|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
Looks like Manafort has no issue with foreign interests getting their hands into a country as long as they're paying him. Interesting...I'm sure the cash ledger from which smoke is pouring out like a dumpster fire is NBD, folks.
"Anti-corruption officials there say the payments earmarked for Mr. Manafort, previously unreported, are a focus of their investigation, though they have yet to determine if he actually received the cash. While Mr. Manafort is not a target in the separate inquiry of offshore activities, prosecutors say he must have realized the implications of his financial dealings.
“He understood what was happening in Ukraine,” said Vitaliy Kasko, a former senior official with the general prosecutor’s office in Kiev. “It would have to be clear to any reasonable person that the Yanukovych clan, when it came to power, was engaged in corruption.”
Mr. Kasko added, “It’s impossible to imagine a person would look at this and think, ‘Everything is all right.’”
- NYT, 8/14/16
|
On August 16 2016 00:14 Doodsmack wrote:
Looks like Manafort has no issue with foreign interests getting their hands into a country as long as they're paying him. Interesting...I'm sure the cash ledger from which smoke is pouring out like a dumpster fire is NBD, folks.
"Anti-corruption officials there say the payments earmarked for Mr. Manafort, previously unreported, are a focus of their investigation, though they have yet to determine if he actually received the cash. While Mr. Manafort is not a target in the separate inquiry of offshore activities, prosecutors say he must have realized the implications of his financial dealings.
“He understood what was happening in Ukraine,” said Vitaliy Kasko, a former senior official with the general prosecutor’s office in Kiev. “It would have to be clear to any reasonable person that the Yanukovych clan, when it came to power, was engaged in corruption.”
Mr. Kasko added, “It’s impossible to imagine a person would look at this and think, ‘Everything is all right.’”
- NYT, 8/14/16
Gonna be really surprised if this doesn't go anywhere. It looks rather incriminating. However, it is still unclear exactly what laws he may have broken or if this is just sketchy. If Manafort ends up having to resign, I wonder if the GOP consider a coup against Trump.
|
On August 16 2016 00:24 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2016 00:14 Doodsmack wrote:
Looks like Manafort has no issue with foreign interests getting their hands into a country as long as they're paying him. Interesting...I'm sure the cash ledger from which smoke is pouring out like a dumpster fire is NBD, folks.
"Anti-corruption officials there say the payments earmarked for Mr. Manafort, previously unreported, are a focus of their investigation, though they have yet to determine if he actually received the cash. While Mr. Manafort is not a target in the separate inquiry of offshore activities, prosecutors say he must have realized the implications of his financial dealings.
“He understood what was happening in Ukraine,” said Vitaliy Kasko, a former senior official with the general prosecutor’s office in Kiev. “It would have to be clear to any reasonable person that the Yanukovych clan, when it came to power, was engaged in corruption.”
Mr. Kasko added, “It’s impossible to imagine a person would look at this and think, ‘Everything is all right.’”
- NYT, 8/14/16 Gonna be really surprised if this doesn't go anywhere. It looks rather incriminating. However, it is still unclear exactly what laws he may have broken or if this is just sketchy. If Manafort ends up having to resign, I wonder if the GOP consider a coup against Trump.
There are a lot of people with vested interests in other countries, especially one like Ukraine which has a lot of money AND a lot of corruption. Though there's some obvious shitty dealings, is that really unusual for the Trump campaign?
You're too quick to the trigger on the "remove the candidate" issue. It's too late to depose Trump, it's too late to depose Hillary, and it's most certainly too late to do either in a way that would be less damaging than calling it a loss for this election cycle.
|
On August 16 2016 00:24 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2016 00:14 Doodsmack wrote:
Looks like Manafort has no issue with foreign interests getting their hands into a country as long as they're paying him. Interesting...I'm sure the cash ledger from which smoke is pouring out like a dumpster fire is NBD, folks.
"Anti-corruption officials there say the payments earmarked for Mr. Manafort, previously unreported, are a focus of their investigation, though they have yet to determine if he actually received the cash. While Mr. Manafort is not a target in the separate inquiry of offshore activities, prosecutors say he must have realized the implications of his financial dealings.
“He understood what was happening in Ukraine,” said Vitaliy Kasko, a former senior official with the general prosecutor’s office in Kiev. “It would have to be clear to any reasonable person that the Yanukovych clan, when it came to power, was engaged in corruption.”
Mr. Kasko added, “It’s impossible to imagine a person would look at this and think, ‘Everything is all right.’”
- NYT, 8/14/16 Gonna be really surprised if this doesn't go anywhere. It looks rather incriminating. However, it is still unclear exactly what laws he may have broken or if this is just sketchy. If Manafort ends up having to resign, I wonder if the GOP consider a coup against Trump.
It seems absolutely clear that he was at least aware that there was category 5 hurricane of corruption going on around him and his dealings. Now his candidate's positions on NATO and Russia are correlating with his associations.
But don't worry...Trump is NOT a subscription member of the establishment, and has NO tolerance for public corruption.
|
On those corruption/ties; I mostly just watn the ffbi to look into things and report if there's a problem or not.
|
There are ways for Manafort to save his own ass. Only way Manafort resigns over this is if he really fucks up his response. Which, given the track record of the Trump campaign, is pretty much a coinflip.
One thing is for sure, if he stays Trump better have a prepped response for Clinton asking him about it at the debates that sounds pretty convincing (I have my doubts he even knows the historical relationships between Russia and Ukraine).
|
On August 16 2016 00:41 TheTenthDoc wrote:
(I have my doubts he even knows the historical relationships between Russia and Ukraine).
To be fair, how many people in the US actually do?
|
United States44203 Posts
Trump is scandalproof. He's lost every supporter who cares about scandals already. There's no need to respond to it beyond "Ukraine is a fiction created by the left wing media and Crooked Hillary to stop me making America great again".
|
Manafort won't flub the response. Hes one of the people in the trump campaign that actually knows how to play in the major leagues
|
On August 16 2016 00:44 KwarK wrote:
Trump is scandalproof. He's lost every supporter who cares about scandals already. There's no need to respond to it beyond "Ukraine is a fiction created by the left wing media and Crooked Hillary to stop me making America great again".
The only way it hurts Trump is if the GOP finally thinks that any support of him at all will hurt them down ticket. This is the point in the election where the only thing that can happen is that there is further resistance to Trump’s polls going higher.
|
|
|
On August 16 2016 00:43 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2016 00:41 TheTenthDoc wrote:
(I have my doubts he even knows the historical relationships between Russia and Ukraine). To be fair, how many people in the US actually do?
It's not a question of fairness. Unfortunately for Trump, ignorance is almost entirely working against him on that question.
Clinton's point would boil down to "Your campaign manager took money from corrupt pro-Russian Ukrainian officials and you expect us to believe your policy isn't tainted by that when a good chunk of it praises Russia?" Even a third-grader gets that.
Trump would need to both explain the geopolitical situation AND why it's not important a major player on your campaign who helped shape foreign policy in a region was found on the ledgers of corrupt foreign politicians in the region.
That requires both knowledge of the area and the ability to communicate that knowledge, both of which Trump sorely lacks.
This is assuming he's still actually trying to court new voters by the time of the debates, of course, and edge above his current dismal numbers.
|
United States44203 Posts
On August 16 2016 01:02 TheTenthDoc wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2016 00:43 LegalLord wrote:On August 16 2016 00:41 TheTenthDoc wrote:
(I have my doubts he even knows the historical relationships between Russia and Ukraine). To be fair, how many people in the US actually do? It's not a question of fairness. Unfortunately for Trump, ignorance is almost entirely working against him on that question. Clinton's point would boil down to "Your campaign manager took money from corrupt pro-Russian Ukrainian officials and you expect us to believe your policy isn't tainted by that when a good chunk of it praises Russia?" Even a third-grader gets that. Trump would need to both explain the geopolitical situation AND why it's not important a major player on your campaign who helped shape foreign policy in a region was found on the ledgers of corrupt foreign politicians in the region. That requires both knowledge of the area and the ability to communicate that knowledge, both of which Trump sorely lacks. This is assuming he's still actually trying to court new voters by the time of the debates, of course, and edge above his current dismal numbers.
"Crooked Hillary killed Ben Ghazi".
checkmate
|
On August 16 2016 01:10 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2016 01:02 TheTenthDoc wrote:On August 16 2016 00:43 LegalLord wrote:On August 16 2016 00:41 TheTenthDoc wrote:
(I have my doubts he even knows the historical relationships between Russia and Ukraine). To be fair, how many people in the US actually do? It's not a question of fairness. Unfortunately for Trump, ignorance is almost entirely working against him on that question. Clinton's point would boil down to "Your campaign manager took money from corrupt pro-Russian Ukrainian officials and you expect us to believe your policy isn't tainted by that when a good chunk of it praises Russia?" Even a third-grader gets that. Trump would need to both explain the geopolitical situation AND why it's not important a major player on your campaign who helped shape foreign policy in a region was found on the ledgers of corrupt foreign politicians in the region. That requires both knowledge of the area and the ability to communicate that knowledge, both of which Trump sorely lacks. This is assuming he's still actually trying to court new voters by the time of the debates, of course, and edge above his current dismal numbers. "Crooked Hillary killed Ben Ghazi". checkmate
That's a fine debate response if he wants to lose by 6 percentage points but I'm not sure that's his goal (it sure won't win him any of the GJ voters he needs to actually compete with Clinton).
Then again he's always been pretty nearsighted and thinks doubling down on a base is the optimal way to win due to its success in the primaries.
|
United States44203 Posts
I think he quite likes the platform and the attention and speaking in front of crowds of thousands who all chant his name, but that he doesn't really want the actual work involved in being President. But that's just me.
|
On August 15 2016 21:59 Leporello wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2016 14:13 oBlade wrote:On August 15 2016 11:06 Leporello wrote:On August 15 2016 10:41 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Sigh. I hope we're delaying giving Donald Trump classified information for as long as possible. Every day, it seems, we're hearing about a new staffer or accomplice having direct ties to Putin and/or the Kremlin. Unbelievable. It just gets worse and worse. What a surprise that Donald Trump has a weird, previously unexplained distaste for NATO. Trump probably couldn't even name half the countries in Eastern Europe, but for "some reason", he has strong opinions about NATO. What a coincidence. But what does it matter? Donald Trump could invite Vladimir Putin over to desecrate on Ronald Reagan's corpse, and I'm sure the Trump-voters would find it great. The Kremlin isn't in the Ukraine and Trump's not an agent of Putin. He's had two wives from Eastern Europe. He's had the same ideas about other countries taking advantage of US defense for 30 years. [obscenely large and irrelevant picture inserted here] You seem to be being deliberately obtuse. This was the pro-Russian Ukraine that was overthrown, that Manafort is accused of accepting money from. So.... And then the photographed letter you attached has nothing to do with anything NATO or Russia, so I'm not sure what the point of it is. Donald has had a strange pro-Russian anti-NATO stance his whole campaign. It makes no sense, given Russia's actions the past 10 years. NATO has never been more relevant than it is today. And he wants to weaken it, question its relevancy? What? It's nonsense.
I just explained the relevance. Do you need it spoonfed to you again? His criticism of NATO is absolutely unsurprising because he's been talking about other countries taking advantage of the US for three decades. People who realize Trump wasn't born in July 2015 have been able to figure these things out.
The fact that you have an ideological disagreement with him, that you think NATO is unimpeachably great and working as intended and don't think amending relations with Russia is a good idea when their fighter jets are buzzing US ships and planes, that doesn't make him a Putin stooge. Stop reading Slate and grow up.
On August 15 2016 21:59 Leporello wrote:
So, just a coincidence, then, that we hear, time and time again, about these pro-Kremlin connections.
I have yet to hear of one Kremlin connection, you're just regurgitating gossip propaganda. It's like the people who claim the Clintons killed Vince Foster. "Time and time again there's a fucking dead body next to whatever the Clintons had their hands on, coincidence??????" Truth by repetition doesn't work.
On August 15 2016 21:59 Leporello wrote:
But that's not saying anything, because at this point, it seems pretty obvious that Trump is, witting or unwittingly, a fucking Russian stooge. For real.
Oh, a Russian stooge, so let's turn to Clinton who, unlike the tradition of Reagan, she's going, between Russia and the West, she's going to build up that wall and make Russia p- oh. 
|
On August 16 2016 01:21 KwarK wrote:
I think he quite likes the platform and the attention and speaking in front of crowds of thousands who all chant his name, but that he doesn't really want the actual work involved in being President. But that's just me.
This is on point. If you seen his recent interviews about the "media", he complains that the media doesn't cover how huge the crowds are or how excited they are. When he says something that gets him headlines, he says it is good because people are talking about what he said, even if the discussion is negative.
I long suspected that Trump was going become very confused in the general election, when it is about courting voters that don't come to rallies and small, face to face meetings with people. I really want to know if he has staffed up nation wide yet.
|
On August 16 2016 01:21 KwarK wrote:
I think he quite likes the platform and the attention and speaking in front of crowds of thousands who all chant his name, but that he doesn't really want the actual work involved in being President. But that's just me.
That would certainly be collaborated by the Kasich VP deal where he would get foreign and domestic power (aka everything really).
One can probably reasonably assume Pence got a similar deal.
|
On August 16 2016 01:21 KwarK wrote:
I think he quite likes the platform and the attention and speaking in front of crowds of thousands who all chant his name, but that he doesn't really want the actual work involved in being President. But that's just me.
I thought that was pretty obvious when he gave his VP a blank check on policy decisions.
|
Trump's daughter is vacationing with Putin's current girlfriend lol
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
