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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne
There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 |
On August 25 2011 15:03 archbounds wrote:
So now the Warp Prism is the fastest (equal without Gravatic), cheapest and strongest (and can benefit from 2 different armor upgrades), which can warp in units once it lands? DID I MENTION IT ALSO COSTS NO GAS?
Perfect balance blizzard. Perfect.
Medivacs can heal, and you get them anyway for your main army comp. Warp prisms need to be upgraded with expensive upgrades to make them what you make of them, and Medivacs can carry Marines. Your argument is invalid.
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Is it another infestor nerf? Shit. We are low on supply as is, and now we're gonna have to get 8-10 infestors instead of 5-6 
36 (47) is down to 30 (40).
5 for blue flame does seem a bit too small for TvZ, but it's awesome for TvT. I'm tired of watching mech battles, I would prefer more MMM fights
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Russian Federation823 Posts
On August 25 2011 15:08 tdt wrote:
This is a shitty patch can't believe so many like it.
BFH were fun as shit to watch and were dealt with as long as opponets were not greedy and built some roaches or stalkers. I like having scary units like that as long as there is easy counters, half the units in BW were scary as hell.
In BW the damage output was lower than in SC2, so scary units weren't a scary as 3 hellions killing 20 workers in 4 seconds.
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Barracks build time isn't a big deal, but it annoys me the most. Seriously.
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Can someone explain me why Terran cry about the helion nerf? I tought bfh was good in TvT but it took 3 hit to kill scv but since it take as many shot to kill other worker mean bfh is like the reaper 2.0 ???
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yah the short range really is an issue. I would prefer if it was still range 9 and upgrade at fusion core. I mean didn't Blizzard want to encourage the usage of seeker missle when they changed it to tech lab, maybe range 7 or 8 would be a better change than the speed change.
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On August 25 2011 15:17 Thorzain wrote:
I think that they should have added range to the seeker missile instead of the speed bonus (or both) if they wanted to see it used more. I think that the biggest problem with seeker missile is that whenever you use it, you practically sacrifice your raven as well, because it has an extremely short range.
It should be awesome against muta flocks though. Since once the Seeker Missle gets closer than 2 range it cannot be out run (according to liquipedia).
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On August 25 2011 15:19 Jugan wrote:
Barracks build time isn't a big deal, but it annoys me the most. Seriously.
Lol I know, I am not even a Terran player but it seems like a random jab to nerf terran no matter how small.
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Great changes. Hoping to see what can come out of this. Blueflame +5 is enough and everything beyond +5 is just way too devastating. Of course people will whine like they always do but maybe they will adapt. Looking forward AND people should really know that this still is the PTR version, it might not be like this and things can be changed if people whine enough and something is off.
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On August 25 2011 15:19 Jugan wrote:
Barracks build time isn't a big deal, but it annoys me the most. Seriously.
Indeed, there is no reason for that nerf.
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On August 25 2011 15:11 archbounds wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2011 15:09 JiPrime wrote:On August 25 2011 15:03 archbounds wrote:
So now the Warp Prism is the fastest (equal without Gravatic), cheapest and strongest (and can benefit from 2 different armor upgrades), which can warp in units once it lands? DID I MENTION IT ALSO COSTS NO GAS?
Perfect balance blizzard. Perfect. Warp Prism is built from robo, which means while you're building warp prisms, you can't make colossi, or immortals, which are important units that make up the protoss deathball. It's a very fair tradeoff, IMO. This gives more choice of strategies for protoss, which the protoss seriously lack as of now. Medivacs are built from starport, which means whyle you're building medivacs, you can't make vikings, and if it's reactored, anything else. HSM buff will remain unused as long as it's that fucking expensive for something that isn't guaranteed to hit anything for 125 energy.
Yea, but it feels like this kind of equalizes the weakness in protoss harass. In terms of harassment:
Zerg: Burrowed infestors, mutas, zergling runbys, and overlord drops/nydus
Terran: Banshess (with or without cloak), extremely damaging drops with bio and hellions, and nukes
Protoss: Dark Templars, blink stalkers, phoenix, warp prisms
Just doesn't seem too fair for toss :/. Might explain why their play is typically built around timing attacks or just getting a death ball.
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On August 25 2011 15:19 Jugan wrote:
Barracks build time isn't a big deal, but it annoys me the most. Seriously.
It's so unlikely to make the cut, it's just PTR after all, I don't think a single set of changes has gone through as-is, they just seem to do it to make the other changes look tame by comparison.
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On August 25 2011 15:11 archbounds wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2011 15:09 JiPrime wrote:On August 25 2011 15:03 archbounds wrote:
So now the Warp Prism is the fastest (equal without Gravatic), cheapest and strongest (and can benefit from 2 different armor upgrades), which can warp in units once it lands? DID I MENTION IT ALSO COSTS NO GAS?
Perfect balance blizzard. Perfect. Warp Prism is built from robo, which means while you're building warp prisms, you can't make colossi, or immortals, which are important units that make up the protoss deathball. It's a very fair tradeoff, IMO. This gives more choice of strategies for protoss, which the protoss seriously lack as of now. Medivacs are built from starport, which means whyle you're building medivacs, you can't make vikings, and if it's reactored, anything else. HSM buff will remain unused as long as it's that fucking expensive for something that isn't guaranteed to hit anything for 125 energy.
What BS is this? You're trying to make the most flexible race in the game look inflexible? Stick a reactor on that starport and you can build 1 medivac and 1 viking at the same time. Build Tech Lab right below Reactor, lift off and land next to the addon you need, takes only 3 seconds. Also, HSM's speed is fast enough to catch up to a viking. If that isn't enough, I don't know what will. HINT: With this patch, the workers cannot outrun HSM.
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On August 25 2011 15:02 Emporio wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2011 14:48 Quintum_ wrote:
I dont think the infestor is all that big, here is the units you see fungal on the most
Right now fungal
2 shot rins without shilds
2 shot rins with shields
3 shot maruaders
5 shot zelots
4 shot stalkers
5 shot voids
Post patch if it changed like in the op
New fungal
2 shot rins without shields
2 shot rins with shields
4 shot maruaders
5 shot zelots
4 shot stalkers
7 shot voids
So post patch you are going to need 1 more fungal to a maruader and 2 more fungals for a void/ I think most zergs can live with that. And huge nerf for terrans and big buffs for protoss, blizz must of not of been happy with the state of GSL.
Rax nerf i think will give zerg those precious seconds to hold off a bunker rush.
I'm more interested in what fungal can do to marines that are being healed by a medivac. Will 2 fungals still kill them?
Definitely not with the recent nerf. Will be more like 3-5 depending on the amount of medivacs. Now the fungal dps is less than medivac hps.
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On August 25 2011 15:19 TBO wrote:
yah the short range really is an issue. I would prefer if it was still range 9 and upgrade at fusion core. I mean didn't Blizzard want to encourage the usage of seeker missle when they changed it to tech lab, maybe range 7 or 8 would be a better change than the speed change.
Yeah the issue has never been the speed, it's that using seeker missile means you normally forfeit the ravens in the process.
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United Arab Emirates1141 Posts
On August 25 2011 15:18 kusto wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2011 15:08 tdt wrote:
This is a shitty patch can't believe so many like it.
BFH were fun as shit to watch and were dealt with as long as opponets were not greedy and built some roaches or stalkers. I like having scary units like that as long as there is easy counters, half the units in BW were scary as hell. In BW the damage output was lower than in SC2, so scary units weren't a scary as 3 hellions killing 20 workers in 4 seconds. I'm still frankly disappointed at how weak the SCII tanks are when sieged. BW siege tanks melted all kinds of junk before they could ever reach the siege line.
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What I read: "Ultralisks"
Thought: "ZOMG YAY ultralisks are going to be buffed into not being TERRIBLE!"
What actually happened: "They build faster.... but they still suck and you probably should still make broodlords instead"
Also Yay immortals getting slightly more range, and warpprisms becoming slightly less like the glass wankavator.
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In before raven gets energy upgrade or energy needed to use HSM is 100? 
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On August 25 2011 15:14 Jimmy Raynor wrote:
I still can't find a good reason for barracks nerf, that is damn huge in tvp (close positions will be nightmare)
How is it's damn huge anyway? It's not like 4 gates is gonna hit you anything. Warp gate got nerf so badly, zealots build time has increase too. I thought close spawn only benefit Terran and 6 pools zerg, that's it right? Protoss has no kind of cheese beside cannon rush.
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omg yay drones patched finally!
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EPT
