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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3176

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
March 05 2016 04:20 GMT
#63501
even if that isn't obvious, you'd have to be illiterate to fail to recognize the discrepancy in reputation and accomplishments.
kwizach
Profile Joined June 2011
3658 Posts
March 05 2016 04:22 GMT
#63502
Time to get back on topic, perhaps?
"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions." -- Stephen Colbert
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
March 05 2016 04:30 GMT
#63503
I like how my joke about if you disregard Harris's contributions, you'd have to disregard Chomsky turned into an intelligence pissing contest.
When the whole point of the comment was that it should be discussion of ideas, not individuals.
liftlift > tsm
ErectedZenith
Profile Joined January 2016
325 Posts
March 05 2016 04:43 GMT
#63504
On March 05 2016 13:16 oneofthem wrote:
chomsky is much smarter than harris


Prove it.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
March 05 2016 04:51 GMT
#63505
i'm sorry but that line of trolling was terminated due to external pressure. dial 9 to return to the main menu
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
March 05 2016 04:52 GMT
#63506
On March 05 2016 13:22 kwizach wrote:
Time to get back on topic, perhaps?

Yes.

And if people feel they just have to have a brain-measuring contest, then at least do so without all the snark.
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States6267 Posts
March 05 2016 04:54 GMT
#63507
On March 05 2016 13:30 wei2coolman wrote:
I like how my joke about if you disregard Harris's contributions, you'd have to disregard Chomsky turned into an intelligence pissing contest.
When the whole point of the comment was that it should be discussion of ideas, not individuals.

It was a good point, but apparently not noticed. Having interesting conversations about what's true is less appealing than measuring the faculties of public intellectuals who don't have identical interests.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 05 2016 04:55 GMT
#63508
The Alabama supreme court refused on Friday to defy the US supreme court ruling that effectively legalized same-sex marriage nationwide, cutting off a conservative bid to prevent gay weddings in the state.

The court issued a one-sentence order dismissing a challenge by a probate judge and a conservative policy group that wanted the state to bar gay marriage despite the landmark federal decision.

In one of several written opinions accompanying the order, Justice Greg Shaw called the decision a “clear refusal” to ignore the supreme court ruling last June.

Several other state justices railed against the high court’s ruling while noting they can’t overturn it.

Chief Justice Roy Moore, a Christian conservative who has repeatedly spoken out against same-sex unions, wrote that previous state orders barring gay marriage in Alabama remain. Most probate judges already are ignoring that directive, however, and hundreds of same-sex couples already have wed in Alabama.

Eric Johnston, an attorney for the Alabama Policy Institute, which went to court seeking to prevent more gay marriages in Alabama, said the decision left opponents nowhere to turn in the court system.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
ElMeanYo
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1032 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 05:37:19
March 05 2016 05:29 GMT
#63509
Why Trump is a master at media manipulation:

"He transformed politics into reality politics using skill sets he acquired in 11 years of reality TV," said Hugh Hewitt, a conservative radio show host who has interviewed Trump several times during the campaign. "He is quite an artist of rhetoric and modern media communications and has more practice than any other Republican. I give him props for being able to carry this and sustain it. He's the best interview in America."

As one New York-based campaign reporter put it: "Being a reality-television star is the perfect experience to prepare a candidate for the modern news-media cycle."

"He's been easier to book than many, many people. I won't name names," Hewitt said. "He is very disciplined in making the rounds and so that has been to his benefit. It's all media all the time. That's great. You've got to flood the zone in America. In a media cycle where there's a breaking story every day, every candidate ought to be available every day, to every major media platform."

"He's absolutely exploited the media environment to his advantage," the producer said. "He understands every single tendency that producers of this business have and he tailored his strategy to hold us hostage."

The producer, like many media professionals interviewed for this article, spoke on condition of anonymity because the campaign still needs to be covered. But also because there's evidence that speaking even remotely critically of Trump will incite the candidate and may spur him to retaliate by either blocking access to him or by publicly ridiculing the source of the criticism.

Neither makes for good business if you're a political journalist pressured to get clicks or if you're a TV news executive in a fight for ratings.

"It's a problem. We need to make revenue," said the producer. "In terms of ratings, Trump is good for the company."


Source
“The only man who never makes mistakes is the man who never does anything.” ― Theodore Roosevelt
panditdksharma001
Profile Joined March 2016
India0 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 06:21:05
March 05 2016 06:21 GMT
#63510
Bot edit.

User was banned for this post.
i am an astrologer
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 06:30:06
March 05 2016 06:26 GMT
#63511
Is it really some nuanced media strategy, or is it just that he whipped up the right base, doubled down against media frenzy, and then continued to double down against media frenzy, earning him the favor of the anti-establishment (which includes media) masses? Did Trump himself predict the response to the phrasing "they're rapists"? Did Trump say "blood coming out of her wherever" to purposely keep the lights on him, or because he actually is so sensitive to criticism psychologically that he lashes out with schoolyard insults? I think it may just be a happy coincidence for Trump that his insecure nature meshes well with media coverage (which has been the case since the 80s).

That Trump is highly available to the media is certainly smart and geared toward remaining in the spotlight, but I don't think it's the core of how he got in the spotlight. He could only have gotten in the spotlight by attracting the masses. I'm just not convinced he attracted them in some cunning way.

Either way, what we do know is that he's a media-created spectacle without any indication of governing ability, realistic ideas or actual government knowledge.

Trump's ambition in life, starting with his earliest business activity, has been gain as much as possible by any means necessary. He's filth, and if America elects him, we can be sure that America is filth too.
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
March 05 2016 06:29 GMT
#63512
Wow I didn't expect this thread to suddenly turn into Sam Harris bashing. Since it has, however, would one of you self-professed brilliant minds (IgnE, plansix, zulu_nation8) be as kind as to point me to some of Chomsky's more brilliant works so I can enlighten myself as to why he's so great and why Harris is just a populist moron? I've read a lot of Sam Harris, but I've yet to see him make any sweeping generalizations about the Muslim world. In fact he consistently focuses his criticisms towards Muslim fundamentalists and the regressive left who cannot even bring themselves to concede that ISIS has *something* to do with Islam.
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 06:37:51
March 05 2016 06:37 GMT
#63513
On March 05 2016 15:29 writer22816 wrote:
Wow I didn't expect this thread to suddenly turn into Sam Harris bashing. Since it has, however, would one of you self-professed brilliant minds (IgnE, plansix, zulu_nation8) be as kind as to point me to some of Chomsky's more brilliant works so I can enlighten myself as to why he's so great and why Harris is just a populist moron? I've read a lot of Sam Harris, but I've yet to see him make any sweeping generalizations about the Muslim world. In fact he consistently focuses his criticisms towards Muslim fundamentalists and the regressive left who cannot even bring themselves to concede that ISIS has *something* to do with Islam.

Pretty much a lot of his linguistic theories, especially around linguistic hierarchy were pretty much the most cited pieces of research. I think there's like some algorithm that shows how good of a researcher you are based on the number of other research your cited in, and I think Chomsky is like insanely highly rated (like we're talking about top 10 territory) because of how fundamental his work in linguistics was in computer science, and various other fields. There's no doubt his work in linguistics is top notch, it's his foray into politics that is considered questionable depending on who you talk to..
liftlift > tsm
Soap
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Brazil1546 Posts
March 05 2016 06:42 GMT
#63514
I would just like to understand how someone referring to his penis on cable television is enough to make everyone throw a tantrum, while high schoolers shoving a broomstick up a freshman's ass is called "hazing".
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 06:49:37
March 05 2016 06:49 GMT
#63515
On March 05 2016 15:37 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 05 2016 15:29 writer22816 wrote:
Wow I didn't expect this thread to suddenly turn into Sam Harris bashing. Since it has, however, would one of you self-professed brilliant minds (IgnE, plansix, zulu_nation8) be as kind as to point me to some of Chomsky's more brilliant works so I can enlighten myself as to why he's so great and why Harris is just a populist moron? I've read a lot of Sam Harris, but I've yet to see him make any sweeping generalizations about the Muslim world. In fact he consistently focuses his criticisms towards Muslim fundamentalists and the regressive left who cannot even bring themselves to concede that ISIS has *something* to do with Islam.

Pretty much a lot of his linguistic theories, especially around linguistic hierarchy were pretty much the most cited pieces of research. I think there's like some algorithm that shows how good of a researcher you are based on the number of other research your cited in, and I think Chomsky is like insanely highly rated (like we're talking about top 10 territory) because of how fundamental his work in linguistics was in computer science, and various other fields. There's no doubt his work in linguistics is top notch, it's his foray into politics that is considered questionable depending on who you talk to..


Right, no one doubts his knowledge in linguistics. In fact only a few weeks ago I had the pleasure to learn about Chomsky normal form in my compilers class. It's politics that I'm particularly interested in, seeing as some users here have not only asserted that Chomsky is on a completely higher tier of intelligence than Harris but also apparently consider the truth of this claim so self-evident that they don't see a need to provide any reasoning or proof whatsoever. I'll go with glass half full here and assume they aren't full of shit. In that case it would be nice to receive some pointers as to which works I could consult in order to arrive at the same (presumably inevitable) conclusion, or at least expand my mind by hearing some good counterarguments.
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
ErectedZenith
Profile Joined January 2016
325 Posts
March 05 2016 06:54 GMT
#63516
I think we can all agree that both Chomsky and Harris have some intelligent points.
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
March 05 2016 07:02 GMT
#63517
You could look up the little spat they had last year or the year before and read their emails to each other.
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
March 05 2016 07:18 GMT
#63518
On March 05 2016 15:26 Doodsmack wrote:
Is it really some nuanced media strategy, or is it just that he whipped up the right base, doubled down against media frenzy, and then continued to double down against media frenzy, earning him the favor of the anti-establishment (which includes media) masses? Did Trump himself predict the response to the phrasing "they're rapists"? Did Trump say "blood coming out of her wherever" to purposely keep the lights on him, or because he actually is so sensitive to criticism psychologically that he lashes out with schoolyard insults? I think it may just be a happy coincidence for Trump that his insecure nature meshes well with media coverage (which has been the case since the 80s).

That Trump is highly available to the media is certainly smart and geared toward remaining in the spotlight, but I don't think it's the core of how he got in the spotlight. He could only have gotten in the spotlight by attracting the masses. I'm just not convinced he attracted them in some cunning way.

Either way, what we do know is that he's a media-created spectacle without any indication of governing ability, realistic ideas or actual government knowledge.

Trump's ambition in life, starting with his earliest business activity, has been gain as much as possible by any means necessary. He's filth, and if America elects him, we can be sure that America is filth too.

Nuanced isn't what the story claimed. He hits the broad strokes of staying a media sensation harder than others.

The main point is he kept the spotlight longer than anybody else. The article isn't about "how he got in the spotlight." He had a bigger initial splash than others, but that was very different than staying power. If he didn't have the whole package, the media pundit consensus might've been right on the length of his campaign.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9881 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-05 08:40:46
March 05 2016 08:29 GMT
#63519
My opinion on Trump might get me in trouble on here but oh well.

He is basically capitalizing on a phenomenon I actually first encountered on Team Liquid when discussing the movie Cloud Atlas.
Some guy said he hated it because it was an intelligent movie for intelligent people and it offended him that stuff like that was getting made.
Trump is making the most of this kind of people. Not only uneducated, but absolutely proud of it. The idea that having some kind of intelligence, or education, and the will to us it is something terrible seems to actually have traction in the US right now which just fucking freaks me out,
Its frankly pathetic.
I can't understand why so many people are beguiled by this utter idiot. He contradicts himself in a sentence regularly. No-one cares because he insults people.
Why?
There's only one conclusion.
America is, right now at least, full of idiots. I know that sounds xenophobic and like America bashing but what other conclusion could a foreigner draw from looking at the situation? At least there's a pretty big reaction against these idiots, but they are really showing their numbers right now.

Just look at the 'American Dream' answer. He actually just mumbles for like 10 seconds and then starts going on about someone's nice hat.
This isn't some media savvy genius. He's a moron that everyone has rallied behind because they are also morons.
RIP Meatloaf <3
puerk
Profile Joined February 2015
Germany855 Posts
March 05 2016 08:52 GMT
#63520
Although i agree in sentiment: "America is, right now at least, full of idiots." Applies to every country and is nothing special. What is special is that there is a decoupling of money and consum in media, which is for me the driving force in the downfall of the public discourse. Why do idiots get catered to in unprecedented amounts? Because nobody buys high quality journalism anymore.. in fact nobody buys journalistic work. Advertisers buy views, people watching/reading are no longer the customer but the product that is sold. The easiest to sell product is the one that doesn't notice.
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