EPTNaNiwa not invited to Code S - Page 223
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While I understand that there's a need to discuss this matter, this thread has way too many trash posts in it. Please think carefully about what you want to say. Ad hominem attacks on Swedish people in general, calling you fellow Starcraft fans idiots etc etc will be dealt with with harsher punishment from here on out. Keep it civil people. Page 230: Here's some more stuff that'll get you banned! - Conspiracy theory mongering about MLG and GOM - Comparing people to Hitler - Posting useless one liners of arguments that have already been repeated ad nauseum. | ||
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zeru
8156 Posts
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ShootingStars
1475 Posts
I'd rather watch an honest player than a player who is all nice and good manner because hes FORCING himself to. | ||
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Condor Hero
United States2931 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:42 LeopoldStotch wrote: Idra has GG'd every tournament that has required him to do so. GSL was one of them. Not true, he told Mana to fuck himself after losing IPL2. | ||
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amazingxkcd
GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:46 iky43210 wrote: match fixing is a rule that doesn't exist now? its not match fixing! | ||
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Govou
Canada1072 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:46 tlin wrote: I'll be eagerly awaiting NesTea's GSL ban for fucking around in games against HuK. Because it's not like GOM could ever hold Koreans to dfifferent standards than they do Foreigners, right? if Naniwa did put down as much as nestea on that game, he wouldnt have been kicked out of code S think before you post. | ||
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poorcloud
Singapore2748 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:45 ZAiNs wrote: If Naniwa 4Gated it'd be so obvious he wasn't trying and had no care at all. It wouldn't even be a proper 4gate, he'd just 4gate and do it as badly as possible to lose as quickly as possible. I guess some people are really dumb and wouldn't realise unless Naniwa straight up said that he didn't care about the game. IF he really didn't care that much, he wouldn't even have 4 gated. He would have did what he did. To even bother to 4 gate in the first place, you at least have to give more of a shit than Naniwa did. And i'm pretty sure once hes halfway through the game, he at least try to see how far his 4 gate can go and try to win. | ||
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XRaDiiX
Canada1730 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:44 MLG_Adam wrote: Slasher works for MLG in our video department. He is NOT a representative of the League. Any opinion or discussion from Slasher is solely opinion based. Saving Face again ... wait didn't GomTV put you guys up to misleading everyone? User was temp banned for this post. | ||
tree.hugger
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:42 MorroW wrote: but dont you guys agree in general making a rule where if a game doesnt matter, player should be allowed to request for walkover? or do you prefer them to be forced to play a game that doesnt matter? because this to me is far more important discussion than whatever else happened here a rule like this to me, makes perfect sense It's a fine rule to think about, but for a tournament like Blizzard Cup, where you've invited ten of the top players in the world, you have a strong interest in every game being played, because every game is a marquee match-up. So I doubt GOM would've done anything different. I don't think you're right about the tournament format being the bigger issue; plenty of tournaments have group stages, and group stages almost always produce some meaningless games, but they get played out anyway because that's what professionals do. I think the reason this has blown up is because NesTea, and I think the majority of players would have no problems playing out that game, but NaNiwa did have a problem with it, and that's unacceptable and unprofessional to most people. | ||
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MrSweetNess
Australia312 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:05 Hambone636 wrote: So why wasn't BitByBit Prime Banned? I assume he left his hand on the keyboard Because BitByBit actually tried to win those games. The problem isn't pulled workers.. it's the worker rush itself. Something like an all in where you pull workers or something like proxy gates or 6 pools are different because it is possible to win if you do them, a worker rush, no matter what, will not beat a Code S class player, it is virtually throwing the game, and that has a lot of other implications. What about people who had money on Naniwa? or something of that sort, it isn't too unreasonable since he has already beaten NesTea, and of course, people paid to see that game, it was one of the most hyped games in the group. I mean, it has certain (admittadly very small) impications of match fixing.. As for the disrespect, I think it is not only refering to NesTea, I mean how would you feel if you had gone 0-3 and were trying to fight for pride and 6 probes run into your base? But I think GOM also means the audience, I have a feeling that they are of the oppinion that Naniwa probe rushing was disrespectful in a way that it didn't give the fans the game they deserved.. This is just what I feel GOM thought, not necesserily my own opinion. As for my own opinion, I'm not too sure what to think.. I agree with points from both Nani and GOM, while I agree Nani should not have been forced to play that game, they should have allowed a forfeit, what he did was still not in very good spirit of the game, and that is what he is being punished for.. whether it is right or wrong, I don't know.. and with that rant over, bed time,... | ||
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Slin
Sweden13 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:47 Kieofire wrote: Rules get made this way, not everyone thinks about situations that may or may not happen at all to make them. You get jailed or the death punishment for killing and that was not a "rule" since the beginning of time. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Due_process | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:46 iky43210 wrote: match fixing is a rule that doesn't exist now? It's not match fixing. He was playing for nothing. No monetary gain. Two wrongs don't make a right. | ||
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Catalyst
Japan77 Posts
Blaming the format is somewhat understandable (because there are ways to avoid games where neither player can advance) but ultimately not really supportable. The format was clear, and he accepted an invitation to participate knowing such a resulting situation was possible. Naniwa stopped caring when he'd lost the opportunity for his own personal advancement and winnings, which may be fine as a gamer but NOT as a professional. Posters have drawn parallels to plenty of other professional sports where games are played even when standings have been determined, and there is no chance for a team's personal advancement. I would argue that it is precisely in those situations where the professionals are defined: they still go and give 100% for their fans, sponsors, teammates, and their own development. Naniwa did what he did because he was thinking about himself, emotional, and not in a state to care about those other things. Other players who BM during their matches do so while doing their jobs. That's a pretty big distinction. | ||
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ZAiNs
United Kingdom6525 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:46 HolydaKing wrote: well... in this case i would have prefered if they were forced to play for the fans. i was really eager to see the naniwa vs nestea rematch and wanted nestea to win in a legit way. nestea trained his ass off apparently and didn't get to show anything vs naniwa, while he lost everything else. You would never have seen a legit match, at best you would have seen Naniwa do some dumb all-in and do it purposely bad. Maybe that would be enough to satisfy your Nestea beating Naniwa boner if the probe rush didn't do it for you. | ||
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Vardant
Czech Republic620 Posts
Hopefully it gets resolved, so all the sides end up happy. On December 15 2011 01:44 MLG_Adam wrote: Slasher works for MLG in our video department. He is NOT a representative of the League. Any opinion or discussion from Slasher is solely opinion based. | ||
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aderum
Sweden1459 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:42 StatikKhaos wrote: in most things i try to remain neutral so i'll attempt when you do something like a probe rush (w/no micro) you've got to understand how people are going to interpret that, naniwa (most likely) knew how this was going to be interpreted, and he probably expected them to over look/not care for whatever reason, but what he failed to realize was that the koreans do care, above all else you've gotta respect them and the crowd and any arbitrary rules there may be , look no farther than the coca byun incident. and about the progamers not actors this in a sense is false, + Show Spoiler + they are entertainers they make money by entertaining. Gom gets views by entertaining these views lead to sponsor interest, and that leads to money. So in a sense the players ARE actors in a sense that its supposed to entertain. If every player cheesed cause that was the easiest/best way to win then NO ONE would watch, the games would be repetitive and boring. The players make money by being entertaining. No players aren't actors, just as tennis players aren't actors. They are there to win, and if they have no chance of winning and the match are completely meaningless, they shouldn't be required to play that match. And they shouldnt be punished for not playing a serious match. | ||
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Dexington
Canada7276 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:47 ShootingStars wrote: I don't care if Naniwa offended those Koreans. He is TRUE TO HIMSELF and is honest to both PUBLIC and private. Nestea however... >_> I'd rather watch an honest player than a player who is all nice and good manner because hes FORCING himself to. There's rules. | ||
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES49496 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:48 tree.hugger wrote: It's a fine rule to think about, but for a tournament like Blizzard Cup, where you've invited ten of the top players in the world, you have a strong interest in every game being played, because every game is a marquee match-up. So I doubt GOM would've done anything different. I don't think you're right about the tournament format being the bigger issue; plenty of tournaments have group stages, and group stages almost always produce some meaningless games, but they get played out anyway because that's what professionals do. I think the reason this has blown up is because NesTea, and I think the majority of players would have no problems playing out that game, but NaNiwa did have a problem with it, and that's unacceptable and unprofessional to most people. finally! I've been saying the same thing too! | ||
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poorcloud
Singapore2748 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:47 ShootingStars wrote: I don't care if Naniwa offended those Koreans. He is TRUE TO HIMSELF and is honest to both PUBLIC and private. Nestea however... >_> I'd rather watch an honest player than a player who is all nice and good manner because hes FORCING himself to. Then good for you. Others don't like Naniwas views, the koreans certainly didn't and he thus got his spot revoked. Thats all, no need to resort to insults and name calling. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States43771 Posts
On December 15 2011 01:46 iky43210 wrote: match fixing is a rule that doesn't exist now? When people have started accusing Naniwa of match-fixing, the conversation has reached the point of lunacy. | ||
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Holloworb
Norway345 Posts
Sports and Esports are 2 things. Competition and entertainment, you need both for a succesfull scene to develop. When someone on purpose breaks with those ideals they're hurting the sport and league/tourny they're a part of. Saying you dont want to play a game is not okay, even when there's nothing on the line. If that was the case every sports league in the world would end when the spot of the winner and those having to be relegated to a lower leage were decided. I can't even imagine the uproar if the Premier League ended early, or a team decided not to play a match... | ||
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