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Patch 1.4 PTR Notes (updated 9/8) - Page 95

Forum Index > Closed
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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne

There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55
Partypants
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia50 Posts
August 25 2011 08:35 GMT
#1881
Nothing wrong with hellions at all the way it currently is . This is coming from a zerg/toss player . i liked being harassed by them
_Search_
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada180 Posts
August 25 2011 08:36 GMT
#1882
On August 25 2011 17:26 Amui wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:21 _Search_ wrote:
On August 25 2011 17:18 Elefanto wrote:
It's hilarious how people complain about the Warpprism getting buffed, because they fear that protoss will be able to harass and they have to pay attention on the minimap and start multitasking.



When Terran drops we drop 360-500 hp worth of units.

When Protoss drops they drop 600 hp worth of units and immediately warp in more.


This Warp Prism buff is far too good.


When you drop 360-500 worth of units, if we are out of position, we lose a critical techstructure and a handful of probes, even if we run instantly. When protoss drops 600hp of zealots, you run workers losing maybe 1 because you aren't used to protoss drops, and possibly a techlab or a supply depot before your production kicks in. If protoss can drop 4+6, you'll easily have 5 barracks pumping stuff out, and clean up with ease. You forget how cost efficient your stuff is against gateway in small numbers.


Unless you camp the production facilities, unless Terran doesn't have enough army to repel the attack and was defending with bunkers, unless Terran does anything other than an end-the-game-quick bio build.

It takes 75 shots for a marine to kill a zealot with guardian shield and +1 armor. We NEED our wall-offs.

Hell, with 3 gate robo, you can usually have a warp prism in a Terran base before stim is done.
PlosionCornu
Profile Joined August 2010
Italy814 Posts
August 25 2011 08:36 GMT
#1883
As a zerg player I don't think the BFH nerf is needed at all. It's perfectly counterable like every other unit.

As Someone previously stated, this nerf will contribute to the continous death of mech terran in tvp and nothing else.
ApocAlypsE007
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Israel1007 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-25 08:39:04
August 25 2011 08:36 GMT
#1884
I'm kinda meh with this patch because while I feel it is a step in the right direction. The patch does little to affect the 111 build in PvT, the Immortal range buff is much more significant in PvZ where those crabs will stop dancing like idiots behind the stalkers and actually attack and provide a nice answer to mass roach. While I like the Warp Prism buff it is still very expensive and very risky to harass as Protoss as their units good in large numbers, not small. Fungals are still a pain to deal with as Protoss as it takes the same amount of fungals to kill core units.
This patch doesn't solve the core issues of Protoss: the 111 build in PvT and the weakness in early game vs Zerg allowing them to take a very quick third without punishment and Protoss have to resort to timing attacks and cute tactics.
I'm playing the game, the one that will take me to my end, i'm waiting for the rain, TO WASH-- WHO I AM!!!
TENTHST
Profile Joined December 2010
United States204 Posts
August 25 2011 08:37 GMT
#1885
Great job Blizzard.

I'm glad to see youre listening to the community.

I think this is one of the best patches to date.
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
August 25 2011 08:37 GMT
#1886
On August 25 2011 17:36 PlosionCornu wrote:
As a zerg player I don't think the BFH nerf is needed at all. It's perfectly counterable like every other unit.

As Someone previously stated, this nerf will contribute to the continous death of mech terran in tvp and nothing else.


the blue flame change only effects workers (idk bout zealots). It still like 1 shots zerglings I don't get how its the death of mech as it only effects workers takes 3 instead of 2, and hydras it takes like 5 instead of 3 or something. vs everything else its like the same lol (idk vs zealots but doubt its as big as people are making it out to be)
When I think of something else, something will go here
firehand101
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Australia3152 Posts
August 25 2011 08:37 GMT
#1887
On August 25 2011 17:28 decemberTV wrote:
Show nested quote +

So BF will be useless for worker harassment vZ and vP. This is kind of stupid since the main issue was vT ?


This made me lol so hard.

useless....... i think it still takes the same amount of shots from a hellion to kill workers?
The opinions expressed by our users do not reflect the official position of TeamLiquid.net or its staff.
ApocAlypsE007
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Israel1007 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-25 08:38:35
August 25 2011 08:37 GMT
#1888
I pressed the wrong bottom lol delete this massage
I'm playing the game, the one that will take me to my end, i'm waiting for the rain, TO WASH-- WHO I AM!!!
arbitrageur
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia1202 Posts
August 25 2011 08:37 GMT
#1889
On August 25 2011 17:36 PlosionCornu wrote:
As a zerg player I don't think the BFH nerf is needed at all. It's perfectly counterable like every other unit.

As Someone previously stated, this nerf will contribute to the continous death of mech terran in tvp and nothing else.

Hmm.. Have you played against Korean GM blue flame multitasking? It's fucking gross trust me.
arbitrageur
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia1202 Posts
August 25 2011 08:38 GMT
#1890
On August 25 2011 17:37 firehand101 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:28 decemberTV wrote:

So BF will be useless for worker harassment vZ and vP. This is kind of stupid since the main issue was vT ?


This made me lol so hard.

useless....... i think it still takes the same amount of shots from a hellion to kill workers?


His assertion was "So BF will be useless for worker harassment vZ and vP."

which is completely wrong for ZvT at least because you can't just use lings to defend.
Brainiac
Profile Joined May 2011
Poland641 Posts
August 25 2011 08:39 GMT
#1891
On August 25 2011 17:36 ApocAlypsE007 wrote:
I'm kinda meh with this patch because while I feel it is a step in the right direction. The patch does little to affect the 111 build in PvT, the Immortal range buff is much more significant in PvZ where those crabs will stop dancing like idiots behind the stalkers and actually attack and provide a nice answer to mass roach. While I like the Warp Prism buff it is still very expensive and very risky to harass as Protoss as their units good in large numbers, not small. Fungals are still a pain to deal with as Protoss as it takes the same amount of fungals to kill core units.
This patch doesn't solve the core issues of Protoss: the 111 build in PvT and the weakness in early game vs Zerg allowing them to take a very quick third without punishment and resort to timing attacks and cute tactics.


Dude, read my earlier post. Immortals will still dance behind stalkers because they both have the same range. Stalker is faster so will still get in a way.
Si vis pacem para bellum
sk1nex
Profile Joined May 2010
Finland299 Posts
August 25 2011 08:39 GMT
#1892
Oh yeah, finally the range upgrade for immortals! A bit meh about the blink research time, but i have to say that so far it has always felt short enough. Prolly won't make a big difference, at least if you CB it all the way through. Blizz seems to be trying all kinda tricks to make PvP matches longer
"Im at Quakecon, Gonna win the Duel and TDM. Quake is easy" (c) 2GD | NTHNTHNTHNTHNTHNTH
Argus92
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands93 Posts
August 25 2011 08:39 GMT
#1893
On August 25 2011 17:21 _Search_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:18 Elefanto wrote:
It's hilarious how people complain about the Warpprism getting buffed, because they fear that protoss will be able to harass and they have to pay attention on the minimap and start multitasking.



When Terran drops we drop 360-500 hp worth of units.

When Protoss drops they drop 600 hp worth of units and immediately warp in more.


This Warp Prism buff is far too good.

Since when was hp a good indicator of how strong a group of units are?
Diderick
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands298 Posts
August 25 2011 08:40 GMT
#1894
Im most shocked by the barracks build time change. Why would they do that. I thought rushes werent really a issue anymore. This totally throws the standard opening timings off
arbitrageur
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia1202 Posts
August 25 2011 08:40 GMT
#1895
On August 25 2011 17:39 Brainiac wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:36 ApocAlypsE007 wrote:
I'm kinda meh with this patch because while I feel it is a step in the right direction. The patch does little to affect the 111 build in PvT, the Immortal range buff is much more significant in PvZ where those crabs will stop dancing like idiots behind the stalkers and actually attack and provide a nice answer to mass roach. While I like the Warp Prism buff it is still very expensive and very risky to harass as Protoss as their units good in large numbers, not small. Fungals are still a pain to deal with as Protoss as it takes the same amount of fungals to kill core units.
This patch doesn't solve the core issues of Protoss: the 111 build in PvT and the weakness in early game vs Zerg allowing them to take a very quick third without punishment and resort to timing attacks and cute tactics.


Dude, read my earlier post. Immortals will still dance behind stalkers because they both have the same range. Stalker is faster so will still get in a way.


Immortals may still dance behind stalkers even if you give them +5 more range. Derp.
Amui
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada10567 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-25 08:43:04
August 25 2011 08:40 GMT
#1896
On August 25 2011 17:36 _Search_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:26 Amui wrote:
On August 25 2011 17:21 _Search_ wrote:
On August 25 2011 17:18 Elefanto wrote:
It's hilarious how people complain about the Warpprism getting buffed, because they fear that protoss will be able to harass and they have to pay attention on the minimap and start multitasking.



When Terran drops we drop 360-500 hp worth of units.

When Protoss drops they drop 600 hp worth of units and immediately warp in more.


This Warp Prism buff is far too good.


When you drop 360-500 worth of units, if we are out of position, we lose a critical techstructure and a handful of probes, even if we run instantly. When protoss drops 600hp of zealots, you run workers losing maybe 1 because you aren't used to protoss drops, and possibly a techlab or a supply depot before your production kicks in. If protoss can drop 4+6, you'll easily have 5 barracks pumping stuff out, and clean up with ease. You forget how cost efficient your stuff is against gateway in small numbers.


Unless you camp the production facilities, unless Terran doesn't have enough army to repel the attack and was defending with bunkers, unless Terran does anything other than an end-the-game-quick bio build.

It takes 75 shots for a marine to kill a zealot with guardian shield and +1 armor. We NEED our wall-offs.

Hell, with 3 gate robo, you can usually have a warp prism in a Terran base before stim is done.


Your wrong about the 75 shot thing, but I'll let it slide. If I have the ability to get +1 and the ability to warp in enough to shut down your production, you should rightfully die if you were defending with only bunkers. Exact same principle as dropping a weakened protoss who's warping in sentries to defend the nat on shakuras. Not enough units to defend the drop? You die. Since when was making bunkers an excuse for not having an army big enough to deal with 10 gateway units 10 minutes into a game.

3gate robo won't be able to warp enough stuff in to end the game in most cases. An elevator play maybe, but the warp prism buff doesn't change elevator play, and you didn't see that did you?
Porouscloud - NA LoL
sleepingdog
Profile Joined August 2008
Austria6145 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-25 08:41:33
August 25 2011 08:41 GMT
#1897
On August 25 2011 17:37 firehand101 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:28 decemberTV wrote:

So BF will be useless for worker harassment vZ and vP. This is kind of stupid since the main issue was vT ?


This made me lol so hard.

useless....... i think it still takes the same amount of shots from a hellion to kill workers?


Exactly this is, I think, what Blizz wants to achieve. Higher numbers of hellions and GOOD usage of them will still lead to devestating damage.

Nevertheless nowadays you don't really need neither of those as even a couple of hellions can together already kill a whole mineral line.

On another subject: any intel as to why blizz thinks it's necessary to nerf blink? Reading this I was like....wut
"You see....YOU SEE..." © 2010 Sen
sztanpet
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Hungary44 Posts
August 25 2011 08:41 GMT
#1898
Issuing new orders to charging zealots will cause them to lose the charge buff.

This might also have a few implications, depending on what "new orders" mean.
Does it mean simply a new movement command? That would mean that the usual spam clicking people play with would make charge less good maybe, if a new movement command does not constitute to a "new order" there is no issue really.
Brainiac
Profile Joined May 2011
Poland641 Posts
August 25 2011 08:41 GMT
#1899
On August 25 2011 17:40 arbitrageur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:39 Brainiac wrote:
On August 25 2011 17:36 ApocAlypsE007 wrote:
I'm kinda meh with this patch because while I feel it is a step in the right direction. The patch does little to affect the 111 build in PvT, the Immortal range buff is much more significant in PvZ where those crabs will stop dancing like idiots behind the stalkers and actually attack and provide a nice answer to mass roach. While I like the Warp Prism buff it is still very expensive and very risky to harass as Protoss as their units good in large numbers, not small. Fungals are still a pain to deal with as Protoss as it takes the same amount of fungals to kill core units.
This patch doesn't solve the core issues of Protoss: the 111 build in PvT and the weakness in early game vs Zerg allowing them to take a very quick third without punishment and resort to timing attacks and cute tactics.


Dude, read my earlier post. Immortals will still dance behind stalkers because they both have the same range. Stalker is faster so will still get in a way.


Immortals may still dance behind stalkers even if you give them +5 more range. Derp.


Yeah dude, you are smart. Now, what was the purpose of your post?
Si vis pacem para bellum
HinagikUx
Profile Joined January 2011
United States178 Posts
August 25 2011 08:41 GMT
#1900
On August 25 2011 17:39 Argus92 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 25 2011 17:21 _Search_ wrote:
On August 25 2011 17:18 Elefanto wrote:
It's hilarious how people complain about the Warpprism getting buffed, because they fear that protoss will be able to harass and they have to pay attention on the minimap and start multitasking.



When Terran drops we drop 360-500 hp worth of units.

When Protoss drops they drop 600 hp worth of units and immediately warp in more.


This Warp Prism buff is far too good.

Since when was hp a good indicator of how strong a group of units are?


such a good point. srsly sick of this guy saying how overpowered the warp prism is all day on this forum -_-;
uGpTaiga/HinagikUx NA Server
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