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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
strongwind
Profile Joined July 2007
United States862 Posts
February 24 2016 18:25 GMT
#60341
On February 25 2016 03:16 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:09 Plansix wrote:
On February 25 2016 03:04 Mohdoo wrote:
On February 25 2016 03:00 cLutZ wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:38 travis wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:35 oneofthem wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:34 OtherWorld wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:18 oneofthem wrote:
bernie already is on the trump path except he's not saying racist stuff. free college, 15 dollar wage, declare isolationism etc. very shocking stuff

I can get behing the fact that there are arguments going in favor of most stuff we Europeans find weird about the USA (extreme capitalism, extreme individualism, extreme freedom, etc), but I genuinely don't understand how is free college/free education something "shocking", let alone "very shocking" ?
Not having free education means that (1) the natural effect of kids from higher sociocultural classes staying at the top (independently from their efforts) while kids from lower sociocultural classes staying at the bottom is not fought, which is not favoring meritocracy ; (2) on a societal level, you are missing on kids that could have made great things but didn't because they were stuck at the bottom of the social ladder, while giving money & jobs to kids that aren't exceptional at all and just had the luck of being raised in the right family ; (3) you force parents with lower income to do a relatively greater sacrifice compared with parents with higher income when saving money for their kids' education, thus also furthering current inequalities.
How is that good for anyone? That's basically the creation of a static society, where where you come from (instead of what you do) determines what and who you are, and a static society can only die.

have you been to a u.s. private college recently. it's a fucking day spa


even state schools are expensive though, especially graduate schools (which is a big problem in itself because many students will end up having no choice but to go to an out of state graduate school which in turn will cost ASSLOADS).


Yes, because even state schools engage in the ridiculous amenities creep that people lampoon private schools for.


In both my undergrad and grad school, there were just so many TVs everywhere. TVs showing the most basic stuff. Usually just a single page of what looks to be a PDF file to show some kinda banner or chart or ad for a football game or something. Hard to not cringe thinking what the total # of TVs on campus may have been. So unbelievably unneeded.

Screens in general are pretty cheap. Likely cheaper than a physical sign that you have to keep changing, because they you need to hire a person to handle that. Salaries, health care and are the real problems.

Lets not be my home town that was confused by a school need a computer per classroom in 2006.

It always seemed to me that new real estate was the biggest vanity expense that added size but not educational or research value to the university. For example, new dorm rooms that are fancier when the old ones suffice or are not necessary because students could live at home.

I agree with this. The college I was at was huge and I felt like I was just a number there in a sea of numbers. The solution? Build more campuses to hold more people. You could tell it was an arms race with no end in sight. Every time they call alumni for donations I can't help but sneer.
Taek Bang Fighting!
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44077 Posts
February 24 2016 18:26 GMT
#60342
On February 25 2016 03:23 Plansix wrote:
Unless a professor is publishing or working on other things, there is no reason for them not to do some administration. Though lessons are a lot of work too.

Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:23 GreenHorizons wrote:
This is the dark future that Back to the Future 2 predicted.


Didn't it predict 9/11 too


They have not abolished lawyers yet, so I think they got lucky with that one.

There absolutely are reasons not to have the faculty doing admin. If they knew how to do things like admin they wouldn't be faculty, they'd do something productive with their lives.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-24 18:28:36
February 24 2016 18:26 GMT
#60343
On February 25 2016 03:16 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:09 Plansix wrote:
On February 25 2016 03:04 Mohdoo wrote:
On February 25 2016 03:00 cLutZ wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:38 travis wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:35 oneofthem wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:34 OtherWorld wrote:
On February 25 2016 02:18 oneofthem wrote:
bernie already is on the trump path except he's not saying racist stuff. free college, 15 dollar wage, declare isolationism etc. very shocking stuff

I can get behing the fact that there are arguments going in favor of most stuff we Europeans find weird about the USA (extreme capitalism, extreme individualism, extreme freedom, etc), but I genuinely don't understand how is free college/free education something "shocking", let alone "very shocking" ?
Not having free education means that (1) the natural effect of kids from higher sociocultural classes staying at the top (independently from their efforts) while kids from lower sociocultural classes staying at the bottom is not fought, which is not favoring meritocracy ; (2) on a societal level, you are missing on kids that could have made great things but didn't because they were stuck at the bottom of the social ladder, while giving money & jobs to kids that aren't exceptional at all and just had the luck of being raised in the right family ; (3) you force parents with lower income to do a relatively greater sacrifice compared with parents with higher income when saving money for their kids' education, thus also furthering current inequalities.
How is that good for anyone? That's basically the creation of a static society, where where you come from (instead of what you do) determines what and who you are, and a static society can only die.

have you been to a u.s. private college recently. it's a fucking day spa


even state schools are expensive though, especially graduate schools (which is a big problem in itself because many students will end up having no choice but to go to an out of state graduate school which in turn will cost ASSLOADS).


Yes, because even state schools engage in the ridiculous amenities creep that people lampoon private schools for.


In both my undergrad and grad school, there were just so many TVs everywhere. TVs showing the most basic stuff. Usually just a single page of what looks to be a PDF file to show some kinda banner or chart or ad for a football game or something. Hard to not cringe thinking what the total # of TVs on campus may have been. So unbelievably unneeded.

Screens in general are pretty cheap. Likely cheaper than a physical sign that you have to keep changing, because they you need to hire a person to handle that. Salaries, health care and are the real problems.

Lets not be my home town that was confused by a school need a computer per classroom in 2006.

It always seemed to me that new real estate was the biggest vanity expense that added size but not educational or research value to the university. For example, new dorm rooms that are fancier when the old ones suffice or are not necessary because students could live at home.


those are the obvious costs. you have support services like 15 semi redundant academic tutoring and assistance groups, a huge slush fund for student orgs (which can budget 300 bucks for a catered dinner for 10 people) and so forth. then the ridiculously bloated admin which has dozens of offices across campus with people in each one handling some arcane function that someone else is probably doing anyways and then they hire a third guy to make sure the two records match.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 24 2016 18:28 GMT
#60344
Each live body is a potential federally back student loan you can take it. They are losing money by not building these dorms. Other colleges have them and they will get the loan if the student picks them.

Federally backed anything + the free market with limited regulation = horror show after 30 years.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Deathstar
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
9150 Posts
February 24 2016 18:30 GMT
#60345
Is Melanie Trump an example of female empowerment (smart, beautiful, and entrepreneurial) and can she help Trump get the female vote?

Btw Trump finally got some congressional endorsements.

Real estate magnate Donald Trump earned his first endorsements from two sitting members of Congress on Wednesday, according to multiple reports.

Rep. Duncan Hunter (R-CA) told Politico that America "doesn't need a policy wonk" in his endorsement of Trump.

"We don't need a policy wonk as President. We need a leader as President," Hunter said.

Hunter also told Politico he likes that endorsements seem to "mean very little" to Trump.

"I think you have more Trump supporters in Congress. They just have to come out of the closet, so to speak," he added.

Politico noted Hunter sponsored the so-called "Donald Trump Act," which would have required police sanctuary cities to notify immigration officials if they apprehended an undocumented immigrant. Hunter also recently made headlines for using a vaporizer while arguing against a ban on e-cigarettes on passenger planes in a congressional hearing.

Rep. Chris Collins (R-NY), who previously endorsed former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush (R), said Wednesday Trump "has clearly demonstrated that he has both the guts and the fortitude" to be President in a statement to the Buffalo News.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-first-congressional-endorsements
rip passion
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States6228 Posts
February 24 2016 18:33 GMT
#60346
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24033 Posts
February 24 2016 18:35 GMT
#60347
"I think you have more Trump supporters in Congress. They just have to come out of the closet, so to speak," he added.


I feel like there's just so much to unpack in such a short statement.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 24 2016 18:36 GMT
#60348
I sort of doubt it. I question how relatable a fashion model from the EU is going to be. I am sure some women will like her, but I don't expect her to bring out the lady voters on mass.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
strongwind
Profile Joined July 2007
United States862 Posts
February 24 2016 18:37 GMT
#60349
On February 25 2016 03:33 oBlade wrote:
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.

The only thing I'm sad about is the 100 million. How many mouths could that feed...

I don't know how anyone outside of the Bush family could think America would want to see another Bush in the White House. Heck, even Barbara thought it was a bad idea.
Taek Bang Fighting!
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 24 2016 18:39 GMT
#60350
On February 25 2016 03:37 strongwind wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:33 oBlade wrote:
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.

The only thing I'm sad about is the 100 million. How many mouths could that feed...

I don't know how anyone outside of the Bush family could think America would want to see another Bush in the White House. Heck, even Barbara thought it was a bad idea.

I said it before, the Republicans are blissfully unaware of how angry the US people are over Iraq and that administration. They don't seem to understand that total inaction in congress and failure to admit that anything was done wrong just feeds the cold, anti-establishment rage.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 24 2016 18:44 GMT
#60351
On February 25 2016 03:33 oBlade wrote:
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.

It shows though. Jeb had all that money, and he couldn't manage to run a powerful campaign in the face of opposition (mostly Trump). He might be a nice guy and well-meaning, but he hasn't shown he's got what it takes to be a strong leader, so his run fell apart.

Funny, that coming out of the closet quote is very similar to one said by Milo Yiannopoulos about his own supporters.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 24 2016 18:45 GMT
#60352
On February 25 2016 03:30 Deathstar wrote:
Is Melanie Trump an example of female empowerment (smart, beautiful, and entrepreneurial) and can she help Trump get the female vote?

Btw Trump finally got some congressional endorsements.

Show nested quote +
Real estate magnate Donald Trump earned his first endorsements from two sitting members of Congress on Wednesday, according to multiple reports.

Rep. Duncan Hunter (R-CA) told Politico that America "doesn't need a policy wonk" in his endorsement of Trump.

"We don't need a policy wonk as President. We need a leader as President," Hunter said.

Hunter also told Politico he likes that endorsements seem to "mean very little" to Trump.

"I think you have more Trump supporters in Congress. They just have to come out of the closet, so to speak," he added.

Politico noted Hunter sponsored the so-called "Donald Trump Act," which would have required police sanctuary cities to notify immigration officials if they apprehended an undocumented immigrant. Hunter also recently made headlines for using a vaporizer while arguing against a ban on e-cigarettes on passenger planes in a congressional hearing.

Rep. Chris Collins (R-NY), who previously endorsed former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush (R), said Wednesday Trump "has clearly demonstrated that he has both the guts and the fortitude" to be President in a statement to the Buffalo News.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-first-congressional-endorsements

She won't get the female vote but she and Ivanka, and their business contributions to the Trump family, make a pretty good counterargument to the "Trump is sexist" line.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 24 2016 18:45 GMT
#60353
Milo Yiannopoulos is like beetle juice, do not say his name. He will find you and publish your sexual history for daring to question him as a journalist.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 24 2016 18:49 GMT
#60354
On February 25 2016 03:45 Plansix wrote:
Milo Yiannopoulos is like beetle juice, do not say his name. He will find you and publish your sexual history for daring to question him as a journalist.

Not questioning him at all. Just surprised that congressmen talking about "daddy" would use nearly the same words he did.

The only thing embarassing about my sexual history is that it doesn't contain Milo Yiannopoulos. But I'm the wrong color so that's not going to change anytime soon.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24033 Posts
February 24 2016 18:50 GMT
#60355
I just saw a political ad for Rubio... Did you all know he's the "conservative, anti-establishment candidate"?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22422 Posts
February 24 2016 18:51 GMT
#60356
On February 25 2016 03:44 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:33 oBlade wrote:
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.

It shows though. Jeb had all that money, and he couldn't manage to run a powerful campaign in the face of opposition (mostly Trump). He might be a nice guy and well-meaning, but he hasn't shown he's got what it takes to be a strong leader, so his run fell apart.

Funny, that coming out of the closet quote is very similar to one said by Milo Yiannopoulos about his own supporters.

I am still convinced that Jeb never wanted to run for president and got pressured into it by his family. There was no fire, no drive and you cant convince people if your not convinced yourself.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 24 2016 18:54 GMT
#60357
I find any candidate claiming to be anti-establishment sort of comical. Even Sanders has been in the senate for 30+ years, even if he isn't a democrat. Luckily, Sanders doesn't use that language directly.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 24 2016 18:55 GMT
#60358
On February 25 2016 03:51 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:44 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
On February 25 2016 03:33 oBlade wrote:
I had a sad reaction about Jeb earlier. Like he came, the second most eloquent Bush, speaking Spanish, and with a bowl of guacamole and was going to be the next face of the Republican party, and then over $100 million is gone. I would have liked to see Trump and Bush fighting for the nomination. Oh well.

It shows though. Jeb had all that money, and he couldn't manage to run a powerful campaign in the face of opposition (mostly Trump). He might be a nice guy and well-meaning, but he hasn't shown he's got what it takes to be a strong leader, so his run fell apart.

Funny, that coming out of the closet quote is very similar to one said by Milo Yiannopoulos about his own supporters.

I am still convinced that Jeb never wanted to run for president and got pressured into it by his family. There was no fire, no drive and you cant convince people if your not convinced yourself.

IIRC his wife didn't want him to run and Barbara didn't seem all too thrilled either. He was doing pretty well in the early stages. Was the #2 spot in the first two debates before he began to fall off.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
strongwind
Profile Joined July 2007
United States862 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-24 19:05:01
February 24 2016 19:04 GMT
#60359
On February 25 2016 03:50 GreenHorizons wrote:
I just saw a political ad for Rubio... Did you all know he's the "conservative, anti-establishment candidate"?

Anti-establishment is all the rage nowadays. Whichever one starts using terms like "ratchet" and "throwing shade" first has my vote.
Taek Bang Fighting!
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24033 Posts
February 24 2016 19:12 GMT
#60360
On February 25 2016 04:04 strongwind wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2016 03:50 GreenHorizons wrote:
I just saw a political ad for Rubio... Did you all know he's the "conservative, anti-establishment candidate"?

Anti-establishment is all the rage nowadays. Whichever one starts using terms like "ratchet" and "throwing shade" first has my vote.


This close enough?

"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
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