• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:07
CET 13:07
KST 21:07
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Evil Geniuses - shutting down14ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier5Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League64Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.167
StarCraft 2
General
No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development Evil Geniuses - shutting down How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted
Tourneys
ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier WORTEX Challenger Series — Open SC2 LAN in Budapes
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
Do we even care about balance? Rollback Netcode in Brood War [Recap] 0-6 Defeat for Mong's Team Bot on ladder Young Players Tournament Announced by SOOP
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [BSL23] RO24 Group C Small VOD Thread 2.0 2v2v2v2 Tournament
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) 50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Armies of Exigo - YesYes? General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7382 users

Heart of the Swarm beta coming soon! - Page 30

Forum Index > Closed
Post a Reply
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 144 Next
Do not use this thread to beg users for beta access or trade access with others. Thanks.
Gben592
Profile Joined August 2012
United Kingdom281 Posts
August 18 2012 07:15 GMT
#581
On August 18 2012 05:36 Zergrusher wrote:
since zergs AA would be weaker... Blizzard can buff the hydralisk like this:

- Unnerf the 2 nerfs it got.(look them up on Liquidpedia II)

- Remove Grooved spines and make 6 range default range

- make off creep movement speed 2.5

Because shure the hive tech speed upgrade is good(and should be in the game).... but it doesn't solve the main issues of the hydralisk.

After all the roach ruined zerg entirely.

its so easy to fix..... actaully you know what? One of these days I have to post a big thread on How to completely improve and fix SC2.




Please do! I gotta lot of stuff to say too ^^

Also, making the hydra more responsive, meaning, when you tell it to stop there is a smaller interval between it stopping and it doing the first shot (like a marine), would be cool, then you could kite more effectively with it, maybe some stutter step :D. It's just another avenue for micro, and i think it would be cool :D
"The more skilled player is the one who wins, and I don't think there's better balance than what we have now." INnoVation
Zergrusher
Profile Joined November 2011
United States562 Posts
August 18 2012 07:30 GMT
#582
On August 18 2012 09:47 eviltomahawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 09:42 RogerChillingworth wrote:
On August 18 2012 09:33 stichtom wrote:
Why no one is speaking about Ultralisk charge ? It seems so so so strong


what's the cool down? is it microable? I'm actually really anticipating it because i've always preferred ultras to broods but i just don't know the specs.

when DB said "yeah zerg has banes and fungal, but they both have some pretty harsh counters--when you really just need to clean up a bunch of marines..." i creamed my pants.

Apparently, ultralisk charge doesn't have auto-cast and thus must be manually cast, and it also apparently does friendly fire damage as well. However, I like it having these cons to balance out what would be powerful pros.



alot of false details you heard
Cabinet Sanchez
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia1097 Posts
August 18 2012 07:36 GMT
#583
On August 17 2012 23:53 Snowbear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 17 2012 23:13 Ramiz1989 wrote:
On August 17 2012 23:04 Snowbear wrote:
It's blizzard. They will nerf OP things.

I know, I am following that logic, but I am not convinced. Currently Widow Mine doesn't cost a lot, 75/25, but it prevents Muta harass completely, which is retarded. There is no sane Zerg that will trade Mutas that are 100/100 for Widow Mines, and currently Widow Mine does 200 damage to single target unit, and they even BUFFED that damage...

We will see, but I hope for more diversity, not less.


Please stop whining before the game is even in beta. If it's OP then blizzard WILL NERF IT. Ghost snipe was OP so blizzard nerfed it. Tanks were OP so blizzard nerfed them. Reapers were OP so blizzard nerfed them.


Sweet, what if it's just really lame / stupid? (Warhound)
avilo
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States4100 Posts
August 18 2012 07:40 GMT
#584
On August 18 2012 00:48 Shiori wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 00:45 xPabt wrote:
On August 18 2012 00:09 Herect wrote:
Cons:

- You can't make 20 of it at same time, and, plus, it takes some factory time (you could be building BHs).
- It'll have to burrow before attacks, so it can't be used in a normal battle with the bio/mechball.
- It doesn't have a uniform AoE damage. Something like the Seeker Missile. It'll probalby stacks, but the damge will fall considerably with the radius.
- It'll break Deathballs just like banes.



That's a con??


I think he means "break" in the sense that it'll make them too strong. Imagine a mech Deathball surrounded by Mines. Wtf do you even do against that?


The same thing you do now...broodlords lol ;d
Sup
avilo
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States4100 Posts
August 18 2012 07:45 GMT
#585
Everyone that's QQing btw should go play brood war. So you can see how much harder brood war is. Everyone including blizzard wants SC2 HOTS to have a higher skill cap (if possible) than SC2 WOL.

So if you think you can 1A around the map blindly with a huge deathball of units and complain when you don't have detection and lose all your shit...well what do you know?

SC2 is going to become a game with more depth with HOTS hopefully. 99% of the people that play SC2 WOL right now...you guys in brood war would be the people losing 100 supply of units to spider mines lol.

I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D
Sup
Ramiz1989
Profile Joined July 2012
12124 Posts
August 18 2012 08:00 GMT
#586
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
Everyone that's QQing btw should go play brood war. So you can see how much harder brood war is. Everyone including blizzard wants SC2 HOTS to have a higher skill cap (if possible) than SC2 WOL.

So if you think you can 1A around the map blindly with a huge deathball of units and complain when you don't have detection and lose all your shit...well what do you know?

SC2 is going to become a game with more depth with HOTS hopefully. 99% of the people that play SC2 WOL right now...you guys in brood war would be the people losing 100 supply of units to spider mines lol.

I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D

Tbh, I didn't expect optimistic view from you, but I pretty much agree on everything.
"I've been to hell and back, and back to hell…and back. This time, I've brought Hell back with me."
Umpteen
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United Kingdom1570 Posts
August 18 2012 08:30 GMT
#587
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D


Personally, I'm a bit of a sad panda about that. Terran can access all their fun new stuff nice and early, expanding the variety of early harrass and 8-10 minute attacks, which is cool for them - that's what an expansion should do for a game. Protoss get more ways to open air against Zerg, who can't be aggressive with anything they make for early AA, which is going to suck. Zerg get nothing new before infestation pit and nothing useful in small numbers, which means 90% of my games are going to play out using the exact same low-tech units I have to manage with in WoL: ling, bane, roach, queen. Hello another twelve months of P/T coming up with new builds and Z trying to figure out how to stop them with hatchery tech :/


The existence of a food chain is inescapable if we evolved unsupervised, and inexcusable otherwise.
Ramiz1989
Profile Joined July 2012
12124 Posts
August 18 2012 08:36 GMT
#588
On August 18 2012 17:30 Umpteen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D


Personally, I'm a bit of a sad panda about that. Terran can access all their fun new stuff nice and early, expanding the variety of early harrass and 8-10 minute attacks, which is cool for them - that's what an expansion should do for a game. Protoss get more ways to open air against Zerg, who can't be aggressive with anything they make for early AA, which is going to suck. Zerg get nothing new before infestation pit and nothing useful in small numbers, which means 90% of my games are going to play out using the exact same low-tech units I have to manage with in WoL: ling, bane, roach, queen. Hello another twelve months of P/T coming up with new builds and Z trying to figure out how to stop them with hatchery tech :/

But the whole problem for us Zerg players is mid game(Lair tech), after the Queen buff, we don't really have problems in the early game, while in the Lair tech, the most Zerg just camp with the Infestors, or harass with the Mutas to delay the attack from P/T, while going straight up for the Hive because we couldn't really end the game with the Lair. If there was some fortified position, you couldn't break it without losing a tons of resources.

We will see in the end, maybe they add something new, but right now, all additions to the Zerg feels amazing to me.
And can't wait to see what new Nyduses can do.
"I've been to hell and back, and back to hell…and back. This time, I've brought Hell back with me."
HubertFelix
Profile Joined April 2010
France631 Posts
August 18 2012 08:44 GMT
#589
When I see this thread at the top I furiously click on it thinking "the beta keys are sent???!!!!!!!"
But there only worthless theorycrafting / whine on other races
Garmer
Profile Joined October 2010
1286 Posts
August 18 2012 10:00 GMT
#590
tree word, nothing else: i can't wait
kranten
Profile Joined January 2012
Netherlands236 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-18 13:52:36
August 18 2012 13:48 GMT
#591
On August 18 2012 17:36 Ramiz1989 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 17:30 Umpteen wrote:
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D


Personally, I'm a bit of a sad panda about that. Terran can access all their fun new stuff nice and early, expanding the variety of early harrass and 8-10 minute attacks, which is cool for them - that's what an expansion should do for a game. Protoss get more ways to open air against Zerg, who can't be aggressive with anything they make for early AA, which is going to suck. Zerg get nothing new before infestation pit and nothing useful in small numbers, which means 90% of my games are going to play out using the exact same low-tech units I have to manage with in WoL: ling, bane, roach, queen. Hello another twelve months of P/T coming up with new builds and Z trying to figure out how to stop them with hatchery tech :/

But the whole problem for us Zerg players is mid game(Lair tech), after the Queen buff, we don't really have problems in the early game, while in the Lair tech, the most Zerg just camp with the Infestors, or harass with the Mutas to delay the attack from P/T, while going straight up for the Hive because we couldn't really end the game with the Lair. If there was some fortified position, you couldn't break it without losing a tons of resources.

We will see in the end, maybe they add something new, but right now, all additions to the Zerg feels amazing to me.
And can't wait to see what new Nyduses can do.


Agreed. I was watching an old daily on TvZ, and Day[9] said 17:30 is a good time to scan for Hive. It's like 5 minutes later than what I'm seeing in some of the IEM games right now, Opening up more options for zerg in the midgame armies will hopefully make more diverse and interesting games to watch.

I'm still wondering what TvZ will be like, mech still has problems dealing with BL/infestor and the viper will be so good vs bio.
Shiori
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
3815 Posts
August 18 2012 14:25 GMT
#592
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
Everyone that's QQing btw should go play brood war. So you can see how much harder brood war is. Everyone including blizzard wants SC2 HOTS to have a higher skill cap (if possible) than SC2 WOL.

So if you think you can 1A around the map blindly with a huge deathball of units and complain when you don't have detection and lose all your shit...well what do you know?

SC2 is going to become a game with more depth with HOTS hopefully. 99% of the people that play SC2 WOL right now...you guys in brood war would be the people losing 100 supply of units to spider mines lol.

I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D

I think that's what people are QQing about: units like the Tempest, Warhound, and so on have very little micro potential and are essentially 1-a units.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-18 15:01:15
August 18 2012 15:00 GMT
#593
On August 18 2012 23:25 Shiori wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
Everyone that's QQing btw should go play brood war. So you can see how much harder brood war is. Everyone including blizzard wants SC2 HOTS to have a higher skill cap (if possible) than SC2 WOL.

So if you think you can 1A around the map blindly with a huge deathball of units and complain when you don't have detection and lose all your shit...well what do you know?

SC2 is going to become a game with more depth with HOTS hopefully. 99% of the people that play SC2 WOL right now...you guys in brood war would be the people losing 100 supply of units to spider mines lol.

I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D

I think that's what people are QQing about: units like the Tempest, Warhound, and so on have very little micro potential and are essentially 1-a units.


Complaining the tempest doesn't have micro potential is like complaining the siege tanks and broodlords does require much micro. There are going to be units in the game that are slow at shit and rely on long range to get their work done. As long as those units required the player to pay attention and have weaknesses, they can do their job without being babysat 100% of the time.

The Warhound is clearly a work in progress and I would be willing to be will go through a number of changes. I can see the need for a high damage dealing ranged unit that comes out of the factory, it is just a question of making the unit good. If the warhound can be microed like a longer range stalker that can dump a brink ton of damage every once and a while, that isn't that bad. After all, stalkers are not without their flaws.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Shiori
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
3815 Posts
August 18 2012 15:10 GMT
#594
On August 19 2012 00:00 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2012 23:25 Shiori wrote:
On August 18 2012 16:45 avilo wrote:
Everyone that's QQing btw should go play brood war. So you can see how much harder brood war is. Everyone including blizzard wants SC2 HOTS to have a higher skill cap (if possible) than SC2 WOL.

So if you think you can 1A around the map blindly with a huge deathball of units and complain when you don't have detection and lose all your shit...well what do you know?

SC2 is going to become a game with more depth with HOTS hopefully. 99% of the people that play SC2 WOL right now...you guys in brood war would be the people losing 100 supply of units to spider mines lol.

I'm interested to see how the new units make old strats better. Like a cloaked 6 gate all-in with the oracle -_- sounds good eh lol :D

I think that's what people are QQing about: units like the Tempest, Warhound, and so on have very little micro potential and are essentially 1-a units.


Complaining the tempest doesn't have micro potential is like complaining the siege tanks and broodlords does require much micro. There are going to be units in the game that are slow at shit and rely on long range to get their work done. As long as those units required the player to pay attention and have weaknesses, they can do their job without being babysat 100% of the time.

The Warhound is clearly a work in progress and I would be willing to be will go through a number of changes. I can see the need for a high damage dealing ranged unit that comes out of the factory, it is just a question of making the unit good. If the warhound can be microed like a longer range stalker that can dump a brink ton of damage every once and a while, that isn't that bad. After all, stalkers are not without their flaws.

The Tempest, BroodLord, and Siege Tank are not the same type of unit. The latter two are Siege units that can slow push forward and do large amounts of damage in an engagement. The Tempest does very low damage, requires a spotter, and probably wouldn't kill more than a single Brood Lord in the time it takes to have an actual engagement.
Resistentialism
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada688 Posts
August 18 2012 15:14 GMT
#595
Tempests are the blink stalkers of the sky. Superiority harassment and ranged supporting damage.
Resistentialism
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada688 Posts
August 18 2012 15:18 GMT
#596
And low dps.
Shiori
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
3815 Posts
August 18 2012 15:24 GMT
#597
On August 19 2012 00:14 Resistentialism wrote:
Tempests are the blink stalkers of the sky. Superiority harassment and ranged supporting damage.

300/300 for a Blink Stalker? Heh...
pallad
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland1958 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-18 16:19:22
August 18 2012 16:16 GMT
#598
On August 19 2012 00:14 Resistentialism wrote:
Tempests are the blink stalkers of the sky. Superiority harassment and ranged supporting damage.


Slow dps
Slow speed
cost 300/300
I didint play HOTS anywere , but i think even two ( 3 for 100%) mutas can kill Tempest

Other thing is you need an observers to really make use of that range , but when opponent snipe your observer this range of Tempest is useless , its really easy to close Tempest harras if you think about it.
SC 2 -LingsLover- EU -- Jaedong , NesTea , Nerchio , DRG , Moon , Oz , Tarson , Scarlett -- Dota 2 Pallad EU- NaVi - LGD
Sroobz
Profile Joined December 2011
United States1377 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-18 16:30:46
August 18 2012 16:29 GMT
#599
OOps wrong thread, SO pumped for the beta
Flash---Taeja---Mvp---Byun---DRG
Excalibur_Z
Profile Joined October 2002
United States12269 Posts
August 18 2012 16:32 GMT
#600
On August 18 2012 03:38 Lorch wrote:
Friends and family has in fact recieved keyes, i don't know if they are playing yet though, and since it's nda no one is allowed to talk about it anyways.

The really great part about this is that f&f usually only starts a few days before beta is open to everyone, so expect beta in max a week.


F&F haven't received keys yet. The beta also isn't going to be NDA'd.
Moderator
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 144 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Sparkling Tuna Cup
19:00
Weekly #152 (SHIN Mod Edition)
herO vs ShamelessLIVE!
TBD vs ByuN
CranKy Ducklings173
SHIN 35
CranKy Ducklings SOOP13
LiquipediaDiscussion
FEL
19:00
ScienceCraft - Day 2
RotterdaM378
IndyStarCraft 359
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ByuN 417
RotterdaM 378
IndyStarCraft 359
SHIN 35
Classic 12
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 45643
Shuttle 14397
Bisu 2570
BeSt 1897
firebathero 1109
Horang2 828
FanTaSy 711
Hyuk 626
EffOrt 388
Stork 281
[ Show more ]
Mind 171
Last 147
ggaemo 142
Killer 131
Light 109
Hyun 97
Pusan 75
Bonyth 69
Movie 65
Barracks 63
sorry 44
Mong 38
ToSsGirL 34
Shinee 30
Bale 26
Aegong 24
Sexy 24
scan(afreeca) 24
Hm[arnc] 22
ProTech22
zelot 19
Yoon 17
Noble 14
Shine 12
JYJ 12
soO 12
yabsab 12
Sacsri 10
Dota 2
Gorgc18789
XcaliburYe119
Counter-Strike
allub696
fl0m543
x6flipin356
Other Games
singsing1588
B2W.Neo1382
DeMusliM170
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL14235
Other Games
gamesdonequick1307
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 14
lovetv 6
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 25
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2441
• WagamamaTV447
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
10h 53m
WardiTV Weekly
23h 53m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 22h
ByuN vs Lambo
MaxPax vs Bunny
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
3 days
SHIN vs GuMiho
Clem vs Classic
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
GSL
4 days
Epic.LAN
5 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Epic.LAN
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #5 - GSC
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
BSL Season 23
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2026-27
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.