US Politics Mega-thread - Page 2522

On November 13 2015 13:34 Deathstar wrote:


The point was that talking about power is not necessary to answering the question of "Is this person a racist". And a dictionary is a good place to start, unless we're going to start making up words now.

On November 13 2015 13:03 GreenHorizons wrote:


I hardly imagine myself as a spokesperson, there are just no other black people around whatsoever (the only other one got fed up and left).

I just can't stand idly by and watch the circle jerk without at least trying to interject some perspective (although I know it mostly falls on deaf ears).

On November 13 2015 13:41 KwarK wrote:

How on earth do you think words happen if people don't make them up? English majors don't track them down and capture them for selective breeding and dissemination to society. They don't run wild and they're not a mineral. Every word is made up.

On November 13 2015 12:55 Falling wrote:
I've defended in the past the idea that racism is prejudice + power, but I'm not so sure anymore. Or rather, there is an attempt to make the academic separation, but I'm not sure it's how the word 'racism' is used in the vernacular, at least not yet. And until the vernacular has changed, it comes off weird, the idea that in North America, only whites can be racist. I get the distinction intellectually- that there is a distinction between having prejudices and having prejudices and having prejudices with power... but in that case, the difference is power. Prejudice + power = Racism + power.

Because on a visceral level, it feels like it is being said is that North American whites are a special kind of evil. That they are the only ones that can be prejudiced. That is not what is meant, but the prejudice + power = racism formula does tend to put the conversation on very weird footing as people naturally react against the idea that white North Americans are special kind of evil or that African-Americans cannot be prejudiced (which is the meaning most people get, when they hear 'cannot be racist" ...as in that video). Again, I get the academic distinction, but I don't think that's actually how the word is actually used day to day except in certain circles and the corresponding connotation feels intuitively wrong.

On November 13 2015 13:36 WolfintheSheep wrote:

Quite an assumption thinking that everyone here is white.

On November 13 2015 13:26 KwarK wrote:

I think we're a little beyond quoting dictionaries here. However I did look up the word dictionary in merriam-webster and you'll be surprised to learn that in no way does it claim that a dictionary is anything more than a reference book containing information. So, if the dictionary is to be trusted then you could reference a dictionary for information about racism but you should not expect the dictionary to provide you with a clear definition. The dictionary describing itself thinks it doesn't give a clear definition.

On November 13 2015 13:45 MattBarry wrote:

I don't think a majority of white americans recognize the racism=power+prejudice definition. When you start telling someone a word doesn't mean what they and most people they know think it means and start redefining you come across as an arrogant ivory tower jerk who redefines words to suit a narrative. If you actually care about getting through to people, it'd be much more effective to just...not define racism that way and use a different word.

On November 13 2015 13:45 GreenHorizons wrote:


We've established there aren't any other black people who post in this thread. I'm well aware there are a few non-white posters though.

On November 13 2015 13:47 KwarK wrote:

Okay. I'll let the word catchers know to go back out into the field and find us a new word to refer to it with.

Incidentally a majority of white Americans used to think that laws against interracial marriage weren't racist etc. A system where white Americans exclusively get to define racist systems would be an excellent candidate for that new word, once we've found it.

On November 13 2015 13:50 MaCRo.gg wrote:

I am not "white"...

On November 13 2015 13:52 GreenHorizons wrote:


Congratulations!

On November 13 2015 13:54 Plansix wrote:

GH, you are dangerously close to the point where I call you out on being a douchebag.

On November 13 2015 13:51 MattBarry wrote:

Cute rhetoric. Good luck accomplishing anything when you have a powder keg that derails meaningful discussion and immediately pisses off the opposing side and makes them not want to see your point. Obviously many people will be racist despite your best efforts, but I know you piss off otherwise reasonable people when you tell them they can't be racist.

but I know you piss off otherwise reasonable people when you tell them they can't be racist.

On November 13 2015 13:50 MaCRo.gg wrote:

I am not "white"...

On November 13 2015 13:54 KwarK wrote:

I have no idea what you mean by

On November 13 2015 13:58 MattBarry wrote:

I'll try to explain it more clearly. "White people can't be racist" is a very provocative statement because the people saying it know the average joe doesn't know about the racism=power+prejudice concept. Or perhaps I'm being too assuming in thinking they know the average person doesn't know. Regardless, it's a very inflammatory statement. You piss people off and immediately make them feel as though they're under attack for being white. People aren't going to listen to your excellent points about the systemic racism minorities face if they feel as though you're demonizing them.

On November 13 2015 13:58 MattBarry wrote:

I'll try to explain it more clearly. "White people can't be racist" is a very provocative statement because the people saying it know the average joe doesn't know about the racism=power+prejudice concept. Or perhaps I'm being too assuming in thinking they know the average person doesn't know. Regardless, it's a very inflammatory statement. You piss people off and immediately make them feel as though they're under attack for being white. People aren't going to listen to your excellent points about the systemic racism minorities face if they feel as though you're demonizing them.