Arabia could be narrowed to ease concerns about its effect on Americans abroad.
A day after a rare overwhelming rejection of a presidential veto, the first during Obama's eight years in the White House, the Republican leaders of the Senate and House of Representatives opened the door to fixing the law as they blamed Obama, a Democrat, for not consulting them adequately.
"I do think is worth further discussing," Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell told reporters, acknowledging that there could be "potential consequences" of the "Justice Against Sponsors of Terrorism Act," known as JASTA.
House Speaker Paul Ryan said Congress might have to "fix" the legislation to protect U.S. service members in particular.
Ryan did not give a time frame for addressing the issue, but Republican Senator Bob Corker, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, said he thought the issues could be addressed in Congress' "lame-duck" session after the Nov. 8 election.
The law grants an exception to the legal principle of sovereign immunity in cases of terrorism on U.S. soil, clearing the way for lawsuits by the families of victims of the attacks seeking damages from the Saudi government. Riyadh has denied longstanding suspicions that it backed the hijackers who attacked the United States in 2001. Fifteen of the 19 hijackers were Saudi nationals.
Riyadh is one of Washington's longest-standing and most important allies in the Middle East and part of a U.S.-led coalition fighting Islamic State militants in Iraq and Syria.
JASTA will add tension to U.S.-Saudi relations, after friction over Obama's 2015 nuclear deal with Saudi rival Iran.
White House spokesman Josh Earnest noted how quickly lawmakers shifted from overwhelmingly voting to override the veto to wanting to change the law.
"I think what we've seen in the United States Congress is a pretty classic case of rapid onset buyer's remorse," Earnest told a White House briefing. SourceYou can't make this shit up. Congress is blaming Obama for a law they wrote, he veto'd and they overrode.
maybe tomorrow I'll wake up and realize this was all just a dream. That is pure gold
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On September 30 2016 04:46 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. The inside battle to determine which shade of racism is the best must be fascinating.
Yeah looking at the samples xDaunt gave it certainly looks like an argument over how to be acceptably racist. That the alt-right has a lot of people in it that are disenchanted with the Republican party and stuck choosing between them and racists who don't know how to maintain plausible deniability.
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Vox Day, professional sci-fi convention brigader is now mentioned unironically as a voice in politics. What a time to be alive
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United States42009 Posts
On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now.
I'm not sure that's really happening given that you'd probably place yourself on the non-racist side. The battle between racist and not is the election.
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On September 30 2016 05:00 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. I'm not sure that's really happening given that you'd probably place yourself on the non-racist side. The battle between racist and not is the election.
Plenty of racist people voting for Clinton though. Admittedly not so many of the white hood and swastika wearing types, but no doubt there are plenty of racists supporting Clinton.
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On September 30 2016 05:00 Nyxisto wrote:
Vox Day, professional sci-fi convention brigader is now mentioned unironically as a voice in politics. What a time to be alive
The man who elevated Chuck Tingle(this name is NSFW, do not search for his writings at work, Im not fucking kidding) to twitter legend and god level troll of the angry white male sci-fi fans. What a time to be alive.
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On September 30 2016 05:02 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 05:00 KwarK wrote:On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. I'm not sure that's really happening given that you'd probably place yourself on the non-racist side. The battle between racist and not is the election. Plenty of racist people voting for Clinton though. Admittedly not so many of the white hood and swastika wearing types, but no doubt there are plenty of racists supporting Clinton.
Well, if you don't vote for someone because racists in the country cast a ballot for the same person, you wouldn't vote on anyone.
(Or you would be smarmy and say "Less racists like Jill Stein though")
(Which is technically statistically true because less people in total like Jill Stein)
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On September 30 2016 05:02 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 05:00 KwarK wrote:On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. I'm not sure that's really happening given that you'd probably place yourself on the non-racist side. The battle between racist and not is the election. Plenty of racist people voting for Clinton though. Admittedly not so many of the white hood and swastika wearing types, but no doubt there are plenty of racists supporting Clinton.
And a bunch of sexist, racist assholes were going to vote for Bernie. A lot of women complained about the “Bernie bros” on the internet and how they were total sexist jerks. It is a matter of degrees.
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On September 30 2016 04:53 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:44 Dan HH wrote:On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. While it's not a homogeneous movement by any means, I'm not aware of a single alt-right community that rejects racism. In fact, racism (the self professed kind, not the kind where you argue whether it really is racism or not) is the one element that is persistent between all the places that call themselves 'alt-right', from /r/the_donald to /pol/ to Breitbart comments to The Right Stuff to Daily Stormer and the likes. I guess it depends upon how you define "racism." If you go by Vox Day's dichotomy of the alt right, there's the "alt west" and the "alt white." Alt west cares about culture. Alt white cares about (white) race. In my opinion, the alt west movement isn't racist (it's race neutral), but anyone who adopts one of those over-expansive definitions of racism that I railed against a week or so ago may disagree on that point.
Yeah... except racism has precisely long been revamped around culture, if only to be more acceptable. Biological racialism and antisemitism have been completely shunned by the contemporary standards, so racist ideologies had to evolve and “reinvente themselves”. In France this is partly how the Front National rose; its new leader put under the carpet the most crude/obvious stuff that the former one was still saying (“I believe in unequal races” etc.), and now uses the language of “culture”: our culture and values are radically, fundamentally incompatible with such people (who can't be assimilated, etc.) and such religion, follow my eyes... Targets the same people, but avoids all drawbacks associated with racism 1.0, especially historical links to nazis or fascists. Racialism is actually an obsolete language, it's a ghost from the XIXth century; clever racists moved on the new, much more profitable battleground: culture/civilization.
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to extend on that a little:
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/?ex_cid=rrpromo#now
Trump below 30% for the first time in some time. Hillary turned Nevada, North Carolina and Florida since the debate happened. Granted, with the smallest margins you could imagine but those looked like pretty good states for Trump lately, except for Florida maybe which always ended up being a coinflip either way. So Trump has to get those 3 back and Colorado on top of that.
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On September 30 2016 04:48 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2016 04:31 Evotroid wrote:On September 30 2016 04:21 xDaunt wrote:On September 30 2016 03:55 Dan HH wrote:Wonder what the people that were arguing here that the alt-right isn't racist think about what those speakers Again, it depends upon your definition of "alt right." Interestingly enough, there appears to be quite a battle going on between the racist and non-racist elements of the alt right over control of the "alt right brand" and "alt right movement." Long story short, the alt right is quite fluid right now. Where/how can one observe this battle? I am serious, I only see the alt-right through what comes through this topic, but I would be interested to see the "battlegrounds" so to say (It was also interesting seeing world war bernie on the dem side until the great saltening) If you want to see the perspective of the racist elements (as in true Nazis), go look at this article at The Daily Stormer. If you want to see the perspective of the more moderate elements, look at this post (and the comments) in Vox Day's blog.
First of all, thanks for the reply, It is eye opening. I started with the Vox article as I believed it was the underrepresented side in the topic. It was let's say very interesting, though not that very informative on what exactly the author think is the true alt right.
But then the daily-stormer (and here my attention quickly slipped to the sidebar "a normies guide to the alt-right") got me suspecting, did you link that site in jest? as in, because you know I am pretty liberal, and just to troll me?
Half the article reads like the encyclopedia dramatica with bits of onion in it. If not, then that site paints a pretty bad picture of the alt-right? Like, trump bad.
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http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-na-pol-trump-women/
It might be par for the course for Trump (an appropriate golf pun here) but this sort of sexism is still very pathetic . I don't know how anyone can stand him, myself I can't watch a single clip of him talking without feeling visceral disgust.
I think anti-feminist cultures or workspaces are often havens for people that are abusive towards women, you can see that also in the recent expose (link) on the fox news work culture, and unsurprisingly a sexual predator like Ailes has now joined forces with Trump, an unrepenting sexist who raped his wife.
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A law prohibiting New Hampshire voters from taking self-portraits with their ballots has been deemed unfair. Taking self-portraits with your ballot markings in a voting booth has been illegal in that state since 2014 and punishable by a fine of up to $1,000. The law was put in place to avoid potential vote-buying schemes. Politicians feared that the ballots in the images could be used for tracking and verifying influenced votes.
This law has now deemed to be unfair and in violation of the First Amendment by the First Circuit Court of Appeals in Boston, which has upheld a lower court ruling. The court acknowledged the reasons for implementing the legislation but said in the ruling it felt there was a 'substantial mismatch between New Hampshire's objectives and ballot-selfie prohibition,' and that 'the restrictions on speech' were 'antithetical to democratic values.'
Ballot selfies are regulated in different ways across the US. A total of 26 states prohibit them explicitly through various laws, such as bans on cameras in polling places. In 9 states, now including New Hampshire and Oregon they are allowed and in the remaining states the law is unclear. The court ruling in Boston only has an impact in New Hampshire but hopefully other states will follow, as harmonized laws across the nation would provide some much-needed clarity on the subject.
Source
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On September 30 2016 05:33 Grumbels wrote:http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-na-pol-trump-women/It might be par for the course for Trump (an appropriate golf pun here) but this sort of sexism is still very pathetic . I don't know how anyone can stand him, myself I can't watch a single clip of him talking without feeling visceral disgust. I think anti-feminist cultures or workspaces are often havens for people that are abusive towards women, you can see that also in the recent expose ( link) on the fox news work culture, and unsurprisingly a sexual predator like Ailes has now joined forces with Trump, an unrepenting sexist who raped his wife.
People can argue, I guess, about whether or not Trump himself is racist or just stupid and ignorant. The question about him being a sexist was answered a long time ago and occasionally gets supporting evidence.
Yes, you are voting for a blatant sexist when you vote for Trump. Not that many of his white male voters care I imagine.
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Apparently giving a man power and letting him get away with whatever he wants is a fast track to creating a monster.
Reportedly Bill raped Broaddrick twice on the same day. It all reeks of a pattern that he would do anything to gain power, and he probably did this more than once.
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EPT
